I don't know what to tell you, Cards. I know that my wife felt the same way for a long time...not that she wanted to renew the EA, but simply hoping that he was doing ok, etc... But from what I've seen, I believe that this desire does fade over time.

Just do your best to fight thoughts of the OM and keep him in the proper perspective...in the past. Hope that helps.

Is it the FANTASY? We escaped to a fantasy world for a time and it was EASIER than the REAL world? Do we still want to live in the fantasy world and not face reality? Sorry all, I am serious about answering these questions to get myself unstuck.

Owl & Cards -

To answer what I was hoping for?? Not really sure except to know "he is there" and "OK" I guess. There is a way for me to know if he was there in my email...hard to explain, but I thought he was, but not totally sure.

Cards - I think I AM having a hard time of not completely wanting to let go and I can't explain why for myself. Last night I had some time to myself at home and I did go back to that forum and looked at some of the OM's posts from before we had the EA. We were talking during that period of time, however we had not admitted to any feelings for each other. It was strange how I felt reading his posts (last night) about how his marriage was better than ever, but yet I KNEW at the time he was being drawn to me. He would offer advice to others about their M's but yet his heart was not right in his own M.

Was it wrong of me to look there?? I know I am still trying to sort this all out in my head and that's why I looked there, but I should be OVER this by now shouldn't I?

I NEED to realize that this is OVER as Owl stated. He is out of my life and I KNOW I will never go back. But, at the same time, something keeps drawing me back to hold on to it all.

This is a quote from something I read this morning:


My failure in these areas, I feel, is that I am not fully trusting in God for ALL of this. I am holding onto something that I know is hindering me in my M and my relationship with God. I have to surrender it all to HIM, but I struggle deeply with this! My heart doesn't want to let go, and it is a battle of my fleshly desires that are NOT matching up to what "He desires me to be".

Those are my thoughts and what I feel that God is impressing on my heart.

Owl-

Actually that does help to know that others continued to wonder about OM even though marital recovery was under way. It keeps making me feel like I'm going nowhere that I would still entertain those thoughts.

By the way, I read your latest posts for Win & Bass. You have done a great job persevering and trying to help them.

Cards - I don't think that we want to escape to that fantasy again - at least I don't. I want to progress and heal, but we don't trust enough to let go completely.

I think I posted at the same time as you, so take a look at my post above yours...thanks..

Cards and 2BN-

I don't know if it's a fantasy, or what, but it takes an EFFORT for you to get to the point where you no longer dwell on the OM as much. One word of advice for both of you...start acting like your H can see every single thing you do...and then ask yourself what would happen if he saw what you were doing. Case in point, how will your H feel if/when he knows you went back to that forum, or changed your password, 2BN?? Not well at all is my guess.

I'm thinking about taking the EN checklist to our next MC session and talking with our MC to see what he thinks about us working on it jointly. Bluntly, the reason for that is that I feel like I'm doing all of this to meet my wife's EN's, but she's not doing much to try to meet mine at times. Hopefully we'll be able to talk about it there and see if we can do something to help this out some.

I HAVE done this, but then sometimes I just tell myself I don't care and do what I did anyways. I DO KNOW he would not like me looking at that forum, even if it was to look at old posts and trying to figure things out.

Changing the password was eating away at me and I KNEW I could not leave it that way.

OUCH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

That is as scary as it gets friend. I'd suggest that you really need to talk with your H about this...'cause if you're truly feeling this way at times, he needs to know. That would scare the hell out of me to hear from my wife, and hurt a ton to hear as well. It was exactly THAT that got you to where you're at now...at least that's my thoughts.

Not sure what else to tell you friend. I hope that Cards might have some good insight for you here.

I guess that did sound a bit harsh, but the reality is if I still did what I did and looked and changed my password, then I am not truly considering the feelings of my H am I? I can try to justify it all I want with saying I'm trying to sort out things, but the truth is I am not considering my H in this. And, that is something I cannot admit to him!
It's difficult to tell him that and admit that I still "want to know" about the OM. He just cannot understand it.

I just don't know, 2BN, why it's so hard to let it all go. I would love to wave the magic wand and have it all disappear from my head. I feel that if I just KNEW what was keeping the thoughts coming I could fix it and be done with it. I want that more than anything. And, NO, I definitely do NOT want to be living in that fantasy again. Talk about being out of control.

Wrong to look at OM posts? I don't know about wrong, but probably counter-productive. For me, I think doing something like that would pull me back to some degree. I think that ANYTHING directly related to OM is some kind of contact and that's what we need to stay away from.

As far as trusting in God in this situation, I have struggled here, too. For some reason I have not been able to turn this over to Him. I don't know if it's guilt and shame, or what. I turned to Him for help and strength during the ugly time of that horrible withdrawal, but have not been able to ask for help recently. That would probably be a very good step at this point - to feel forgiven could get us over this hump of letting it go.

Owl, I don't consider myself "dwelling" on OM, it's just that there seem to be periods of time when the thoughts come. It might be on and off for a couple days, then nothing for a few days. It's very unpredictable. You know when it's happening because that's when I post about it. It's not obsessive thinking, but sometimes it just comes.

You said you still spend more time working on your W's EN's than her working on yours? Has it always been this way in your R? Or is this something related to the EA? Or do you just have more needs in the last year since the EA?

2BNORMAL WROTE:
“Was it wrong of me to look there?? I know I am still trying to sort this all out in my head and that's why I looked there, but I should be OVER this by now shouldn't I?”

