No, you love busted all over the place. A lot of men (or at least - me!) have trouble seeing where they are being disrespectful, so it's good to post here to get some help figuring it out. Usually a withdrawn and traumatized wife doesn't feel like being your coach to teach you how to stop disrespecting her.

Yep...you guys are right. I really did make some poor decisions last night. I just thought that I had to try to show that I care/ concerned and willing to help. But I am the worst person to offer any kind of advice to her right now. Also I reacted poorly to the friend calling her...but she does do it often and she was one of the reasons why I felt alienated in my relationship because my wife was always talking to her on the phone about the friends life problems but ignored attempts to talk about mine ( at work etc.). I would be lying if I did not acknowledge that as being my true feeling. The reality is though this was no excuse for what I did. I really never did talk about feelIngs about it back then before the affair without using love buster language and I still used love buster language last night.

Really would be taking advice on being on here more using you all for advice and support as well as Listening to Dr. Harley's radio programme more
regularly.

I guess a lot more pre planning has to go into these dates so I can avoid landmines.

I've been there!


It's not wrong to feel bothered by something your spouse does. And if you tell them you should just stick to saying that: "It bothers me when you ..."


It takes some time to build new habits.

It also takes a lot of consistent, diligent effort.

My wife currently lives with her parents. When we discussed it a frw days before she said it would have no problem because she would pick up the kids from school and drop them home to stay with the parents. It's only on her getting home did she call me to indicate that noone else was home yet. I said no problem, took it on the chin and we agreed to just have dinner alone instead. My wife always had issues with trusting babysitters (before the affair I would try to plan nights out and arrange for babysitting but she was always uncomfortable with the idea). I guess I could have offered to have the kids stay with my mom but I did not know well in advance that there were going to be any problems on this occasion. In the future I would offer upfront to take care of baby sitting arrangements.

The issue she was having with her parents that week ( she said at dinner last night) had to do with them not respecting the way she wants the kids to be cared for. She said they tend to tell her what she is doing wrong but not help in her doing it right.

I actually think my mere presence is a source of her unhappiness. I don't even have to say anything really.

I feel like I'm walking on eggshells. I know that this isn't about me but apart from my personal counsellor and this forum I have no else to speak to about how I'm feeling about this process. I'm just going to stick to the programme learn from my mistakes and others advice and keep improving.

Not too keen on taking antidepressants because I'm afraid of side effects. The OW I was with took them and abused them. She tried to get me to take them because I was often down after I was separated from my BS but I saw the effect it had on her behavior and avoided it.

Even when I came out of my fog and realized how many relationships/ lives I destroyed because of my affair I had a serious bout of depression which landed me in hospital and even then I avoided taking them. I preferred to go the root of thorough counselling and joined a mental health day programme for two months. I still get sad about this entire situation but I have tools now to avoid going into depression.

We'll give you all the help we can. Some suggestions:


That kind of criticism is murder on wives. (Anyone, really.) We had to cut off contact with my parents for years because they treated my wife like this. (And me, too, come to think of it.)

So understand that your wife, from what I'm reading, is MISERABLE. Her husband had an affair and doesn't seem to get her, her parents are criticizing her and she has to live with them - I imagine there is not much brightness in her life at all.

So:


It sounds like you weren't the problem, though, at least not at first. Her initial conflict was with her parents. You have potential here to do something tricky: become the friend she talks to for support. That's DIFFICULT to do right (you can't be judgmental or disrespectful or express criticism of her OR her parents), but you need to do it because it deposits a LOT of love units.

If you can become the man that she can safely talk to her about her problems (safe means you aren't demanding, disrespectful, or angry - and disrespect includes unsolicited advice), you have the potential for her to really and truly fall deeply in love with you.

Find and read Dr. Harley's article and chapter on the "friends and enemies of good conversation." Review that material daily and practice it every time you are talking to her. This is the road map to the love bank deposits that you need to make for you guys to recover.


There's a lot of practical suggestions here:
* find more babysitters that can be acceptable to your wife! Obviously reliance on her parents is stressing her terribly. (Don't make any demands on this subject, though.)
* take care of as much of the arrangements as she will let you take care of. (Again, no demands: don't get upset if she doesn't want you to make arrangements.)
* if she is planning to make arrangements for an evening and it doesn't work out, do not become demanding, disrespectful, or angry about it (blaming would be disrespectful - even if you think that it is factually, objectively "her fault," expressing this is disrespectful and will set you guys back)
* make the dates better with the friends of good conversation and avoiding the enemies so that getting away from the kids feels WORTH IT
* fill the rest of the time when you are not dating with concrete acts of care. Do whatever you can do for her. Become her partner in life.

Here.
Conversation is Boring

I understand to some extent. My mother abused prescription drugs, so I try to avoid medications like the plague.

In my case, I took LexaPro, and the side effects were minimal. For the most part I didn't feel like I was taking anything. It did take both the highs and the lows off of my mood, which was really exactly what I needed. It might have depressed my sex drive to some extent, but I'm still not sure if that's the drug or the fact that our relationship wasn't going well at the time.

I think Dr. Harley tends to suggest Wellbutrin as really having minimal side effects, particularly minimal sexual side effects.


Even if you aren't fully "depressed," if you are feeling so emotional that you tend to become disrespectful or angry, I really recommend it. When you experience setbacks on your road to recovery, when your wife's mood takes a downturn, if your habit is to first reach for disrespect or anger or demands, you are going to shoot yourself in the foot with a bazooka over and over again. It's helpful to have something blocking your brain from making every silence and every downturn into a catastrophe.

Here's a good radio clip also. Tell us what you think.

Radio Clip on Conversation

Wellbutrin is an atypical antidepressant.

There are sexual side effects, but it is typically an increase in sex drive. Also, side-effects for weight is typically weight loss.

I'm thinking about requesting it myself for cessation of tobacco use, as well as the antidepressant effects.

And, FYI;

I deal with several patients across multiple life stages on various antidepressants - most reports of side effects per anecdote are poor representatives of the effectiveness of these medications, as well as poor representations of the statistical probability of experiencing any side effects.

Most of these medications take up to 3 weeks to take effect, different drugs of the same class may be more or less effective depending on the person, side effects under the same banner.


That being said, if you choose to look into this option, do know that - again - it will take up to 3 weeks for the medication to start being effective. And, you will want to monitor for adverse effects and communicate closely with your physician.

Lots of good suggestion Markos. Thanks. I've been doing well lately avoiding the key love busters ( this is not just my opinion my BS highlights when I've committed a love buster offense). We both make it a point to try and point it out. The difficulty is those little grey areas like giving unsolicited advice which I need to pay attention to. It's hard for me to not try and overcompensate for the pain I caused by trying to seize every opportunity to give what I may think is helpful advice...but I need to understand that I can't be doing that.

Thanks for the article and the video. I have a couple questions from this though

As I mentioned in an earlier post my BS and I have been spending at most 8 hours a week either on conversation ( mostly by phone) or whilst doing a recreational activity. It's been mostly because she started a new job which takes up at least 10 hours of her time a day. Because she just started she is trying to hit the ground running hard. She's a chemist by the way so some of the experiments require a lot of set up time. She has even had to leave home late at night to go check in on experiments from time to time. Something else she did when we were happily married. Anyways the question is how do we get to even having a conversation about spending more time together? I've tried introducing the conversation a couple times but stop once I realize that she believes I'm trying to be demanding. I'm thinking once the time we currently spend becomes more enjoyable she'll want to find more time to spend.

Secondly my BS told me that she hadn't finished reading love busters...I'm sensing that she way be losing interest in the process. Is their anything I can do to encourage her? I'm thinking I just continue doing the things the programme asks for and hopefullyy enthusiasm will rub off on her.

Thanks for the information and suggestions regarding antidepressants. Will be thinking about it. There is another factor in all of this which is my BS opinion. Had a conversation about the medication I was on during my therapy last year. I rejected taking the anti depressants my therapist prescribed but agreed to take zopiclone for the sleep disorder I was faced with. Also been sticking to a new vitamin regime and encouraging my BS to start taking vitamins because she's recently been complaining of lacking energy during the day. She like me is adverse to taking medication so I think it's best we talk about it before I take any new ones.

Not that I even think it's even necessary right now. I'm usually in a positive mood and my strategy for avoiding depression developed from my Day programme works fine. But I'll still think about the advice.

Thanks!

For some, A.D's are great, but for addicts and/or those with addictive personalities they can be a disaster.


Alternatives;
St John's Wort
Ignatia; Homeopathic Remedy
Exercise
Set healthy goals
Healthy diet
Eat regularly scheduled meals
Sleep on a regular schedule
Keep your day scheduled
Eliminate T.V. and Video Games
Vitamin D and/or sun light can decrease tired feelings

Etc...

Your plan for dealing with depression is already working well, so stick with it.

Have you found a job yet?

With everything that has happened with your adultery, I'd bet that Financial Support (FS)is a key need/issue for your wife.

What/how are you doing with this?

Still looking for a job. It's been slim pickings finding something in my field. Starting to look for jobs outside of my field.

My wife and I actually did our ENQ's. Financial support was on the bottom of the list but Family Support was her fifth. I know the two kinda go hand in hand so it's starting to become an issue for me that I haven't found a job yet. Been paying for expenses for kids and recreational activities with my savings which is about to run out. Starting to become anxious.

Good!

should take a week or two and then you can continue your search inside your field.



I believe that given your current financial position, that FS is near the top of her list. That EN may drop down again once it's met, but until then, you need to consider it extremely important.

I would bet she has no interest in reconciling if you are unemployed.... Hence, FS is vital for recovery.

Yep. A fair bit of the opportunities in my field are not in country but in other islands...but now is not a good time to be away from my wife or kids. There are so many concerns I have even regarding the kids development that are on my mind that need paying attention too...some aren't directly related to marriage reconciliation but inevitably are indirectly related.