Hey, good to hear from you, lbc--congrats on the 6 months!!!

I have thought a lot about what you have said. It is a very strange situation; in some ways, what we have now is much better than what we ever had, in terms of the honesty and yes, even the emotional connection. I guess that's what I meant by "throwing myself into the marriage". The really strange part (at least for me) is the fact that both WH (FWH, according to him!) and OW both feel that it is over, and they are moving on. So, am I the only one with the problem here??

I DO see WH engaging with me, and with us as a family. Sunday was a very good day, and yet I kept second-guessing it.....you are right; he knows something will have to give, and the really grating part is that, as usual, he is waiting for someone else to make that decision.

I had some very very good advice from starfish and ForeverHers.....and they both told me that due to the conditions that led to this mess, I really would be short-changing everything if I didn't give plan A at least 3 months...but like you said, I can feel the resolve weakening at times. It's not that I want to LB; it's more that I get tired of the game and want to leave. And that is basically what I told WH.

Have more to say, but little girl and boy want their mommy! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I had some very very good advice from starfish and ForeverHers.....and they both told me that due to the conditions that led to this mess, I really would be short-changing everything if I didn't give plan A at least 3 months...but like you said, I can feel the resolve weakening at times. It's not that I want to LB; it's more that I get tired of the game and want to leave. And that is basically what I told WH. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">cciyer - yes, it IS tiring. He is continuing in the affair and in disrespecting you. BUT, the GOAL is what you must keep in focus to help you get through the tough times. You are already feeling more confident (seems strange to say that doesn't it?). Your talk with your husband about "maybe just giving up and leaving" is just the sort of thing that you should be doing. This is NOT a permanent solution and he needs to know that. He CANNOT have both of you. Someone IS going to get hurt. Adultery. That is NOT a "victimless crime."

You managed, IMHO, to get across that idea in a very matter-of-fact, yet loving way. That is what he needs to hear. "You love him enough to wait, but not forever. Marriage MEANS choosing one person to the exclusion of ALL others, especially those to whom you had some past (or in this case, current) feelings for."

You have chosen him, and you cannot force him to chose you. But just as in the "dating world of singles", you won't wait forever or "cling" to someone who cannot "be a man" and choose, no matter how hard it might seem.

God bless. Stay the course. YOU ARE DOING GREAT!

Thanks for the boost, FH--sometimes I think maybe I am the only one with a problem ! And yet, I saw how cranky WH was after coming back from seeing her for coffee, and yes, I think he KNOWS a decision is looming in the near future.

Maybe I'm being delusional, but I do see him engaging more with us as a family, with me as his wife...and it's not hostile at home. He himself told me that "he wasn't playing both sides of the fence"; yet he looked somewhat pained as he said it, so I KNOW the thought has crossed his mind that it really looks that way to me.

As I said, right now I believe OW is out of town...so this may all be an illusion, and we'll return to the same old stuff when she gets back into town. She apparently tells him that he is the only one who has ever accepted her for who she is....sigh.....this is like candy for my "want to rescue everyone in the world" WH.....

I don't want to be rescued---I want to GROW. WITH HIM. And as you said, FH, I chose him--but I can't make him choose me. Nor am I going to try to guess and pretend to the person that he "wants". I need to accept MYSELF for who I am....and then we will see what happens.

Take care, FH! Thanks for stopping by... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Oh, I'm so glad someone else posted. It's hard to know what is right in this situation. On one hand, people say the A must end and you need to do whatever in your power to accomplish that. On the other hand, Plan A is about meeting ENs, etc.

I think your situation does need Plan A, though. In ours, FWS was not sure for awhile that he wanted the M. In that case, I heard Plan B is recommended.

In your case, WS is trying to end the A and you are making sure he has every reason to end it.

Oh, I think I know what you mean now. WS and OW seem okay with the situation as it stands. They have dinner or coffee a couple of times a week. It seems it's only you that is clamoring for contact to end, etc. I see.

Don't worry about being the only one with a problem. That's okay! That is your truth. And if WS wasn't walking around in a fog, he would know that a marriage is not three people.

Unfortunately, Plan A means you are the only one fighting for the M. It sucks and it's so incredibly hard, so make sure you are taking care of yourself. When the A did finally end, FWS thanked me for staying.

I don't believe many WS' plan the way things go. It's just the fog. They are not trying to have their cake and eat it, too, it just happens that way. So you are just nudging them in the right direction.

Oh god, that is the exact same dynamic between FWS and OW. He felt he had helped OWs self-esteem in much the same way as your WS. He was actually afraid she would 'act out' if their A ended by going out with other men. Tough.

But we have to recognize that our Hs chose us for a reason. And I believe one of the most important is that we are not dependent victims. Yes, my FWS is attracted to saving others, but he has said he couldn't do it 24/7. Your WS chose you, because he felt secure in your relationship and he knew he could completely trust you with your children.

In terms of 'wanting to leave', you might try addressing these feelings. Plan A does mean that you should be concentrating on yourself. Perhaps you can find a way to 'leave'. I'm talking about doing something different, picking up a book, making a new friend.

Also, to counteract those feelings, know that this has a deadline. You might not have the exact date in mind, but know that this situation will end and you will be the one to end if necessary. Be confident in that. Yes, you will leave, but not before you have tried everything in your power to make your M work.

Stay strong, sweetie. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Hey...wanted to give you an update. Apparently they are going out for dinner again tomorrow....and again, I told him how I felt about this. This was a tough conversation; I told him that I wanted to work on US, but he had to come to some sort of closure with OW. He asked me if I would divorce him over "this friendship"...and I told him that I would not live my life under a shadow permanently--I don't think that anything I did in the past prevents me from fully reaching out to life and embracing it. What I DIDN'T say was that he was willing to risk the loss of my feelings by maintaining this friendship. I did say that I was struggling, and I didn't want to live with this constant stress forever. Again, he panicked....said he would "never forgive" me if I left him (???) and that he has been so happy with the changes that he has seen in me.

I told him that he should view this conversation as part of those "good changes"--that complete honesty, as painful as it is, is part of a healthy relationship--one that we have not had in a while. And that just as he was looking for changes in me, I was looking for the same in him (he DID NOT like that, but that's ok). He went back to the usual defenses " Why did it take this? You don't have a right to feel this way because of what you did", but it sounded much weaker, and even he realized that he could not dictate what I should or should not feel.

Did well, but lost it at the end and cried for a bit in bed (yeah, does this count as an LB? if so, I goofed, but couldn't help it). It's not a game on my part....it's exercising my right to LIVE and communicate.

On a different note--yes, I'm hijacking my own thread!--I read your update lbc--wow. This road isn't easy for ANYONE, is it? It's so wonderful that, even though you seem to be well on your way to recovery, you still visit this board, and pay attention to sorry individuals like me.... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

As always, looking forward to hearing all responses! I should really move this thread somewhere else, but I like the continuity--it's kind of like my own journal to mark progress (if any...)

You are doing very well, cc. I'm glad you told him that he is continuing to hurt and disrespect you. And crying is not LB'ing. He needs to see what he is doing to you. You want to stay away from yelling and disrepectful judgements, but crying is expressing your own pain. Not an LB.

I believe you did everything right in your conversation last night. This is coming to a head and you're handling yourself perfectly.

He is starting to sound like cakeman and that is only going to damage his relationship with you and OW. Does he talk about how OW is feeling with this new 'arrangement'?

WS' don't understand that honesty is a two-way street. In order to regain emotional intimacy, both of you need to tell the truth. Unfortunately, he may not like all of your truth, but that is the only road to the M that you both want.

Thanks for your kind words. I know some updates are pretty effusive, but I just wrote what was true for us. There are really alot of changes I need to work on and I know I'm not quite there, yet.

This place was a lifeline for me in those dark days of Plan A. I would be at the end of my rope, I'd post, and someone would encourage me to hang on a little while longer.

I guess the major thing I've learned is that you really have no idea how your relationship can change. You can't see it from where you are standing, so it's important for those of us further down the road to say, "Yes, it is very different down here, just keep moving forward." And I guess that is why I'm still here. I want to give that encouragement to others and sometimes I need to hear that from those that are further along in recovery.

I think the "General Questions" forum has more visitors. "Plan A/B" doesn't seem to be moving very much lately.

WEll, a funny update....my husband is a physician, and today is his call day....well, he emailed me, saying that he has already received 3 different "calls" to the hospital after work today (very unusual for a weekday)...and that tonight may be a "working night" (ie can't make his dinner with OW).

Gosh. Darn. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

That was petty, but it felt good. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

I told him that, if he missed his dinner, there is plenty of food at home, and that it sounded like it would be a long night, and I might be asleep when he came home, and how sorry I would be not to see him. (All true, and said very nicely).

I'm starting to believe in divine intervention... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

May have slipped a bit tonight....called WH because he seemed to be having a tough day, and all he did was dump on me. I really felt like a doormat, and then he got mad because " I was sending him weird vibes". HUng up (I didn;t hang up on him, just decided I had better stop this conversation), then decided I had better call back....and this conversation wasn't much better.

I told him that he never seemed that enthusiastic to hear from me; it felt more like a chore. He denied this, and then when I asked him what time he would be home tonight, was somewhat evasive. I got a bit fed up and told him that I knew where he was going--he told me--and all I was asking was for something less vague. Then he got all bent out of shape and accused me of checking up on him.

Actually, that was never my intention at all.....you know, most times when I know he is seeing her, I panic--will he come home, etc. Tonight, I am feeling nothing. Even worse, I actually had a really nice evening with my kids....by myself. I don't want to emotionally detach from him, and yet, he clings to " all the things you did to me" argument for a justification of everything he does now. And his battle cry is sounding weaker and weaker....and I struggle against the distance that is growing in my heart. I struggle to maintain the connection (maybe that's why I "picked the fight" although I did not LB.).

It is coming to a head....I left him a letter on the bathroom sink, with an apology--for starting this type of conversation when we were both frazzled and tired. Bad timing on my part.

But....do I really want to be with someone who takes me for granted? Who will hold all of my imperfections against me but can't/won't look at his? Who thinks somehow that I "deserve" to be unhappy since he was for so many years (and yes, I was too!) ? If that is the case, why doesn't he let ME go?? Why the veiled threat of " I will never forgive you if you leave"? Why would he want me to stay in a situation that causes me such grief...if what he says is true--that he loves me.

He asked me the same questions before, and after much grief, I WAS ready to let him go...and he chose to stay. But I still don't think that what I did means that I have to live life as a martyr. And I certainly don't think that he is completely free of responsibility towards this marriage. And I am deathly afraid that if I stay like this, I might end up like him....and seek attention and companionship somewhere else. There is no point causing anyone that type of grief, having experienced it myself.

I don't want to terminate my marriage---far from it---but I also think sometimes that as much as he says he didn't like the person I was before, there was a certain comfort in the fact that I would never question him, and always defer to his opinion....and I'm not doing that anymore.

Yeesh, such a long post. Now I can go to bed. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

It is so very hard. We are suffering and not getting many ENs fulfilled, but we have to keep giving and giving. As others like to say: Plan A is not for wimps!

But you are doing very well. I can tell because you say that you had fun with your kids without WS. You are getting stronger as each day passes. It's important that you get to the point that no matter what happens, you know you will do fine. That is what I'm hearing in your writing. Your self-esteem will only help you do a good Plan A, traverse a better recovery, and create a wonderful M.

I have a question: does WS have a pattern of 'dumping' on you throughout your M? Does it make you cringe or do you usually handle it pretty well. I'm wondering cuz my FWS and I are opposite of most couples in this regard. He is the emoter, I'm the logical one.

He likes to vent to me and feels loved when I can just listen and tell him he is doing a great job. That is so hard for me, though. I just think, "Here we go again!", but I have to work on validating his feelings.

Perhaps 'dumping' is an EN for your WS and you might look at how you can respond differently next time. What do you think?

So something changed between the time he said he wouldn't be able to make the dinner with OW and later in the day?

Why don't you want to emotionally detach to what he is doing? I'm not saying you don't care or that you detach from your feelings, but ED (emotionally detaching) is actually a skill that benefits all BS'.

WS' are all over the place. They don't know which way is up, so how the heck can we know where we stand? Their feelings change depending on who they are talking to. BS' in Plan A need to jump off of WS' rollercoaster or you get sucked into a whole bunch of fog.

BS' need to be clear. They need to be sure of their own path. Really, what else can anyone do, but be themselves? Now, whether someone else chooses to join you on your path is another question. Everyone has the right to decide where they want to be. We can't be morphing into someone else just so that a particular person will be with us. That is not honesty and that is not the basis for a good relationship.

It sounds like you are finding your footing. It will only serve you, your children, and your M.

Try to ignore the hurtful things WS says. He is still in the fog. Yes, you probably did feel the disconnection, but it's on his part, because he hasn't ended the A.

No, you don't want to be with someone who takes you for granted, but WS is not the man you married. He has been taken over by 'aliens'. He is not thinking clearly. Who you are seeing right now is not your H.

Why are you thinking the situation will not change? No, it doesn't change during Plan A, that is why it's so difficult. But Plan A doesn't last forever. The A will end or you will go to Plan B.

The pain comes from the fact that you guys are changing. You are pretty much reevaluating everything about yourselves and your lives.

You know what? I bet WS fell in love with the stronger you and that is who he will come back to.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">But....do I really want to be with someone who takes me for granted? Who will hold all of my imperfections against me but can't/won't look at his? Who thinks somehow that I "deserve" to be unhappy since he was for so many years (and yes, I was too!) ? If that is the case, why doesn't he let ME go?? Why the veiled threat of " I will never forgive you if you leave"? Why would he want me to stay in a situation that causes me such grief...if what he says is true--that he loves me. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">No you don't. But that isn't who you love or who he can be once you both get through this ridiculous time.

Your husband is a physician. I'll bet it disturbs him when a patient won't follow his "advice" or take his "prescription" as your husband knows that humble obedience IS the way back to recovery. Refusal to embrace what he is telling his patients or their refusal to take the medicine will at least delay the healing, and in some cases, will lead to severe injury or death.

Physicial, "heal thyself." Why do you suppose the are admonished to not treat those they are emotionally involved with? Why do you suppose the saying exists that, "A lawyer who has himself as a client has a fool for client"?

cciyer - what you are hearing from your husband is classic "fog speak" and "withdrawal protection." Right now, you should be in "endurance mode" because you are not in recovery yet. Hang in there, keep the Plan A going, it will get better.

God bless.

Good advice from both of you....I have family over so I can't respond in depth, but I plan to as soon as I can!

Have a great weekend!

Just an update....we had a good talk on Sat night--we had grandparents over so we could go out without the kids. I don't know if it's the fog lifting or him just telling me what he thinks I want to hear from him (so I quit pestering him!), but for the first time, he admitted that "friendship" would be close to impossible. I asked him whether he needed this prolonged contact with her--because I saw that this prolonged contact, from OW's viewpoint, may be giving her hope....and if he really didn't want to give her that hope, this was really unfair to her. He told me that she was very bitter about being "friends", and that he did want to discontinue the friendship (the first time he has said this) but he feels guilty. He also said that he saw my stress every time he went to see her....and that it wasn't really fair to me either (the first time he has said this too!).

I told him that we all had made choices--and now we all had to take responsibility for them. For WH to hang on because he feels "guilty"....he made the choice that would put him (and us) in a situation where hurt and pain were inevitable. OW made a choice--and took an incredible risk--by getting emotionally involved with a married man--and now she has to take the fallout that (apparently) he didn't make the choice that SHE wanted. I guess that's why their last meetings haven't been so pleasant for WH...she's been making statements like "well I'm glad that your wife is finally being nice to you...and you get to go back to your nice big house" and "oh sure, let's just be best friends...". I can't say I blame her...but placing the responsibility for her actions on ME...is crazy. I made a choice of contributing to the decline of the relationship that set up the stage (in part) for all of this to happen. I have to take responsibility for that part....

