I imagine it could be challenging to focus intently to a program in a second language.

He is actually is getting better at it. The first videos, we stopped every now and then to make sure he was understanding. The last one we saw he did just fine. He is even getting admiration from understanding more english now .

Excellent!
English is my first language and I still found it useful to view the videos more than once!

How about "I felt hurt by your Independent Behavior yesterday when you called to inform me that you would be working late. I would love it if we could start reading the Independent Behavior section in the LoveBuster Book. Are you willing to do that with me?".

markos has hit it right on the nose! And great point about keeping any LB'ers out of it or else he will get mixed messages regarding how important the finances are to you.

I LB'ed my H over finances (he had snuck a lot of debt to finance his A) at the beginning of recovery. That was setting us up for failure because my H's instinct was to "do the right thing" and try to pay off all of his debt "on his own"�which in essence meant over and above the 40 hours per week of work. NOT what I wanted at all! Anything from here forward that is "on his own" is IB. We had to learn to POJA all of it, even the wreckage of the past�without LB'ers!You are doing AWESOME Alada! Yay to the admiration!

Aww thank you, I get my own points too!!

The evening was a little awkward, I didn't want to bring the topic unless we were really ready to discuss it, but I was feeling down. He asked and I told him straight that I was not happy about the way he took his decision, I did not say I was mad for him going to this seminar. He didn't took it well. We stopped there for a while and talked about other stuff. We came back later to talk about it.

He then said he would not go to the seminar, if that is what I wanted. He has a history of silently doing things the way I want even when he is unhappy. I explained to him that the problem was not actually him going to the seminar, but the way he handled the decission making process. He was stuck in this it's-my-work-my responsability idea. He was getting a little worked up, so again we stopped the discussion.
For third time, we tried again. This time he had decided already he was not going to the semiar. I asked him if he was enthusiastic about it, of course he was not. So I asked him for alternatives. He had none. I actually gave him a couple of alternatives to cover our UA time while he was attending his seminar. He was surprised and he actually liked them all.

At the end, he said he was sorry for not knowing what to do. This morning we woke up earlier to spend some time together, we will have lunch together since his seminar is about 15 mins away from campus (no, he is not comming to pick me up at campus, even when OW is not here, I don't want him close by), and we will put kids to bed earlier to enjoy some more UA time. I know it is not an ideal set up for UA, but it works for both of us, and it will only be two days!!

Sounds perfect and to the point the way that you explained your unhappiness to your H.

Good thinking, he shouldn't be anywhere near your campus. And neither should you, but I know that you're working on getting a new job.

And great POJA'ing and coming up with enthusiastic agreements that work for both of you. I am impressed!

BS2013, I had a long post on your thread but I didn't want to hijack it, so I cut it and put it here.

Hubby has a history of being very unexpresssive. I can count how many times I have seen him crying with one hand. When we got married we moved to the USA, it was a different culture and different language. It was hard on us, but specially on him. I was doing my Ph.D. back then and I AO a lot. I hurt him a lot and I'm sure he felt very vulnerable in this new country with no friends and with a crazy wife. I remember he was often sick the first year. Now that I think of it, it maybe was his way of letting out so much stress.
So he turned even more unexpressive. He would do everything I said, with no beep to it. So I assumed he was happy with my decissions and never bothered asking. Again his unexpressiveness got deeper and deeper.

When I found out about the A, and I confronted him, he was very unexpressive, I guess that is to be expected. When he went NC, there were no signs of depression or anything. When I did exposure, he showed no emotions again. I have asked him if he got mad about exposure, but he says he felt nothing about it.

Now that we are working on R it feels to me that hubby is unexpressive as well. He shows affection if I ask him to, but stops once I feel satisfied, then I ask him again and the cycle starts. I honestly don't think he is in love with me, and it hurts so much. I feel like I'm picking up crumbs from his love. He is entusiastic about the online program and the R, but I don't think he gets it yet. He says he has done so much work, and I do agree he left college, got a new job, texts me every so often to let me know where he is, helps with the house. But you see, he is doing things that do not directly do love bank deposits.

Whenever we had SF he seems so unattached to me. I can see his eyes are not what you call filled with love.

