I'm sorry I can't go into too many details... but I am wondering if anyone here has actually had much success in using Plan A in the face of repeated lies about ongoing A. <p>My WW has continued her A despite me catching her a few months ago (D-day No. 2 with the same guy), her writing a "no contact" letter to OM (I delivered it), and me doing a tremendous Plan A for the past six months (she has told me several times that she can't think of anything I could possibly be doing better and that her life appears to be "perfect"). Yet, I know she resumed contacting the OM about a week after D-day No.2 earlier this year (they talk several times a day at a minimum). She has been telling me that there has been zero contact and she "promised" to tell me if there was any contact when we decided to try harder after D-day No.2.<p>I am still Plan A'ing my little but off, but I don't know if I am just fooling myself. At this point, I fear they may have actually been in contact nonstop for the past year even though she told me it had been an accidental meeting just a couple months before I caught her (which I NOW know is untrue but didn't on D-day No.2).<p>Help please... my heart is breaking... and I don't know how long I can continue pouring out my love to her knowing that she is talking to and meeting him all the time.

bump... sorry, really need help here.

Conan: I feel your pain. I don't know that I can really offer much in advice here, but I am sure there are others who will. I just wanted to let you know your cries are heard, and I feel for you. I hope that one day, soon, your WW sees what it is that she is risking and realize it's not worth risking. I pray for you and your success. Keep working on you. Take care.

^^BUMP^^<p>Come on group - let's help him out.

Conan,
So very very sorry, you were a big help to me I wish I could pay you back. Have you and your wife tried Retrouvaille? My wife said that after going through that it made it "impossible" to go back to the A. Reminded me of something alcoholics say about AA, it ruins drinking. Maybe you could give it a shot. It is run by Caothloic church but is non-denominational program, I am not religious and liked it very much. Hang in there, will you?<p>Jack

Conan,
I'm in EXACTLY your same situation, and I've gotten some good ideas and feedback on my thread "Affairs that don't end...confused...HELP"; maybe you can start there, and we can share some of the information and run it by each other and help each other find solutions...

Jack, I have not heard of that, though I recall you mentioning it. Where can I get info on it? I am practicing Catholic, but my WW gets the hives if you mention the church... LOL.<p>Spacecase, I saw we were in similar circumstances... sorry to hear that. I will look at your thread some more.<p>Tutter, thanks for the "call to the troups"! :-)

Conan, I really relate to what you are going through. My wife continued active A for at least 2 months after D-Day, KNOWING that I was tracking her every move, lying about her activities, etc.<p>I too was "Plan A'ing my butt off", as you say, and the pain seemed unbearable. You say you are a man of Faith? Great!! That is all that kept me going.<p>Some tips:<p>

• Don't snoop too much as the details that get revealed to you may be too hard to ever forget. I made this mistake and now I am haunted by erotic e-mails, IM sessions, professions of undying love, cutting remarks about me, etc. Only time is healing my of that pain.
• let go and let God, to a certain extent. You can't control WW's behavior, only your own. Unless and until your love bank gets so low there's nothing left, continue Plan A. I can tell you, and others here know it by my posts, that I am very impatient and this seems like the hardest thing in the world. But patience will pay off!
• If you have children, get involved in their life! That is also a good way to deflect the captive thoughts of A and OM. It also shows your WW that you care about the family.
• Most A's die a natural death in 6 months to 2 yrs after exposure. You probably know this from reading SAA. In my case it took only about 3 1/2 months from D-Day before my WW began to lose interest in talking to or seeing OM when she began to get most of what she was seeking from me. Yet, prior to that, they were talking about marriage, future plans together, getting me to accept it all, etc. I thought I had no chance to recapture my wife's love.

<p>In any event, there are many good people here to support you and help you through this. This forum has been my lifeline. <p>God Bless you.<p>[ April 16, 2002: Message edited by: Boppo57 ]</p>

I agree with Boppo about the snooping...you know it's going on, knoweing EXACTLY what goes on is not necessary, and it does bring a lot of pain and very nasty flashbacks...not recommended.
Also, at least in my experience, every time my sbnooping was caught (and it's very hard for it not to be because you WILL bring it up in your converastions) it'll be a major LB.
Best to Plan A, have faith, find the "little" good things to think about even if they are really very little, and keep moving forward.
Take care of yourself, try to find those things which make you better, and give it the time it needs.

Conan,<p>Speaking as a WW I can see your wife has the best of both worlds which makes it even harder to end A. I should know because I went through that stage myself. It was extremely difficult to break the A and not to ever contact OM again, infact I'm still in withdrawal, however not contact since Jan.29/02. Your wife says your M is perfect and there is nothing you can do to improve it. So then what does she get from the A?? OM must be giving her something that is still missing from the M. If you can somehow find out what that is you can start winning the battle and eventually the war!<p>Good Luck!<p>Brianna

Not a problem Conan. I feel you pain as if it were my husband. I have come a long way now, and it hurts to see someone else going through what I put my husband through. I feel for you.<p>What Brianna said makes sense. However, be cautious as to not COMPARE yourself to the OM. Know this - YOU ARE THE BETTER MAN. You know this, and one day your WW will too - here's hoping it's not too late for her. Yes, she has the best of both worlds right now, but that will end. What is she getting out of the A? I would venture to say that at least part of it has to do with the fact that this borrowed time with the OM has created a fantasy that takes her away from the realities of life (cleaning, cooking, kids [if you have any], etc.). However, one day she will start to try to see how the OM fits into reality (in her mind) and realize that he DOESN'T. Key here is for you to keep a good head, keep doing the good job you are at Plan A, and keep working on you. I will offer you my salutation quote - here, to really bring your attention to it: Be true, stay strong, but remember it's ok to feel weak sometimes. And yes, this place is a wonderful helping hand. You are doing fine. Take care.

Conan,<p>I can truly understand your pain since your WW did go back to the OM. I know this all seems frustrating and very discouraging but you must hang in there. I to lived the double life and the OM always asked if I wasn't happy with my M then why not just end it? One of the reasons was that I still cared for my H very much and felt there may be something left to salvage. I'm grateful to the OM for showing his true colours and showing me that my H was the better man all along! <p>What is your marital history? Does your wife rely on you for financial support? If she really loved the OM she would have left by now, but something is holding her back. Whether she has some doubts about OM or sad to say, she is to comfortable with the life you have made for her.<p>Good Luck.<p>Brianna

Brianna,<p>My friends have told me she just has too good to want to leave. She lives in a million dollar home, works only when she wants to (hasn't at all for 6 months), 2 kids go to school/daycare everyday, I take care of the kids at least equal to her time, go on date nights with her every weekend with a sitter taking care of kids, etc.<p>You asked what she is getting out of the affair... I haven't a clue and I have spent a lot of time thinking about it. The only thing I can imagine is the sick thrill of sneaking around or, like Tutter said, the fantasy life they imagine they are living without responsibility.

It seems as thought your WW has the best of both worlds and since there is only one that you can take away there may come a time that Plan B will be very useful to you. Do not think that Plan A is your only option. With an ongoing A, Plan B works very well with a well done Plan A preceeding it. Your WW has obviously noticed the Plan A efforts so when you start to feel those love units pouring from your bank please do not hesitate to jump into Plan B.

Conan:<p>From your description, and feedback from others, maybe what you need to do is go to plan B, but only if you can face DV if that's what your WW decides. Doesn't sound like she's willing to lose what she has with you. <p>As someone said to me a while ago, maybe your W just needs to crash and burn to be shaken back into the real world. If she's comfortable with the things the way they are, this might be the only way to force her to choose her family or the OM. Is OM married? If so, the A has a greater chance of ending if you go to plan B. If not, it might just drive her to him. But then they'd have to live "real life" together, and that would probably fail when she came to grips with what she gave up for him. It'd be more painful for you while that was happening.<p>In the end, remember though that Plan B should only be done once you've done your best Plan A AND you are ready for the prospect of divorce if it doesn't wake her up.<p>Hang in there!

Conan,<p>I would strongly urge you to use the phone counseling here at MB (888-639-1639). Steve and Jenn Harley are very good at motivating and teaching the intricacies of Plan A (and B), and they can be invaluable during the transition of a separation.<p>One thing I have written (a long, long time ago) is that I did a pretty effective Plan A while my wife was in an affair. But---I had no idea that it was effective UNTIL I had transitioned to Plan B, and the affair began to unravel. If you have been truly effective in your Plan A efforts (and have established the "consistent track record" that Steve loves to harp about... [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img] ), then my guess is that you're probably getting close to transitioning to Plan B. One of the things that helped guide me to Plan B was that I felt like this:<p> <blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>Help please... my heart is breaking... and I don't know how long I can continue pouring out my love to her knowing that she is talking to and meeting him all the time. <hr></blockquote><p>You're going to need to remove yourself from this situation before the sadness you feel turns to hate (and then disinterest)---at that point, there will be little that will save your marriage.<p>If you live in a million dollar house, you can afford a call to the Harleys. Do it---no excuses.

K:<p>"If you live in a million dollar house, you can afford a call to the Harleys. Do it---no excuses."<p>No disrespect intended, but this isn't necessarily true. Our house COST us about a third of that, but it's going to cost over a Mil to rebuild since the fire. Having that kind of house can be a burden, if your income can't handle it. Sure, we can pay the mortgage and do lots of other things, but watering the yard alone costs about $400/mo during the summer. Sorry this is off topic. In a way, this kind of thing can have a big effect on the ability to go to plan B, though. In our case, we need to communicate almost daily with each other and the contractor, to make sure the house is rebuilt in the right fashion. If I go to plan b before the work's done, I would have a tough time doing plan b correctly. Are lives are almost too complicated right now for that, but make no mistake, I won't put up with OM contact forever. In fact, my Plan A deadline falls right in the middle of this one-year rebuilding ET. I will have to plan carefully how I want to deal with the property, if I have to go to plan B in 6 months.<p>persevere, all!

K - I will make the call, thanks for the little push in that direction. You are right, I can afford it... but what is to become of my polo pony? LOL<p>2long - you are right that the "burn rate" of living in a big house is rarified air. There is no way my WW would ever be able to stay in the house even if she completely devastated me in a divorce (and that would not happen) due to the amount of money a bigger house burns through, excluding the mortgage, taxes and insurance. By the way, sorry to hear about the fire... that is scary stuff.

K, judging by your member number and what I've read from you here, it sounds like your experience would be very helpful to me. Would you mind checking out my thread "Affairs that don't end...confused...help"?<p>No disrespect to Conan intruding here...just trying to gather all the feedback which has been so helpful...

<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>but what is to become of my polo pony? LOL<hr></blockquote><p>Glue???<p>(I have two horses, so please don't take offense with the joke).<p>2long---I understand all too well about burn rate (those aforementioned horses put a dent in the monthly budget---add three kids, four dogs, a few cats...) My point is that it's usually well worth the expense to try to fix your marriage, even with professional help, then to go through a divorce. I used to say that the grand or so you'd spend on 20 sessions with Steve was a heck of a lot cheaper than a lawyer---but Steve's rates have gone up since then [img]images/icons/shocked.gif" border="0[/img] . Still---it's always cheaper than divorce, and I found the MB counseling invaluable.