Mine is a convoluted story, but the long and the short of it is that I am the WW (first) and the BS (a few months later). Once I got out of the fog and realized what I wanted was for my marriage to work, I have been committed to doing so. I had not revealed the full extent of my A to BS/WH as I was terrified I would lose him and I did not want to hurt him anymore than I already had <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" /> I wanted to do it with a MC we both trusted. But, we have had two attempts at MC, both did not work out. Part-way through the 1st MC, I finally got the truth about WH's A. I have known for sometime that I needed to tell him the whole truth about mine, but the failed MC and then the discovery of his A (he had also denied his was an A before), set everything back. I wanted to do it in the best way I could and I felt involving a MC was the kindest way to go. I was devastated when I got the truth about his A. I discovered the proof myself and had noone to intermediate and "let me down easy"---I wish I had. That day, he told me he had broken up with her at lunch, but by that night, I caught them communcating again (while I was at MC) <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />
The bottom line is I love my H and I want our marriage to work. I want to trust him and to be trusted again. I know we have a lot of work to do and I am actually eager to do it. I think my H is a wonderful man and I would not fight for this if I did not think it was worth saving. We have hurt each other so badly. I am so broken-hearted when I see what I have done to him. I will truly never forgive myself.
I want to help him through this pain of the truth about the PA, but I don't want to make it worse by crowding him. I know how much he is hurting because I was there and still am in so many ways. I read BobPure's story the other day and was sobbing uncontrollably. I don't think I had the the chance to really feel the devastation of what he had done. I was in "save the marriage" mode. I want to be there for him, but I also need someone to be here for me. Sometimes, I feel so alone.

Any advice on what I can do for him? Anyone else been in the same boat? Please no 2x4's, my anger toward myself/shame/guilt is more than anyone else could ever come close to matching.

Well, this comment is not a very good start. Allow me to help you back yourself out of this self-made trap.

If this were true, and you never forgive yourself for your past, how could you ever be happy in the future? And who would ever want to recover with someone who could never be happy in the future? Would you want to be married to you if you never forgave yourself? Think about this.

So, stop saying this to yourself, because it is a self-defeating script that makes you weaker, not stronger. And if you are going to fight for your marriage, you need to become as strong as you possibly can.

You can and will be able to forgive yourself in the future. How? By starting today to become the woman you can admire ... earn your self-respect back ... and learn to forgive yourself in daily small steps. Small steps and positive actions.

Because without the right attitude, you have lost before you have begun.

OK !!!!

Chin up. Develop a plan. Read some books. Have faith in yourself to make it through all the hard stuff. There is pain enough awaiting you in this life, try not to manufacture extra pain for yourself. It's not attractive, it does not forward your goal, and it will not create a woman who is ready for marriage recovery. Start this journey with a heaping tablespoon full of self love mixed with courage and faith.

God bless ~~~~~

Pep <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

Improving
I know very well where you are coming from and the feeling of being unable to forgive your self.
- see here Remorse and Regret
I have big swings even with AD's where I feel so sad and then hopeful ... no real happiness yet.. maybe one day soon ..I got some good advice AGAIN - because I needed it - recently from many who were BS here too. Their compassion through their own anger and hurt always amazes me.

I have faith it will get better, I hope and I WORK at it every day. There is no magic wand or gentle words to repair the hurt I caused, only persistence through my H anger, hurt and pain.
MC/IC is and can be confronting ….. Yes its hard to get a good MC and a good IC ,, but I feel its important for me .. Though my H rarely goes often - its more for me when he attends - don’t settle for poor MC even if you need to ring the Harleys here and get some of the best available. Yes it does cost money, but as I was told over and over and have heard so many times here - a divorce costs so much more.

Read the books recommended here on this site, learn the methods to win your H back, meeting emotional needs, understanding them, learn what love busters are and don’t do them - mostly they are ‘YOU’ statements we make to our spouses when angry or hurt.
You can express your own hurt by his actions by saying things like ‘I feel hurt when you …etc’ it expresses your pain without being critical of his actions. Its subtle but it works over time.

Improving you can do this and here you will not be alone. Listen to Pep and to the other experienced people here they have been through so much and understand so much. They will push you, challenge you, confront you at times, but always be ready to help.

Thank you so much for replying. You both gave me some good tips and things to consider. When I am less upset, I will be re-reading your posts. Things went from bad to worse last night as he went off on me and I did not hold back either, as I am still very hurt at what he did. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" /> We both apologized, but I was so hurt I was in tears half the night. I am trying to make things better not worse. <<<SIGH>>> But, I also have my own hurt feelings that were never addressed. I am trying to be there for him, but I am battling my own demons too.
Last week, I actually had hope and thought things were improving, now I wonder if I should have just kept this secret, but I felt we could not really move forward if I did not give him the truth. I feel I did the right thing in my heart. I just hate to see him hurting so much because of me.

Sometimes, a way to make things better is to shutup and just listen while your spouse is going off on a rant .... and just *be there* without comment.

Have you ever tried that?

Not making his emotional outburst about you and what you've done, but about him and what he feels and keeping your focus there.

If YOU were experiencing an emotional erruption and venting to your husband all your hurt and pain ... would you like it if he simply listened and offered to hold you in his arms after?

I know I would.

This is a learned technique. Keep the focus on allowing the other person to express pain, and not rubbing that pain directly into your own being ... and then ranting back about your own pain or trying to talk your husband out of his feelings.

Here's a useful thing to say when you are trying to remain calm when the one you love is losing his mind with pain:

"I can see how hurt you are." ... comment on his hurt not on his anger ... "I am sorry to have been the one to hurt you."

Are you aware that it is very common for men to disguise their deepest hurt with anger? Anger is a much safer emotion for them to feel ... because hurt makes one so vulnerable and feels so out of control.

Bring him back to his hurt no matter how angry he gets .... because that is the real issue.

He may be unable to say "For God's sake just hold and comfort me. I am in such pain I can't stand it !!!

You may have to read between the lines and just hold and comfort him ... unless he cannot stand that closeness ... which sometimes happends, so you must be sensitive to that.

And ... when you are hurt and/or angry .... ask him:

"I need you. Will you help me right now? I need you to just hold me in your arms. I need your arms around me.

So ... give this a try.

God bless ~~~~~

Pep

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

Improving,

The longer you wait to reveal to your H the extent of your A the worse it will be for the two of you. There are many spouses that only learn about their spouses affairs YEARS after they ended them but for them, the BS, it is like the first day after they ended. What is worse is that a tremendous resentment and bitterness arises when they realize that years have been literally stolen from them. It makes the survival of the marriage a lot more difficult than if the WS had come clean right after they ended their affairs.

Your fear is totally understandable but just like he had no right to hide the extent of his affair from you, you don't have the right to do the same. You don't have to give him all the gory details of your encounters with the OM [unless of course he explicitly requests that you do so] but for his sake and yours, the sooner you come clean as to the extent of your affair, the sooner the healing can begin for BOTH. Only then can you two start anew without any skeletons in the closet or live in constant fear that one day your terrible secret will be revealed to your H.

TMCM

Very very good points. I took your advice to heart and I have been going out of my way to show him understanding the last few days without bringing up my own simialr pain. It's hard to watch how upset he is as I feel terrible about what I have done and it stirs emotions in me about what he has done. But, I am trying to remain strong for both of us and let him know I am here when/if he needs me. I also wrote him a note after the big fight apologizing for LBing and letting him know how sorry I am for the pain I have caused. Man, this is hard. I know it will be worth it in the end, but it sure hurts. He did go out of his way to make my Mother's Day spectacular and it made me feel so special and cared for, something I have not felt in a long time. And, for him to do it when he is hurting so much is testament to what a loving and giving man he is. I thought that man was gone--so it was really nice to see him again!

Know what a wounded man likes just about more than anything?

He likes to feel that ~he~ is needed by ~his~ woman... really necessary for her happiness. Can you whip up some enthusiasm for him when he does something even remotely generous and loving toward you ... I highly suggest this. Can you flirt outrageously with your husband every day this week and make it real??? Try it.

Pep<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

Improving,

You have been getting some very good advice from some "veterans" here. I would like to encourage you to do something that will be very hard for you. It is along the lines Pep mentioned. When you "feel" down, stop and examine it. Why are you down? I mean really why, not just a feelings, but is it your conscience, your pride, your feelings of abandonment because of his A, whatever it is, identify it.

Here is why? If you can identify the exact thing that is "hurting" you, you can then ask for what you NEED from your H. If you feel abandoned, that what might help is a hug, or a good Mother's Day. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> If you feel guilt, remorse, something of that sort, express it to him.

He will respond better if he KNOWS what he is dealing with. You will heal faster as you can identify what is bothering you specficially. It could be a trigger, or something he has said. But, move toward the concrete in your talks with him. Further as Pep and others have said, if he is going off, it is very likely something within himself.

His pain may well be self-induced. You may find this surprising that even if he had NOT had an affair, all that bothers him is NOT about you. It could be he is dealing with HIS sense of failure. His inability to keep you happy. His self-esteem. So don't make the mistake of assuming his anger is about YOU. It very likely is about him.

Pep pointed this out, but you need to realize that anger is a secondary emotion driven by: pain, fear, etc.

I am not sure if your H knows all of the story. From you posts you sort of indicate that you have told him all, and in others it seems you have not. Please let us know if he knows ALL of the story now. It will help us respond, and if you have not, plan on hearing about the concept of "radical honesty". Save yourself some grief from us by reading the articles here on "radical honesty".

Hang in there, you can do this.

God Bless,

JL

Yes, he knows it all. (he's lurking, more later.)

JL- This makes a lot of sense. I need to understand better what it is I need, so then I can respectfully request it. I have started to learn more about myself, what makes me tick, what I need, what I deserve, and what I will need to change to be happier and healthier. After I read your post, I asked him for a hug. It felt nice to ask and to receive. Thank you <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />