I know, 2BN. And honestly, I wouldn't be surprised if thoughts of the OM DO cross her mind while she's on her vacation. Because this is the first time she's done something totally on her own in ages...other than when she got ready to leave last year.

But what I've been reminding myself of is that this ISN'T last year. We have put a perfectly wonderful year under our belt since then, and I need to let that build up my confidence in both her, and in myself. So I've been trying to let that worry go.

I just can't wait for her to get back!! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Sys-

Hope we didn't discourage you. Keep in mind, Sys, that you & your W are roughly on the same timeline as me. My vacation was 9 weeks ago and I am in a different place today than I was 9 weeks ago. Your W is, too. NC at that time was just a few weeks, now it's months. 2BN had contact fairly recently. Your W is and will be further along than either of us were at the time of our vacations.

Thanks for your thoughts everyone. Cards, I think for me on this vacation, I was able to connect with my H and we did have some good times together. We even had some alone time since our daughters are older. We were able to go out to dinner alone several nights and take some nice walks while the kids stayed at the hotel. It was a nice break for us to be able to do that and I did enjoy my time with my H. And I did enjoy his planning of everything! He had planned this trip for months and really did a good job!

I didn't feel that my vacation was totally ruined by these thoughts of the OM, but I hadn't had such strong thoughts of the OM in awhile and I had to work hard (in my head) to try to stop them. This all caught me so off guard. At times, we were all walking around as a family and my mind would drift to the OM about all sorts of things...conversations, thinking of contacting him, etc.!!

Cards, I do remember how you felt when you returned from your vacation. I had thought about that on my vacation and thought how can this be? I knew you were still in withdrawals during your vacation, but I don't consider myself in withdrawals anymore. I kept thinking if I'm not in withdrawal, why do I keep thinking of the OM?

My thoughts are clearer today being back into my routine at work and home and I'm able to control my thoughts better. Maybe being on vacation with no planning and no routines just did me in. Plus my H did plan everything and I wanted it that way. I basically just followed him around and let him lead us during the entire trip. I had not wanted to think about planning anything and maybe if I had done so, I may have been more focused.

Sys - I would think things would go better for your W. Please don't base what happened to me and think the same will happen to her. I did keep all my thoughts from my H though too. I just can't share with him that my mind kept wandering to the OM. I know it would hurt him to tell him. I did tell him one night while we were there that I kept having strange thoughts of the OM and had the crazy thought to email him. My H just said I was strange! So I left it at that!

Owl - As Cards said, your W is much further along than me or Cards. It's possible as you said that the OM may cross her mind at times, but I highly doubt it would be what I just experienced.

2BN-

I can imagine it must have felt really odd thinking about OM while you were on vacation. But what exactly were your thoughts about them?? Were they 'missing them' thoughts, or what? You say that you've felt like you're clear of the withdrawl, but sometimes relapses can and do happen some.

Cards-

I thought it was awesome how your H asked you to lunch. I do that occasionally with my wife too. Or, I'll sneak home for lunch, and bring something nice to eat along with me so that we can share it together.

Sys-

It's awesome that you're able to see the progress you've made. Feels nice when you look back at your first posts on LS and see how far things have come, doesn't it?

Hope everyone has a good day today.

Owl- I was only thinking of the last OM on vacation. The 1st OM is not even an issue with my thoughts. I had only one thought of the 1st OM when flying over his city and that was it.

My thoughts of the OM were all over the map. Some were of intimate conversations I had with him, and some were of what if we had met and I had flown to meet him? Others were wishing I could talk to him again. I had seriously considered sending him some type of email when I returned, but then I wasn't sure what I would say?

Was this just a relapse of thoughts that I had when in strong withdrawal? This can't be normal!

As I said earlier, once I returned home, these thoughts subsided and I feel much better now. I am worried somewhat about our next trip in about a month. We are going to visit my parents in my home state, but I feel I need to have a plan so this doesn't happen to me again.

Cards - I thought that was awesome that your H asked you to lunch yesterday. I can't ever do that with my H at lunch because it's impossible for him to get away. I am envious!

I had a question for you guys. Both of you seem to need physical touch from your W's. Would you both say that this is a high EN for you? The reason I ask is that I had a conversation with my H last night regarding touch. It is not a high need of his at all, but it is of mine. I would love it if he would initiate physical touch with me and I had mentioned this to him. He said it is so hard for him to think that way. Do I just give up on wanting him to initiate it? He will sit close and such if I ask, but he never initiates it.

Well, it is a high need of mine, and used to be a high need of my wife's, but that seems to have changed over the years.

All I can suggest would be to continue to remind him that while it might not mean as much to him, it means a lot to you, and it's an awesome way for him to demonstrate his love and affection for you in a way that clearly gets the message accross to you. Again, back to the "The Five Love Languages" kind of thing.

Owl - why do you think it changed for your wife?

Yes, I do remind him and he is good about meeting that need when I ask. It's just never initiated. It is not my highest need, but it's up there.

Why do I think it's no longer a need of hers, or why do I think it's changed?

Simply put, she's just not as physically affectionate as she used to be. For MANY years, we had couples comment about how we'd always hug or kiss or touch each other whenever we were near. But now it just doesn't happen as much, and most all of it is initiated by me now. When she DOES initiate, I always let her know how much I appreciate it.

I'm not sure WHY this has changed.

Owl - Interesting that your W no longer has the need for physical affection when you were both so affectionate for many years. I guess I was wondering if the change was related to the EA, or if the change happened long before the EA?