I also told WH that these past weeks had been an incredible time of growth for me....and I realized that I COULD TAKE CARE OF MYSELF. BEcause I had to, for those weeks when he was in the fog so very deeply. I had to take responsibility....for myself, and for my kids.

I don't know what will happen now. He's inching closer to NC, but still can't bring himself to do so--I still think there is a connection that he won't (can't?) admit to me....but we had a very good weekend (our son turned 1!), and his interaction with me was much more relaxed, less forced--more teasing and more laughter.

lbc, you caught me on the "dumping"....I'm very much like you; I sometimes get VERY fed up by WH's need to vent (sometimes I feel "just get over it!!!" ) but I'm realizing how very important it is to him...and actually I have been working on it. I think the fact he was going to see OW just made my threshold for his "dumping" pretty small.

I don't know--perhaps later this week we'll be back at the same place--well no, I won't be; I'll be trying to strengthen myself and work on plan A. And as you said, there is a timeline for this....

You are doing great! Plan A is going according to -- well -- plan. Don't second-guess yourself. WS' may leave out some details to spare the BS, but they do not say things just cuz they think you want to hear them. At least most of them don't and from what you say, I don't believe your WS is playing a game.

It just takes time for the WS to get out of the fog. Like I say, I suspect you will see very minimal withdrawal when the A finally ends. You are living through WS' withdrawal right now. He's trying to pull away -- he knows he needs to go NC -- but he's just not there, yet.

I'm actually glad you are able to talk to WS about the OW. More information is only helpful to you, but also, WS needs a friend and that will only increase the emotional intimacy between you. It also seems that WS can empathize with you. A definite lifting of the fog.

I'm glad OW is bitter. It's time she woke up from her fog, too. But it also takes their relationship out of fantasyland. No, she's not the perfect woman who would not need anything from him. She's a human being who didn't get the memo that OWs have to be happy with the crumbs that they get if they want to stay OWs.

Okay, you are not even gonna believe this, but your WS will work on his need to vent all the time. Just the other day, my FWS was complaining about this and that and I was trying to come up with all these 'fixes', but then he said, "I'm just venting." It was such a relief. He didn't *need* me to make everything all better.

BTW, I don't think you will end up in the same place. You keep saying that and all I see is progress. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Happy Birthday to your baby!

cciyer, he's realizing that the "addicition" is destructive and hurts all around him. Considering his profession, "...do no harm," I understand his "caring" about the hurt that his decisions, whatever they turn out to be, will have.

But he is also having to deal with the "withdrawal" side of addictions. It is hard and it is painful. We, the BS's, don't like to think about that, much less agree or "feel sorry for their withdrawal pain" because we are also dealing with a huge amount of pain that their affair causes us.

But you seem to have your "head screwed on right" and are being patient. His climbing out of the fog seems inevitable now, especially since he is beginning to see the selfish, clingy, spiteful side of the OW. The fantasy is breaking apart under the glaring light of reality.

Stay the course. Stay with Plan A. Be supportive and also know that you can't make significant deposits into his Love Bank until after withdrawal is gone through. That won't begin until he decides that No Contact is the only way to go. But he will decide that. He's probably seen enough addicts in his professional life to know that IS the only way to go in breaking free of a destructive addiction.

God bless.

Just a quick note here....still have family visiting so not as much time to really respond. It is very timely, both of these posts, because it helps keep me focused, and helps me also to deal with the resentment that I find in myself sometimes when WH simply "takes" and doesn't give back ANYTHING in return. And to expect anything in return, while he is in contact and/or withdrawal, is probably unrealistic. I'm starting to realize that now (that of course doesn't mean I like it! ).

I think some of his "venting and dumping", oddly enough, may be from GUILT.

I do need to emotionally detach, to simply watch and try not to get involved in his every move.

I hope this is withdrawal.....of course, there is a fear that this is just a game on his part with me. I'm trying to deal with those feelings, and keep working with plan A in good faith. And with your encouragement, I think I can do this!

Hi cc, I'm glad you have family visiting. My MIL was an angel and came down for 10 days to give us a little breather.

Ban the thought that WS is playing a game. Now. Whenever that thought pops in, command it to go away. It's not true and it only makes you lose focus.

If WS can feel guilt, then he is starting to emerge from the fog. Unfortunately, if he's like most WS' there will be a time when he will feel like the scum of the earth.

I'm not a giver by nature, so Plan A was so hard! I found another one of my threads when I started to need more from FWS.

http://www.marriagebuilders.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=30;t=001986

Post when you can. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

lbc and Foreverhers,

I just want to say that you both have given OUTSTANDING advice to cc and she is doing a FANTASTIC job at trying to save her marriage. Kudos to all of you and KEEP UP THE GREAT WORK!!! lbc and Foreverhers, you have won your wings when you get to Heaven... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

God bless,
Natalie

Natalie, I couldn't agree more about ForeverHers and lbc...I don't know WHAT I would have done without their input and advice! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> And thanks for the kind words....sometimes it just feels that I am running in place....

I'm starting to put some things into practice. Yesterday, WH (who has had a very busy week at the hospital) called me to say that, for the third night in a row, he had to go to the hospital after work. I was very supportive, but I have to admit, after I got off the phone, all sorts of bad thoughts crossed my mind...and I got busy with the kids, hoping to chase the bad thoughts away. Then he called from the hospital, to tell me that he was on his way home. And then I waited...and waited...and again, BAD thoughts went through my head--is he doing this AGAIN? couldn't he have TOLD me? WHY does he have to sneak around--and again, I got the kids ready for bed, and tried to think of other things.

Well, he came home, and instead of lashing out at him, I just said that I was glad he was home. And then he told me....he had met another patient at the hospital who wanted to talk to him, and that's why he was late. (and he really wasn't that late...it was just my head playing tricks on me) You know, I BELIEVE HIM! He just seemed so content to be with us---he put our daughter to sleep (even when I offered to do it for him since he was so tired), and then we sat in bed and just chatted.

Baby steps...but it would have been SO easy for me to go ballistic on him, but I didn't. And I think he knows that he has to tell me--he DID call from the hospital to tell me he was on his way home, and without prompting, he DID tell me of these other patients who he had to see. It's been a long time since he has called me to let me know that he is coming home....

I'm TREMENDOUSLY fortunate to have such good input, and I am starting to feel as if all I do is TAKE from you all, and never give anything back in return....to say "thank you" seems barely adequate...but it's all I can do, over and over!

Silly follow up post for lbc...I reread some of your old posts, and you had mentioned that your FWS, as part of his withdrawal, was interested in buying a new car....

My husband has recently been showing me quotes on...REALLY expensive telescopes! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Perhaps we live in parallel universes? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Is there a smiley? I'm glad someone else thinks we are giving you good advice. Sometimes I'm not sure, because I'm not an expert at this and really we've only been in recovery for a short time. I don't usually 'follow' someone's story, but your situation sounded so familiar that I had to comment.

But, seriously, you are doing all the work. I didn't do half as well as you and the A ended. That's why I'm so positive about your situation.

You are still the Plan A queen! Wow, very impressive on not going ballistic when WS came home late. Way to go! That is exactly what you should be doing.

Didn't you just amazed yourself by not LB'ing? I continually surprise myself, haha. I would just wait up for FWS when he had spent the day with OW. However, I had no idea if they had slept together that day, so it was easier in that respect.

That strength is what's going to save your M.

I would kinda think that a doctor would need to stop by the hospital pretty often. Do you think he is becoming a better doctor? I wonder if the A was coming from low self-esteem and he is starting to feel better about himself.

Go by your instincts. You will 'know' if he is telling the truth or not. It might be hard to hear right now, but you have a good man there. Somehow he *knew* he should call. He could have blown it off, but somehow he knew that was the right thing to do.

Oh my lordy on spending money! We did trade in my car, but for something about 1/4 of what FWS had his eye on. I knew he wanted to do it for me and he saw it as my way of showing that I was hopeful for our future. Kinda hard after only a week of NC, but sometimes you just have to make that leap of faith.

FWS wants a telescope, too, but I'm fortunate that he will be happy with a cheap one. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />