How are you doing with the house stuff? I may not get around to E-Mailing. I'm so paranoid about disclosing my identity for several reasons including my job security. It's the PTSD!

I still "luv ya"!

Mimi, I can´t put my emails and Dr. Harleys here. If you really want to read them you can create a yahoo or hotmail account, I´ll send them to you there. My name and other data are on those mails and I´m afraid that if I start editing all identifying features you´ll end up doubting the mails.

Today has been a crazy day at work, the at lunch hour I went to pick my neice up from the airport and the car alarm broke!. Now I left it at the mechanics again. Tomorrow I have to go on a field trip and next week I get to go on my first official trip to Guatemala!

Anyway I got a peek at my new laptop, but I{m longing to check out the books. I´ll be leaving work in a while and going to my mothers. I´ll be home later tonight.

Having started doing anything about the house yet. Tomorrow is WH´s birthday.

Hi cc:

Point of interest...#1S / DIL went on a church mission trip to Guatemala together when they were still in H.S. My former church has adopted a group in Guatemala and sends medical teams there about 2X a year. Some of the worst poverty I have ever seen in that part of the country.

Georgia

CC:

You may be asleep by now. However, I wanted to let you know that I was able to E-Mail you. I'm so proud of myself!!!

Mimi, I'm here setting up my new laptop. I have to go downstairs to check mail and send you the letters. Give me a few minutes

haven't got any e mails from you. i get up early tomorrow and have time to e mail you then . If not it will be in the evening as I have a lot to do at work

I must have copied your E-Mail incorrectly because the delivery failed. E-Mail me at [email]MimiMarriagebuilders@hotmail.com.[/email] Looking forward to hearing from you.

the address doesn't work. I'll give you my e mail again:
[/Email]

Ok you should have gotten them.
the laptop isn´t working right.

I got your letters to and from Harley. I will respond to you on the forum ASAP.

ok. Thank you. I´m going to sleep now but <I´ll check tomorrow before leaving

I printed out the E-Mails. I will be reading and thinking. I guess you won't get chance to read my response until Wed. evening.

Have a great day!

Checking this morning, but I won't get much of a chance today until the evening. Thank you for doing this.

CC:

I have come to the understanding that Dr. Harley and Steve Harley, who counseled me, believe in strict adherence to the MB SYSTEM and their beliefs. Notice how Dr. Harley warned you about DOBSON. He said:


That's a strong statement right.

The same warnings were used in my coaching with Steve when I brought up other points of view.

I'm saying this because I think Dr. Harley's comment to you that "unfortunately, your relationship may be beyond saving" was his reaction to YOUR VIEWPOINT in your May 8 E-Mail to him. You conveyed strong disagreement to many of his basic concepts. This will be clear to you after reading this article.
http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi8110_cod.html

He strongly believes in interdependence. In your E-mail, you stressed YOUR strong belief in independence and how much you value your independence. You said I a lot and did not speak of wanting to become a COUPLE with your H.

Also you did what I used to do prior to PLAN A. People here on the forum jumped on me about this. You repeatedly called your Ds. MY Ds.

I think Dr. Harley wondered about your questioning of this mindset. I think your E-Mail was in your "LEMON-MAN" mode.

Read the CODEPENDENCY article, think about this and let me know what you think.

Somehow I once thought that there was value in being an INDEPENDENT WOMAN whatever that means. It took my H leaving for me to learn that I am a much better WOMAN with him than without him. Giving priority to showing CARE AND CONCERN for him results in him doing the same for me and both of us are better parents and people. I think Dr. Harley wants YOU to try out this way of relating in any future relationship that YOU will have with your H or whomever.....

Thank you for reading the exchanges of e mails. I don't really understand the co dependant thing. I had already read it when I read everything on the website. But I am a people pleaser, I hate people getting angry with me, I gave up my career to be a wife and a mother. WH was the one who actually pushed me to study again when I had basically "quit" after dds were born but although he wanted me to study and work he never did much to help. I was still in charge of the house and the kids by myself. So when they were a little older I finally decided to be a little more independant and I took a couple of trips and things.

Even so I'm not independant and have never acted as though I were.

So I don't really understand...

You say I haven't followed MB principles. I would like more details about that because I don't really understand.

And since I found out about the A I have followed MB plans and very strictly. Made easy by WH's willingness to not seek me out, fortunately. After the experience on saturday I realize I can not yet have any kind of contact with him.

I don't see it at all clearly. I feel better now, I've been very busy today which is very god because it is WH's birthday and he chose to spend it with OW. He took dds out to dinner last night and said that he was going to be busy with work tonight and not doing anything. Anyway I have managed not to e mail him or say happy birthday in any way.
But I think maybe it's the fact that HE is so detached that may make Dr. Harley say that there is little hope.

I bought Dobson's book because it has been mentioned here probably. I just noted the books that were most mentioned and asked for them. It took me all these months to get them. I will be reading them in the next few weeks. But I have decided to adhere to MB plans for a year at least. If I'm in the mood I was in a few days ago (before saturday) I may be able to go on for two years.

But just as I said in my last e mail to Dr. Harley: I don't want to be married or right, I just want to be happy. If it can be married and happy I would prefer it, but I don't want to be married just to be married. I was willing to do whatever it took, except "share". Last year I was underemployed and WH wanted me to work more, to travel more, probably because he was already in the A or thinking of it.

Too tired today.
I haven't even read any threads today...

And I know you're busy having a great dinner with your H and son. I wish you all the best. I'm sure it will be a great dinner!

Qucik T/J being that I was "called out" here and I missed this. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> I guess I should feel honored that I have a "mode" named after me. Kewl.

Also, Mimi, I agree with you 1000%, it is an extremely healthy way to NOT acknowledge or consider any other points of view other than Steve Harley's view or way of doing things. That is some very good advice and "warning" you are giving to CC. Nice work. I look forward to your words of wisdom daily.

LM

LM, I have actually read a lot of stuff and consider Dr. Harley's approach to infidelity the most logical and comprehensive. I read everything on this website before I ever found the forums. I've also read SAA and HNHN before I went into plan B. But I'm still going to read other things which might help me understand what I can't explain. I have read on other websites...

Maybe I chose MB because it does agree with me. It felt intuitively right to me. I went ahead and exposed, and plan Ad for 2 months and I've been in plan B for more than 4 months now. So far the results haven't been good, but after all Dr. Harley does say that there is nothing I can do until the A is over and that takes "usually" 6 months.
I'm expecting WH to take a little longer because he doesn't make decisions: that way he is never responsable for what happens.

This time, although many are urging me to ask for a D I'm not going to help him by doing that. I will wait. I've nothing to lose and maybe I will gain. It sounds cold and calculating but even my MIL with whom I don't have much of a relationship told me that I have to have a cool head... just this sunday.

I have my cool head back on again, at least for now.

CC:

I am rooting for you to get what you want. You do NOT need to spend time convincing me why MB is so good or trying to convince me that this "is right for you". The "proof is in the pudding" here. This is your life, and you are responsible for what happens to you. If you feel that staying on the present course is what you need to do, then by all means keep going. You do NOT ever have to justify anyone for doing that.

My point is that it can potentially be harmful to be so obsessed with only ONE way of doing things. I am in an analytical and scientific profession, thus whenever I hear one doctor say about another "Anything you hear from Dr so and so that does not agree with me, DON'T BELIEVE IT", I kind of go hmmmmmmmmm, interesting... Hey, but that is just me. I have always been the "odd ball out" around here, so who knows?

It is not by any coincidence that "certain" people are very very intimidated that I opine any different points of view on how to heal. The funny thing is that I have the reputation of being Mr ANTI-Marriage Builder Steve Harley around here, and if you really look at what I say here, that is probably not a true representation of what I am, or who I am. BUt oh well, I still like it here <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />.

Enough of that stuff. This is your thread, and I apologize for participating in a thread jack. You can go back to your counseling with Mimi, and I will try very hard to NOT say anything more on this stuff.

Cheers,

LM <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Lemonman:

I was posting to CC. You intruded on a conversation between me and her. You went beyond a boundary given that you didn't even read her E-Mails.

I do not care to ever communicate with you ever again.

It is NOT OK for you to be sarcastic with me.

I plan to NEVER communicate with you again.

CC:

I realized that I wasn't clear enough with you. The reason why I wanted to read the E-Mails was to understand how come Dr. Harley said that there may be no hope for your marriage.

My answer to that is how I think HE must have interpreted your E-Mail. What I left out my communication to you is this: I don't think that particular E-Mail reflected how you have lived your life with your H and how you really feel. However, if you read back over it you may see what I mean. You talked about how you value your present independence, you are not sure if you want to me married. You referred to your Ds as MY Ds. I think that Dr. Harley took this literally without having the information about you that I have come to know. Do you see what I mean?

I don't think the fact that your H is DETACHED is why Dr. Harley said that "there is little hope". He probably would have only based his thoughts on what how he was interpreting you since he has not had the opportunity to actually speak with your H.

I also wasn't clear about why I mentioned the Dobson book. I was using that as an example of how the Harleys feel about their approach. I actually used the Dobson approach with my FWH, quoting him directly so I agree with a lot that he has to say myself. Let's talk about that later.

This is actually the quote that probably was of concern to Dr. Harley:



He probably wanted to hear you say something different than this in order to have more "hope" for your marriage. He may feel that YOU are losing your love for your H.

Am I being clearer?

My H and S are talking as I post giving me more time this evening.

Sorry I ranted on your thread. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />