Shmaley,

The purpose of this letter is.....? I think you lost it in the beginning. You want to write a 'nice' letter after what she just did to you?

Hold back. If you must write a letter keep it simple. Light is ok but not to cheery and not too teachy. Can guarantee you that a WS will see all sorts of red flags with your letter. Just your cheeriness will push her into a WS mood. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" />

Tone it down a bit or if you can hold off a bit do so. She needs to realize that you know she manipulated you and as a result, you have cut off some contact. Let her stew in her own gravy for a while.

But if you must, write about the dogs, tell her you are starting to come out of the weather (don't explain) and plan to feel better soon. Toss in a few things like the dogs seem happier, plants growing nicely, cooking is getting better..... you know say a few positive and let her 'wonder' how good you are doing.

The EN stuff, needs to take the back seat for a while. She probably isn't ready for that yet. You will get a chance to use it.

Is all this editing making you dizzy? It did for me to. Not your letters but when I did mine. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

take care,
L.

Orchid said: </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> The purpose of this letter is.....? I think you lost it in the beginning. You want to write a 'nice' letter after what she just did to you? </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Jennifer C. said that I should continue with letters like the last one I wrote. She has not read this one though. She said around 1 a week would be good. Are you saying that I should spite WW for what she has done to me? Or are you just suggesting that I withdraw to make her become mentally engaged? I am confused. Where is this part of MB principals in Plan A?

Orchid said: </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Hold back. If you must write a letter keep it simple. Light is ok but not to cheery and not too teachy. Can guarantee you that a WS will see all sorts of red flags with your letter. Just your cheeriness will push her into a WS mood. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I see that I was being teachy point taken. But what is wrong with being cheery? I though I was suppose to project that I was doing well even better without her. Jennifer C. said that I want to seem that I am persuing WW to some extent. Can you be more specific with what the red flags are and how I should hold back. Are you talking 180 stuff?

Orchid said: </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> Tone it down a bit or if you can hold off a bit do so. She needs to realize that you know she manipulated you and as a result, you have cut off some contact. Let her stew in her own gravy for a while. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> I have made some strong comments to her that I documented from our last conversation. Basically, wouldn't allow her to manipulate me (with the credit card to go see OM thing). Where are you talking about WW manipulating me? As far as contact she seems to be just starting to warm up to me. She called on her way back from a lesson tonight just to tell me something that an old friend said that she thought I would enjoy. We talked for about 15min that is the most I have had her talk to me on the phone in 2 months. Do you still think that I should back off. I understand your concern for toneing it down but why cut down contact especially when she is initiating?

Orchid said: </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> But if you must, write about the dogs, tell her you are starting to come out of the weather (don't explain) and plan to feel better soon. Toss in a few things like the dogs seem happier, plants growing nicely, cooking is getting better..... you know say a few positive and let her 'wonder' how good you are doing. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">She knows I am not sick anymore because I just saw her the night before last so I can't make her wonder this way. LOL all plants are dead...I murdered our Mango tree with thirst too <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" /> I do get your point though.

Orchid said: </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> The EN stuff, needs to take the back seat for a while. She probably isn't ready for that yet. You will get a chance to use it. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> You and Weaver are probably right that I am coming on too strong with the EN's. I was just going for what Jennifer C. said about planting seeds to grow later. But I am probably trying to grow a chiapet rather than a modest flower garden.I must need to back off. But if I don't write about something of M value it just feels awkward. I need to quit hand delivering these letters and start sending them through the mail. More romantic that way and it won't feel weird giving her a letter about casual stuff when I just got done talking to her.

I still feel conflicted here though. Really felt like I was suppose to be sneeking in concepts. Uuuuugghhhh. This makes my brain hurt.

WW came by earlier while I was gone to pick up mail. She called me to see if it was ok if she went inside to change clothes. I told her that was fine. When I got home I noticed that she had opened the symphony contract package that was on the counter but she left it. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" /> What the..... What do you make of this? My roommate that works with her said that she was talking today about not being able to afford plane tickets and how she could get them. Push Pull Push Pull.

I will not let it upset me too much though. Sorry that I am asking a million questions and that this post is soooo long. I'm just feeling confused and a little off track I guess. Need some guidance.

C.

Hellooo.

