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#1279791 02/21/05 08:53 AM
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I had another discussion with my WH/H(?) and I can see the pain he is in with our R. I brought up the OW and he says she has nothing to do with how he is feeling and she has issues of her own that i'm not privy to. He says he doesn't mean to treat me like crap, he's just unhappy and needs to take the next step which would be separation.

Do I think what he is saying is fog? I'm not sure, everything he says seems sincere. I know he still has feelings for the OW; however, i'm beginning to think she has nothing to do with it... or maybe she still does. (i'm not sure what to think)

When he says he its not going to work out and he is no longer working towards recovery I somehow believe this is what he really wants. But then again, we thought getting married was the right decision.

So I wake up this morning feeling like a desperate housewife... emtpy, lost and sad... where am I to go from here?!?! Plan get-over-it or will plan B still work? My love for him has diminished although I care for him dearly, I just want to share those special moments with our DD. But I don't want it to end. <img border="0" alt="[Teary]" title="" src="graemlins/teary.gif" />

<small>[ February 22, 2005, 06:22 AM: Message edited by: much mahal ]</small>

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I think he does have feelings for her and is still in the fog. Let's see what others have to say.

Keith

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He's in some type of fog. He is the type that thinks he knows what he is feeling and will act a certain way because of it... there's no going back. So he made the wrong decision marry me and feels unhappy so there is nothing anyone can say that will change his mind. But I hope there can be a way.

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<small>[ February 22, 2005, 06:13 AM: Message edited by: much mahal ]</small>

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OW does have something "to do with it" since she is in the equation.
No matter how unhappy your H is he will not get happier with any introspection as long as OW is in the picture (her own issues just gum it up MORE).

Your H's reasoning is bunk.

If you want to discuss the OW aspect to your marriage he really should stop putting up boundaries of discussing it. You should point out that it is now YOUR issue and he should address it when you feel the need to.

Honesty, openess are not LBs.

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Maybe for him being open is a LB.

She is part of the equaution and he never denied that. He kept fishing for answers as to how I know how often they talk. I also told him that I knew they talked at work and he asked me how I knew (I just assumed they did) and he blamed it on one of our mutual friends from his work... but I said she didn't say anything, she didn't want to be involved (he probably doesn't believe that tho).

But I don't know how else to tell him that talking to her about your M issues, and talking to her on a consistant basis is wrong. He asks why I say that... I tell him you should talk to me first... that's what you're suppose to do in a M, then he says "you think you know everything now, huh." He also gets mad when I say "you think that because..." He tells me not to speak for him.

Well we just had an arguement because I asked him if we could buy our DD a walker or a play station since she has been really fussy. He was mad because I *always* want to buy her stuff. He didn't come out and say it right away... he just hinted when he asked if we have room for one. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" />

*sigh*

<small>[ February 22, 2005, 06:19 AM: Message edited by: much mahal ]</small>

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I am still learning about what this site has to offer and it helps to be able to share with others who can really understand.
From what little I gathered, your husband sounds like he is taking his anger out on you to justify his own frustrations wether they be quilt, resentment, or just wants you to push him out the door.
The only way it seems I ever got the truth out was due to moody behavior. One minute it was I love you and I don't know why I am acting so mean, then the next minute it was turned toward I was the one with the problems.
Finally, I said I love you and I don't want you to go, but you need to leave and see what life is without me. (me first, family second) I don't beleive in staying for the children, unless your really working on it and showing affection. Something for the child to see as positive and happy.
I stuck with this decision and brought it up again when were not arguing so it wouldn't sound as a threat. I never mentioned the other woman. It was all about me and him. It was my last resort and all I could take emotionally.
Good Luck and God Bless
Jenny Baker <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

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My WH has decided he wants to move into his own place, the only problem is he can't afford to do so. We are back to everything being my fault. He wants out. He only has one other option but he's not going to take that one. I am fed up with him being mad at me for no reason and I think the reason for him being mad is because he wants out. I can tell its getting tougher and tougher for him to deal with it although i'm not doing much.

I find myself feeling sorry for him now. He wants to look for a cheap room and the only thing he says he needs is an air mattress, a tv and probably his recliner. I wouldn't want him to live like that nor do I want anyone feeling sorry for him then they blame me.

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Hi Jenny Baker, </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> From what little I gathered, your husband sounds like he is taking his anger out on you to justify his own frustrations wether they be quilt, resentment, or just wants you to push him out the door. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">That is exactly what he is doing. It wasn't bad before but now its unbearable. We have no affection what-so-ever. I may be giving up hope.. I do not see anything positive with our R. Now I have to rethink my plan.

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Trust me, this has everything to do with OW. He wants to move out so he can keep seeing her and not have to feel guilty when he comes home to see you. That is exactly what my H did. In their minds the OW is not the problem, but they'll keep seeing her anyway. He told me it wasn't about her, he just wasn't in love with me. Funny he didn't feel that way until she came along. I wanted to believe him, but I came here and told everyone my story and they told me it was about OW. Now that the details are coming out I see everyone was right.

In my case, I let my H move out (into his Moms house). Things were horrible with him here and they weren't going to get any better. I couldn't stand the constant rejection I felt every time I saw him. He was gone for 6 months and was seeing her during this time. Did I mention that I was sitting at home pregnant with his child? And not by accident, it was a planned pregnancy. In time he realized this was not the life he wanted, he didn't like the way he was living and he came home. In a way I still don't think he sees that it was about OW, but we are in counceling and hopefully in time he will understand all this. We are now working on rebuilding our relationship, but that too will take time. I figure he was gone for 6 months, it will take at least that long to recover.

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</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> Trust me, this has everything to do with OW. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">He never denied that he still had feelings for her.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> He wants to move out so he can keep seeing her and not have to feel guilty when he comes home to see you. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I'm not sure about this since they only talk on the phone. She moved away a couple years ago and doesn't have a reason to come back to the area. But i'm sure it will turn physical once they see each other.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> In time he realized this was not the life he wanted, he didn't like the way he was living and he came home.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I hope this is the case with us but now I can't even see us having a good co-parent relationship.

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Well he's decided to move out. Probably 2 weeks from now. I have to get myself strong enough to take on the responsibilites as a single parent to a 3 month old. Now my question is... should I continue with Plan A or go to plan b once he moves out? I have LBed like crazy with all this R talk. I still want to work it out and I told him I will not be fine unless I explore all of my options to save the M. As Dr. Phil says "earn your divorce"

<small>[ February 22, 2005, 06:21 AM: Message edited by: much mahal ]</small>

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Can someone guide me in the right direction?

I will have a hard time seeing him once he leaves but I may need his help taking care of our DD. I'm pretty sure I can handle it on my own but it will be very tough.

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<small>[ February 22, 2005, 02:14 PM: Message edited by: much mahal ]</small>

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woohoo... anyone out there?!?!

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I'm not a "real" expert but since the real experts seem to have not found you yet I'll give you an opinion.

I sense from your post that you DO want to save the marriage. If so you can still Plan A while separated. Several posters on here have done exactly that. In fact if you haven't done the perfect Plan A yet its probably recommended to continue to get maximum effect. Make sure you have a time limit though, and then move to Plan B. Everyone has their limits to how much Plan A they can take (for me it was about 2 weeks <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> ). I think I've heard 6 months thrown around as a reasonable timeframe. Since DDay was December for you, that puts you at about June. I don't think 6 months is set in stone but you do need to have a point in mind where you say, enough of this I'm moving to plan B.

As I say, I'm no expert. I did a very short sort of plan A and a relatively short sort of plan B and a very definite plan D.

Experts, where are you? What do you think?

Miker

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Just got back on the computer after 3 days of being depressed. I am trying to move on and make this marriage work, but it seems like I go in stages of Why, How can I be sure you won't hurt me again. etc...This is the first time I have actually been depressed since finding out in Jan 05. Maybe these are stages of healing. I am trying to put my faith in God and let him take care of this. I must not be totally doing that. Why would I keep thinking.
Enough about me:
I think your husband needs to go. Don't deprive your daughter from her Dad and don't let him get out of his responsibilities. You will find an inner strength you didn't know you had. Especially if you know where you stand and a solid ground to move on. Instead of focusing on what he is doing to you emotionally. I told my husband in therapy"If I have to dig ditches tomorrow I will, I will survive." He said "How can you return to that independence and strong will that I miss in you" I said, "Because I will know where I stand and move on" This is consuming me. If I know it is over or what you are really thinking and doing.. then I can stand back up and worry about just me and my son.
He may move out..He may realize what he is leaving and he may not. You have no control over that. He has made his own mind up. Being selfish is causing emotional pain to you and probably affecting you child in some way.
Let him go and you take control of what you can control. It obvious if you love him or have loved him, it will be hard at first.
Think about yourself and your child's best interest. He is thinking about his.
If he wants to come back later, then you will have a better frame of mind (after you have moved on and released your dependence on him) to make your decision wether to take him back. You can forgive and move on. Forgiveness needs to be there for it to work out, but it also needs to be there for emotional peace and strength to move on and not let it take control of you and cause you to build up hate,anger, etc...
Is he worth living a life and feeling miserable?
Sincerely;
Jenny B Baker,RN <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" />

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You may care for him deeply, but you still love him; otherwise why wouldn't you want it to end. He has hurt you and I would think (from my own experience) you are going through a number of feelings. (Sadness, anger, hope, love, low self-esteem, lost, no sense of control, etc.)
I am sure he is feeling pain. If he is any MAN at all, he should. His reasoning may include a lot of things such as: hurting you and seeing you cry, breaking a family apart, and HIS OWN SELF PITY. I say this, because he is a grown man. Before you married him, could he take care of himself? His wants his cake, ice cream, etc. it sounds like to me. : Mad:


Remember, he made a decision when he broke sacred vows. I hear " I don't know what I was thinking, I wasn't.... in my right mind, etc." He knew the consequences of getting involved with another person. Whatever the reason is, he sounds like he wants out and tries to justify it with the past, OW, problems between both of you, etc. He also sounds like he wants you to feel sorry for him or that he is hurting so you will have some pity on him.
If the OW has nothing to do with it, then you should be privy to anything you ask. He owes you at least the dignity to be a man and tell the truth of why. You may never get that answer. The concept of WHY can drive you crazy. It can consume you. I would not worry about how his living arrangement will be. He made this choice, instead of trying to talk to you or go to counseling. If he needs time or out, then let him. Explain to him your feelings and make stipulations. He has a responsibility to take care of your child and you are entitled to half of everything, including retirement benefits, etc. You invested your life and time with this man. I think you do love him, but you have lost respect for him. If he realizes he is treating you like crap, then he is aware of the reality and should be able to stop that.
Get a good separation agreement and stipulate that he also pays for the lawyer's fees. He is the one, who wants this, as well as adultery, etc.
It takes two to make things work. Some times one has to give more at times and the other at other times. If he isn't ready work on this relationship and realize that he has a family, then let him move out and you move on with counseling for yourself and child if needed. If at a later time he wants to come back, counseling will enable you to make a clear decision. One that is not based on just emotions.

My situation seems to be better. My husband is focused on family life, giving attention (and receiving). He wants to go to church. I have talked with this OW (which is weird and on my first log entry (history). I told her to call him and talk to him about an issue. He told her that he was sorry to say this, but he didn't need her to give advice and he didn't want to talk with her anymore and didn't want her input whether it was helpful or out of guilt for hurting me. He told me he wished and thought it would be best if she was just left out of the picture and I didn't talk to her anymore, but he wasn't demanding it.
I have prayed, asked for my own forgiveness in my mistakes, and am trying to completely turn this situation over to God. I am trying to focus on positive things and let God guide me. I sometimes start feeling sad, asking why, can I trust, etc. Then I remember what I was trying to do and ask God for strength and guidance. This has allowed me to enjoy a new beginning with my spouse.
I think what you are feeling "desperate housewife, etc." is normal. Your security of a family has been rattled. Focus on yourself and your child. At one time my husband would say, " Well I am here aren't I, that should say something". Just because a body is here doesn't mean anything if the heart, soul and will is not with it. It is just another figurine collecting dust. Sorry for the long reply and if I sound harsh. I wish you the best and will be praying for you.
Sincerely
Jenny Baker, RN <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

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Hi Jenny Baker,
Thanks for your reply. I have found that inner strength you are talking about. It is easier for me to accept the fact that I will need to move forward with or without him and focus on my DD and I. He is being selfish and I realize it may take him awhile before he is out of the fog. I feel that separation will help. I hope to have the opportunity to rebuild our marriage but I know I do not want to live life miserably. But I will plan A for a little bit longer.

He insists MCing will not work and he no longer has feelings for me but I am not sure he’s actually thought this thru. He knows that in order to get a D we have to be separated for a year so he thinks the next step is separation. He doesn’t know the consequences. You would think if he was so miserable that he would do the research needed but all he does is read his newspaper and watch television…. As if sports and current events are more important than his own life.

I consulted with an atty last week so I can be prepared for what may come. The atty definitely recommended a separation agreement since my WH has agreed to pay for a majority of the mortgage.
My sister in law visited this past weekend so we had to play pretend again. She allowed my WH and I the opportunity to leave the house without our DD but my WH did not care to do so. I had to ask him several times to take his sister out so she could see the area. It took a couple hrs for him to decide. My WH was on the phone with a friend. I heard him mention my name a few times… all were nice things. Then yesterday, he stayed home because of the snow and he actually called me at work a couple of times. He was actually pleasant to be around. However, I will take it with a grain of salt. I am sure something will change… I will be too nice that he will have to justify himself by disrespecting me.

Well with your situation, it does sound like it is getting better but you never know. One day they will act one way and the next day can be totally different. So you have to be careful.


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