OK, my story;

WH searched out old girlfriend on 16/1/14 apparently for business development ( or because he wasn't sure he could love me the way he should and had residual feelings for OW which he needed to resolve, depending on which day I ask) contact established 20/3/14. PA began 20/5/14. Viagra use began 14/6/14. Affair discovered by me 24/10/14. confession 26/10/14. NC 2/11/14, 10/12/14 and finally on 6/2/15. She is no longer a client of his firm.

Text and emails I have confirm this and that he always maintained that he loved me and would never leave me.

We have been trying to rebuild ever since, not very successfully. I didnt get to SAA until February when PTSD wore off finally. And there has been alot of very stupid behaviour on my part. ( Burning his porn and dope, sledgehammer to motorbike, physical fights)

I first found MB forum 12/12/14 and WH and I read HNHN and FLSL together on holiday in January. We've done the EN questionaire. Trying to get enough QT. Our farm is for sale. He has stopped the porn and the marijuana. We are both trying very hard but we are not being effective. He only wants to talk to me. ( all our friends and family know, but there is no-one he can talk to) After 4 months hard work he can now name his feelings and talk to me about them which is awesome, but I am exhausted with being his counsel and feel more like his mother than his wife.

Yesterday we decided to rent the farm and move to a city 5 hours away as the constant triggers are too much for me with the OW working and living 5 minutes from his job and me being 1.5 hours away at home. He always asks if I want to come with him and is totally open with his life, physical and digital.

We are both now concerned that he can't meet my EN; HO, IC and SF.SF is difficult since HB wore off 6 weeks ago.

I keep ending up in Love Busters as my LB is so low. My LB's are SD, DJ AO. WH love busters are IB W D.

I'm so tired and I feel stuck.
Thank you for your help.

Welcome to MB.

Was the OW married? Who did you expose to on OW's side?

Has he changed all his contact information?

Are you having angry outbursts (AO)? Is he?

How are you confirming NC with the OW?

In addition to the constant triggers, it is also very possible for him to carry on his A when he works so closely to her. NC is next to impossible when he could run into her on the street in that close proximity. It sounds like you have already made the very necessary decision to end that job and move far away, good for you.

How did contact continue after the initial NC? Has he changed all methods for OW to contact him; cell#, email address, etc?

Thanks Brainhurts.

The OW is not married. She is the ex-wife of an important politician and was a large client for the duration of the A. WH work knows and is supportive of our marriage ( small co. whom I also contract to occaisionally) OW continued to email WH after first NC. WH ignored them but shared with me, they confirmed NC on his part altough I could have done without the attachments ! Together we sent nasty email on our wedding anniversary (yay) and nothing since. WH and I agree if there is any further contact we will contact her boss through our lawyer re harrassment. There is only her two adult sons to expose to. There is no-one else in her life.

Work contact remains the same but OW is blocked. Done last week by his IT people as per my request of 7/2/14. He is not on facebook or anything else. I installed Dr wondershare and datamine his phone once a week with his approval.

I am having AO he is not. We both go into withdrawal and I run away (sometimes for an hour sometimes over night) everytime I find another lie or lack of openness. We are both trying to change that. We agree the marriage is the best its ever been for 1 day out of seven then falls down over three days, is hell for 48 hours and then brilliant again. We are getting exhausted by the rollercoaster and cant seem to stop it. hence the move and hopefully some decent counselling.

WH is working on his courage to POJ (telling me what HE enthusiastically agrees to instead of what he thinks I want) which we have both been doing for 20 years. WH says I fill his LB easily (Admiration, HO, DS, SF, Affection) and when he is happy he forgets that I am not. He is more aware of this now and it is putting pressure on him.

I have nailed the SD's but not DJ's or AO. Frustration level goes through the roof and I almost faint with rage. ( better than it was , no more blackouts, not vomiting and shaking, skin not crawling, can eat and sleep at least 4 hours - so definately improving :-)

Hi Unwritten,

He will continue the same job but can do it online mostly and his boss is happy to rearrange so that we can move.

Contact was by email and phone and these remain the same as they are work ones, but OW has been blocked on both. He offered to let me install GPS, I told him I had :-) He makes sure to be home before 5.30 (its a 1-2 hour commute) and I have a friend who occaisionally checked that her car is at work still. He works from home as much as possible now. We moved here 2 years ago from his work location and all our friends, our son and family are there. They are now aware and watching and he knows that. Im trying not to be suspicious and let other people do that for me as it just empties my LB and Im a bit OCD about it anyway !

Sorry I didn't answer your question Unwritten,

NC on his part I confirmed from OW's emails to him saying how much she missed him; how 'he said to give her 3 months to sort it out and its been 2 months' etc, etc also no time unaccounted for, confirmed by work mates.

thanks,

Please tell us what he's done from this list.

From Surviving an Affair, pg 66-67

The extraordinary precautions do more than end marriage-threatening affairs; they help a couple form the kind of relationship they always wanted.

These recommendations may seem rigid, unnecessarily confining, and even paranoid to those who have not been the victim of infidelity. But people like Sue and Jon, who have suffered unimaginable pain as a result of an affair that spun out of control, can easily see their value. For the inconvenience of following my advice, Sue would have spared herself and Jon the very worst experience of their lives.


Checklist for How Affairs Should End

_____The unfaithful spouse should reveal information about the affair to the betrayed spouse.

_____The unfaithful spouse should make a commitment to the betrayed spouse to never see or talk to the lover OP again.

_____The unfaithful spouse should write a letter to the lover OP ending the relationship and send it with the approval of the betrayed spouse.

_____The unfaithful spouse should take extraordinary precautions to guarantee total separation from the lover OP:

_____Block potential communication with the lover OP (change e-mail address and home and cell phone numbers, and close all social networking accounts; have voice messages and mail monitored by the betrayed spouse).

_____Account for time (betrayed spouse and wayward spouse give each other a twenty-four-hour daily schedule with locations and telephone numbers).

_____Account for money (betrayed spouse and wayward spouse give each other a complete account of all money spent).

_____Spend leisure time together.

_____Change jobs and relocate if necessary.

_____Avoid overnight separation.

_____Allow technical accountability.

_____ Expose affair to family members, clergy, and/or friends.

Hi Donna! Welcome to Marriage Builders. I am sorry for the reasons that brought you here. You are definitely doing many things right, but there are a couple of red flags here that concern me. I wanted to discuss them:


My concern here is that he has the same email address and can be contacted by the OW. Just blocking her email address does nothing. Even the dumbest cheater can figure out how to email from another address. As long as he has that email address, he is at HIGH RISK of an affair resumption. Your husband �ignoring but sharing them with� you is meaningless. Showing you the email [which he may or may not do] does not mitigate the trigger that leads to resumption of affairs. She may contact him at a weak moment and the affair will resume.


Any spy resource he knows of is useless. It just tells him how to hide better and does nothing for you. It won�t help you regain trust and only helps him hide an affair better.


This is good. He needs to share his feelings with you, but it has to be in a way that is ATTRACTIVE to you. If he is �exhausting� you, then he needs to clean up his conversation and do a better job. And he most certainly should NEVER be talking about his affair, or any mistakes/tragedies/unhappiness of the past. His conversation should be pleasant and enjoyable for you.


STOP all love busters now. Stop talking about the affair and focus on Conversation, affection, sexual fulfillment and rec companionship during at least 20 hours of UA time per week. That will restore your marriage the fastest.

What is this 3 months? The fact that she knows his email address means he is at high risk for an affair resumption.

And I just want to assure you that your H absolutely can continue his affair and you would never know it. His coworkers cannot be with him every second of the day. He is free to contact her from a free work phone and meet up with her at lunch. I am not trying to upset you, but you must understand that this is not a safe situation. I understand you have taken steps to move and that will be ONE solution. But you need to make him change his email address and get some TRUE spy resources in place.

Put an absolute halt to anything in your relationship that leaves you feeling like his mother NOW. I lived like that nearly my entire marriage of 27 years and you are correct in your assessment that it is exhausting and I will also add unhealthy for you and your relationship. That type of relationship will breed Love Busting behaviors & potentially withdrawal.

_The unfaithful spouse should reveal information about the affair to the betrayed spouse.

Done. Alot of I don't remembers initially but since no more marijiuana WH has answered all questions. My problem is if I ask ( as I did yesterday) Do you think of OW? He replies: no. Then after further interrogation. He does but only in a negative way. ie: he makes sure he takes a different route to see a supplier so that he is not driving past her house. If I don't ask the correct question in the correct way he doesnt associate it. This concerns me. There is no voluntary disclosure. My request to be told of anything that might upset me now so there are no more love bombs is difficult for him as he has blocked alot out and doesn't associate answers that I would.

_____The unfaithful spouse should make a commitment to the betrayed spouse to never see or talk to the lover OP again.

Done and maintained since 1/12/14

_____The unfaithful spouse should write a letter to the lover OP ending the relationship and send it with the approval of the betrayed spouse.

Done. 1/12/14 and again 6/2/15

_____The unfaithful spouse should take extraordinary precautions to guarantee total separation from the lover OP:

_____Block potential communication with the lover OP (change e-mail address and home and cell phone numbers, and close all social networking accounts; have voice messages and mail monitored by the betrayed spouse).

He has no private email or social networking. Only work cell and laptop which I monitor with WH and his bosses approval.Can't change work email or cell ( loss of business) but has blocked OW and all work and home is monitored by me.

_____Account for time (betrayed spouse and wayward spouse give each other a twenty-four-hour daily schedule with locations and telephone numbers).

Done.

_____Account for money (betrayed spouse and wayward spouse give each other a complete account of all money spent).

Done.

_____Spend leisure time together.
All time except for work and farm ( which we do together) is spent with me.

_____Change jobs and relocate if necessary.
Relocation has been our plan but as house has not sold we are renting it and relocating asap to try to ease the stress.

_____Avoid overnight separation.
He does not have any overnight seperation. None for either of us in duration of affair. I have had four weeks in total away since D-Day. Some unavoidable commitments and some escaping. He texts me a photo of him at home and a friend of mine comes over to check and have coffee ( at his request) to reassure me.

_____Allow technical accountability.

Done. Total access to computer and iphone.

_____ Expose affair to family members, clergy, and/or friends.

I disclosed to my friends and family and at my request he told our son and his boss. It took longer to get him to disclose to his family. They are not close.

Don't ever ask this question or interrogate him again. It only keeps the OW top of mind for you both. Leave the past in the past. This talk makes your present life unpleasant. The affair should never be discussed again unless it pertains to a current situation, such as the OW's ability to contact him at work.



Any monitoring that he knows about is utterly useless.



Awesome!! This is the most promising part of your plan. It will reap fantastic benefits.


i would make plans to avoid all overnight separation. Can you take him with you? The photos and the checking in on him is not a reliable safety measure.


This would be achieved if you secretly placed spyware on his phone. With an iPhone, you can retrieve everything and install spyware so you can watch everything. But he should NEVER EVER know about it. If he knows, then he can work around it. Telling him about your spy resources renders them useless and will do nothing to restore trust to your marriage.


What were your son and the boss told? The wayward is not typically a good exposer.

Thanks SKD I will stop this 'counselling' behaviour now. It has been my habit for 20 years too and I need to change it.

hi MelodyLane.

Thank you for your input. Very clarifying.

Our son and WH work were told the truth.
We have tried to give DS as little informaton as possible but if he asks he is told the truth. We have both talked to him regularly and I am confident that WH is being clear, honest and supportive.
Both bosses at work have spoken with me and I am confident that WH's disclosure was full, honest and contrite.

Coversation re: thinking of other woman was regarding blocking email as I asked why it took 3 weeks to do and was told that the IT dept have stopped all incoming mail and text from her work and home and cell and these are now directed to her boss in case of a request (legallay obliged) for any information or resources from her company. WH boss is happy to deal with this.This has required some conversation and a site visit to reboot server ( I can confirm this with their IT rep if I wish)

I agree that known spyware does not alieviate my suspicions. I dont think he knows Im searching his phone and PC, he offered me carte blanche with them 3 months ago and I said I didnt want to be investigating him anymore and spending any more of my time snooping. This was after I got to the bottom of the lies and evasions and we went from SAA to recovery. I will investigate otherways of getting around company firewalls to install software.

Overnight seperations should not be a problem any longer as the last of my commitments are done.

Stopping the love busters and WH learning how to meet my EN's are the two major works in progress while we try to relocate. When my LB is negative we both withdraw from each other and get stuck.

Discussion yesterday regarding honesty and openness and POJ's were clarifying and we have found that we both love each others favourite activities ( motorbike and dancing) we have invested in these and when it gets tricky we jump on the bike and go for a swim or dance in the kitchen until we laugh again. It's remembering to do these BEFORE we crash.

Going to go write it on the blackboard !

Thank you so much, Support really does help. I stopped talking to friends and family as I got sick of having to feel grateful !

Thanks for the answers, Donna! I would sit down with him on your own and tell him much more. For example, he should know the basic facts about the affair and most especially the OW's full name. I would show him her picture. You can also tell him how much this has devastated you.


All it takes is one email from another email address to get through and then the affair is back on again. This is why it is so critical for a wayward to change all of his contact information after an affair.


There are several good ways to get spyware on an iPhone. Read this thread: http://forum.marriagebuilders.com/ubbt/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2832187#Post2832187






It is critical that you focus now on the top 4 intimate emotional needs of affection, conversation, sexual fulfillment and recreational companionship by going out on 4 - 4 hour dates a week. That will restore the romantic love in your marriage. Are you familiar with the policy of undivided attention?


A good idea is to schedule 4 4 hour dates outside of the house. Time spent together at home is typically useless because it is too easy to get distracted by chores, phone, etc. UA time spent at home is lousy and ineffective.

If you make these changes, especially not talking about the affair and eliminating love busters, you will start seeing a huge difference in how you feel very fAST.

By "poj's" do you mean the policy of joint agreement?

Sorry MelodyLane. Yes POJ being Policy of joint agreement.

WH thought POJ meant agreeing to what I wanted because letting me do what I want makes him happy. Getting him to say 'no I don't agree' is the hardest part. This has been a problem for many years so its taking a while for

Farm chores are getting in the way of UA which we are on top of this week. WH has agreed to start keeping a QT diary so we can see what is effective. We re-read UA yesterday and he has a better understanding of the need to make the time we spend together effective instead of just drivel talk or TV or 'companiable silence' which I don't enjoy at the moment as it gives my brain time to wander down the wrong paths.

We can't change his work cell or email address. Its been discussed but it's just too disruptive to the company and his clients. Financially everyone suffers too much. I will read the thread on spyware. Thank you.

If you leave these door open you are setting yourself up for a False Recovery.

Can't he send a message to all customers with the new contact information? Your marriage should come first.

Read this.
False Recovery-Need Voices of Experience