These past weeks have been hard to get UA time. He is now obssesed with work. We tried scheduling our UA time for this week, and we can hardly agree to have 15 hrs. I feel he is not giving me the chance to fill his love bank.

If I give him affection, he just shrugs it off. SF, he is not engaged with me. His third EN is Physical attractiveness, and that one is a little tricky. The first trime we did the questionarie, he said he wanted me to look more juvenile (is not the exact word in spanish, but somethink like that) and I felt hurt because OW is 15 yrs younger than me, and I feel he wants me to look like her. I really don't know how to get to his heart.

Hi Alada, I have to get to work now, but I wanted to make a quick post to ask you how long was his affair with this woman?

What snooping do you have in place to be certain of no contact? I want to be certain that it is rock solid and there is no unaccounted for time. Also that you are snooping emails, phone, texts, etc.

I'll think about the rest of your post today and I'll be back later tonight to reply.

The A lasted about three weeks according to hubby. As he said, the third week, he was comming to the realization that what he was doing was wrong. He said he left his FB open so I could catch it and help him end the A. In the note I found, OW was saying to hubby how she felt he didn't like her kisses.

After he ended the A, he stayed home for about 3 mos, and my mom was helping with babe, so he was not alone at home at all. OW did call hubby a few times after exposure, when my mom was there. So after I found out about these calls I told mom and she was all ears. One of our EP's is to never go somewhere else when you get a call, so whenever he receives a call, I can hear what he is saying.

I have gps on his phone, he changed his phone number. There is no email or FB for him. I do check his cell phone every day both calls and texts. He is not very tech savy and he has a new cell, so I don't think he knows how to erase calls or text. He tried erasing the call OW make to his old cell phone but couldn't, thats how I found out. I have showed up unannounced to his work a few times to make sure he is there.

I guess the only thing I'm missing is his heart...

What was your relationship like when you were dating? How did he behave then? What about him caused you to fall in love with him?

Good! I like that he answers his calls while you are there.

How about at work? Could he get phone calls at work from OW? Could he email with her from there? I don't like it that the OW was brazen enough to keep calling him, but I do remember from your radio show that Dr. H stated that they look at affairs much more laid back in Mexico (you are in Mexico, right?)

It's obvious that you care for him very much and I am so sorry for the heartbreak that you are enduring. So long as you both are present and working on moving forward with learning MB techniques, things will consistently get better. They absolutely will. My H was always unexpressive also. I remember a few times when I saw alligator tears, like when we gave birth, when we miscarried at 6 months, when he lost his fingers�but mostly was stoic and has always gone off by himself to grieve.

My experience was probably different than yours Alada, because of my H's long term affair. When my H truly had NC, oh my goodness I knew it with every fiber of my being. He would wake up howling so badly that I bet that our neighbors assumed that we suddenly invited Frankenstein to move in with us. And we live in a rural area lol.

Anyway, what I wanted to address is that my hubby was also very closed off to me until just recently. I think that he opened up a lot more simply because of my witnessing his withdrawal. It took some time for him to be at all present in our conversation. I think that as time goes on, you will notice this change in your hubby also.

You are figuring out your contribution to the state of the marriage. But you know that does not excuse an affair, right?

I'm not minimizing your pain at this because I did the same and still tend to beat myself up. I hazard a guess (please forgive me if I am wrong) that you and I are both very driven women?

Our pastor said a WONDERFUL thing to me when I told him the very same thing. He said "how cool is that? You BOTH bring such wisdom to the marriage that if you will learn to POJA, can you just imagine what you can accomplish together?".

More tomorrow on the rest of your post.

Alada; when everything else goes well, the SF will improve.

Right away, what sticks out is that you aren't getting in enough UA time.

15 hours is to MAINTAIN romantic love once it has been restored.

You need 25+ hours each week to restore it!

That is where your focus should be.

It will take time for the two of you to learn to make love bank deposits in the way that each of you like it. I know what you mean about things not hitting the mark, but they will.
Same here Alada, but my H also says the same thing about my eyes. I think that this is something else that will take time. Once you two get the gist of POJA and can do it fairly and successfully, you can POJA about SF. We have only been in real R for three months, and we have only just now begun to POJA SF things (it was too hard for me to stay pleasant because of mind tapes before now). We have to trust what everyone else who has gone before us says�that if we follow MB, we WILL build a passionate marriage that is better than ever.

