Oh good heavens that describe Al's (my fiance) sister to a T...but she is not a wayward.

I was thinking Karma, that this discribed my Dad to a T, his expectations and paranoia as he learned while growing up

We never have figured that out. My mom divorced him when he had an affair, and insisted AP move in with us...

He is resting well in a nursing home from his altziemers, and of course, it's all in the past now.

Remembering what someone told me once about mental illness, self medicating, and how dreadful the consequences are to the clinically mentally ill

As Dr H has experience in that area, and with the drugs self enduced via the human mind, through the euphoria of what some call,"In Lurve", AKA the wild wayward mindset and yes, it's selfish and narcisstic manifestations, there is no wonder many find themselves here, on the rollercoaster. "Stop the world, I wanna get off"

Just thinking of those very wise words from the good book. "Buy the truth and sell it not"

Staying connected to the truth, who woulda thought...

My favorite spout of waywardspeak as of date...
"You will be sorry when I'm gone, all that I have sacrificed, all that I have given, so what I slipped and had a moment of weakness"

Sure I'm sorry, sorry for her, and the children at the loss of thier mom, but life goes on. Time heals all

Let's have some fun - anyone want to translate my WW's following statement? I can think of a few ways to translate it.

"You only live life once and I want to be happy."

Come on....go for it!

"I am feeling impulsive and entitled and darnit all I DESERVE to trample falconrap like dirt so I can feel good!"

Me, me, me....MEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Sorry who r u again standing there with your heart on the floor? Clean that mess up!

Sorry FC.. amazing they r all like that

I want to do just exactly what I want to and you people that I am responsible for, or vowed to be accountable to, are just getting in the way of my good time.

Remember you are here to make me happy, and instaead of discovering why I dont feel happy, I am blaming it on you, and your inability to make me feel happy anymore.

Yeah and along with all of that, I just wanted to add that your life does belong to me, and that I will stomp on it if it makes me happy..dont care why.. I just like it..


Yeah selfish and souless they are indeed, and by this time you can start to see it

For some reason I keep thinking of Toby Keith's "I Wanna Talk About Me" when she's says cr_p like that.

I also thought: I'm not happy, don't know why, but why can't you just get out of my way and let me be happy, even if I won't?

That thinking went really well with her blank stare at me when I asked why she couldn't be happy with me, especially if I found a way to fill all of needs and ways to have fun together. She just stared at me, stunned, without any response. I asked again and the stare continued. Must have been beyond the walls of her little reality. Not a question she was prepared to answer, especially since she probably knows, deep down, that I could make her happy.

Waywards are nuts.

Ok So its a she...I cannot answer for the members of the female gender, but I have been at the mercy of two womens, "I wanna have fun", bullcrap in my life..

Turns out they thoughly enjoyed having fun, and at my expense musta just made it more exciting.( You can read on this forum all about that too, and in Dr Harleys writings, He talks about the excitment factor also)

But to be fair, my second wife did feel sorry for having to cheat on me in order to have fun...yeah Bull, part of the web she wove and then became a victim of herself...They allways lose

They just can't accept that actions have consequences.

This reality must be considered when the betrayed spouse is working his/her Plan A.

If we MBers educate the betrayed spouse to anticipate their wayward will act nuts, we (hopefully) stop the betrayed spouse from giving credence to their wayward's nutty spew.
In my "carrot/stick" thread, I wrote the following based on Dr. Harley's advice.


I wish I had also written:

"Recognize the wayward's words are illogical and make no sense, and you throw their foggy babble into your mental trash bin, labeled as nonsense".

This thread about wayward fog can be a useful avenue of information for the betrayed working Plan A. Too many newly betrayed try to do a forensic on their troubled marriage based on wayward fog. Betrayed husbands, especially, are prone to listening to their foggy wives and try to "fix" what is wrong in the marriage based on the fog babble.

STOP DOING THAT !!!!!!!!!!

Don't argue with fog babble. Don't educate fog babble. Also, while I'm at it, don't try to teach your pig to play the violin. (apologies to pigs everywhere)


My point is this. Do not base your Plan A on what the wayward says.
The unhappy-messed-up-foggy-WH who wrote the original post on which this thread is based, underlines in CAPITAL LETTERS why we want you to follow Dr. Harley's advice and ignore your wayward's pile of verbal doo-doo.

Which is why we do not preach to waywards while they are foggy.

Ergo, we Plan A the "stick" and not just the "carrot".

Consequences can turn the wayward's head. Warnings of consequences? Not so much.

