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#1281081 02/23/05 07:39 PM
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</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">What if the common idea of a soulmate is incorrect?</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">It might be, but that's just not the commonly held definition.
Which leads to the next...

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">What if my definition is correct?</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Then I think it's a very nice definition and you should lecture to high school students on what the definition should be.

And yes, I do think that it's possible to have that with someone. And yes, i think it's possible to have it with more than once person (say in the event of the death of one spouse)

#1281082 02/23/05 08:52 PM
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</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Then I think it's a very nice definition and you should lecture to high school students on what the definition should be. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Ouch! Hope I didn't offend you - it was not my intent! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" />

Hope you're doing well.

FR

#1281083 02/23/05 09:09 PM
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lol..no, you didn't offend me at all...I meant that sincerely.

I wish kids were required to learn relationship skills in all areas of life...friends, workplace, kids, parents, romantic.

#1281084 02/24/05 12:49 AM
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</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by Fishracer+:
[QB] Do not mean to hit a sore-spot with BS's, but have often wondered;

1. Do you believe in "soulmates"?[/b]</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">In the sense of one person "meant" or "destined" for another? No.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">2. Can a person have more than 1 soulmate during their lifetime?</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Definately.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">3. Please explain your belief.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">The romanticized version of "soulmate", as being another person "destined" for you, is deterministic, which then forces one to accept that nothing they do is truly their own choice. First, if there is only 1 other person made for you, then how are you supposed to find them out of 6+ billion people on earth? You find someone during your lifetime that makes you feel in love, but how do you know that this is your soulmate and not one of the 6+ billion others? You would never find out. Not to mention it promotes infidelity and divorce, because believing such a concept precludes one to always be on the lookout for their true "soulmate".

Second, if you do fall in love, marry and then find someone else who you believe is your true "soulmate", then you have done nothing wrong by leaving your first spouse to be with this "soulmate", for you are only acting in some grand design that is out of your mortal control and you are actually doing the first spouse a favor by freeing them up to find their "soulmate". Thus the whole notion favors infidelity and divorce, not to mention reduces human will and choice meaningless. You can't be held responsible for what was "destined to be".

"Soulmate" can be a valid term when one considers that humans can share their "soul" with others, they can share their innermost fears and passions and desires with others whom they care for and feel for, and likewise be a vessel for another in the same manner. But there is nothing magical or deterministic in this idea; we willingly choose to do this with another.

#1281085 02/24/05 06:00 AM
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Soulmates?..well if the definition of that is a person temporamentily (sp?) suited to another then yes l do believe in them,l believe people change as they grow and often people at a typical marrying age meet and marry someone who at that time they feel they are in love with only to find that as time progresses each of them chage and the feelings shift like sand...for some people it is simply the case of reajusting to their partners but for others the changes are too great and for whatever reason they look elsewhere,few people are lucky enough to find someone who grows and changes as a mirror image of their partners, back in history when divorce was almost unheard of the average lifespan was also far shorter and so consequently the timescale to change was not their either so couples stayed together. nowadays with expectations higher,lifespans higher and freedom greater l think many people may look for a soulmate when their own relationship changes,many affairs start with people in their 40's as at this time people have generally evolved into how they want to be for the rest of their life and are looking to find fulfillment,if couples are religious then this adds extra strains and problems as often each partner has a differing view of their responsibilitys....so to finish, yes l believe in soulmates, ...no unless they are incredibly lucky...l do not think they can have more than 1 soulamte in their life as the very premise of a soulmate gives supreme joy and theirfore neither partner would want to search for another person. ........and my belief is above...........many thanks Sue

#1281086 02/24/05 06:40 AM
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1. Do you believe in "soulmates"?
No. Not anymore.

2. Can a person have more than 1 soulmate during their lifetime?
see answer 1

3. Please explain your belief.

This affair taught me that each of us is fundamentally alone in this life.

I believe that a man and a woman can intelock well, and make a successful and loving life partnership, but for teh health of each party there must be a part withheld. A final neediness and otherness that must not be handed over because when that R breaks down, as the all do at some point, the giver is utterly destroyed and left helpless.

