o2bsane.........good advice. I heard you.

I'm confused....you have one post about wanting to have an affair and another about wanting to have a baby! What's up? Please don't bring a baby into an unhealthy marriage.

vernon3,<p>I went back to re-read what you said after I posted yesterday and I worried that you might take my comments personally. I really do know how hard this stuff is when you're dealing with an uncaring spouse. And I didn't mean to be disrespectful - I know you've been working a long time at this, and anyone who works at a relationship has my respect.<p>I really do hope your H "gets it", and soon. I hope you can get the marriage you want, and personally I think that the MB principles are the best method around for healing damaged relationshiops. It's a pretty simple approach, really, but often people make the mistake of thinking that Plan A is all about influenceing a WS. That's a great thing if it happens to work out, but Plan A is much more about making you an attractive alternative. Maybe if Resilient comes back she could bring up the "Misapplication of Plan A" thread. NSR used to have a really great collection of "Notable Posts" too, and there was some good stuff on Plan A there.<p>Finally, I'd like to nominate this<p> <blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>I know that having an affair is so bad for a relationship...<hr></blockquote><p>for consideration in the "Understatement of the Month" contest.

The issues that you have with your husband should not be used as a justification to have an affair. If you are not happy with your husband than do the honourable thing and divorce him. He does not deserve to be punished by you lying and cheating behind his back because of disagreements that you have with him. If both of you have different goals in life and see marriage differently than divorce may be a valid option. To thyself be true.

Hi and thanks so much for all your kind words and support. I did talk to my husband and we talked for hours last night. There were a lot of tears and angry words. In the end, we promised to try so much harder to work at our relationship since it does mean so much. I am searching for the books that were recommended and will begin reading them as soon as I have them in my hands. My husband doesn't think we need conselling or to take any questionaire. His reasoning for not doind either is because he doesn't want to fight about such things. Talking to him made me feel better and we discussed the OM very briefly. My H knows the OM and I are good friends, but seeing the OM is out of the question for now, since we are collegues. Guess it makes it hard to be away from the Man who could put a nasty kink into my life. I have held back from this man, and it has been real hard. I know he is giving me the EN that I am not receiving at home. My H and I thought for awhile about things we have in common (nothing) and things we used to have in common (lots). Things have changed alot between when I first met my H and now. Don't they always change? But we are going to look into some new activites that might interest both of us and take it from there. <p>Yes Maggie, I do still want a baby, it yearns for me daily. I know bringing a baby into an unhealthy marriage is the wrong thing to do (I see teenage parents who struggle with it daily), but I pride myself on being fairly intelligent and once my husband knew of any pregnancy, that we could get help and focus attention on each other and lean on each other instead of someone else. Sounds dumb, I know, but there is a real though behind that. Having an affair with this OM, would not give me the baby I so desire, and my H would know that any baby right now would not be his. We haven't been together in a while, and he is smart enough to put two and two together.
So I am still struggling through this, but I cherish all your advice and support. Please keep giving me advice, since my H will not participate in any questionaires or counselling. Do any of you have a way that I can convince H to go to counselling?

Holly, I am not the most experienced at this and I am sure others can give you great advice!<p>I would like to say that you've taken the biggest step in having that talk with your H. You probably know this but you can't "make him" do anything and you can't change him either; only yourself.<p>Get His Needs/Her Needs and Surviving An Affair. You'll be able to see what it is that you need to do to make changes in you. Any changes you make always have a ripple effect on others close to you. <p>He may get more interested in what you are doing when he sees the positive results from what you're learning. You've been very courageous!!
Bless you! CSue

holly:<p>"My husband doesn't think we need conselling or to take any questionaire. His reasoning for not doind either is because he doesn't want to fight about such things. "<p>Famous last words!!!! Tell your H, please, that this is the EXACT same attitude that I had when my W started her first A 12 years ago. It'd be a lot better if he hunkered down NOW and dealt with these things with you rather than let you two continue to grow apart until something awful happened (like one of you having an A). Marriages require maintenance to remain fulfilling and "compete" with the excitement of a fantasy person.<p>Do YOURSELF a favor and never see your OM again. I know this sounds hard and maybe even seem impossible, but it's got to be easier than dealing with the pain of getting involved with him.<p>Take care, and GOOD FOR YOU for talking to your H about this very difficult subject for you.<p>All my best,

Ditto to what 2long said!!! Hi 2long how's it going?

Want it back and vernon3,<p>I should have made it clear that the whiners I had in mind were the ones I have seen on talk shows so many times who always seem to lament that they tried and tried to tell the spouse how unhappy they were, but they were never straightforward enough to tell the WHOLE truth as Holly has done. Most of us posting here have achieved some level of personal insight or else we wouldn't be here looking for answers, so I do recognize that about my fellow posters. Just had that image in my head from the last talk show I saw.
[img]images/icons/rolleyes.gif" border="0[/img] <p>I share your dismay, vernon3, as I've been trying to educate my H about my ENs for nearly 11 years now, and the essence of his stance is that I shouldn't HAVE the needs I have. He would argue why it was wrong for me to feel the way I felt. His position is that *I* need to adjust my needs to fit what he is willing to give and my feelings to be happy with whatever he does. Not only was this absolutely unsatisfying so that I felt unloved throughout most of the M, but then he proceeds to compound it by having an A.<p>The way I have dealt with this is pretty much as o2bsane outlines with Plan A, and I have also found The Divorce Remedy helpful for new ideas in getting through to my H. Also, I've switched my focus from trying to educate him about my ENs and/or defending them and my feelings, and I communicate more about the RESULTS of his failure to meet my ENs and/or avoid LBs.<p>I keep him apprised of the balance of his account in my Love Bank and what happens when it's empty. I am very matter of fact about it because I'm so used to seeing the inevitability of it from reading this forum. For example: "When A happened, my feelings for you deteriorated quite a bit and are now very close to the danger zone." Or, "When B happened, it resulted in a HUGE deposit in my Love Bank, and I am feeling very loving towards you right now." "I just cannot be in a M where I don't feel safe and protected." I just share the facts. What he does about them is his choice, but I feel I am meeting my obligation to communicate with him what he needs to know about the status of the M.<p>Holly,<p>The reason for the counseling and the questionnaires is so that you and your H can learn how NOT to fight about such things--that is the purpose of them. Hopefully you can find a way to convey that to him.<p>At the top of this page is a link, "Q&A", which leads to Dr. Harley's Question and Answer columns. In the "How to Survive Infidelity" section, Dr. Harley answers a letter from a woman in a situation much like yours, except she is attracted to her H's best friend. I think Dr. Harley's advice to her would be very beneficial for you as well.<p>Also, PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE understand that a baby WILL NOT draw you and your H closer together, especially when you have pathology in the M currently. Babies tend to have the opposite effect EVEN on very healthy marriages because of the added time away from one-on-one quality time and added stress of meeting the child's needs. Better to have all the M ducks in a nice straight row first, or everything will just go from bad to worse. Dr. Harley discusses this issue on this website as well. Please read what he has to say about it.<p>We have all learned these lessons the hard way. Learn from our mistakes. I don't think anyone here has had more babies than I have; I love having them and I understand the desire, but there is no doubt of the burden they add when trying to build an affair-proof M. Affair-proof FIRST, then baby.<p>[ May 30, 2002: Message edited by: Conqueror ]</p>

thanks congueror, I tried, I really did. Even though, the full blame still lies with me, though I don't whine about it. [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img] [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img]

<p>[ May 31, 2002: Message edited by: want it back ]</p>

Hi,
When you are unhappy it is easy to want to find someone else to fill the needs that are not being met. However, in doing so, it will cause more pain than the unhappiness did. <p>If you told your H, about the feelings you are having for this other person, what do you think his reaction will be? Will he wake up and realize that there are issues here or will he see this as a betrayal? <p>Can you cut back on your social events so you have more time with your H. How important are these social events? More important than your M. Maybe he is angry that you are not home much and the social events you attend do not interest him. <p>Do not start the A, but you need to find ways to have your needs filled. <p>Good luck and stay strong -

o2bsane...I did take it personally, and that was a good thing. I didn't feel any disrespect at all, on the contrary....I felt that 2x4 that I desparately needed and I should have THANKED you.<p>I just wanted you to know that someone was listening and what you said got thru the fog before it was too late.

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