I guess we all have different needs and we do need to let our spouses know that when those needs are met, they are greatly appreciated.

Same here. As I outlined in my earlier post though, it seems that we both withdrew from each other physically over time. Having the kids makes it harder too -they are all over both of us and when we go out as a family one of us is invariably carrying one or holding one's hand so there isn't any good way for us to hold hands, go arm in arm, whatever. About the only us time we really get is in the evenings after the kids are in bed.

Like you Owl, touch is really important to me. Over the years, I suppressed that need as I stopped getting it, but now I crave it. My W on the other hand seems to either want it or need it less -probably due to her extreme over stimulation from the trolls. Early on she expressed that she had missed it, but now it seemed weird to have me giving it to her. Either way, we are maing stirdes in that area.

2B - I too mant my W to initiate more -I'm doing most of the work. When she does initiate any kind of intimacy though I feel like a million bucks ). Make sure your H knows you want it and how good itmakes you feel when he initiates touch. I think with some practice, he will come around to it.

I'll be going on vacation starting tomorrow -some of that time will be away, some at home, but my contact with the boards will be sporadic at best. So in case I don't get a chance, I wish you all well and good luck for the interim. Hope I have good things to say about my time off.

Sys - Have a great time away with your W and family and I truly hope that everything goes well!

Wow, I would have to think back to when our kids were small and if I needed less physical affection at that time. I never thought about it that way, and yes, I can remember feeling like we never had much alone time back then! I think for me as the kids got older, I seemed to want more physical affection from my H. When we do go out alone, we will hold hands at times and sometimes he does initiate that and I appreciate that.

Maybe I'm not thinking of the times he does initiate physical affection and that there can be a good balance even if I'm the one initiating it. At least he doesn't turn me down!

I think that the change started occurring over the year or so prior to her EA. She'd begun gaming HARD during that time, and staying up all hours playing online. (I personally believe that she'd even had the start of a first EA during this time with someone else...she's not sure at this point if that is the case or not, but willing to accept that it could have been).

She began to ignore me in a big way during that time...and no matter what I did or how I tried to deal with things (mostly badly, in truth) we just grew further and further apart. And it was during that time that the physical touching and such really went downhill.

Now, it's recovered some since the EA ended and all, but nowhere near to the level it was prior to our troubles overall. My thoughts are that part of it might just be a change in our relationship, and that it may simply be something that we'll have to work through.

Sys-

Have a great trip and enjoy your family! I hope that you & your W get some time alone to reconnect.

OK, so at lunch time I stopped and bought some posterboard, markers, streamers, and balloons. The kids have agreed that we're gonna make some welcome home signs for mom, and decorate the living room with balloons and streamers for when she gets back. Not to mention I plan on stopping and having each of us pick up a small thing of flowers for when she gets off the plane.

Top that off with a trip by the custard stand on the way home from the airport, and an arrival at a clean house with nothing for her to do but relax and have fun, it should be a good welcome home.

Gotta love teenagers that don't think doing stuff like this is too sappy! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Owl - Sounds awesome for your W! Coming home to a clean house alone is wonderful and then to top it off with all the extras! I'm sure she will enjoy her welcome home!

2BN-

I don't think your thoughts are "abnormal" - I'm still having thoughts, too. In fact, my last couple days have been hard and I haven't even been on vacation. I did share this with my H today, and my frustration as to why the thoughts keep resurfacing. I just wish I could understand it. Like you, I have to admit that often what I think of are some of the more intimate conversations we had. I'm not exactly sure how to approach that and I don't know what that means. For you it may be related to your physical touch need, but for me I didn't think I had a huge need in that area.

In the last couple of days I have really had to talk myself out of the thoughts - much more than I've had to in a while. I still am attributing some of it to the stress I've been under. Maybe I'm drawing on the EA as something that was a comfort to make myself feel good.

Cards -

Well, I'm glad that my thoughts are not that "abnormal"...but not glad that I had them! I too was frustrated with the fact that I was thinking those thoughts of the OM. I cannot figure it out, but I do know they have really subsided since I've been home and back to my routines.

I can't help but wonder how long these thoughts will keep resurfacing? We can do our best not to dwell on them, but why do they pop in our heads to begin with?

I hope things get better for you in this area, Cards.

HI guys,
Just stopping by to see how u are all doing. I'm in NC now and have deleted pix and stuff from OM. I just need help. Sometimes I feel like I'm going crazy because I think about him all the time. Today I'm feeling angry so thats good at least. But then I cave, and start to miss him! I just can't deal with my feelings anymore! I know this gets easier with time, and I've had a HORRIBLE time doing this. But I"m committed to doing it for myself. I need to move on with MY life, as he has.

I'm trying all the tricks, its hard cuz i sit in front of a pc all day. BUt I"m socializing more w/my coworkers when I start to feel bad. Not good for work, but THIS is more impt right now. I'm also talking to girlfriends when I start to feel lonely and missing him. Anyway, I've made a tiny bit of progress today, and I'll deal with tomorrow, tomorrow!

-win

(((( win ))))

giving you hugs and prayers of support

be strong honey

you deserve your best effort

Pep

Good for you! You are doing the right thing.

When you feel like caving, just take it a few moments at the time. Just get through the next few minutes...and then the next few hours, and then the next day, and the next week.

Focus on it in small goals.

That's what I did. And before you know it, you will go much longer without feeling lonely and wanting to caving. And you will begin to feel better.

I promise.

Susan <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />