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DND, you have to put this someplace where you'll see it each day, and she won't.
BH's ARE TO DO PLAN A WITH NO EXPECTATIONS.
We had a poster a while ago who was forever doing the action/analysis - action/analysis tango until he was spinning himself into a snarl. He was told to stop pulling up the flowers to see how the roots were growing!
Stop with the "Why did she do this/that/the other..." Firstly, (probably not MB-correct) even normal females do things that will confound us males. Second. WW's are more so. Third, your mindset is not fully free of affair-sensitivity, so you will see everything as tied to your situation.
JUST DO PLAN A! That's enough mental/emotional burden for anyone.
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NG , i know and do understand what your saying, i only post things on here as a place to at least let them out rather than rip me up inside and also to get other peoples thoughs feelings on them and how i shoudl react to certain things, so that i dont LB in plan A , i am getting better and learning hoenstley
BH
Married 13yrs, togther 18yrs
1 son, 11yrs
DD: 27th July, Current status plan A
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Hmmmmmm....sounds familiar... 
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Hmmmmmm....sounds familiar... in what way ?
BH
Married 13yrs, togther 18yrs
1 son, 11yrs
DD: 27th July, Current status plan A
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even normal females do things that will confound us males.  I am more than certain Dr Harley has said the exact same thing.
What would you do if you were not afraid?
"Fear is the little death. Fear is the mind-killer" Frank Herbert.
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So you think you have developed a "masque" that will shield your confusion/concern/marginal resentment from getting through to her? JUST DO PLAN A! Expect nothing to come of it. Expect no improvement. Expect more WW foolishness.
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Sorry, dave...just that I did the EXACT same thing until some really great people here taught me to STOP the 'paralysis by analysis' and simply START Plan A (and stick with it) -- with NO EXPECTATIONS.
(P.S. - they were right, and it works!).
Last edited by helpfordad; 09/17/12 11:31 AM.
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I am trying todo plan a with no expectations and I am getting great advice on here abouts things to do n say  I try not to analyse everything but somethings I wonder so that's when I post them. I know the what people say regarding plan a n plan b but one thing I dont understand is what the signs are etc to recognize if she was coming from fog n withdrawal etc to conflict and when she is ready for recovery etc as well. So that why I report things I see here, thee are lots of things I do ignore and never mention as well. Like tonight after the txt messages I mentioned earlier we both we t to our sons meeting and then after she asks if we should go out for food instead of home. So again it's bizarre I really don't think she does know what she is doing but I will just keep on plan A
BH
Married 13yrs, togther 18yrs
1 son, 11yrs
DD: 27th July, Current status plan A
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I know what you mean...looking back at my Plan A -- which wasn't perfect -- I realize that some of the 'signs' after exposure were there. Meaning, W was very clingy on me, initiated alot of HB, initiated alot of our UA time, alot of cards, notes...I could sense she 'wanted back in' so to speak, into the marriage.
Where I really needed support, and got it, was NOT LETTING UP with Plan A..as soon as I saw crumbs of 'this could be saved', I was tempted to ease off the MB pedal...no, no, no.
Becasue I realzed that Plan A was not only the means to save my M, but it was/is making ME a better husband and father...
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I know what you mean...looking back at my Plan A -- which wasn't perfect -- I realize that some of the 'signs' after exposure were there. Meaning, W was very clingy on me, initiated alot of HB, initiated alot of our UA time, alot of cards, notes...I could sense she 'wanted back in' so to speak, into the marriage.
Where I really needed support, and got it, was NOT LETTING UP with Plan A..as soon as I saw crumbs of 'this could be saved', I was tempted to ease off the MB pedal...no, no, no.
Becasue I realzed that Plan A was not only the means to save my M, but it was/is making ME a better husband and father... That's exactly what I mean and think as well, I want to be able to see n recognize the signs and that's why I post here but when they do come that isn't going to stop my plan A at all the plan and changes in me are for every I just don't want to miss and signs or risk screwing up n saying the wrong things, when I do start seeing signs I guess that's when you go into a turbo mode to encourage them more
BH
Married 13yrs, togther 18yrs
1 son, 11yrs
DD: 27th July, Current status plan A
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what the signs are etc to recognize if she was coming from fog n withdrawal etc to conflict and when she is ready for recovery etc as well. So that why I report things I see here, thee are lots of things I do ignore and never mention as well. Well withdrawn people are withdrawn, not wanting to discuss anything and people in conflict are battling for what they want. So the signs of that are obvious. In one she is communicating clearly in the other she is not. What is confusing you is more the difference between foggy and non foggy. Foggy behaviour has no rhyme or reason. It is designed to keep you confused. You will get a smile followed by a tantruma nd then vice versa. And you will never get clear instructions. You will be kept in a state of anxiety and doubt. Foggy behaviour = bizarre and inconsistent. Non foggy behaviour = consistent, clear, words match actions. You will be in NO doubt as to when she is out of the fog.
