I just stumbled upon this site today and am desperately taking in all the information here. After nearly 7 years of marriage, I have become a cheating spouse. I went on a vacation alone - no kids, no husband - and fulfilled all those aching needs that demand attention in a stagnant and emotionally empty marriage.

I came home depressed and unfocused. My normally detached and somewhat dense DH suspected something... so he boldly asked (very out of character!). After a few days of denying it out of shame and disbelief, I caved in and admitted my indiscretion. I refused to give him any details - I was ashamed and sad and depressed - and I felt (still feel) that I deserve to keep SOME dignity in the matter. Why be so explicit? However, he knows enough to know that we are now faced with that OH SO LOVELY issue of testing for STDs. So now I vaselate between nasuea and depression. (I honestly doubt I have contracted anything, but only time and testing will tell.)

We are currently trying to put our marriage back together. We love each other deeply and just recently, my DH has realized his own unhappiness in our marriage and life in general. (We had been in couple's counseling prior to my affair b/c I was unhappy and unfulfilled - yet he remained steadfast in his belief that he was quite happy with our situation. This was hurtful in itself since I could not understand HOW he could be so happy when I was NOT.)

So in short, we both realize the part we have played in this whole miserable situation and desperately want to work it out. I can honestly say that there is no chance of me keeping in contact with the OM since he lives out of state, and I have no way of contacting him. It was truely a "fling" - I did NOT have an affair with a close friend or co-worker.

So here are my questions:

1. How much honesty is required when it comes to the details of the affair? Do I really have to give him a play-by-play? Isn't it enough that DH knows I had sexual contact with OM?

2. I have not been 100% totally honest about my sexual past with DH. Is it really important to tell him about every sexual encounter I ever had?

3. I am concerned that if we don't get back on track with our marriage, I will be tempted to seek outside validation and gratification again. I had discussed the possibility and temptation of having an affair with DH before this happened - thus we went to counseling. His efforts with our therapis were non-existant there since he was supposedly "happy". I felt abandoned in my crisis... thus the affair was a logical next step. The affair was a wake-up call to my DH (but a really crappy and hurtful one.) I want to be sure it doesn't happen again... but so much of this depends on getting what I need from DH... What is the next step?

I desperately need support and help. I hope this is the place to get it!

Eve <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" />

Eve,

On this site the concept of "radical honesty" is taken very seriously. So, the answer to one of your questions is: Yes. You need to answer his questions very honestly. HOWEVER, it is fair for you to warn him that they will hurt him. It is even fair to ask him if he wants the general stuff now, and the more specific stuff later, that you will be honest with him. It will hurt him and he may regret learning as much as he will, but it is his call. Some here have found that they really needed the details to process what has happened and to deal with it in their minds.

You are correct to ask that question and to wonder about it, but if there is to be good in your marriage you both need to learn to be honest and open with each other. As you might surmise there was a better way to learn this, but this is the path that has been set, so the people here will do their best to help you with it.

Two answer you second question, I cannot think of a better time to open up and tell him the truth about everything. It will be a blow, but it will help his healing.

Your third point is valid. However, there is something you need to address and you won't want to. No matter what your H did or didn't do, he didn't deserve what you have done to him and your marriage. I know you are early into this, but you must come to see your role in the marriage, and own your decisions. You really have no idea how badly you have hurt him. But if you read here you will get some idea.

Now having said all of this, I would suggest you two get several books: His Needs Her Needs and Surviving an Affair, both by Harley. There are some other very good books out there but these two I am familiar with. Read them, read the articles here. As your H to read the books, particularly Surviving An Affair first, but the needs book secondly.

It will open both of your eyes to your relationship and what has happened. What can happen?

Well, if your H decides he wants to try and you give him your best efforts, I suspect you two can really improve your marriage. BUT, realize it takes 1 to 2 years to fully recover from an affair, IF people are trying. This stuff isn't for sissies. It is hard to do. A lot of pain, alot of lost self-esteem, lost of trust, so many things, but they can be overcome.

So do some reading. Hang in there, this won't be easy. Please post and ask questions, and offer advice as you see fit.

I am sorry to welcome you here, but I am glad that you found this site. I suspect as the weeks go by you will be glad you found it.

God Bless,

JL

Welcome Eve, and yes, this is the place to get some help and, yes, you need it.

So does your husband.

Before I attempt to answer some of your questions we need to get one thing straightened out:

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by Eve72:
<strong>I felt abandoned in my crisis... thus the affair was a logical next step.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">There is no logic in an affair. Only selfishness. Please do not attempt to "logic" your crisis. You likely will not be able to proceed until you accept this truth.

But, you are to be commended for seeking out help and posting here. There are many other WSs here - most of them female, I think, so you can find some people in a similar place.
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">1. How much honesty is required when it comes to the details of the affair? Do I really have to give him a play-by-play? Isn't it enough that DH knows I had sexual contact with OM? </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">It seems very common for WSs to underestimate the pain and confusion experienced by BSs. Wanting all the details may seem unnecessary to you and perhaps you feel the details will cause unnecessary paint to your H. But believe me, the MOST pain in affairs for a BS comes from dishonesty. As you read and learn here you will encounter the concept of Radical Honesty. Herein lies you answer.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">2. I have not been 100% totally honest about my sexual past with DH. Is it really important to tell him about every sexual encounter I ever had? </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">See my response to your first question. Perhaps your encounters before marriage or before you ever met your H are off limits. But all encounters that were infidelities ought to be laid on the table. When you demonstrate radical honesty, he will be more willing to do so as well.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I want to be sure it doesn't happen again... but so much of this depends on getting what I need from DH... What is the next step? </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">You're in the right place to learn. Your husband needs to be here as well. You will learn about the reasons behind the temptation to stray. They're rooted in unmet emotional needs. Your H played a big role in not meeting your needs, but did he know what they were? Was he trying and not able to read your mind? Or did you not communicate them well?

First step: browse and find the emotional needs questionaire. Print one out for both of you, fill them out in private and then share the results. You will likely both be surprised at what you learn.

Good luck and keep asking questions.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">1. How much honesty is required when it comes to the details of the affair? Do I really have to give him a play-by-play? Isn't it enough that DH knows I had sexual contact with OM? </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Knowing our spouse had an affair is not enough for some of us BS(betrayed spouses). I for one felt that I could not go forward in my marriage without full disclosure of any question I wanted to ask.

My WS finally agreed to tell. The answers were not easy to take I can assure you. But afterwards I felt some ease. At least I now knew where I stood and didn't have that aspect of it eating at me.

So no, knowing is not enough. I urge you to look at this as a test by your H to examine your truthfullness.


</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">2. I have not been 100% totally honest about my sexual past with DH. Is it really important to tell him about every sexual encounter I ever had? </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Well it may have been of little importance to him before your affair, but now I can see where it could be all important. Should that matter in the relationship now? I do not think it should. But then again...everyone has different opinions on the subject.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">3. I am concerned that if we don't get back on track with our marriage, I will be tempted to seek outside validation and gratification again. I had discussed the possibility and temptation of having an affair with DH before this happened - thus we went to counseling. His efforts with our therapis were non-existant there since he was supposedly "happy". I felt abandoned in my crisis... thus the affair was a logical next step. The affair was a wake-up call to my DH (but a really crappy and hurtful one.) I want to be sure it doesn't happen again... but so much of this depends on getting what I need from DH... What is the next step? </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">An affair is never a logical next step to marital problems. I suggest that you leave the marriage before having another affair.

You seem to think that an affair can be justified by inaction from your husband. That is clearly wrong. If things cannot be repaired to your satisfaction and that of your H then you need to not be together. Do not let another man be the reason for your marriage failing.

jd

<small>[ March 10, 2003, 04:49 PM: Message edited by: jdmac1 ]</small>

His efforts with our therapis were non-existant there since he was supposedly "happy".

I was, if not happy, content at the time my H began a PA. I knew he was depressed, his mom was ill, he didn't like his job. He never said any of his unhappiness was with me.

That was 4/98. And I spent 2 extremely miserable years while he had his PA and we separated 7 times. We reconcilied 5/00 and I am glad for that, but...last fall my H told me he was happy and he'd give anything for me to be happy again. I am happy, we're in love, but it's been work.

Now with your A, your H has realized his unhappiness...you may find you wish you could have his happy self back. And you may not see it for a long time.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I want to be sure it doesn't happen again... but so much of this depends on getting what I need from DH </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I would have a lot more hope for your situation if you were certain it would never happen again NO MATTER WHAT. Or that you would divorce first. If you leave the door open for further infidelity, your marriage won't recover.

In some ways a fling may be easier for you to overcome than, as you say, a co-worker or friend because you don't have contact...but in another way, for your H, it makes your behavior suspect, you picked a stranger...could have been anybody, no relationship, just bam, infidelity.

It is a loss of your dignity. Of honor. Of trustworthiness. A blow to your husband's self-esteem, trust, love.

How is your counselor? Effective? Experienced with infidelity issues? Is your H participating more now?

Follow through with the STD testing, with a follow up in 6 months.

Marriages do survive infidelity...but as Just Learning says, it isn't for the half-hearted, or perhaps, for the unremorseful wayward spouse.

You can learn a lot here.

<small>[ March 10, 2003, 05:09 PM: Message edited by: Lor (Lor) ]</small>

1. How much honesty is required when it comes to the details of the affair? Do I really have to give him a play-by-play? Isn't it enough that DH knows I had sexual contact with OM?

I saw a study that said one of the biggest factors determining recovery from an affair is if they couple is able to discuss it openly and honestly. The more they talk, the better they recover.

My counselor told me there are prices a person pays for having an affair. One of them is to have to answer the BS’s questions over and over and over until the BS has no move questions and is satisfied. What do I mean by satisfied? The BS is not asking the questions to torture the WS, they are trying to make sense out of why the WS had an affair, why the affair was all about, if the WS still loves them and if so how they could have done it, can the WS be trusted to never do this again, and what assurances the WS can give them.

Another price is that the WS has to listen to the BS express their anger over and over and over until the anger is gone.

My husband told me shortly after d-day that he caused the damage to our relationship, so it was his job to fix it.

Thank goodness he understood. We spent about 3-4 months like this.. discussing his affairs for hours at a time. Then one day I suddenly had no more questions. I’ve had few since.. 3/21 is our 2-year d-day anniversary. We are well into a very good recovery.

I realized early on that there were some details that would hurt very badly. I had a few of those and it really did no one any good for me to have them. So we discussed what I wanted to know. We agreed that if I asked for a detail that was not in the best interest of my mental health, that he would warn me that I was treading on thin ice. But if I insisted, he had to tell me. The point is not about the details, it is about honesty and sharing.

You have to rebuild the trust and intimacy in your marriage. One very important aspect of that is radical honesty. You lived through the affair, you know everything about it. He knows nothing… so as hard as it is, bring him into your secret world. Let him experience it with you.

My husband and I came out of this period of recovery much closer than we’d ever been. He became both the source of my pain and my recovery.

Believe me, his imagination is worse than what went on. It’s better for him to know the truth.

2. I have not been 100% totally honest about my sexual past with DH. Is it really important to tell him about every sexual encounter I ever had?

What my H and I did with the personal history questionnaire is that we listed the names of the people we’d had major relationships with. And we gave an overall number of sexual partners. We also shared what the most way-out things we’d done. We have very similar backgrounds in this. Neither of us cares to know any more details. They are irrelevant to our relationship.

3. I am concerned that if we don't get back on track with our marriage, I will be tempted to seek outside validation and gratification again. I had discussed the possibility and temptation of having an affair with DH before this happened - thus we went to counseling. His efforts with our therapist were non-existent there since he was supposedly "happy". I felt abandoned in my crisis... thus the affair was a logical next step. The affair was a wake-up call to my DH (but a really crappy and hurtful one.) I want to be sure it doesn't happen again... but so much of this depends on getting what I need from DH... What is the next step?

Work through the MB material with your husband. Give your marriage a set amount of time. I would also suggest you read the material on www.divorcebusting.com. Though there are differences in the MB and DB material, they work wonderfully together. If he will not work on your marriage with you, then end your marriage. An affair is not the logical next step.

There are many ways you can get the validation and gratification you need other than from an affair. Affairs, as you have already experienced, do more harm to one’s self worth than not.

Affairs are not caused by unmet needs. Unmet needs make a person vulnerable. Affairs are caused by people not protecting their vulnerabilities. You and your husband need to affair proof your marriage.

Another point you may want to contemplate. BS’s have secondary affairs so often that it’s almost predictable.. somewhere between 50%-80% of them. It is not about revenge, it’s about an attempt to make the pain go away and to regain some feeling of self worth. While I know you are worried about the pain you are in and having to share too deeply with your husband, a very large part of your work right now is to affair proof your marriage to keep your husband from following in your footsteps.

This is a good website. I’m sure you can find a lot of support here.