I always DID believe in "two becoming one " as a single physical, spiritual and emotional unit, but Squids affair and the affairs of many other folks on here in seemingly 'soulmate' relationships demonstrate that they do not exst. And when we try to achieve such, we set ourselves up for unhealthy levels of dependency.

I don't regret believing in soulmates for 22 years. But I can't behave that way again. It would kill me next time.


<small>[ February 24, 2005, 05:43 AM: Message edited by: b0b pure* ]</small>

#1281087 02/24/05 10:28 AM
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I believe that what most people think of as "I have found my soulmate" is merely infatuation or the "falling in love" stage. Doesn't everybody who is "in love" think they have found their "soulmate"? And then when the honeymoon period wears off, unless they are mature enough to build the real love stage (because that part doesn't just "happen") then they claim they were mistaken and are off to be with the next "soulmate"...

Cany you have more than one soulmate in your lifetime?

IMHO, yes.

You can have several falling in love experiences, each time BELIEVING that you are in a relationship with your soulmate.

You can also BUILD a soulmate relationship, over many years, but if that relationship ends, that doesn't mean you can never BUILD another relationship that is more than just infatuation.

IMHO the first example is just immaturity and not really relationships with a soulmate.
People who think that every time they become infatuated they have found there soulmate (and they were just mistaken all the other times they fell in love?) are never getting past the crush stage to experience mature love.

On the other hand, it is entirely possible for mature people to recover from one soulamte relationship that has ended regardless of their maturity and committment, to then meet somebody mature enough to build a lasting love realtionship with. And THAT is what a real soulmate is IMO.

A while back I came across this article from the Psychology Today magazine:

http://www.freedomlist.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=17179

#1281088 02/24/05 10:39 AM
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Micro2000,

I think my opinion of soulmate is sort of like yours.

I agree that thinking there is one soulamte somewhere out there for us, that we just have to somehow bump into, is the cause of a lot of relationship problems and excuses lack of responsibility for BUILDING or BEING a soulmate in your relationship.

The article I linked to discusses that problem.

And Bob,

You sound sort of like my WH in his more honest moments. My WH felt it was OK for him to hold back as a way to protect himself from being hurt WHEN/if our marriage ended. Although I understood his fear and wanting to protect himself, his lack of committment guaranteed our marriage would fail.

I certainly can relate to how a BS can be afraid to give a relationship their all after being hurt so badly. But IMHO love has to be all or nothing. We should be very careful about who we get involved with but when we do choose to get involved I think we should always do our best to build the best relationship we can. Yes, we could get hurt again but I just don't see any sense in making sure the relationship fails so somebody HAS TO get hurt. (Somebody WILL always get hurt and I just want to make sure it's not me sums up my WH's motto I guess)

I do believe that it is possible to have a mature love relationship. To me finding the right person is not about finding some mythical, one in billions "soulmate"... but about BEING one and being extra careful to only get in a relationship with somebody who is mature enough to also be a soulmate. It has much more to do with committment and maturity than with destiny or luck.

Love is a verb which some people don't bother to learn how to do (or are too afraid to do)

<small>[ February 24, 2005, 09:43 AM: Message edited by: meremortal ]</small>

#1281089 02/24/05 10:45 AM
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</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by Fishracer+:
<strong> 1. Do you believe in "soulmates"?

2. Can a person have more than 1 soulmate during their lifetime?

3. Please explain your belief.

</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Ok,
1. yes. I believe in soul mates.

2. Yes and no. Wishy washy I know but see below.

3. I believe that out of the billions of people on this planet, there are probably thousands out there you could fall in love with. There are also probably a bunch of people who could qualify as a soul mate. Now that does not mean I think you could have more than one soul mate in your lifetime. I think if you end up finding one of your soulmates, even if another potential soul mate comes along you would not even notice, since you are already with someone who is a soul mate.
Michael

#1281090 02/24/05 10:50 AM
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Hi FR,

The word soulmate always makes my radar go up so I thought I would just make a quick post.I didn't even read the other replys since I am so dang tired but if I can find it,I will bring back an article I posted here a while ago from Psychology Today about how the search for the "soulmate" is a huge blow to marriages and a big "cause" of D.

I do not believe in this "soulmate" theme.I think it was born from the idea that,mistakenly,there is that one special clone person that completes you or was meant for you.blah <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" /> This can lead people to think that what they already have at home isn't enough or the "right" one or a whole host of other misguided fruitless searches.

It's an illusion.

Ok,I think I need a nap.yaaaaawn........... lol

I will try to get that article for ya

#1281091 02/24/05 11:12 AM
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Hi OctoberGirl,

Got your article link already:

http://cms.psychologytoday.com/articles/pto-20040301-000002.html

You and I were apparently surfing the same brain wave when we saw this thread title LOL

I agree with your opinion of the "soulmate" myth (blah)

I imagine the shock when my WH and the latest OW looked at each other for the first time after realizing they hadn't found their soulmate after all. And neither of them had the maturity and integrity to actually BECOME a soulmate - both takers and no givers. Oh sure they acted like givers for a while because they were "in love" (infatuated). But when that started to wear thin (thanx in great part to exposure LOL) they had to face the fact that neither of them was really willing to BE the other's dream mate because that meant actually BEING honest, sacrificial, hard-working, faithful, etc.

IMHO nobody should have a sexual relationship with a child - even if the children involved are 33 (OW) and 51 (WH) LOL Adult relationships are best left to adults.

Enjoy your nap girl.

I'll be driving half the day - up into the Adirondacks. Can't wait to see what this soulmate thread's been up to when I get back.

<small>[ February 24, 2005, 10:17 AM: Message edited by: meremortal ]</small>

#1281092 02/24/05 11:26 AM
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MM!!

Thanks so much for pulling that up for me.I am going to read it again.I think it was rather accurate in many respects.

Have fun in the mountains <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

I'm going back to my nap.....zzzzzzz LOL

#1281093 02/24/05 11:40 AM
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Call me surly today... it makes me squirm to see grownups using this word.

GC

#1281094 02/24/05 11:53 AM
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The soulmate concept is bogus. Practically ALL involved in affairs believe they have found thier soulmate. However, many or most do not leave the marriage.

My wife and I never had the soulmate discussion, however she did with OM. Obviously the soulmate talk was nothing but hot air.

#1281095 02/24/05 08:37 PM
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RESULTS!!! OF UNOFFICIAL SURVEY:

BS’s: 14
WS’s: 5
Unsure: 1
Yes to believing in Soulmate Concept (Traditional Definition.): 5
No to believing in Soulmate Concept (Traditional Definition.): 14
Yes to meeting multiple Soulmates in life: 7
No to meeting multiple Soulmates in life: 4
Formerly Yes to believing in Soulmates, now No: 3
Soulmate status is “earned”: 2
Unsure: 4

Total: 20

Male: 10
Female: 10

Interesting! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

FR <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

#1281096 02/25/05 05:19 PM
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Bumping so all can see the results and draw conclusions. I thought the results were - well - not as I thought!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" />

FR

#1281097 03/01/05 10:45 PM
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bump

#1281098 03/02/05 10:04 AM
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Here's what I think the adulterers mean when they say they've found their soulmate:

They're "in love"

You know how they tell the betrayed spouse "I love you but I'm not in love with you"?

Well with their adultery partner they should be saying "I don't love you but I'm in love with you"

IMHO people under the spell of an adultery addiction can only be "in love" - lack the maturity and sanity TO love. While the addiction has it's grip on them they don't really love anyone - not even their own children.
They will claim they love their children and even the betrayed spouse, but their actions prove otherwise.

They have convinced themselves that "in love" is what it's all about. And they avoid responsibility and guilt because one can't help who they "fall in love" with... It was fate - they met their soulmate - yea, that's it!

(They refuse to talk about how they consciously chose to put themselves in situations that nurtured falling in love, failed to protect their marriage from OP's etc,)

Unlike real love where one has to make conscious choices and take actions even if they don't feel like it at the moment, the person "in love" just wants to do whatever they feel like doing, allowing their emotions and carnal desires to rule over them.

Selfishness is sanctioned because they are "in love".

When it's a case of a normally sane person having AN affair the adultery eventually loses it's sparkle, the honeymoon phase always ends, and unless the adulterers start TO LOVE when they start "falling out of love" with each other, the affair ends. TO LOVE would mean they would have to admit to themselves that if they had worked at the marriage(s) their adultery destroyed, then the marriage(s) could have been not just saved, but quite satisfying. Also, once the adulterers fall out of love with each other they will KNOW they can't trust each other and doubts that each other will have the morality and maturity to DO what's needed to maintain the relationship will surface.

Serial adulterers are not merely suffering from a string of such addictions, causing temporary insanity (fog) but have a chronic inability to commit or love. ALL THEY KNOW how to do is "fall in love". Or maybe they know better but lack the morality, maturity, courage... whatever.

NOTE: Sometimes "red flags" are mentioned in the posts here. IMHO it's important to realize that people with overly developed skills at romance, at the sort of behaviors that help somebody "fall in love" with them, should be regarded with extreme caution. People with LOTS of experience with the falling in love stage might have no clue whatsoever when it comes to the building and maintaining a lasting love stage. So when you hear women gush about how they never suspected their guy would be the type to hurt anyone, because he's been so charming, attentive, kind, blah-blah-blah TO THEM, ironically those charming behaviors may have been the red flags they missed. The book Men Who Can't Love says these men can put so much into their pursuit because they know they don't plan to maintain this level of attention for very long. Plus they are better at starting relationships because compared to other men that's all they put any time or energy into - they have a LOT more practice at it. When he goes overboard making a woman feel like Queen for the day, maybe the woman should pay more attention to the "for a day" part?

TO LOVE, the verb, is something serial adulterers lack the capacity or willingness to do.

They probably figure why bother when they can just keep falling in love? They seem like parasites who come and take while the taking's good and don't trouble themselves with the fallout when they move on. It's all play and no work for them (watched too many Bond movies maybe? LOL)

Or they have been so hurt by something in their past they have a very strong committment phobia.
They have learned how to get their needs for relationship met without the risk of getting hurt or dumped. Some have a strong fear of feeling trapped - very similar to claustrophobia. So once the relationship starts to show signs of committment or expectation they escape and start a new relationship with somebody else.

<small>[ March 03, 2005, 06:15 AM: Message edited by: meremortal ]</small>

#1281099 03/02/05 10:12 AM
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1. Do you believe in "soulmates"?
Yes, I do believe in soulmates, and I believe that I found mine in my husband, now if I can just make him remember that, we'll be in good shape.

2. Can a person have more than 1 soulmate during their lifetime?
I don't think so, It makes me immeasurably sad to say this, but I know that I have a soul mate in my H, and if it doesn't work out, part of my soul will die with the R.

3. Please explain your belief.
I have been married before, and dated quite a bit, and I can honestly say, that I've never loved anyone before I met my husband. When we are together, we connect. I don't think I'll ever feel that for anyone again, that's why I'm so adamant about saving my M, I don't think I can, nor do I want to live without him.

-Caren

#1281100 03/02/05 10:35 AM
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WOW!

I JUST realized something!

I have been sort of depressed for the past few days (got some sort of bug so not getting enough exercise and I recently went to a lower dose on my AD) and worrying that since my WH and I were married 25 years, the odds of me having the sort of marriage I want, with time to build a level of closeness hoped for but never achieved in my marriage to WH, are getting slimmer by the day.

Also, WH has lots of time left to have numerous relationships of the short, shallow sort he prefers. So this was making me feel sort of bitter.

But it just occurred to me:

Since I believe you have to BECOME soulmates, not merely bump into them, I should be enouraged by my and future mate's ability to do so. Even though I probably won't get to have another 25 year long marriage, with a MATURE man, minus a serial adultery problem, I have PLENTY of time left to build a rewarding marriage!

WHOOOPEEE!!!

Meanwhile WH will have to settle for flings with increasingly older, less attractive women (not enough money, stamina, good looks left to attract the sweet young things) LOL And his odds of attracting mates without kids of their own and ex (or current) husbands will decrease over the years too. His latest OW had a child and issues with that child's father, which spoiled some of their fun LOL

<small>[ March 02, 2005, 08:54 PM: Message edited by: meremortal ]</small>

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