What would you do if you were not afraid?
"Fear is the little death. Fear is the mind-killer" Frank Herbert.
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Ok indie so she is definitely withdrawn and somewhat foggy but keeps peeking out of it I think. I have my solo councilling session tomorrow which I need even for me to just get stuff out verbally just sort of feels that WW is going to need quite a few solo sessions to encourage her out of the fog
BH
Married 13yrs, togther 18yrs
1 son, 11yrs
DD: 27th July, Current status plan A
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Well am pissed off now she is now started watching tv alone in the spare room rather than together downstairs so now there NO time alone together
BH
Married 13yrs, togther 18yrs
1 son, 11yrs
DD: 27th July, Current status plan A
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Well am pissed off now she is now started watching tv alone in the spare room rather than together downstairs so now there NO time alone together This is WHY no expectations. Because as soon as you develop an expectation, the wayward will thwart it. And piss you off. Where did you get the idea she was set on watching TV with you every night? Expectations, that's where. You must become more zen. So what if she is watching TV in the spare room? Some spouses have to Plan A long distance from a different househould - or a different country!! She's only a few yards away and there are still gazillions of opportunities to meet ENS. Chill. She gets six months free trial of a great marriage and that opportunity to choose the marriage. If not, she ends up in Plan B. Its your call that you offer it and its her call to choose it. Please, relax!
What would you do if you were not afraid?
"Fear is the little death. Fear is the mind-killer" Frank Herbert.
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Evil me, would make bacon butties for the people watching TV in the living room. Bacon smells nice!
What would you do if you were not afraid?
"Fear is the little death. Fear is the mind-killer" Frank Herbert.
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And I'd open a bottle of wine. Or offer to run out and get a takeaway or some luxury ice cream.
Pop your head around the door, say you're getting some for yourself and would she like to share some with you?
If she says no, offer to bring her some up.
You aren't phased, you oh-so-confident man, you. See?
What would you do if you were not afraid?
"Fear is the little death. Fear is the mind-killer" Frank Herbert.
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GREAT advice, indie!
(DND -- THAT'S how you play it in Plan A!)
I started going out or doing something almost every night in Plan A -- taking the kids here, there, and everywhere -- baking at night, taking walks, joining a class, etc. -- always asking W if she wanted to join in...
Sometime yes, sometimes no...and then, SHE would be the one to initiate the activity OR suggest that we leave the kids at home this time...
Then I could see she started to turn...keep up the Plan A!
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Indie your my inspiration and keep me going just having a bad night tonight so thought bollox to her am laying in bed on phone playing games need to make myself feel better now
BH
Married 13yrs, togther 18yrs
1 son, 11yrs
DD: 27th July, Current status plan A
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GREAT advice, indie!
(DND -- THAT'S how you play it in Plan A!)
I started going out or doing something almost every night in Plan A -- taking the kids here, there, and everywhere -- baking at night, taking walks, joining a class, etc. -- always asking W if she wanted to join in...
Sometime yes, sometimes no...and then, SHE would be the one to initiate the activity OR suggest that we leave the kids at home this time...
Then I could see she started to turn...keep up the Plan A! All makes sense although I thought this would be I dependant behaviour or selfish demands?
BH
Married 13yrs, togther 18yrs
1 son, 11yrs
DD: 27th July, Current status plan A
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She was soooo fogged out, day to day, hour to hour...I put my best self forward -- never went out alone, mind you -- always family stuff, walks were just around the neighborhood, baked with the kids, etc.
My point is I was pleasant (bit alot of my tongue off!) and always invited her, wlecomed her -- it was SHE who would withdraw from me and the kids, and then feel the consequence. Again, she only did that a few times after exposure, but more often than not -- after the anger wore off -- she would accompany us and even initiate activities, like family bowling or just a dinner for us two.
I may have mentioned it before -- a few times, like taking the kids out for pizza or going for a moonlit walk, her first response was 'no', then actually called me on my cell to come back and get her so becasue she wanted to be with me/us.
Make sense?
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