</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by deafjeff:
<strong> Redhat- Am I being irrational? </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">yup, at the time you were out w/ checking out this M-lady and justified it that you were emotionally Dv from your W. Now you are good <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> .

2long,
2long doesn't make it right ... it drags everybody in the name of "saving M". 2short doesn't make it right either. Just right is the answer <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> and you have 2 decide ... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" /> .

-rh-

OK Redhat, maybe a little irrational. If by M-lady you mean MARRIED lady- hell no. I would never have gone out with a married woman before this crap started raining down, I damn sure wouldn't now that I know how it feels. I wouldn't even wish this on her OM and he ain't real high on my list of favorite people right now.

Justin--

I know you have had a lot of advice already, but here is one more.

I saw one respoonse that sadi technically you are still married. True. So technically you would haveing an affair.

My wife (soon to be X) had an affair and served me with papers a month ago. The one thing that I know now, that I was unwilling to realize before is that "WE" broke our marriage. I see that now. I want to do whatever it takes to make sure that I am not in the same postion again in my next marriage (if I get married again). Before I am going to go out into the field and "play ball" I want to make sure that I know exactly how to treat and respect my partner. Before I thought I knew how to do it, but I didn't.

So I guess what I am trying to say is that the thought of dating again is kind of exciting and scary at the same time, please wait until you have healed. People do some very stupid things when they are hurting. Please be patient.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by cinderella:
<strong> You want them to be upset about her dating but ok with your dating? </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Whoa! Hold on one minute. My wife is not just dating. She has had a 5+ year affair with another man. (EA and PA) She lied to me about it repeatedly. She left me and and broke up our family so she could be with the OM. She filed for divorce so she could marry the OM.

I do have great reservations about dating while married and have decided against it . But I do not believe it is logical to equate a dinner with a woman to my wife's long term affair.

Stop,
As is often said in this site, we are 50% responsible for the state of our marriage. Given that truth, I accept repsonsiblity for the flaws in our marriage. But, there weren't that many flaws, and nothing that could not have been fixed by us, IF SHE HADN'T HAD THE AFFAIR AND LEFT ME.

An affair is not a proper response to marital problems. As I read in another place: Having an affair because of marital problems is like burning down the house to get rid of the termites.

I have taken many steps to examine my behaviors in our marriage, to understand them, and to improve or elimate the troublesome ones.

I am really getting upset at people (not meaning you Stop) who somehow want to get me to take part of the blame for the affair.

<small>[ May 22, 2004, 11:46 AM: Message edited by: JustinExplorer ]</small>

J--

In no way is the affair your fault. It was her decision not yours.

I as well get frustrated with everyone telling me that it is 50/50. Drives me crazy. It is my opinion that someone can "confide" in a friend without sleeping with them. Apparantly my WS thought otherwise. I just choose to not hear that and choose not to believe it --- yet.

After I posted my response to your question last night, I got a call from a woman that I met while looking for a place to live. She asked if I would like to come over and watch the BBall game. As much as I wanted to, I passed.

I just know that I want to fix my challenges before I embark on any other adventures.

Just be patient. No one else can undertand what YOU are going through. They can just tell you their experiences and then you can choose to do what you want to with that information.

Good luck -- It is going to be a long journey.

<small>[ August 09, 2004, 08:33 PM: Message edited by: laura_lee ]</small>

<small>[ August 09, 2004, 08:33 PM: Message edited by: laura_lee ]</small>

Marriage is an intersting institution. It is a contrast and a covenant and I think that is why so many people view things differently at times.

First, marriage is a covenant. That is it is a deeply personal commitment between two people. For many religions, the covenant also includes God, so it is between three people.

But, marriage is also a contract. We get a license from the state. The marriage has to be performed by a recogzided person of authority (justice of the peace, clergyperson, ship's captain, etc.) We sign a form and have witnesses sign the form. All very legal like other contracts. But unlike many contracts, it is not enforceable. You can't force your spouse to stay married or stay faithful. One side can violate the contract at will and in many states there are no consequences.

For most of us the most important view of marriage is that of a covenant. We see it as far more than a contract. When the covenant is broken and the perpetrator has shown by WORD AND DEEDS that he/she has no intention of honoring it anymore, well... The marriage is over in the eyes of many people.

The contract may still exist on paper, but the convenant has been broken.

This is all very difficult since our marriage covenant no longer exists, but he marriage contract does.

Thoughts on this??

<small>[ August 09, 2004, 08:34 PM: Message edited by: laura_lee ]</small>

<small>[ August 09, 2004, 08:35 PM: Message edited by: laura_lee ]</small>

I have decided not to date until the divorce is final later this year.

It's the right thing to do.

Parallel with the divorce, I am also working on my own healing and getting ready for dating. I have taken several classes sponsored by local churches on divorce recovery. And I have also taken classes to brush up on my dancing skills, joined a cultural association and done other things that will make meeting other single people easier.

When the divorce is final, I hope I will be ready on all levels, the Good Lord willing.

It's the right thing to do <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />
Exactly!

<small>[ August 09, 2004, 08:35 PM: Message edited by: laura_lee ]</small>

I am waiting for the my divorce to be final before dating.

And if my WH & the OW had done the same, my WH and I would be back together now.

Also, I would not date a married man, no matter how long he's been separated, who filed for divorce, whatever. If he's married - he's married.

In fact, after the divorce is final, before I would date a divorced man I would want to be sure his ex-W doesn't want him back, that there's no chance of their marriage recovering, ESPECIALLY if they have children. It would have to be a situation where the ex-W left him, and she had already remarried. And even then, I would want to know why their marriage broke up. There's no way I would take his or his family/friends word for anything. I would want to talk to his ex-W and HER family/friends first.

To tell you the truth I'd rather not date or remarry than to end up with another loser. Not that I'm paranoid - just VERY picky AND I am quite happy by myself so I don't exactly need a man to make me happy. It would be nice but not necessary.

And if my WH & the OW had done the same, my WH and I would be back together now
If they had waited, the affair would have never occurred & you would have never separated to get back together.

There's no way I would take his or his family/friends word for anything. I would want to talk to his ex-W and HER family/friends first.
I guess you never plan on dating anyone who has ever been married then.

If I were to ask someone out and they wanted to question my ex (and good luck finding her) and her family before we even went out one time, that would be a date that doesn't happen.

After a few dates and it starts to get "serious" (do people go "steady" anymore? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" /> ), then I could see asking the more important questions.

You're right Chris, I probably won't remarry then LOL,

OK, I guess I would have to know the guy well enough and/or his family/friends well enough that I would have heard the divorce story form several sources. If he had kids I certainly would want to hear what they have to say about their parents' divorce (but not sure how/if it would be appropriate to bring it up - easier if they were grown). And if he still had any contact with his ex-W at all (because of kids) then I would want to meet her and talk to her.
I realize she might just tell me bad, untrue stuff about him...

I guess my best bet is to just not get involved with somebody who had been married in the past. It's difficult for me to picture dating anyone because I really think if there's kids then you should try to save the marriage so I would want to be really sure he can't patch things up with his ex-W someday, somehow. I'm sure I should have left my WH about a decade ago but didn't want to because of this belief. For the last few years we lived together and the first year after separation I was sure I would never date or remarry. (Ironically, WH's insistance that I couldn't was part of reason I began to consider it as an option after divorce.)

Also, if the guy is willing to admit HE made some mistakes in his previous marriage, that the divorce was not all his wife's fault AND that he did try to save the marriage, that would make a difference to me.

I would also be extra cautious about avoiding serial adulterers or guys who haven't yet had their midlife crisis. And oh yeah - Momma's boys are dangerous.

I guess it's a good thing I'm OK with being by myself, huh? LOL

Anyway, I will not be man-hunting - never have - think it's not natural behavior for the females of the species. I believe in letting the man do the chasing. (I do like to do the fixing though... need to let the man take more responsibility and not try to carry the marriage by myself next time.)

<small>[ May 29, 2004, 09:55 PM: Message edited by: meremortal ]</small>