<img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

I'm reading "Love must be tough" and I am starting to understand your direction a little better Orchid. I hope you didn't get buried in a box avalanche. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" />

C.

Well, WW just came by and I pulled back. It really hurt a lot to do that. Here's all that happened.

She called said she was outside, I was down stairs, and wanted me to let her in so she could get some "things". I was not cheery when I answered the phone or when I answered the door. Acted very ho hum. She went to the kitchen and said I've got to get this contract for "orchestra" the one OM lives by. I was walking into the other room. Then I turned around and said well I'm going downstairs. She said with a slightly sad slightly suprised look "ok, it's good to see you". I said kind of like I didn't care too much "yeah, it's good to see you too." Then I went downstairs. And now I'm posting. I am pretty sure that she is gone now.

I feel like ****. I didn't like doing that it made me feel sorry for her. Why the heck would I feel sorry for HER. Grrrrrrr <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" /> She is showing me ZERO respect and that is a load of crap. Comes by to pick up that contract and wants to be cordial. I wanted to be happy and nice and it killed me to be uncaring and cold. Help is this the right thing to do?? I NEED SOME ADVICE!!! Felt like sobing a moment ago and now I feel like chopping down an oak with a Louisville.

Posting from purgatory...my own little corner of it anyways.

C.

Just got an email from one of WW's friends. One of the good ones. She talked to WW today. She encouraged her to do the right thing and work on our marriage. She also told her that the OM was getting in the way of this. To which WW told her that she had alread made up her mind before OM came in the picture. The friend said she thought that this was true. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" /> I emailed the friend back and said among other (nice) things:
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> If she was going to leave me before OM then why didn't she? Likewise why didn't she
talk to me about it? Because it is a fabrication. I do not doubt that she was unhappy I was too. However, to stretch it to saying that an affair has nothing to do with her leaving even though it happened in the same month is a joke. I have
expressed my willingness to work on the relationship and marriage (She has moved out
and continues her adulterous affair). I have expressed my willingness to go to counseling, she says "I don't have time to go". I have been bettering myself (she tells people it won't last and continues to cheat on me.) I have given her and I am still giving her lots of room. But it is insulting to my intelligence for her to say
that she was already going to do this and it has nothing to do with OM. If it has nothing to do with OM then promise NC (no contact) and lets begin reconciliation through counseling. She won't do it. (Friend's Name), please do not buy into that excuse it is only a rationalization. She cannot even admit reality to herself at this point. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">The bad part is that the friend told her that I asked her to call her, that I was sad and that I still loved her. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> I did ask her to call her but it was over a month ago. I was in a totally different state of mind at that point. How bad do you think this is? How much damage? This makes this exposure where I can't say I did it for myself. Is this a big deal or am I overreacting?

One interesting piece of information that the friend told me was "She did say that she wasn't anywhere close to legally ending your relationship and didn't feel like she was in an emotionally stable place to make any final decisions." The last part is a cop out and the first part tells me that she has officially started eating cake.

Am I accurate here or what?

C.

Hey Shmaley,

Sorry I took so long to reply. Been kinda busy. Advertised to give away some of my moving boxes and so far 3 guys came by to take it away.... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

So I am still in the midst of unpacking, insurance thingy, job hunting, paying bills with monopoly $$ (just kidding), etc.

As for the manipulation piece, I was referring to her suggestion for counseling then her pulling it back with the 'not talking to strangers' excuse.

Do you still want your questions that you made before the post where you stated you started reading Dr Dobson's book?

Remember sooner or later, you will get angry at her actions. Others may refer back to older conversations because to them it is still new. Your timeframe, her time warp and the timeframe of the rest of humanity w/b all 3 running at different speeds.

Since you still appear t/b in plan A, then some contact c/b doable but it will take it's toll on you. That is why plan B is available.

I know pulling back is hard but you will find where her current desires are if she tries to manipulate you into throwing some A cash her way.

Stand your ground. She maybe embarressed if she can't make the performance all because you choose not to fund her A. Imagine what type of story she has to conjure up for that one!??!?! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" />

Now you can plant seeds about that A (exposure) to her fellow musicians so that when she tries to blame you, they will already have the truth vs the fog set before them.

JMHO,
L.

I just feel lost for direction. And yes, I am starting to get angry at her actions. You don't need to asnwer all the questions that I asked a few posts back I think I understand more now. Please analyze my last post and answer the couple here:

How much should I pull back? Is acting stand offish once enough or is more than that needed?

Should I continue to set up meetings ONLY when I need to talk official business?

You see I am sort of lost for direction right now. I am not quite grasping the direction to proceed. When I get it it will feel good and I will be confident as before. But right now I am struggling to deal with how to treat her.Example:

When she tries to enable the A I should:

When she is nice to me I should:

When she is nice then talks about the A I should:

When she calls me I should act: happy / indifferent / not answer.

Just starting to feel confused and overwhelmed with everything. I need to get away to somewhere that I can forget about this for a while.

Sorry, I know that is a bunch of stuff. I just feel like I need to get over this hump. LOL I've been feeling like that for a month.

C.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"><strong>shmaley: I just feel lost for direction. And yes, I am starting to get angry at her actions. You don't need to asnwer all the questions that I asked a few posts back I think I understand more now. Please analyze my last post and answer the couple here:

"How much should I pull back? Is acting stand offish once enough or is more than that needed?" </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Orchid: I understand the lost feeling. Part of what a BS goes through. We call it the roller coaster. Each time you communicate with her you are apt to feel lost and dizzy, then angry and frustarted.

As to your question, how much you should pull back it up to your ability to handle it without too much LBing. Don't want you t/b a doormat but if you carry too much of that burden, that is what you will allow yourself to become. So you decide.

Acting standoffish s/b used when you need to protect yourself. I don't recommend it too much in plan A but the more you feel like you need t/d this, the sooner you need to go to plan B.

Temper it with your abilities. It is critical you use plan A to learn how to do your best and when you have done that and the WS is still a WS, then you need to go to plan B.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"><strong>shmaley: Should I continue to set up meetings ONLY when I need to talk official business</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Orchid: Yes. If you are in plan A, it is better to keep all contact to a minimum. She needs to miss you. She can't if you keep popping up with smiley faces every day.


</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"><strong>shmaley: You see I am sort of lost for direction right now. I am not quite grasping the direction to proceed. When I get it it will feel good and I will be confident as before. But right now I am struggling to deal with how to treat her.Example:

When she tries to enable the A I should:</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Orchid: I understand you are at a loss. Realize this is par for the course. Other BS H's are going through the same thing. Some with extra responsibilities. I believe you have the opportunity to grow into a much more rounded out character making you highly attractive, while the OM is still struggling to figure out if his zipper s/b up or down. YUCK!!!

As for when she tries to get you to enable the A, what have you found out it is better for you to do? I have my opinions and you know what they are.... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"><strong>shmaley: When she is nice to me I should:</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Orchid: When she is cordial and nice, you give her the same. No more and no less. See the WS requires a lot from her givers. You give the same amount she dishes out and it will frustrate the WS to no end. It will also relieve you from the responsiblity of being the giver. Eventually she will not require you to be the giver but be more appreciative of your generousity.

With my child, I tell him that when he does wrong, I can and do take things away. Not afraid to take away. When he is good, I am willing and have been quite generous. My child realizes good actions get rewards but those rewards require he be appreciative. Not demanding. The WS needs to learn the same or they will return home demanding you continue giving and giving, feeding their selfish traits.


</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"><strong>shmaley: When she is nice then talks about the A I should:</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Orchid: Stop and walk away from the convo. You talk about the A, when you are ready..... she has the OM to talk about it when she is ready. Don't meet her need for this unless it is to help you. This is very very hard for most BS to do.


</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"><strong>shmaley: When she calls me I should act: happy / indifferent / not answer.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Orchid: Be yourself.....meet her cordial responses with respect. If she gets belligerent, excuse yourself politely and let her know that her tone is not acceptable. The good thing about the phone is that one party can always end the call...... you may not see the other end but the WS c/b talking to herself and look real funny to the rest of the world. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" />

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"><strong>shmaley: Just starting to feel confused and overwhelmed with everything. I need to get away to somewhere that I can forget about this for a while.

Sorry, I know that is a bunch of stuff. I just feel like I need to get over this hump. LOL I've been feeling like that for a month.
</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Orchid: Confusion is part of the territory. The BS has feelings too you know. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

You will get the hang of this....it takes time and learning how to deal with your feelings while there is no one to give you the support you want to give your W but right now can't because she is a WS is hard on a BS. Very hard. That's why you need to keep reading, learning, work with Jennifer and keep posting here.

Got any BS' in your area?

aloha,
L.

Thanks for the answers Orchid. I am starting to feel more in tune with the situation now.

I got really angry yesterday thinking about how I was being treated. It started with talking to one WW's and I mutual friends. The friend actually buys into the line that WW was going to leave me before the A. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" /> Well I emailed her back and let her know what I thought of that. I didn't get a very positive response. Somehow the friend thinks that I am wanting her to "tattle" on her and WW's conversations. I mailed her back that "I have no desire to hear the private conversations between you and WW". I will call her to straighten it out on Thursday. Anyways this put me into a real tailspin yesterday that made me very angry. I went and worked out for an hour. I ran 4 miles yesterday and was still having a angry day.

Then the clouds cleared a little when one of my friends came over and we worked on some music together. That made me feel a lot better. Then at the end of the night my roommate told me some news that made me feel really good. Apparently she spoke with WW even after she had spoke with the friend I mentioned earlier and she said that she heard some positive things. She couldn't tell me all but she said the pulling back that I did the night before definitely had an effect on WW. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> She said that it was positive for our R but couldn't tell me anymore. WW asked her to tell me "Hi". Kind of wierd but encouraging. Looks like you were right again Orchid.

The crappy thing is that I cannot and will not put any stock in this but it did make me feel better when I was feeling like ****. Anyways, just keeping everyone updated.

C.

Sorry to hear about the fog sucking in some of your friends but it does happen. You are getting quite good at the seesaw effect. The next big ride is that creepy rollercoaster. Bigger and rougher than that rollercoaster loop Dee loop twister ride in Ohio!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" />

You are wise not to put too much stock even in what the roommate says but just file it away. WS' do speak in twisted tongues. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" />

Glad the music helped calm your soul a bit. See you can get over these emotional up and downs.

Quite proud of you, Shmaley..... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

Gotta go and now report to the HI Unemployment office and 'register that I am looking for work'. Imagine that!?!?!? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" /> Boy I am sure earning this unemployment check. Putting in more than 4 hours a day not to mention the nightmares at night about this job hunting stuff....then there's those obnoxious boxes. LOL!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> Just kidding. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

take care,
L.

Just got done baking my first batch of sticky pecan cinnamon rolls. Never baked anything before. Made these from scratch with my FIL's recipie. Now all I need is one of those Kiss the Cook aprons. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" />

I was thinking about taking some to WW and leaving them on the door step early in the morning. They're her favorite.... She's been sick today I heard.

Nah... She doesn't deserve them yet. And I am sure that RM (my representative) will mention that I made them. I'll just save them for the W when she gets home. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

C.

U R a baker too??!?!?!?! Wow, u r certainly changing yourself into one irristable kinda guy! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

My grandfather was a baker by trade..... sorry to say that his granddaughter did not inherit all his talents. I recognize good cooking though! LOL!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> Think I was meant t/b a food critic? LOL!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

BTW, don't offer your best to the WS. Save that for your W. Just fan those aromas out her way..... she'll find out sooner than you think.

Bet all the OM can do is buy the stuff from 7-11 (mini market chain on the west coast). Ha! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" />

L.

I was reading some other posts and began to wonder what exactly would I do if WW called today and said that she wanted to come home. NC letter is obviously a must but probably not the first thing that I want to say to her. That would put too much emphasis on the A I think. I'm not really searching for a perfect order here as much as just what approach to take. Should I tell her to think about it for a week or month and make sure? Should I say let's book into MC with Jennifer C.? Lot's of different scenarios that could play out.

What I really need here is to know what my priorities are when this moment arises. I feel like I need a list of things that are deal breakers and another list that are things that we will work on through MC.

Deal Breakers

Committment to new M through MC and IC
NC with OM for life



Things to work on through counseling

Promise to go to MB weekend in IL's home town in Jan.

Giving up all privacy (cell phones, email, mail)

Changing Phone numbers and email addresses

Having all mail sent to home (some mail is going to WW's work)


Even with the deal breakers promised should I still tell WW to wait for some time to make sure?

Let me know what you think.

I sent a picture of my cinnamon rolls to my IL's last night. It makes me hungry just looking at them. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> If we could post pictures I would post it. I will probably eat one when I get home before I go to workout. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> Good luck at the UE office. What do you do anyway?

C.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"><strong>shmaley: I was reading some other posts and began to wonder what exactly would I do if WW called today and said that she wanted to come home. NC letter is obviously a must but probably not the first thing that I want to say to her. That would put too much emphasis on the A I think. I'm not really searching for a perfect order here as much as just what approach to take. Should I tell her to think about it for a week or month and make sure? Should I say let's book into MC with Jennifer C.? Lot's of different scenarios that could play out.

What I really need here is to know what my priorities are when this moment arises. I feel like I need a list of things that are deal breakers and another list that are things that we will work on through MC.

Deal Breakers

Committment to new M through MC and IC
NC with OM for life</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Orchid: Good to plan but not good to overanalyze. Now that you have begun your list. Put it away for a while. You can review it again and update later. I would change the NC w/OM to NC with ALL OMs. Let her know your tolerance level goes down with recovery not up. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"><strong>shmaley: Things to work on through counseling

Promise to go to MB weekend in IL's home town in Jan.

Giving up all privacy (cell phones, email, mail)

Changing Phone numbers and email addresses

Having all mail sent to home (some mail is going to WW's work)


Even with the deal breakers promised should I still tell WW to wait for some time to make sure?</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Orchid: Again a good start but it is a lot to put on a WS all at once. In fact an Xws will have a hard time. So now plan the order of importance because you may have to put these requests out in series and not all at once.


</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"><strong>shmaley: Let me know what you think.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Orchid: I think you are still doing good. The sessions with Jennifer are paying off. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />


</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"><strong>shmaley: I sent a picture of my cinnamon rolls to my IL's last night. It makes me hungry just looking at them. If we could post pictures I would post it. I will probably eat one when I get home before I go to workout. Good luck at the UE office. What do you do anyway?

C. </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Orchid: Ok, now here's where it gets 'sticky' <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" />

I love cinnamon rolls - tastey homemade ones are irresistable!!! Did you leave out the calories? Not fair to send a pix. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" /> The drool is too real and the pix just doesn't have the same flavor - <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

As for what I do, my work used to be in payroll taxes. Working with employer and agency setups.
It was a specialized field even though 'everyone has to pay taxes <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" /> ....... So I have to use my skills and experience when searching for a job in a different field. It is doable, just gotta smooze 'em. LOL!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

L.

Well, I called WW earlier to see how she was doing since she was sick. While we were talking she brought up the baking stuff and the pulling back. She said "I heard you made some cinnamon rolls". I said "yeah, I did, it was a lot of fun." She acted suprised like it shouldn't be any fun but more stressful. She is always stressed, and borderline angry when she is cooking. I told her I enjoyed it, and I did. Toward the end of the conversation she said "were you ok the other day ?...you acted like you didn't want to talk to me...? To which I said "yeah, that's kinda how I felt." She said, "oh, ok." and that was it.

It is kind of interesting that she is starting to bring up this stuff. Acknowledging my baking on her own and even bring up a conflict situation. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> Not the typical WW that I have seen in the last month. Not as much conflict avoidance. She is beginning to warm up a little I think. Not that she is feeling close to me but I am no longer the monster. She cannot make me into that any longer.The defenses are coming down.

I am growing tired of this game. Fighting feeling of anger and resentment more and more. However, I do not want to plan B yet because I feel like there is too much good work to do. I just need a breather. Not quite sure how to get one. Maybe a vacation? Any ideas??? I am probably monitoring her calls too much. I'm usually wanting to see if she has spoken with the family but it is starting to anger me how much that I see her talking to OM and right after she gets off the phone with me. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" /> I should probably stop this for now and see if I feel any better.

Dip and curve and loop de loop.

C.

Need some help now. I am getting very angry today. Just thinking about everything and growing very resentful. Thinking about doing terrible things to WW like:

Calling all her students and telling them or their parents what is going on.

Calling several of University Department faculty and exposing.

Calling several co-workers in orchestras she is in including one in OM's town.

Calling OM's parents and everyone else on the BG check that I have of him.

Jennifer C. Told me not to call OM's parents. She also said no one else except the people that already know (parents one other close member of her family) should be told. But I am very angry right now and my taker is telling me to do things.

My roommate is going to tell the co-workers that she has not told that WW works with. These co-workers asked before what was going on and she didn't tell them. She just made up an excuse. I told her that the next time let them know the Truth. It's not fair that I am the only one dealing with reality here!!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" />

I have been trying to fight this off all day and I am about to explode.

C.

Shmaley,

Why the change? I know these downers hit at bad times (like when is a good time, eh?).....but you seem quite angry now.

Ok, now your roomy gonna do this exposure because?!?!?!?!...... Jennifer C says to hold it and you just stated in an earlier post that you need to plan A longer?

Sounds like you need to compose yourself a bit more. If you need to talk, let us know. If we can't find someone in your area, you can e-mail me: mborchid2@yahoo.com

I can't check it until tomorrow but I recommend you go get the Love must be tough book and read it again if needed.

You need to get your composure back. I understand the anger but now we need to get you to use this harsh energy wisely. ok?

take care,
L.

You've been giving and giving and giving to your best of abilities

Its only natural that your taker would want to come out and rant about the inequities and how it can deal with them.

Try to journal the taker and wait to strategize more clearly another day.

<small>[ October 03, 2004, 06:24 PM: Message edited by: picklesaresour ]</small>

Just went a little crazy. I have been having a bad day all day and a student of WW called asking when she was going to be home. Grrrrr I wanted to let her have it. But I didn't and then it turned into the last post you saw. I should call that my wolfman post. Trying to make jokes but nothing is funny right now. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

Before the student called I tried to call my best confidant IL and she did not answer. This was upsetting because I am having such a bad day. My other confidant the RM is gone out of town until tomorrow night. I tried reading but I couldn't focus. Then the student called asking that stupid question. After that I just started dwelling and obsessing like I used to in the first few weeks. Next thing I know Mr. Taker is making all sorts of demands and I'm saying yeah that sounds like a good idea. I knew it was irrational but I needed to let it out.

When I got done typing the post I was still angry and upset. So I posted it. I really needed to talk to someone and there wasn't anyone that I wanted to talk to avaliable. Then my IL called and we talked for about an hour and a half. That helped a lot. Then I read for another hour or so. I am much more calm now but still a little uptight.

Feeling torn about letting WW cruise through this. I guess I didn't mention that I didn't tell the student anything. Once again I protected WW's reputation. She does not deserve to be protected. And I wouldn't protect her if I thought I could let the info out without LBing. But if I tell people like that she will be furious and will have justification (in her mind) to be angry with me. Jennifer C. told me don't LB no matter what. I am trying my very best.

Thanks for the address, and quick response Orchid. Sorry I freaked out. I have been doing real good but that student just triggered me. I am sooo fed up with protecting WW. And I feel backed into a corner to do it. I am stubborn about wanting to stay in Plan A. It has been 2mo at this point I know I can do better than that.

Orchid Said: </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Ok, now your roomy gonna do this exposure because?!?</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">This exposure cannot be traced to me. These people can potentially yield a positive influence on WW. They are married and in her profession and she is a student under them. WW has always looked up to even idolized her instructors. RM has been asked what was going on by these people I just ok'd her to tell them the truth. So this will not cause a LB situation just more positive pressure on WW.

Picklesaresour thanks! Journaling is a good idea. I have one and use it for strategy now and then. It is easier to think things through when I type them out first.

Well, I am getting tired and will probably go to bed early. Very exhausted now. I'll talk to you guys tomorrow. Thnaks for being here for me.

C,

Feeling much better today. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

When I run every morning there is this giant hill half way around the course I run twice. Yesterday I was 3/4 the way up the hill on my second lap and wanted to give up. Feeling a little self pity too. Today I am to the flat on top and starting to coast downhill again.

Sorry I couldn't make it up the hill alone. I feel ashamed that I became so weak. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

Today is a big day at work. I am a QA/QC manager and there is another QA/QC manager coming from one of our biggest customers to inspect. I know him but it is still very stressful. Kind of like an end of year payroll Audit right.?

There is still plenty of time for me to tell RM not to say anything. Given the situation what do you think Orchid. I just want to do the right thing here. Not anything rash or spontaneous. I feel like it could yield some results and it can't be traced to me. These instructors had told WW not to audition for "Big city" orchestra and she did anyway. Now if they know the truth that OM lives there they might try to help her. They are on their 2nd marriage and know what it is like to go through a D. What are your thoughts?

C.