Island fever, eh MT?<P>I think Lora, Allison, BS, Buffy and anyone else who wants to claim their life back, should fly to HI to visit you and Mrs. O and Leilana. Leilana could entertain us all too! <P>I could use some warm sunshine, sandy beaches and tropical relaxation.<P>Anyone up for a trip to Hawaii???<P>Jo<P><p>[This message has been edited by Resilient (edited October 26, 2000).]

Hi all,<BR>I love Hawaii. Too bad I just went there last year for three weeks. I stayed one week in O'ahu at the Hilton village, one week in Kaua'i, and one week in Maui. I would love to go there again. But it is quite expensive for me to go there from the east coast, especially for 4 people. But next year 2001, I'm thinking about Australia.<P>OOOO

I'll go! Pretty much anywhere... Hawaii or Australia.<P>Hey Jo is that why you were looking for Mrs O? Trying to get our rooms lined up? <P>And OOOO, hate to tell you this, but Australia is quite a bit further then Hawaii from the East coast! Great place to travel though. I have a friend who lives there and have visited quite a few times.<P>I love to travel. I hope I can afford to do it, but it is a high priority to me... maybe I could go without food, save money and diet at the same time.<P>I agree. The year 2001 will be good for us... its really the new melenium you know. We can pretend that whole 2000 thingy never happened and really celebrate this new year!<BR>Lora

WOW! You have inspired me. <P>Yesterday, I wrote a response to someone's post saying that I would not be going through all of this pain etc. if I didn't have 26 years invested in this man, etc., etc. I also expressed that I have resigned myself to my "lot in life" to stay and put up with everything that happens "to keep my family in tact" and "because I have invested so much of my life in this mariage." Wellllll, this thread is causing me to rethink that position.<P>Hey, I may be fiftyish, but I'm still an attractive, well-groomed, intelligent, educated professional woman. Why am I the one crawling under the rock to live out the rest of my life when I'm the innocent party in this sordid mess?<P>We have been "recovering" for 2 years, which have included a second DDay, visitation with OC on a weekly basis, and $10,000 in legal fees to fight OW frivolous lawsuits, to mention just a few of the dozens of problems we have had to deal with as part of the post-affair fallout.<P>I love my H with all my heart. We have spent 26+ years together, and I had hoped to grow old with him. But, I don't want to compromise any more of my own happiness than I have already compromised.<P>Please keep this thread's notion alive and well. It is strengthening and encouraging to read everyone's thoughts.<P>annie

Hi Anniem:<P>You go girl!! <P>It took me a long time to realize that 25+ years of as so-so marriage to which H was not willing to invest much effort into saving was probably not worth my effort to continue to save it either...not when there was another life out there that maybe could offer me some happiness.<P>Makes me sound like WS doesn't it...but the feelings are the same...except that I've tried for five years to fix things without any help from H. He's the one who had the affair...is still having the affair. He knows its not going to work out in the end...yet he's willing to sacifice our marriage to have what he has now.<P>Like so many here, I am just not willing to wait any longer for him to resolve his feelings. There are man out there who would have me with great pride in minute...why settle for someone for whom you are just "second choice" or not worth the effort to keep from losing. It's stupid and I won't do it anymore.<P>Maybe your marriage is worth saving...I don't know about mine...certainly not as it is. If you decide it is...well, go for it...if, not...then don't be afraid to let go. Life's too short to hold on to something just because it's familar. <P>Angels and Prayers ~ Faye<BR>

Hey Guys:<P>Wow, that Hawaii trip sounds great.<P>Had a chance to go last year but decided not to leave because it would put a hardship on my H and the business.<P>Stupid, Stupid, Stupid...that's one of the things I would like to do most...travel.<BR>Always put someone's needs ahead of mine.<P><B> Where did it get me? </B> <P>Alone and lonely. But thanks to all the help I've gotten here...no more. It's really just a mind set...setting yourself free to do for yourself for a change.<P>I'd also love to<P>...take a cruise, or a steamboat ride on the Mississippi, or the Alaska tour.<P>...sing with a country western band (I had offers)<P>...do some couples dancing (H didn't like it)<P>...take a bike tour or a raft ride<P>...join my community choir<P>...wear a pair of 5-inch sling-back heels and a low cut black dress that stops about mid-thigh.<P>I haven't begun to think of all the possibilities....but my mind's open now...thanks for the rotto-rutter service, guys. <P>Angels and Prayers ~ Faye <P><BR> <P> <p>[This message has been edited by buffy (edited October 27, 2000).]

Hey Lora,<BR>Glad to see you on this thread! How are things going with you? <P>AnnieM and Buffy--<BR>Better days ahead, right?! Buffy, when you wear that low cut (to mid-thigh, lol ) dress with the 5" sandals, be sure to strut your gorgeous self in front of H to the arms of a hunk of a man! Make that two hunky men!

Okay "Getting a Life" MBer's!!!!<P>What are we doing for OURSELVES this week-end???<P>I want to hear back .... I want to hear that each and every one of you are doing something cool and fun or constructive to "love" yourselves!<P>If you can't come up with ideas or if your depressed and feeling low, tell us why and we'll help you get motivated. It's important and you ARE IMPORTANT and deserve a good week-end.<P>Waiting ....<BR>lv,<BR>Jo

If y'all are serious about a Hawaii trip, I would love to do it. My H said NO to Arizona , because we have our money "stretch" getting ready to start in December (Dec. 5th - mom's 47th b-day, Dec. 25th - Xmas, January 28th - 4 year dating anniversary, Feb. 14th - Valentine's, March 11th - son's b-day, April 15th - H, H's 2 twin brothers, and stepdad's b-day + 1st half property taxes, May 3rd - my b-day, June - MIL's and FIL's b-days and anniversary.) So maybe around August or September? Seriously, I'm probably going to go anyway since flights out of Vancouver are so cheap. I know of a cozy hotel that's inexpensive and has all of the amenities - and is ACROSS THE STREET from Waikiki beach!<P>Gosh, I'll answer Jo's question, even though I feel I have absolutely no business on this thread (I don't feel that my hell and the way I'm handling mine quite compare to the rest of you amazing ladies!). H is going "fishing", but there's something fishy about THIS fishing trip. He's going with a friend I've never met before, at the same time he has a new lab partner in his class that he keeps talking about. And she's going to try and get him on as a nurse's aide at her job. Hmmmm. I am definitely going to drop by his class this week and meet the chickie (I'm getting my nails done, my hair colored, and living in Lancome self-tanner this weekend first). <P>Anyway, that was a tangent! My self-indulging plans are a facial, hair color, getting my pink-and-white french manicure back on, and bathing in self-tanner until I look like Miss Hawaiian Tropic! H and I will probably karaoke Saturday night since we haven't in a couple of weeks. We're also going to go see a movie. <p>[This message has been edited by Carolina Belle (edited October 27, 2000).]

C'Belle, please share the Waikiki hotel info!!!!!!<p>[This message has been edited by wesse (edited October 27, 2000).]

Hey Belle:<P>You know for years I settle for less then I wanted because I was married and that's the way my H wanted to live his life. We did things his way and did the things he wanted to do. Well, he left me for a totally different kind of life...the seedy side of life. What did that say about what I gave up for him...it certainly wasn't appreciated.<P>If I could take that time back I would have spent more time making myself happy. I really think it would have made the marriage happier too. I just wish all you younger woman could realize this before you spend all those years trying to make things work for someone else.<P>Marriage should not be a death sentence for women...caring for our children, H and home and getting lost in the schuffle. I paid for my H's career with years of my life and he walked away without a backward glance. Even if my marriage survives it will never be the same...because I will never be the same again.<P>Sorry to be posting so much today but I'm on a high and there have been too few lately.<P>Angels and Prayers ~ Faye <P><BR>

wesse - The one that I like to stay at is the Outrigger Royal Islander (I think that they just changed their name, but they're still an Outrigger hotel.) They have nice, clean rooms with patios. They are a little on the small side, but they're inexpensive (besides, if you're visiting Hawaii, how much time do you expect to stay in the room?) You also get all of the amenities of the Outrigger Reef Beach hotel across the street, which is a FABULOUS hotel with a pool, bars, restaurants, and it's right on the beach! <P>Faye - To hear that scares me, it really does. I do feel like I've lost my identity in many ways. As many know, I used to be a professional wrestler, and I ended up turning down a contract offer with the WWF because I was pregnant. H didn't understand my wrestling, he said it was "stupid and fake." But I enjoyed it, I had wanted to do it since I was little, and now I can't - I gave it up for my family.<P>My H also enjoys the seedy side of life. He does fine when I'm with him, but if I go out of town, he is out at the bar doing God knows what with God knows who all night, every single night that I'm gone! I want my marriage to work, so my only alternative is to not travel without him. <P>I've lost most of my longtime friends, simply because most of them think my H is a sleazebag. My mom rarely has us over because she can't stand him. I feel like my H now constitutes most of who I am, and I hate it! I don't even trust him in his school class since he's the only guy in a class of 30.<P>I am scared that I'm wasting my time on him. I'm in the minority of one who hopes that I'm not.<p>[This message has been edited by Carolina Belle (edited October 27, 2000).]

Tonight, work out at the gym and catch up on some much needed sleep.<BR>Birthday party for MIL at my house on Saturday.<BR>Hiking on Sunday.

Don't forget ladies. Codependent behavior is not a life time sentence either. You can get counselling, join CoDa(Codependents Anonymous) or at least get some books on the subject. Once you recognise the behavior, you can begin to nip it in the bud. I am a recent member of CoDa and am very happy learning and talking about how it makes me act, view things, react to things and respond to things and people and certain situations. It is confusing if you are not familiar with the concepts, but it is a help to me. Iy is helping my H to be doing the workbook with outr therapist. He is not in my CoDa group-thank goodness! I talk about him enough~!<P>This weekend I was going to the State fair, going to soccer(my son's game) and going to shop for my new choral group uniform--Black lunging neckline and full, long skirt--all black! Good Luck!<P>But now I will have to see. Someone rear-ended me while driving to my chiropractor. He was able to take exrays right away. Strange. I had just had a new set made two weeks ago, you cannot imagine the damage that a minor collision can cause in the spine! Unbelievable! I am in a bit of pain, to say the least. So my weekend is going to be curbed! Darn! But I'm okay, the only thing damaged was the trailor hitch! (and me a bit!) <P>

Well, I'm off to Dallas for the weekend. Going to a gymnastics meet with DIL and kids and then spending night with daughter. <BR>Lots of riding, noise and sitting, but it will be fun. <P>Hey Belle:<P>There's certainly still time for you if you want something. You're still in your twenties aren't you? I think I could have managed to have at least some of what I wanted...if I hadn't been convinced by society that what H wanted was more important (seven years of college and law school). I did get my decree...but wanted to live in a big city...we came home to his home town...wanted to teach college...settled for high school...wanted to sing in country western band...he didn't like the places we would have to play...was just easier to forget about it. Don't make the same mistake. Go for your dreams.<P>BS:<P>Are you saying you think Belle and I are Co-dependent? Never thought about it. Thought that was mostly just someone who has problem with addiction. H's not addicted to anything (except OW)....just stupid. Am I wrong about this? Could we be co-dependent?<P>Sorry about that rearend...hope you don't have whiplash...that can hurt for a while.<P>Hey I know where you can find a sleazy attorney if you want one!!!! <BR> <P>Everyone have fun this weekend...we need it.<P>Angels and Prayers ~ Faye

Jeez Beth,<P>You OK girl? Sorry about the accident, you know how crazy it gets in this town when it rains...scared me to death to drive in it today.<P>I've read a little bit about co=dependency, and I do think I need to work on this. Are there several CoDa groups around the valley? I'd be interested in seeing about going to one. Can you give me any info on it?<P>You sound a little better Beth. Have you and your husband talked any more about his moving out? Sounds like you're really looking forward to your singing performance...it's great that you two still can do that together. Makes me feel like he really does like his life with you Beth, and maybe he does realize all he has to lose.<P>As far as doing something for myself this weekend....hmmmm....I'll have to think about that one. Jo..how dare you give us such a tough assignment. I'm kinda broke so it'll have to be cheap, my massage and facial days are a distant memory at this poing (ok, sorry, no pity party)<P>Ok, I'll give myself a darn pedicure...and buy a new bra! LOL...side effect of weight loss, damn underwear doesnt' even fit anymore. Maybe one of those water-bras, those are pretty cool, have you guys (women I mean) seen them? <P>H will have the kids Sunday...boy am I having a hard time when they're with him. My lowest possible times. When he picks them up I just want to be with them all, like we used to be. We always did a lot together, movies, sporting events, out to eat, now he takes them and I dont' go (darn this pity party keeps showing up). So Sunday, I'll go to Church and maybe rent a great old movie. <P>I am going on and on here about nothing. If anyone gets through this thank you...I'm feeling lonesome tonight. Just came from my kids homecoming game. Have two theories on going to these things alone:<P>1. It's really weird...sitting alone at events like this. <P>2. I got checked out by the cutest man! , so it was not a total loss.<P>Ok, enough yakkin...congrats you guys on getting out of your funks and giving us all the wonderful encouragement you all do. I'm right behind ya'.<P>allison

Hi,<P>Just wondering how everyone's weekend went? There seemed to be quite a lot of activity on the site that I missed. Anyone do anything special for themselves?<P>Many Tears<BR>

AZ-<BR>No i have not talked anymore about his moving out. He is reluctant, naturally. But I am not backing down. I even told him again tonite. If he is going to make plans to have a physical rendevue, then he must live elswhere. I can't take it. <P>I was very wrong to think I could have been okay with it if I knew the truth. Nope, I have found that it is not realistic. I do not want him sleeping with her, period. I get nothing. He can't have her and be sleeping(only ) next to me. No way. If he needs her, he needs to move out. I must protect myself and show respect for myself.<P>About Coda, yes there is a list I will bring it to you next time we have lunch. I wish you could join mine, but it is too far from your home to be let out at nine pm, Weds.<P>And Faye etc--they say that every alchoholic, drug abuser, etc is codependent, but not every codependent is an addict. That is true. I am living proof. Wives of addicts are also codependent. (Making sure your world appears to others normal, bailing out the addict out of tight spots(calling work-sick, living on no $ when addict spends it all, make excuses to hide his addiction...) <P>It is putting other needs and concerns above yours, trying to control situations that you should leave to God(and feeling frustrated when it doesn't work out,) do things for others because you think they are not really capable(even of every day things!), basing self worth on how other perceive you, feeling lovable only if you are loved in return, fear of other's anger or negative impressions, Ignore your own wants and values and opinions to agree with those around you, steadfastly loyal-even when it is unjustified or even personally harmful.\<P>It is based in insecurity resulting from childhood and the atmosphere in which we were raised, or experiences that effected in us the need to hide, but control our world, even though we can't. <P>This is a long list and it goes on...get a book out of the library on it and read up. 90% of people are codependent and don't know it. There is relief out there, but you have to have the courage to recognise it and not be afraid to change--for the better! And finding respect for yourself, and true inner peace and strength from yourself!

Hello all of you Phenomenal Women!<BR> Haven't checked the board for a 2 or 3 days, and I just realized that it's because I have been so busy working at my full-time job, tending to domestic chores: cooking, cleaning, laundry, leaf raking, grocery shopping, makibng OC a halloween costume (it's adorable!!) etc. Also, son home from college for weekend and I was helping him with a major paper, which means I was doing most of the research. Sign!!!! I'm beginning to realize more and more than I am my own worst enemy.<P>I should have been: having a manicure, shopping for some drop-dead-gorgeous new clothes (even though we can't afford it with alll the child support we have to pay), having a manicure, facial, or bikini waxing (yikes!!), taking a long walk in the magnificient autumn landscape...But, no, I felt responsible for doing all the other stuff because I am "wife and mom" and that's my job!!! Horse pucky!<P>See what not coming to this board for a few days does? Ladies, I really NEED a daily reminder of my self-worth and qualities as a PERSON, not just someone's wife, mom, sister, etc. I know that may sound contradictory coming from a woman who is so devastated by H's affair and wants so much to have a happy, meaningful marriage. But why must we women be expected to sacrafice our very beings in order to make those who love us happy? I don't think that is what marriage means, nor did I realize until now that I HAVE lost myself in this marriage.<BR> BUT...I can't place 100% of the blame on others. I put myself in this position without realizing what I was doing, and now I am really the only person who can do something about it. Unfortunately, after all these years, it may mean that I must sacrafice my marriage to do so. AHHHHHHHHHH<BR> I will come for my daily dose of encouragement that I get from reading your comments filled with courage, strength, and spirit. I know all too well how tough it is to maintain those feelings when dealing with so much emotional trauma. Thank you for being here.