Hi everyone,

Well,if you remember my most recent posts,my WH came home last weekend to tell me he wanted to reconcile and said many sweet things and well you get the drift.Believer you are going to love this.

Well,the weekend goes by and we had plans for my WH to write out his NC letter at work,send it to me to finalize and then off it goes.So,being the huge skeptic I am,I wait and see if this is all going to happen.It doesn't. A few days go by and I am wondering why A)my WH wants to keep minumum contact with me,afterall,shouldn't we be helping and supporting each other? B) No letter is drafted and therefore not sent.

So I discuss this with WH and it turns out that no,OW/HW is not going to be in town next week but she is going to be there tomorrow(which was yesterday)! SO,WH says he can't send her the e-mail/letter because she will be in town til the end of Feb seeing "family"(sure).He then goes on to say that he HAS to give it to her in person, there is no other way after we agreed that he wouldn't, shouldn't, couldn't see her again or it will cause me great pain.

So as per usual,WH is doing what HE wants even if I would implode if he saw her in person again.Tonight after finding out that he sent this HW a gift/flowers for Valentine's Day in Toronto the DAY before he gets home,I go ballistic.I e-mail him and we say somethings,LB's yes but he tells me that he has to say his "good byes" his way and the gift was one way of doing that.Also,to please put the painful past behind us and when "I" finally say it's over it's over and we can owrk on our marriage,etc.etc.Then he casually mentions that he already told the HW it's over but never bothered to tell ME earlier today until I confronted him on it.More selfish painful acts.

So,I am freakin out and I call my SIL and bounce the idea off her of calling OW.She says go for it,what have you got to lose now.I decided that yes,I will because if he did already tell her that it's over,then I am not spilling any beans right? No harm done.So I call her and I am rather calm,a little shaky but I ask to talk briefly,she agrees and I proceed to tell her that I don't know what my WH has told you but these are the facts: and I go down the list of how she is hurting me and my children and our families,yada yada yada.Then I hang up.

Of course my WH is mad as hades and tells me he doesn't want to talk to me anymore tongight and he will check his e-mail Monday.Meanwhile he didn't call my daughters to say goodnight nor can my oldest even get him on his cell phone.Hmmm. I smell a RAT.

As for his counseling session on last Monday my WH said it went good and for my session this past Thursday,I felt like I hadn't accomplished anything.I was mad as a beehive and I am still.I told my counselor that I wasn't sure how things were going to go because the mere FACT that my WH thought about seeing this OW again to say "good bye" after putting me through that before last October speaks VOLUMES.

Remember folks: ACTIONS SPEAK LOUDER THAN WORDS.

Look at what the WS is DOING,not saying.

Argh,stay tuned for more on: "As the Stomach Turns"

O <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" />

Octobergirl, I feel your pain.

My H, months ago, before I even found this website, assured me after his first physical encounter with OW, that he was very sorry and he would break it off. I suggested email. He said no, that he needed to do it face to face.

You can see where that has gotten me.

I agree...watch the actions, even though it gets REALLY hard not to get caught up in believing the words, especially when they sound hopeful.

Oh October girl. Hugs to you.

I think our H's are reading out of the same book. Mine said goodbye to OW "his way" 3 times in a motel room, and twice in his bed. These are just the ones I found out about.

He told me NC letter was pointless - yeah, he was right about that one.

Now he keeps coming over and says he is giving me till April to let him move back home. That is my last chance. Hehe. The fogtalk is just too much.

Stick to your guns. Let H know that this is not going to work for you. Babble to him and say that you want him to come back, can he see himself coming back? What would it be like if he came back? Tell him you are very confused.

Octobergirl, I am sorry you found out the hard way. But please don't let it get you down, it is all part of the recovery process. At least you caught on quickly enough. Others NEVER catch on and end up enduring the continuation of the affair. As you have discovered, actions are all that count with a WS.

Hang in there, he is close to the end. You just have to help him get his mind right and wait until the affair is truly ended. Take care. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Octgirl hug! hug! hug!

You are the superwoman remember!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" />

Hello Octobergirl

Hummm I don't know I might be wrong here. But it seems to me you H is in the middle of the A. Valentine's flowers and he is going to end it? Doesn't look like that to me. Also counseling while he is still in the A might be fruitless. It was for me anyway. I'm pointing all this, because like you, I was very blind and my H a liar.

Keep strong and don't believe what he is telling you now until his actions speak louder.
Take good care

After reading these posts I feel like I am really stupid or very lucky. My husband wrote a NC letter and we met with the OW together in his office. OW tried some tricks that day and of course spilled some beans on information I hadn't been told, even though I had asked point blank about this information. OW has e-mailed a few times, the first one stating that she knew the NC was a lie and it was just to make me feel better.

Hang in there girls, and maybe try doing the NC together.

Hi all,

Thanks for the replies.I don't plan on calling the homewrecker(HW) again that's for sure,that was a very disgusting experience to say the least but I had to let her know my feelings and the facts,I didn't call to berate her although she deserves it bigtime.

Anyway,the most important piece of information I wanted her to know was that my WH's family will NEVER welcome her into the family no matter what so it is pointless to continue to be involved with my WH unless she also doesn't care that she is helping to sever ties between everyone.

I spent this morning packing up the last of my WH clothes and stuffed them into his suitcases until I know what next week holds.Personally,I want so much to go back to plan B and not work on my marriage,in fact I may need a few weeks off from the insanity(WH) and rethink things.But we'll see what WH has to say,if anything,next week.

One positive thing though is that my WH didn't get his contract renewed in Los Angeles so if we have a chance at all at making our marriage better,if that's what we both want,we will not have the huge distance issue to deal with anymore,at least for now.

So,even after a very depressing night and little sleep, I feel more like my superwoman self this morning(thanks ziz). I just had to shake off that depression and self pity and get back to fury mode. "He!! hath no fury like a woman scorned!" LOL That would be me..

O <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" />

Anyway,the most important piece of information I wanted her to know was that my WH's family will NEVER welcome her into the family no matter what so it is pointless to continue to be involved with my WH unless she also doesn't care that she is helping to sever ties between everyone.

I was curious, what was her response to these facts? What did she say? "I'm sorry, but we're in love." .... or what?

The thing is, these adulterors "feel" like their love is so special that when everyone else sees the joy they bring to each other .... all the family strife will be mended magically. "If WS is happy, then he'll be a better father, and his kids will be happy for him, as will his family." .... which is rubbish, of course, but part of the OP fog. She is not a deamon any more than your H is. Don't forget that. The OW my H was involved with told my MIL this: "Don't you think I'd make you son a good wife?" ...... This was before the A was known, and MIL thought the OW was losing her mind. The OW is going to be really hurt, she is about to lose her "special soulmate love" >gag< ..... and in her blinders, the family's pain is justified because the eventual outcome is going to be "special". >double gag<

Sooooo, here is what I think, don't call your WH. If he emails or calls you trying to engage you in a R discussion... keep your responses simple and very vague. "Let me think." or "I'm not sure." or "Time will tell." Dangle him. Let him feel uneasy about not knowing where you are. Very minimal words. VERY.

You are TOO forthcomming with him. Let him be confused and not so sure of having you .... without you actually saying anything that can be used as a reason to go to OW.

Best to you.....

Pep

PS .... If OW is in LA.... I could go pay her a little friendly "visit"! Mr. Pep knows some "security" people .... hee hee

<img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Hey pep!

I agree.I know OW/HW is no better than my WH but had she not involved herself with my WH whom she knew beforehand was married,who knows how things would have turned out but yeah I know,that's a guessing game.I have no respect for her( <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" /> ) nor do I have for my WH BUT the difference is that I do feel an obligation to see if our marriage can be saved,on some level,because if I just bail,then I will not be able to be guilt free on that one.

The HW didn't resond to anything I said on the phone but I didn't really give her a chance to,I didn't WANT to listen to her,I only wanted her to know FACTS as opposed to what she may have been fed by my philandering H.I knew if I let her say a word I would have lost it.

Well,the last couple of days have played out very badly so I am going to lay low for now and see what WH has to say next week.HW is only in LA supposedly until the end of the month(Lives in Toronto) but gee,it would be so nice for her to have a little visit from some related MB friends!I can dream.

The big difference is that my WH knows I am going to see my lawyer next Tuesday so I will have to decide if there is any truth to his insipid,inane e-mails and then I will be the judge whether or not we "move forward", as he says.Ugh <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

Hi Jazzey,

Yep.Keep those eyes WIDE open at all times.I am still aware and keeping my wits about me, my dear.

O <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" />

I'm close to LA. My neighbor is a PI. Let me know if you need some spying.

Ooh believer,

That sounds like a great idea.But,I know already that they are probably together this weekend if not the whole rest of the week,who knows really but them.Grrr.

I mean,according to WH,this is good bye FOREVER so he just has to take days and days to say goodbye! Even though he said he wasn't even going to see her at first.

Funny how he is always changing his tune.Lying, cheating,selfish,coldhearted,manipulating,bas****,oops sorry,I got carried away there for a sec. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

O

The end of February will mean LA is history,thank GOD.Thanks for the offer though.

No, no, no, no, no!!!!!

I know you know this, but goodbye forever doesn't take days, and with OW it should never be in person!

It would be a big LB, so of course don't say it, but it would make me want to say "Let me show you just how quickly a goodbye forever can be....goodbye!"

Ok, just imagine saying it and get it out of your system. But - I notice you said something about going back to plan B. Sorry, I haven't followed every step of your story, but you were in plan B and then went out because he promised NC? And now he is not NC? Doesn't that mean you immediately go back to B until you have proof of NC?

What he's learning here is that he can have things both ways, and still see OW, as long as he tells you he's "working" on NC. This isn't something you should allow him to negotiate. You just say "Sorry. I love you, and I want things to be better again, but I can see that you aren't NC. It isn't fooling me, though maybe you are even fooling yourself. That happens in an affair. So I have to be the one with the clear head here, and that means NC has to be really NC. And what you're doing is not NC, no matter what you call it. When you are ready to really go NC, let me know."

I know it's hard, because you want so much to believe him. But you've read it all here before - it's typical fog. It isn't NC until YOU know it's NC!!!!!!

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by Octobergirl:
[qb}Also,to please put the painful past behind us and when "I" finally say it's over it's over and we can owrk on our marriage,etc.etc.[/QB]</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Hi October! Sounds like your WH has reneged on his agreement with you. The above quote leaves me wondering just who is responsible for the affair. Your WH seems to think you are in control of the affair, or much more likely, is trying to shove the responsiblity for it onto you. You bad girl! If only you would say it's over then it would be over. October, why are you making him participate in this affair? Just say it's over. Of course, October you see my point.

He is shifting the responsiblity to you. This is nonsense.

He should not be allowed to live with you until a proper NC letter is sent and you have both agreed on safeguards to ensure NC.

<small>[ February 21, 2004, 04:40 PM: Message edited by: JustinExplorer ]</small>

Hi penguin,

WH is "supposedly" telling OW it's over and when he gets home next weekend that's it.So we shall see. I am going to wait to see what he has to say next week as we had a blowout of sorts.He is also going to be back home too which will be interesting.

My WH knows that this is IT.I am seeing my lawyer next week so he knows I am serious.I also told him when he came home last weekend to be absolutely sure that it's over because I will NOT tolerate any slips,calls,gifts,chokes,meetings or e-mails or I am DONE.I have never been more serious about that in my life so he better be ready,we would be in for the looong haul.

I personally don't think he can do it.He's weak and still addicted but we shall see.I am going to give him that chance if only for my kids and to have a clear conscience.

O

Octobergirl -

I am right with you on this. My D papers are at the lawyer, ready to be picked up and filed.

I am trying to take my time, but have pretty much had it with the goodbyes in a motel room or in his bed. He has given me an ultimatum - April. We guess what, I don't think it will be that long.

believer,

I had to laugh the other day when your WH gave YOU the ultimatum of April.Now if that isn't fogspeak,I don't know what is!

Well,I am not going to have any D papers drawn up just yet but I am gathering and preparing for that day,if and when it comes.This includes the consults I have been having with my lawyer and mediator.The next few weeks will be interesting.But I am keeping my guard up nonetheless.

I hope you are at peace when it comes to D if that's what you decide.You have been through the wringer with that ole WH of yours.Like you told someone else here,I have two "young" daughters to think of so I do want to have the chance at a better marriage but if I didn't have kids,I would most likely have been gone by now.They are what's keeping me tied to WH at this point.

See ya round the mulberry bush! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

O

You are strong, O, and an inspiration to others.

Make sure you stay firm with him, hopefully the fog will break soon and you wont have to follow through.

At the same time, if he continues to have contact when he returns home you must stay true to yourself and your children, and not allow him to cause you any more hurt.

Good luck

Why thank you ks. I am and have always been a strong woman so I know I will survive this mess no matter what and show my daughter's how to be self reliant.(Well,God has had a hand in this too)!

But this site also has helped me tremendously,so many wonderful folks here! The next few weeks should be interesting though.I just can't wait to see what happens. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

O