This program doesn't work without the UA time. I'd venture to say that it may be THE most important part of the program. I'm not yet enjoying much of our UA time, but we still get over 30 hours per week (we do not have young children at home any more), and if we ever have to go one day without it, I am right back down the roller coaster. Can you two make a schedule TODAY for the rest of the week?

I have those hurts also Alada. I think that all of us BS will have them. For recovery though, it is our jobs to do our best to not think that way, and instead to take present things at face value and work together to meet each other's needs. Our spouse needs to have a safe environment to be radically honest with us. So long as your H was pleasant in his honesty, the two of you could re-visit that need and POJA about what things you could try to meet that need. Maybe he is just meaning clothing style, or hair style, you see? It may not really mean that he wishes that you were younger.

My H was RH about my clothing and it was also difficult for me to hear. I have my own business and I work all day in t-shirts. We agreed that I would try to stop work early and get nicer clothes on before H gets home from work. Who-HOOO! It worked instantly that he gave me a lot more attention when he got home. Then that went over so well that we went out shopping together for some nice sweaters for me that we both liked. We had *never* shopped together before in 33 years lol. That time was one of the first UA times that I enjoyed in our recovery so far. It was fun!

We were in a church group, and we didn't really do much together other than church. We were really involved. For him it was love at first sight, I guess the physcial part is so important to him. I was dating someone else when I met him, so the "hard" part of getting me really turned him on. When we were then dating, I was always smiling, laughing and happy. I was very social. I'm not any of these anymore. I can smile but not laugh out loud, at least not much. I'm not social at all now. He is a social butterfly. He thrives in social settings, I on the other hand feel so much pressure to be around peers.

I have been trying to reach to old friends, to set up a big gathering. I can be social and relax with them, I think, maybe that will help.

That is so true HH, but as I said he is obssesed with work now. If I ask him to come home early he will, but not enthusiastically and eventually he will call it out as a SD. I think we are doing better this week, we have 8 hrs so far. With little kids is hard to schedule 20 hrs or more.

Another caveat is that my older daughther is behaving really strange lately. I asked her and she said she misses his dad. Hubby was a SAHD for almost 3 mos. So DD7 needs also time with his dad.

We ususally have field trips from my work during the weekends, but we are free this and next weekend, I hope I can put more hours into our UA time.

BS you have given me a lot of food for thought, I appreciate you take the time to write to me with so much detail.

I need to sit down and think what you have pointed out. I will get back soon.

BlindS, I found this on your thread


This is so true, I'm so afraid to be madly in love with hubby and have him so unattached to me. I feel we are reaching that treshold for me, but not for him. I feel so vulnerable and afraid to be hurt again.

Alada,


This program does not work when UA is not taken seriously.

Dr. Harley has refused to work with people who will not fulfill the UA requirement.

25+ hours a week to create/restore romantic love, and 15 hours a week to maintain it.

Even people who have had recovered marriages for years can tell you that they can feel when UA is off for just 1 week.


It is critical to your marriage, and more important to your recovery than anything else that has been posted in the past several pages.


If you do not get in your UA time, your marriage will not recover.


If your husband won't commit to UA time, he is not committed to recovery.

UA time is not a selfish demand.

Furthermore, Alada, your UA must be time alone with each other, without your children, without your friends. YOU must feel that you are getting your husband's full attention, otherwise it doesn't "count" as UA time.

Dr. Harley advised me that I will know when I am receiving my husband's undivided attention. What happens is a chemical reaction. Oxytocin is released in the brain (esp of women) when we are feeling that strong connection with our husband.

Dr. Harley advised my husband and I to try hugging and kissing, for a long as it took for me to feel the rush of oxytocin. This was a turning point in our recovery, because I now knew the feeling I was looking for during our UA time.

What I discovered is that we RARELY had true UNDIVIDED ATTENTION during our UA time. Yes, we spent the hours together, doing the planned activities. But it was not really enjoyable for me. And so, I wasn't responding to my husband the way HE wanted, so both of us we getting bored and frustrated. Which made us even less likely to want to have UA time.

What are your husband's top EN's?