Thanks for the responses 2B & Sys.

2B, I really don't think your H believes you set out to hurt people. It's probably more that he doesn't want to accept that for some reason he was not meeting your needs and you looked elsewhere. He's probably feeling anger when he says that.

Sys, I think my H has similar thinking like you in that his biggest responsibility is to work and take care of the family - at all costs. This was his father's role, too. I am proud of him in that he recognizes these anxieties and doesn't deny them like some people would do. He seeks help when he needs to. He goes through periods where he has to constantly fight the worry and negative thinking.

D-day was eye-opening for him............but a bit of time has passed and in his mind we're on to the next problem. The problem is that I am different and experienced attention and care from someone. Having felt that, I want that. I don't know if I can accept our R as it was, and I feel a sense of urgency to make things better. I hate to admit it, but it's almost as if I don't trust myself to not search for it - or something else meaningful. That is what I've been doing - trying to search within myself for healthy ways to be fulfilled until which time we can both put in the necessary effort towards the M. I'm not sure if it's a good plan or not, but I feel my hands are tied to do much else.

Maybe you are both right - counselling. Thank you for your suggestions and listening.

Dear Cards,

Please check out Whisper’s thread. She is a FWW who struggle with similar emotional problems in her M right now. However, the circumstances and rout of her and her H's problems is totally different from yours, but I was thinking that maybe some of the suggestions & advice she receives from others might be helpful to you as well. Maybe the two of you can also give each other some moral help & support since it seem you’re going through somewhat similar frustrations & struggles right now.

Blessings,
Suzet

Cards-

I've been the one shouldering most of the load in re-building our marriage. And my wife has admitted that in MC that she recognizes that. But unfortunately that hasn't really changed the situation much. I've pretty much had to deal with my anxiety and depression on my own...I tried asking her for help at various times, but sadly she just doesn't seem to be able to put forth any effort in helping me to deal with stuff like this. And that just makes her feel worse when she realizes that she's not helped. So...sadly I rarely talk to her about dealing with it, and just do my best to handle things on my own.

But...the anxiety seems to have faded quite a bit again, and the depression is manageable, so this isn't quite the crisis that it might sound like.

I'm not sure what to suggest to you in your situation. Other than gently reminding him that he (I assume) made a promise to you to make these changes in your marriage, and that it's important that you both stick to that. Neither of you want to let things get back to how bad they were before.

Our situation has been somewhat the reverse...I'm the one fighting to ensure that we don't end up back where we were.

Owl,

I feel like I have tried to help and be supportive regarding my H's depression issues for all of these years. But after awhile it began to feel like I really wasn't helping much. I know it's frustrating for you & my H and everyone that deals with that to have to constantly be on top of it and work with it, but it's also hard to be the person watching it and feeling helpless to do much. After a while I think I gave up trying to help and just let him sort it out. Throughout our marital life he has dealt with this and the result has been that he has depended on me to "run the ship". He has stable times, but since it is erratic the net result has been that I basically took over most responsibilities for the sake of continuity.

As I said, he is a good man and has never done anything to intentionally hurt me or distance himself from me, so I have incredible guilt when I even hint at complaining about this. It is not his fault that he has a family history of this. But, I do feel that our M has been so out of balance because of this. I came to not EXPECT any emotional support from him because he was too "busy" with his issues. And guess what happened - sucked into EA.

Owl, just this weekend I did "gently" explain this to my H and his response was that he can't help right now. He was not being hurtful and selfish, just matter-of-fact.

No, I don't think my H believes I "intentionally" set out to hurt him, but he does feel that "I just didn't care about people" or else I wouldn't have done what I've done. He honestly feels it's that simple. He never mentioned him not meeting my needs as the reason I didn't care. I know I've mentioned this in the past but to him it IS so black and white.

Cards, my situation is not as extreme as what you are experiencing with your H right now. But, I have come to realize that my H cannot always meet my needs. There are times when his needs do take priority over my needs. It seems that is what you are experiencing and have experienced alot throughout your marriage. I imagine that this is very difficult for you as you realized it lead you to the EA.


I totally understand this! But, we have to realize what we experienced was NOT reality. I know you know that. I want and desire what I experienced from the OM too, but it just won't happen exactly like that in my M. Even if I would have married the OM, it wouldn't have stayed the same.


Cards, actually I think this is a good plan. I know you are a Christian as well. How much have you sought the Lord on this, and really prayed about it? I'll keep you and your H in my prayers.

Hey Owl, Cards and Sys...
Just letting you know I posted a question over on the Recovery Board this morning. You are welcome to reply there...really need advice...thanks!

I posted this on the Recovery Board, but wanted to post on here as well for anyone to answer...

I'm going back to our MC today. Today, I will be going by myself and perhaps the next visit my husband will join. We both felt it was best that I go first. This is the same MC we both went to in January - February, however, alot has happened since then.

I want to make the most of my time and have been writing down notes to make sure I bring up everything I want to talk about.

Does anyone have any suggestions on how to make the most of my time?

Hi 2B <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Sorry for the just-in time reply.

I don't know exactly what to tell you, as every MC has a different approach. More than anything, I think you need a plan for your life. As our MC said, odds are , if you don't have a plan, you'll probably end up somewhere other than where you thought or wanted to go.

It sounds kind of daunting, but not really. You needn't go too far, but ask yourself, what do you want out of MC, what to you want for yourself, your H, your family? What are you willing to do to get there?

That last one is the toughy, because you may not want to do what you know it might take.

More than anything, I would not try to put too many limits on yourself. No deadlines, no pre-qualifications, etc. But do realize that you will need to set some limits. Limits to behavior, and limits to expectations.

Be ready to give more than you get. Learn to back down when it just isn't worth it. Don't assign blame. Frankly I wouldn't try to focus too much on the past at all. You can't change it. Instead look at this as an opportunity to move forward working towards something positive. Obviously there are the roots of your issues that you need to recognize and correct, past behaviors to modify, but if there is one thing I learned in all of this, wallowing in hurt got me and my W nowhere.

Even if you don't have hope now, realize that things can get better with time and effort.

I don't know if that helps you maximize your time, but at least I hope it gives you food for thought and maybe some hope.

Oh, one more thing -LISTEN. Listen to you MC, listen to your H and listen to yourself. It is the key.

Hi Sys!
Thanks for the advice!


These are good questions to ask myself and I have been reflecting on these the last several days. So much has happened over these past months and I'm not sure if you got to read any of my updates on the recovery board. But, alot has changed within me. I am ready for all this to be behind me and to move forward!

OK...Owl's feeling a little odd today.

Sys, I know you'll understand this a little better than the rest. If you're still here my friend.

My wife's EA started through an online game we've played for quite a while...you interact with a LOT of other people in the game. I've seen numerous other couples go through almost exactly what we did, and (I don't mean to sound sexist, but I'm simply pointing out what I've seen) it seems that almost every couple who plays this game ends up with the wife finding 'her soulmate' via the game, the couple ends up divorced and the husband ends up devestated. So far, Sys and I seem to have the only marriages that I've seen survive this.

My wife and I still play, though we've changed how we do so quite a bit. We just joined a new, HUGE guild where a number of our friends had gone after we'd stopped playing last year due to her EA. Well, I'm off this morning...I've just found out that ANOTHER couple that we were friends with back then has gone through the exact same thing...she's in love with someone she's met in game.

It makes me just want to disconnect my internet service and move to a mountain top in Alaska!

Owl - Well I think the statistics are high for internet affairs, no matter where they meet online. It happened with me and I wasn't playing an online game...as you know. And, I "know" it has happened more than once on the very forum I was on and met OM2. There was a woman on there that was "counseled" just like I was by another man. She was married and was suffering in her marriage. Well, she divorced her husband and is now married to this man! And, get this...she claims that God put them together and that HE is the man that God had always intended for her to marry, and that God gave her a new beginning for the happiness and love she deserves! Talk about deception!

The internet and the secrecy that can happen online has caused alot of damage to marriages that's for sure. We really need to have our boundaries set in real life and online.

Anyways...just my thoughts.

2BN-
You're right, of course. It just really gets to me, since I've seen so many friends whose marriages were destroyed by the exact same thing I've gone through. And seeing it happen to someone now, AFTER what we went through, brings back some of that fear and pain for me.

I couldn't imagine going through this again...and seeing that it hit someone else that I thought was in a good marriage just makes that fear seem possible.

I'm just venting here today, ya'll. We'll make it...I just didn't see this trigger coming after as long as it's been for us now.

I understand the trigger because the situation I referred to in my post really got me upset as well. And more so, because it's on a Christian forum where others have seemed to have backed up her reasoning for divorcing her husband. It made me ill.....

I guess for you, because you are friends with alot of these people, it's hard to hear. Do you think it might be good to take a break from the gaming so you are not reminded time and time again? Just wondering..

Honestly, this really hadn't been a problem for quite a while. The OM had started logging back into the game back in Spring, but there were never any contact attempts, and my wife made it very clear to me then that she did NOT want to have any contact with him. We ended up playing on servers other than our normal one for a while, and I know that OM hasn't been in game for several months now.

This is the first time in ages that this has really reared its head.

We might do that break from gaming for a while...I'll have to see how things work out. Thanks for lending an ear friend.

Quote from Owl:

Owl - I wanted to bring this over to this thread. This concerns me that you feel that contact has resumed or something else has come up. Why do you feel this way? I thought you had a keylogger on your computer too so that you can verify if there was any contact. You also felt certain that your W does not want contact with the OM by what you wrote in your previous post?

Just concerned by what you wrote especially since you have been saying how well things have been.

2BN-

Well, I really am not sure what's going on. But it's a bunch of small things that are adding up that really are starting to worry me.

She's been a lot more distant lately...almost like a light switch after we had a GREAT weekend together weekend before last. She's been keeping to herself a lot more, angry with me and the kids a lot again, not taking care of herself as much. She doesn't want to talk about what's bothering her "I'm dealing with things...I don't want to have to go over it again with you.". Basically a lot of the pre d-day behavior.

And it also just occurred to me that there are gaps in the keylogger's coverage that I can't explain...even conversations that her and I had during the day via IM that aren't showing up. It COULD be that she's figured out how to turn it on and off...she's watched me start and stop processes on the computer enough to have figured it out. I don't know for sure.

We've been doing great...the only stress we've really had to deal with is my work and our oldest kids. But it's just seemed like something has really gone haywire for the last two weeks, and I can't figure out what it is. I really have felt like she's not wanted to contact OM...but the only time I've seen her like this was during her EA.

I guess all I can ask at this point is for you all to hold us in your prayers.

Owl - Well I can understand why you are concerned. It does sound very much like things that are done during an EA...especially if she doesn't want to talk about it and is being distant. But, it could very well be something else. I know for myself, I go through different periods of emotions that are hard to deal with regarding the EA. I went through this last weekend when I was in a women's prayer group. I felt horrible about myself..(thinking about what I've done and felt like a horrible person).. and it took me about 3-4 days to get over these feelings.

And the keylogger? I would think about changing the password so she can't turn it on or off? Don't know if you can do that as I'm not familiar with keyloggers.

But, you really NEED to talk to her! I would sit down and talk about your concerns. Don't let her get away with her words of... "I'm dealing with things...I don't want to have to go over it again with you.". Tell her gently that you really have concerns with how she is doing and that you want to talk about it with her and want to be there for her. Above all, don't accuse (if you don't have the facts)! I know that would make me shrink back if I were accused of another EA!

I will be praying for you and your wife.

I've tried exactly that, 2BN. EXACLTY that. Told her that I love her, I'm worried about her, and I want to help work through whatever problems there are. NO accusations of any kind whatsoever.

And that was when I got the response from her that I'd mentioned above. Bluntly, I was shocked...and that was the end of our conversation. I hadn't heard a response like that since she was still foggy from her EA.

I KNOW that a lot of the stress is our kids...and I've been doing everything I can to help deal with that, and to make sure that her and I are working TOGETHER to deal with those issues. But I don't know...I could be making a bigger issue of this than it is. All I can do is to keep doing my best to deal with things, and to let her know that I'm here for her.

Hi everyone...It sounds like for the most part everyone is doing very well. Owl, hopefully your W is just going through a time of needing to have her own thoughts. Don't jump to conclusions. I know that my EA began an amazing journey of soul-searching for me. Maybe for her, too, and she is still in that process.

2B I haven't caught up on your posts on the recovery side. I logged into the usual page here and saw that there was a post so this is as far as I've gotten. I hope all is well for you - sounds like you are going back to counselling. I have been seriously giving that some thought at least for me individually, but have so far not acted on it. Life has been very stressful as of late - time is always an issue....

I do not have much new to report on my situation. Things are status quo, both of us are dealing with our own issues. My H had a rough summer which has tended to make me withdraw. In the past (before my EA) I spent a lot of energy supporting him and working with him. For some reason that energy has been zapped. I think it's because I've had my own issues that I've been working on. I have always been the "even-keel" one, and been able to be there for him and his problems. The very odd thing is, is that it doesn't seem to bother him that I'm not as attentive. Maybe he, too, just wants "alone" time to work through things. As in Owl's situation, too, what do you think? Do you think it's imperative that we always share what is going on in our thinking? Couldn't it be that sometimes we need to work things out as individuals?

Owl - Well, it sounds like you are being supportive and doing the right things. But, I don't understand why she gave you the response she gave you. Has she done this in the past unrelated to having the EA? Just wondering if this is her way of dealing with things. And I would be concerned about the keylogger as well if you noticed things "missing". Have you asked her about the keylogger?