My husband called me tonight IRATE, he said "WHAT DID YOU DO TODAY?!?!?!" I told him I had counseling all day....and told him exactly what I did. He said "Don't F-ing lie to me, what did you do" (I'm thinking AHHHHHH he found the recorder). So he won't tell me what's going on, keeps making comments about me going to jail.

So I go over to his house, just walk in the front door, he says "Get out of my house b*tch!!" I said "No, I'm not leaving" He said it again. I said "No, tell me what I did" He said "You F-ing know what you did...and you're going to jail" I said "Well I'd sure like to know what it is I did, if I'm going to jail for it" He said "You'll find out".

So he keeps trying to "remove me" from his house (not violently) and I said "You want me out, call the police" He said "Okay I will......then he can't find the number" So I call 411 on my cell, get the number, and call the police. They show up, tell him there's nothing they can do to remove me from his house. He happens to know the policemen...and they're giving him advice about going down and getting a lawyer down at legal aid and getting a separation from me....etc etc.

Well we had a long discussion (not nicely he was screaming at me) tells me that Verizon notified Shannon that someone had accessed her cell phone records online......I admitted that it was me. He said "CAREN!!!!!!!!!!!There is nothing going on with her.....you can snoop all you want....nothing is going on!!!!" And I've reached a moment of clarity....I don't think there is anything going on with her....I think he just doesn't want to be married to me anymore. He listed all the things that I'd done to him over the years (keeping a filthy house - GUILTY as charged, leaving him repeatedly GUILTY AS CHARGED) I told him I knew he was right, and that I was wrong, and that I had changed. I asked him to go to MC, he said no. I also told him that I had been saved, and that as his wife it was my responsibility to see that he was saved too....that we are talking about his eternity here. He said "WTF ever Caren, I could be saved, and then go outside and get hit by a bus" I said "Yes, you could, and if you were hit by that bus.....would you go to heaven?" He thinks it's all another ploy to get him back....me going to church, etc.

I now know that even though I have been saved, I have to get right with the lord, I have to show him by my actions that I am a Godly woman, and that I have changed.

Oddly enough, I feel a strange peace, even after this altercation, I am a peace, I know now that God will take care of this, that I will be okay, and that God will get me through this, and that he doesn't want the dissolution of my marriage.

Maybe it took this to make me realize what I really have to do..........I will still continue to not love bust, as that is imperative to marital recovery regardless if there is infidelity or not.

(I also have to get that stupid recorder out of his house....it's only 2 days since I bought it, I'll just get it out of there, rebox it and get my money back from Radio Shack)

Thank You all for your help, and if it's okay with you, even though infidelity may not fit my posts anymore, I will continue to post here, because I think of you all as my friends.

With God As My Navigator, I will get through this,

-Caren

Caren, I'm sorry you had such a rough night.

Keep going with your changes...whatever happens with your marriage, these changes will be good for you. And I think the following phrase suits you more than anyone else I know here, "Let go and let God!"

aislinn

Thank you, you're right......I'm letting go....I'm letting God take it from here.

-Caren

Caren:

He is at least having an EA. He is denying having an A because he got caught.

I'm suggesting that you don't necessarily believe him. He's using the same WH script. He's wanting you to back off from your investigation Caren.

Don't fess up to what you are doing. Don't remove the recorder.

<small>[ January 13, 2005, 09:23 PM: Message edited by: mimi1254 ]</small>

[QUOTEI also told him that I had been saved, and that as his wife it was my responsibility to see that he was saved too....that we are talking about his eternity here.[/quote]

Caren, where did you get this idea? It isn't your responsibility or even your "ability" to see that your husband is saved. It is only your responsibility to behave as God has commanded you that your godly behavior might "win him over."

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">He said "WTF ever Caren, I could be saved, and then go outside and get hit by a bus" I said "Yes, you could, and if you were hit by that bus.....would you go to heaven?" He thinks it's all another ploy to get him back....me going to church, etc.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Using "God" is manipulative. Remember, God uses people for His purposes, not the other way around. No doubt your husband is skeptical, perhaps even rightly so, because of your past behavior that took years to establish. A change of short duration is not likely to "impress" him.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I now know that even though I have been saved, I have to get right with the lord, I have to show him by my actions that I am a Godly woman, and that I have changed. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">You don't have to "show" God anything. He knows the hearts of all of us. If you talking about "showing" your husband, then obedience to God's commands is the way to "show" you love God, and others will see that. Anything less will be seen as fake and manipulative.

God bless and grant you wisdom and patience.

Caren,

His reaction is WS classic. Don't be fooled. Most WS will say it's not about the OP or even deny there is an OP. The police and everyone will see that the emperor has no clothes but the WS will think he is strutting around in his finest dudds. LOL!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" />

So stick around and keep that recorder going. You will find stuff out soon. Verizon notified her that her records are accessible. Good. Maybe now she will be more careful who she is associating with.

Keep the recorder right where it is. Let them wonder what else you maybe up to. Oh yea and the next time he yells at you? Ask him if he could speak up a bit more..... them respond very softly. Very non MB tactic but it sure shows how out of control these WS can get. My WS' veins popped out on his neck. He turned real red and was shaking.... he asked do you want me to yell louder and let the neighbor's hear? I said, sure go ahead. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> Called his bluff and put cotton in my ears.

L.

<small>[ January 13, 2005, 09:38 PM: Message edited by: Orchid ]</small>

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> (I also have to get that stupid recorder out of his house....it's only 2 days since I bought it, I'll just get it out of there, rebox it and get my money back from Radio Shack)
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Ouch!!!!!!!! I would hate to be the owner of RS. YOu used the recorder and it works---- there is no malfunction. Keep it where it is.

Thank you all for your posts.

Forever, maybe the way I said it wasn't exactly how I meant it, I guess I'm not really saying it's my responsibility (although I feel it's my responsibility to try).

The change isn't going to be short lived, he knows I've been going to church, and now I am just going to live the right way, and leave him alone. Let him contact me, and be nice and pleasant to him when he contacts me.

He did call me last night and talked to me like none of the police stuff ever happened....weird....he was just telling me about how he had gone to the store and bought mashed potatoes to eat (because he had a tooth pulled yesterday), and that he'd be over this morning to shower.

I was a little disturbed by the things the police said to him.....he knew them, but still, giving him advice on how to get rid of me, right in front of me. I thought that was REALLY PROFESSIONAL...sheesh.

When I still maintained that I would not be getting divorced, the police said "If he files for divorce there's nothing you can do" I said "I beg to differ, I will contest it until he's 80" They didn't have anything to say to that.

My husband said "Caren...I just don't want to be married anymore. I do love you, I'll always love you" I said "Why? Because we have a child together?" He said "No...you're the only woman I've ever loved, I just can't stay married to you." I said "Well you are the love of my life, and I can't divorce you, it's not right, and I can't do it"

As I said though, I feel strangely peaceful about all of this, I don't know why, but I believe that it will work out......the only reason I can think of is that God is letting me know that it was never in my hands to begin with, and I've finally released it to him.

I'll leave the recorder there a while longer, I just don't want him to know it's there and be another lovebuster when he finds it, or finds I've been in his house again, unbeknownst to him when I get it out of there. *sigh*

-Caren

Hi Caren,

I agree with the others about the recorder...you need proof, so keep at until you get it.

You are in good hands here, getting advice from the best.

Be careful that the feeling of peace you have right now is not because of yesterday's drama. I used to need my fix from my EX in order to still feel connected to him. And the fix was usually a big dramatic fight, but that was good enough for me to get that "fix", then I would feel "peace". I guess what I am trying to say is look for peace from within, and not in your addiction to your WW.

I could be off, but I think you might have an unhealthy addiction (to your WW) going on, and this needs to be addressed before you can truly make the internal changes you are seeking.

Your still sounding good though!

Weaver-

I see my H everyday, so I'm not sure why fighting with him would give me a "fix", I still feel pretty good, pretty calm today.

I seriously doubt I can get him to come over this weekend after all that though...LMAO...we'll see.

-Caren

Oh, Stanley, I was also considering taking the recorder back to RS, because I'm flat busted....and it was 60 bucks, but everyone seems to think I should leave it there.....so I guess that's what I'll do.

-Caren

Caren,

What in this world are you doing?? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" />

You sure aren't in Plan A...and its obvious by all the continuing contact that you aren't in Plan B. So...what is your plan?? You are literally running amok.

You are being manipulative to the highest degree. The New Years Day incident was meant to be manipulative...because you wanted him to feel guilt and responsibility for that. You are now using the "God" factor as a means of manipulating him back...STOP THAT!


I was a little disturbed by the things the police said to him.....he knew them, but still, giving him advice on how to get rid of me, right in front of me. I thought that was REALLY PROFESSIONAL...sheesh.

That's just it...that WAS really professional of them. That is what they are supposed to do. Your going over there is bordering on harrassment...and threatening...do you realize that? You are pushing him away with these crazy antics of yours...if that is your objective you are right on target...so keep it up.

It is just MY opinion, but I see some very disturbing behavior on your part.

Plan A or Plan B....which is it?

Decide...and then DO IT.

committed

Caren-I see a lot of similarities in me and you. Once my H left me I also found God and started living a different life. Before he left I was controlling, mean and hateful, and wasn't very kind or gentle to anyone-especially him. I "killed" his love for me. After he left, God convicted me of my actions and I changed-I am a much nicer person and much more at peace w/ things-I stopped being so negative and started enjoying life more. At first my WH thought this was a ploy as well-but now he envys me and tells me often-he also has started asking me about scriptures and God b/c he fears he is going to Hell. We always went to church-but we never put God first in out lives. He was saved as a young boy-but now he is questioning it and feels he has "went to far" for God to forgive him. Of course I have told him that is NEVER the case. I can't save him or repent of his sins for him-but I can pray FOR him and show him I have changed-I can live a Godly life and he has started seeing that. He tells me I am different and a better person now. Whether that will bring him home-I don't know-but I know God is in control of it anyway. I finally completely turned it over to Go in the new yr-and when I feel myself getting all caught up in it and trying to "fix" it-I pray right then and get back on track.

In saying all that-being Saved DOES NOT mean we are perfect. We still have tempers-we still do things we shouldn't and say things we shouldn't. I did a similar thing a couple of mths back-I looked up my H and OW attendance records at work to see if they were leaving together. This was WRONG and I felt so bad for it. I confronted WH on it and he went CRAZY-threatening jail and cussing at me-but he was right-I had NO right to do that and was wrong. We both calmed down and talked and I told him I was sorry.....and I haven't done anything like that again-the payoff was NOT worth it.

Anyway-just wanted you to know that you are right in trusting God w/ this and letting him work. I finally realized God won't completely deal w/ it UNTIL we let it go completely. Then we aren't in his way and he is free to do what he needs to do.

Good luck and God bless!

SATM

Caren,

I'm curious..yo usay that your H told you to get out of "his house." The two of you don't own it together? Isn't your name on the deed?

Caren,

While your ire and panic are understandable, your illegal actions of recording telephone conversations and attempting to access records could cause divorce proceeding to go quite badly for you if it gets to that point.

Contrary to other advice you've been given, you need to remove the recording device.

As has already been suggested, you are in no plan at all. Re-read the information on this site.

Lastly, have you considered getting IC for yourself? Not that you don't have reason to be angry, but you seem to have trouble controlling your rage. This won't help you recover your marriage.

You are in a lot of pain, so you are due a lot understanding and grace. But that grace doesn't extend illegal activity. You have repeated referred to your H's house as "his house", so if he asks you to leave it, you should.

It may sound like I'm scolding but I'm not. I'd like to see you stop behaviors that will ultimately hurt your chances for recovery.

Plan A is all about showing your H that you can be the one to meet his ENs. It's about eliminating LB's so he will be enticed back into the relationship.

Plan A is hard. Every post here from someone who has implemented it indicates that it is. What's harder is that there is no guarantee that it will be successful. You should prepare yourself for that eventuality as well.

Caren, let God make you the best person you can be, then show only your best to your H.

Low

What in this world are you doing??

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">You sure aren't in Plan A...and its obvious by all the continuing contact that you aren't in Plan B. So...what is your plan?? You are literally running amok.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Yes, I've broken from plan A, my husband was screaming at me that I was going to jail, and wouldn't tell me what on earth he was talking about.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">You are being manipulative to the highest degree. The New Years Day incident was meant to be manipulative...because you wanted him to feel guilt and responsibility for that. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">The "New Years Day Incident" WAS NOT being manipulative. I was suicidal....I spent that night in the hospital and am currently doing an intensive outpatient program due to my depression and suicidal thoughts. Had nothing to do with making him FEEL anything. It was about what I'm feeling......and it's NOT good.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> You are now using the "God" factor as a means of manipulating him back...STOP THAT! </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">ABSOLUTELY UNTRUE. I was advised by my Pastor that this was what I needed to do, to let him know that I am saved, and that he also needs to be saved, I was just letting him know that.


</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> That's just it...that WAS really professional of them. That is what they are supposed to do. Your going over there is bordering on harrassment...and threatening...do you realize that? </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I did not harrass or threaten him. His police "buddies" were telling him how to get rid of me as his WIFE, not how to get me out of the house, THAT in my opinion was UNPROFESSIONAL. That is the house that WE lived in together as a family for 6 years. And all I wanted to do was to get him to tell me exactly what I was going to "jail" for, he refused to tell me what he was talking about, so I refused to leave, because I HAVE EVERY LEGAL RIGHT TO BE THERE.

I've been trying to plan A, but it is a little disturbing to me when he calls and tells me I'm going to jail....but refuses to tell me WHY I'm going to jail,ya know? I'm not afraid of going to jail, but I'd at least like to know what the heck he's referring to.

I appreciate your viewpoint, but I am offended that you think that I would use GOD and my being saved as a means of manipulation. Was I saved during our marriage? NO Have I been saved since we've been separated YES.....been saved since September 2004. He knew I was going to church, but he did not know that I had been saved.

He is under the impression that because he was baptized several years ago at his mother's request (with no training/information before hand) that he is saved, and that is just not true. He did not accept Christ as his personal savior, and neither one of us has put God first in our lives, which I attribute to the decline of our marriage.

He even went to far as to say that churches are cults.....I don't even know what the heck he was talking about there...but okay.

So, yes, I slipped up in my Plan A, I lost my temper with him, I'm like a human being that way.

-Caren

Committed-

this is in reply to your post


</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">What in this world are you doing?? You sure aren't in Plan A...and its obvious by all the continuing contact that you aren't in Plan B. So...what is your plan?? You are literally running amok.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Yes, I've broken from plan A, my husband was screaming at me that I was going to jail, and wouldn't tell me what on earth he was talking about.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">You are being manipulative to the highest degree. The New Years Day incident was meant to be manipulative...because you wanted him to feel guilt and responsibility for that. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">The "New Years Day Incident" WAS NOT being manipulative. I was suicidal....I spent that night in the hospital and am currently doing an intensive outpatient program due to my depression and suicidal thoughts. Had nothing to do with making him FEEL anything. It was about what I'm feeling......and it's NOT good.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> You are now using the "God" factor as a means of manipulating him back...STOP THAT! </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">ABSOLUTELY UNTRUE. I was advised by my Pastor that this was what I needed to do, to let him know that I am saved, and that he also needs to be saved, I was just letting him know that.


</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> That's just it...that WAS really professional of them. That is what they are supposed to do. Your going over there is bordering on harrassment...and threatening...do you realize that? </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I did not harrass or threaten him. His police "buddies" were telling him how to get rid of me as his WIFE, not how to get me out of the house, THAT in my opinion was UNPROFESSIONAL. That is the house that WE lived in together as a family for 6 years. And all I wanted to do was to get him to tell me exactly what I was going to "jail" for, he refused to tell me what he was talking about, so I refused to leave, because I HAVE EVERY LEGAL RIGHT TO BE THERE.

I've been trying to plan A, but it is a little disturbing to me when he calls and tells me I'm going to jail....but refuses to tell me WHY I'm going to jail,ya know? I'm not afraid of going to jail, but I'd at least like to know what the heck he's referring to.

I appreciate your viewpoint, but I am offended that you think that I would use GOD and my being saved as a means of manipulation. Was I saved during our marriage? NO Have I been saved since we've been separated YES.....been saved since September 2004. He knew I was going to church, but he did not know that I had been saved.

He is under the impression that because he was baptized several years ago at his mother's request (with no training/information before hand) that he is saved, and that is just not true. He did not accept Christ as his personal savior, and neither one of us has put God first in our lives, which I attribute to the decline of our marriage.

He even went to far as to say that churches are cults.....I don't even know what the heck he was talking about there...but okay.

So, yes, I slipped up in my Plan A, I lost my temper with him, I'm like a human being that way.

-Caren

oops sorta doubled that one.....thought I stopped the 1st one in time...apparently not....How the livin heck do you EDIT!?!?!??!


-Caren

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">The "New Years Day Incident" WAS NOT being manipulative. I was suicidal....I spent that night in the hospital and am currently doing an intensive outpatient program due to my depression and suicidal thoughts. Had nothing to do with making him FEEL anything. It was about what I'm feeling......and it's NOT good.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Well he's coming over to take his prerequisite shower this morning before I go to the stupid all day group meeting (due to the whole wanting to commit suicide on New Years Day). He knows about it, and doesn't seem remotely guilty/responsible.....fog, fog, fog.

Here is why I think that it was manipulative. You want him to feel guilt or responsibility for the New Years Days incident. You go on to call the meeting STUPID ..instead of appreciating it for the help that it should give you...IF you were truly serious about it.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> Well I'm off to have group meetings with all the other people who are mentally unstable...woo hoo...go me. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">AGAIN, you are making fun of this meeting. If it was NEEDED because you are truly suicidal I do not think that you would be scoffing at it. Do you see what I mean?


</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> ABSOLUTELY UNTRUE. I was advised by my Pastor that this was what I needed to do, to let him know that I am saved, and that he also needs to be saved, I was just letting him know that. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I also told him that I had been saved, and that as his wife it was my responsibility to see that he was saved too....that we are talking about his eternity here.


Here is the manipulation part...it is NOT your responsibility to see that he is saved...it is HIS. It is HIS eternity.

Now....I have read where you said that you had kept a "filthy" house...and that's changed. You also said that you were guilty of leaving him many times. That prompts me to ask WHY?

Maybe HIS love bank is depleted...something to think about.

JMHO
committed

Oh I am guilty about it. And I am a total homebody.....and when I had written those comments about the group meeting I had never been to one (yesterday was the first time), I saw all the people in the suicide crisis center and they were OFF THE HOOK. They were being brought in kicking and screaming in handcuffs...therefore, I assumed I'd be in a group with a bunch of crazies. As it so happens I enjoyed the group and got a heck of a lot out of it, and forsee me learning a lot about myself.

I will tell you ahead of time, that sarcasm is my weapon, I use it probably to a fault, to disguise what I really fell...I've done it all my life. So I was being pretty sarcastic when I said those things.

I really do appreciate your opinion, but I didn't want you thinking I was a shallow person using suicide and God to get my husband back, because it's not true. Neither of these things are to get him back, I am in so much pain, I don't know what to do with it.

I know I go about things all backwards, and yes I have left my husband numerous times and our house was filthy....I can acknowledge my mistakes. I can't change the past, all I can do is be a better me in the future. I have a temper (anger management is one thing they want to work with me on in group).

There is a certain stigma to having to go to this group, ya know, it's not something I am proud of, I wish I was stronger than this.

And as far as my husband's eternity being my responsibility, I really feel that it's my responsibility as his wife to try, I guess through my deeds, to lead him to the Lord. This is what I've been told anyway.

I'm not trying to be manipulative, I'm really not, maybe I'm grasping at straws, and I do appreciate your input as I'm new at all of this, and thought I was doing the right thing.

I would venture to say his love bank probably is empty, and that makes me very sad.

Committed, thank you for your opinion, I need to be set straight from time to time. I'm not real stable these days.

Thanks,

-Caren