We didn't have that many conflicts in reality. Most of the time we agree on things. However, the problem was working them out amicably. In recent years she would just sit on them and they would stay unresolved. Other times, she will just go with my opinion but I can feel she's seething because of it.

An example is about remodeling our house. She loves HGTV and wanted to do some work on various things on the house. I told her that's fine, why don't you start interviewing contractors and get their bids, then we can set up a budget? However, I have learned she hates making decisions. So she just saw a couple places, felt overwhelmed as she didn't have the knowledge, and then didn't want to do anything. She wanted me to be involved but at the time, I felt she's only working 20 hours a week and most of these guys are easier to book during the week, she has plenty of free time to do a good job on this project.
Of course, now I realize my mistake (after reading HNHN, even though you don't recommend it). I should have been more supportive of her EN on this and made the time to interview the contractors, even though I'm probably no better at picking these guys compared to her. But something like this thing she will just procrastinate and not act if she's not happy, which ends up building up in her.
Another small thing is picking restaurants. She does not like to cook so we eat out very often. However, if I ask her where she would like to go, she always says she doesn't care. Then I will make a suggestion and she will shoot it down, complaining about X or Y about that place. This frustrates me inordinately. I figured out the way around it was to give her choices instead, A, B, or C. Then she can do it like that... But this shows her personality versus mine.

Thanks for the clarification. You did a good job of outlining your conflicts. It does sound like she gives up because you both have not learned to negotiate in a way that is productive. Therefore, the issues tend to build up.


This used to be our biggest point of conflict because we eat out quite often. This is very sensitive in our marriage because my husband does not deal well with disappointment. I have a much longer list of potential restaurants than him and enjoy trying new places. He absolutely HATES trying new places. For example, if we are on a trip, he will want to find a Long John Silvers or KFC. I KID YOU NOT!!

But we have learned how to negotiate respectfully and have abandoned the bad practice of sacrifice, so we are always able to find a restaurant that suits us both. We have a short list of local restaurants that we both enjoy.

Sorry to get off on that subject, the bottom line is that we learned negotiation skills in this program so we became capable of finding solutions that suit us both.

Glad we're not the only couple with "restaurant conflicts!" It's stupid but it's a source of conflict. She doesn't want buffets, any place "smelly," etc. It's crazy sometimes.

Regarding ensuring her claimed NC with OM: How do I do this, now that she wised up to her old email accounts? She still denies she is in contact, but now with the secret phone I'm not sure if she has it set up (it's some type of Verizon prepaid phone, can't make international calls but can receive them). I just ordered a VAR to place in the car to record conversations, but I could not find the darn phone for the life of me. Plus she already warned me not to go through her stuff.

The other thing that bugged me was she wanted us to have a discussion with our son. She told him things may be changing, etc. even though we love him very much. I tried to steer the conversation that "Daddy is working hard to reconcile with Mommy" but she would have none of it. My son knows the details of the affair so he supports me against OM, but he is obviously torn between the parents. I feel so sad for him! He was tough about it though and I think he is holding out hope that we will stay together. But this is another piece of the "planning" I see.

Checking my GPS tracker seems like she's been busy looking at apartments today

Nice thing is now we don't really have problems because we have a short list!


I would continue to go through her stuff like a blood hound and for sure, put a VAR in her car!


I would keep telling him that you want no part of separation and only want to take steps to repair your marriage. Don't lie to him about the reasons for this.

Don't be afraid of this. Like I said earlier, it may very well be the thing that kills her fog for good. A good dose of reality might be the best thing.

Question about WW getting apartment: Is she allowed to use marital assets to maintain a separate space apart from the marital home? If so the costs would be several times her monthly earnings in our area. She had mentioned that MIL was willing to help her...
I have not canceled the joint credit card accounts. If I did that it will be a big Lovebuster (I did that 17 years ago when I uncovered the Affair the first time).
It's a delicate balancing act trying to do Plan A without getting taken to the cleaners...

Plan A does not involve allowing your spouse to hurt your finances. You would want to take steps to protect yourself and take her off any joint credit cards. If you allow her to harm you financially, you are a LESS attractive option when her fog wears off.

I am wondering how she would be able to get approved for an apartment if she has a small income? Don't they check your income much like a bank checks to make sure you can pay the mortgage? Thinking out loud here...

Yes, most apartment managers have a credit process. I did go to some of the websites she visited (from my spying) and found some advertise as no credit check required. I'm sure they want a hefty deposit plus proof of liquid assets (which could be from our joint account bank statements?) She mentioned to me that MIL has volunteer to "help her out" using her savings. I guess she could also claim my W2 income and using the formula calculated to have the maintenance payments I need to give her? But I thought that won't kick in until after the divorce is final?
I told her to really think about it because a divorce will easily cost us $50K and will deplete the savings we have for our son, as she wanted to send him to a prestigious private high school.
My MIL has disappointed me the most. I believe MIL is truly appalled by and ashamed of her daughter's behavior but blood is thicker than water. She reneged on her promise to continue to push WW to reconciliation.

EVen if you were divorced, there is no guarantee she would get that. Keeping in mind that there is no divorce action.


I am surprised that she cares so little about her daughter that she would help her wreck her life and the life of her grandson. It is sad when parents care about being liked than the welfare of their child. A caring parent would not help her daughter wreck her life.

I think WW convinced her that OM is not a factor and it's all my fault, that she was "emotionally abused" throughout 17 years of marriage. Doesn't make any sense. She told me whatever she does she has to support her daughter. It just sucks to see someone turned 180 degrees like that, especially if you recall she was the one that called OM and his family out directly!

WW told me not to contact "her" friends any more, or MIL or her cousin. After 17 year, our friends are commingled... I do think my last contact with the MIL and her enabler friend may have turned out to be a Lovebuster and unproductive. But I was just so upset that MIL got flipped. Do you think I should stop talking to "her" friends and only talk to "my" friends now?

I guess it is a good thing your wife is not a serial killer or her uncaring mother would be "supporting" her. A caring parent does not help her child wreck her life. Very sad. I have a grown son and I care too much to "support" him in ruining his life.


I think you should do what is right for your marriage and not get so hung up on what your wife likes or doesn't like. If you think talking to a certain person will help your marriage, you should do it. But don't avoid doing that because you believe it is a "lovebuster."

Yes, I have to balance what is useful versus what may just be venting and ends up antagonizing WW. It's very hard.

GPS is telling me WW is out apartment-hunting again, there's a flurry of cell calls between her and MIL and cousin.
I started reading the laws in our no-fault state and I'm pretty sure I'll be footing the bill for her to maintain this apartment as well as the standard of living we have now. And chances are she's going to take 50% of everything I worked so hard for all these years to support her lifestyle.
I feel so sad and helpless...
:-(

Have you seen an attorney?

Lost, you need to STOP despairing and calm down. Even if she does move out, that will bring her fantasy to an end faster than it would staying there. And just because your state's divorce guidelines say something does not mean she will get that. You seem to have already surrendered before you are at the field of battle. I know it is so scary, but we have seen far worse than this turn around. This is not anywhere NEAR hopeless.

I would pick up a voice activated recorder and put it in her car/purse or coat pocket so you can hear what she is saying on her secret phone. Here is a good one that another board member tried: http://www.penrecorderpro.com/voice-recorder-usb-fd25

So... here is one thing I noticed when I went researching the way you are right now. It helped me it might help you a little bit.

Who goes looking for divorce attorneys or clarity on divorce laws?
a) Spouses seeking divorce
b) spouses not seeking divorce
c) single people

Answer is pretty simple right? Spouses seeking divorce right? WELL, all the articles you are finding as the rarity looking for some clarity are written towards a spouse seeking divorce. I found that they all address assets on the basis of "what you can get" and always ignore the fact that the spouse who does not want a divorce will also be represented. Do not read so hard, you will only discourage yourself - like I was. I got so scared at what the law in my state (also no fault) says, and all the attorney articles on line about the process etc.

I am in all the legality that your WW may be threatening with and let me tell you this - its nothing like anything I read. Everything is so wishy-washy and its all about your attorney. Everything I tell my atty gets translated anyways by him... I still freak out about it - but it is nothing like I read. So don't sweat looking it up, it does not help at all in the process if you eventually do find yourself there.


You are doing great Lost. I doubt very highly, if you are represented, that you are going to end up paying the apartment rent if she signs the lease alone.

While inexperienced, I would recommend this if she asks you to cosign the lease with her (or some variation) -
"Honey, I am committed to building a romantic marriage with you here in our home. We can certainly sit down and talk about another home if you'd like some evening, but aren't we a little beyond renting an apartment?"

Shes swinging in the dark Lost... she's upset that fantasy land is blowing up. HOWEVER, like MelodyLane said - it might take moving out for her to realize that... Just don't cosign, let her make that decision and be miserable with only herself to blame.

***EDIT***

typicalman, you are abusive.