I'd like to see this discussion become a useful tool for Plan A MBers. More than a simple complaint thread. How can this knowledge that "Waywards are nuts" be of use to current and future betrayed spouses?

t/j the Queen has arrived! So good to see you again.....

You've got mail.

Hi Pep, good to have the author of the thread stop in..

How ya been?

How can the knowledge that WAYwards are nuts, be of use to current and future spouses?

Good question, and it could be its own thread I agree, but again we would have to go into the physiology of nuts, what it comes from and its nature, and blend it into the selfish nature previalent in human beings, and of course the thinking that.."We deserve to be happy and satisfied all the time"

They should name this age as, "The age of instant gratification", or "I wanna feel good and i want it right now", and maybe with a, "At everyones expense if nessesary" clause written in.

I would classify this as crazy, not possible, and not even probable really, but isnt this behind the average wayward activity? "Ive done enough and deserve more!!" seems to be the battle cry of all these poor waywards.

Now if you could get the waywards to examine themselves, and realize they are basically selfish and clinically nuts, that would be awesome, but they are ussually so wrapped up in themselves and thier fantasies, that the BS is in the way of...They are nuts, and will stop at nothing to have their way, spewing thier battle cry...


I suppose the feeling sorry for them because they are crazy and self-entitled can be a way out of the guilt they would have to feel if called "on the carpet", so to speak, by using hormones and life experiences, and whatever to coax them out of the trap they have fallen into, (Ahem), for there own good, and with promises of even better rewards,(highs emotionally and peace internally), might draw out some, but most of them are stomping thier feet, and don't want thier newfound freedom trampled on, once they have found the blissfulness of freedom. lol

If it can be of any practical use, the thread would have to address the obviuos. That the BS is not nuts, because the wayward tells them they are, But WS now that you bring it up..someone is nuts, and the facts show...


All of the fogbabble and wayward speak shows what is real or not. What is sad is it takes so long for BS to understand, that they have lost thier mind, or should I say given it away, for dreams and fantasies, that will never come true.

They are built on lies

Yeah ... I learned that lesson in my thread with a foggy mother in law. We made the mistake of actualy giving her the book HNHN before we confirmed that she was in fact in a full blown affair. ML gave me a 2x4 for that one. And in the end it only gave her MORE reason to leave her Hubby and cleave to her AP.

The next day when Wayward grandma finished reading the book HNHN (we gave it to her to read then after she went to bed, posted on MB that we loaned it to her)she said "after reading this book i learned that my hubby was in fact not being a good hubby at all!". I kick myself for giving her that book which may have fuled the demise even more (grandma blames me for ruining everything and I feel a bit guilty about it).. but her hubby could NOT man up and do that hard work ...we did it all .. and in the end she left him anyhow. Gave him 500k worth of property tho and now grandpa is messing around with Grandmas AP 's wife! YUCK!"

Moral of the story? DONT EDUCATE A WAYWARD! .. It doesnt work and I learned my lesson.

Yeah thats par for the course, a wayward will usually try to use the rules for a good marriage relationship against you, and seems to pull there justifications out of thin air.

Words mean little to them when they can bend them and twist the message around to the way they think.

They allready did that now didnt they? All we give them is just more ammunition.

Exposesure and plan B seems to drive the truth home, and then when they realize your seriuos, maybe they will listen, but the intoxicating drugs that come from an affair, or just wayward activity in general, still have thier effect, that needs to be dealt with fully and completely.

It takes time, but what good thing doesn"t?

I don't love you anymore. I don't respect you. I gave you two years to fix things and you did nothing. Where were you when I wanted to die every day? And now that there's a man you want to do something?!

All these things I heard last night when we got into an argument that started when she thought I was the one being cruel for looking to get a full time DAY job in the career which I've been doing for 20years. This means that we would have to pull our DD out of the pre-school that she just started two months ago. WW's brilliant idea is for me to work nights and/or weekends and still be SAHD so that DD can stay in pre-school which is 3 days/3hours per week.

Hardest part of fog babble is, near as I can tell being a newly BS, is watching the self-destruction as well as the familial destruction all the while she satisfies her need to "be happy", and wondering when/if she will ever come around to see the err of her ways. It's all fine to see it as fog babble, but not knowing if there will be a light at the end of the tunnel is killing me.

WW is involved in an A that exposure did not kill, and she feels great with that and all the attention she is getting from her new found drinking friends from work (most of which are guys).

She may eventually come around to see the error of her ways, but...it will be very hard. The entitlement in her is astonishing.

Bump

Bump

Bravo!