Hi. I think I’ve posted to you before, a long time ago. Just wanted to pop back in with the voice of experience as a FWS to say that every time you look at the old forum, posts, or e-mails, it is the same as having contact with OM. You take yourself back to day one of recovery, or awfully close to that, anyway. That is why you are having trouble being “over this by now!”

You also wrote: “My failure in these areas, I feel, is that I am not fully trusting in God for ALL of this. I am holding onto something that I know is hindering me in my M and my relationship with God. I have to surrender it all to HIM, but I struggle deeply with this! My heart doesn't want to let go, “

Early after my d-day, I read a book by Joyce Meyer called “The Battle Belongs to the Lord,” where she pointed out that God can’t take something away from us that we won’t let go of! It was a turning point in my recovery, although it still took me awhile to become disciplined enough to protect myself by NOT reviewing anything that reminded me of the A or OM.

I know it’s hard to let go, and I know the desperation to try to “sort this all out,” but what I learned is that it quite possibly will never all be sorted out. Forgetting OM, forgiving ourselves, concentrating on our H’s and our M’s and the PRESENT is the only way to move on and to be free. It takes time, discipline, and determination.

Once I heard an evangelist say about an addiction that the only way to stop is TO STOP. It sounded impersonal and harsh at the time, but sometimes I’ve found it to be simply true. Sometimes we just have to STOP obsessive behavior through sheer willpower. God can and will help us, but only if we let go. He won’t force us to do anything.

One last point. You also wrote: "It's difficult to tell him that and admit that I still "want to know" about the OM. He just cannot understand it."

I'm thinking you realize that there is no reason your H should or could be able to understand your wanting to know about the OM. It really doesn't make sense. It's irrational for us to keep wondering about the OM.

At some point, we have to stop being selfish about our own feelings, and start looking at OM from our H's point of view, and ONLY consider our H's feelings about OM, IF we want our M's to recover.

Keep on trustin’ – God bless.

Rose

Cards - I have done exactly what you have done. I sought after God during the horrible time of withdrawal, but lately it's been tough. There is no "feeling" of forgiveness, Cards. We HAVE to trust God and KNOW that we are forgiven by HIS WORD. This I believe is my biggest struggle. To know that I AM truly forgiven even though I did such a horrible thing and not hang on to any of it. God IS in control as much as we often forget this!

WHY IS THIS? This is exactly why I'm trying to answer these questions!!! How to make the jump and trust H with the EN's. This is the same problem for me, 2B, Win and all the others in these EA's. How to pull back out of that something that we were pulled into. I believe the MB principals are sound - have the BS start meeting the needs, but there has to be something MORE that we can do to facilitate the process. The fog is over, the withdrawal is basically over, we WANT to want our M & H, but the thoughts keep with us. It's so frustrating when you WANT so badly to move forward, but you are stopped and can't figure out why. Sorry for venting.

Rose - Thank you for your insight. It's been awhile since you've posted on this thread.


This is so very true! I have to let go first before God can work through me. There is a barrier that I have set up in my heart that I won't release. I will try to take a look at the book you mentioned.

I do realize that I'm still dealing with the addiction. The addiction of wanting to know, and wanting to look back. And you are right, the only way to stop and addiction is to simply STOP!

Thank you for your encouragement!

"How to make the jump and trust H with the EN's"

We have to stop worrying as much about our own EN's and start concentrating on our H's EN's. That's a good place to begin the transition from attachment to OM back to our H's. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

God bless,

Rose

Thank you Rose. The voice of experience is what we needed here, right NOW!! Thank you.

2BNormal and Cards -

I know it is a hard struggle to stop being tempted to turn to the comforting feelings from the A. I don't know how much I might be able to help, but if you ever have any questions, just ask!

Rose

Cards-

Looking back, my wife used to do a lot to meet my EN's for many years after we were married. And I did the same...we've always had a two way relationship when it came to that. But it seems to me that over the last several years it's gotten more and more one sided on my part...that all the onus to keep things going was on me. She's said several times that she's felt that the 'courting' should be done by the man, that the man should be the one who made the woman feel special. And I've done that.

But given all the stress of dealing with my job, my kids, and everything else, I'm starting to feel a bit taken for granted myself now. Now let me make this clear...I'm NOT going to look anywhere else to have any kind of needs met...LOL!!!

But I am going to try to bring up how we can improve meeting each other's needs.

I think that Rose has a VERY good point when it comes to EN's...instead of worrying about having your OWN EN's met, start concentrating on fulfilling or EXCEEDING your H's EN's. I've noticed that I'm usually much more willing to fulfill my wife's needs when she's doing the same for mine. Perhaps that might be key in helping the both of you.

At any rate, I'm kind of rambling on. I had to drop our vehicle off at the house so that Mrs. Owl could do some running, and there was a major bruhaha going on about household chores and such. It's frustrating, I try my best to do things to give her a good birthday, but it feels like I'm the ONLY one trying to do so.

Hope everyone is doing well this morning.

I wish I KNEW what needs my H had! He really can't determine that he needs anything specific.

I went to the Christian Bookstore last night and browsed a bit. I looked at the book that Rose mentioned, but I kept going back to a book called Breaking Free by Beth Moore and purchased it and started to read it last night.

Here is a synopsis of the book:


After what was talked about yesterday, I really I need to put my focus totally on God and quit looking back. This will take alot of work and determination on my part. I believe this will be the key my healing.

I also looked at a book called Every Woman's Battle. I wanted to get that as well, but I didn't want to get 2 books at once. Cards - I think this book is a great book to understand about how our EA's happened. It had alot of great insight. Have you heard of it?

Hope everyone is doing well today.