Gramm, she is emotionally detached so any talk of love only pushes her away. She feels patronized and obligated to respond in kind when you do that. It might be better to drop all that talk and let her come to you. She knows how you feel already.

Gramn - the vets keep telling us about the "rollercoaster", that "the hard part is just beginning" with recovery.

Your sitch is STILL going by the book. Praise God!!!!

I will shoot up a prayer for you.

far

OK, so I don't talk about love, or moving home, but I DO help her out when she needs me and try to be there for her?

Sounds like we'll end up being "friends" in no time...

Gramm, just back off for now because you can see the result. Instead, let her come to you as she withdraws from the OM. I suspect you are probably ripe for Plan B. That will show her what its like to be really single.

Show your love for her by the actions you are currently doing, but keep the "I love you's" to yourself for now.

You actions are sending her the message, but they do not pressure her or force her to see her own guilt. Your words, however, can seem to "throw the affair in her face".... my WW was the same way, so I shut up, but continue with the support and caring ways. Those things "speak" much louder than you imagine.

She's still speaking Fogese. She's still longing for the fantasy. Do things that make her think of you, not things that remind her that she's lost her "soulmate".

It will start to get better when she's on the back side of withdrawal... stay patient.

Best wishes,
SD

I wish I could believe that stuff right now.

Today I'm trying to pay my bills, hoping to squeeze out enough money to afford my mortgage and other bills, now that I have the added expense of child support and day care to pay for. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

How many times have you said that on here, Gramn? That you wish you could believe exposure will work? That you wish you could believe that your wife would talk civily to you again?

Look back at how far you have come. The Lord is in control and has brought you this far. Trust Him, continue to do the right thing...and this will all work out right.

In His arms.

Gramm.... your glass is half FULL right now.... not half empty.

I know it's difficult, but your frame of mind is the driving force behind recovery. Focus on a more upbeat and positive attitude, and allow your daily demeanor to show that upbeat and positive inner-self.

Your lack of faith can be percieved by your W. It can be viewed as helpless and needy, not what she's looking for in a "man".

Don't let the daily roller-coaster impact your demeanor as seen by "others". Let the world, mostly your WW, see a man full of self-confidence and positive vision.

If you can't make that decision internally, "fake it till you make it". It will have positive results!

You are doing just fine! Keep up the good work, just with a little "brighter" appearance, at least on the "outside".

Best wishes,
SD

That does make a lot of sense. It's not always easy to pull off, but I'm giving it my best shot.

I'm VERY angry at WW right now...

I forgot my cell phone at home this morning. She offered to bring it to me at work. "I said, sure, go ahead"... Well, she checked my voicemail!

The point of this? She is always saying how she wants to trust me and for me to respect her privacy and all that. So the first chance she gets, she listens to my messages? What a hypocrit!

And, in addition, she can now see that I had NOTHING to hide! There was nothing "incriminating" on my phone. I had not even called OMW, as I promised WW I wouldnt. Well, that promise is OFF!

I'll have to see what she says later when I ask to play with her phone?!

Gramn:

You should be delighted she snooped and didn't find any dirt. You shouldn't even care if she were 2 come here.

In re2rn, she should be willing 2 open up 2 you in like manner, though.

-ol' 2long

I'm not sure why you're angry...if there was nothing to hide on the phone, then no reason to be upset.

And at the same time, it's a chance to demonstrate to HER the reasonableness of YOUR requests to see HER phone. But if you're all angry and defensive about her possibly invading your privacy, that negates the value of that lesson, doesn't it?

This isn't something to be mad about. It's a chance to show her WHY you want what you want from her.

Good point! I can calmly ask to see her phone. If she refuses, then I can say, I was open with my phone, why are you being secretive unless you have something to hide??

EXACTLY!!!

But if you're angry or belligerent about her looking at your phone, it won't have any value at all.

Odds are she'll try to turn this all around back on you anyway...standard WS behavior being what it is.

No, that's a trap. WW will not understand the concept of fairness. I think you do not mention it; but, if brought up you calmly say you have no problem with her accessing your phone at any time. Say, "That's the way it should be. Is there anything else she would like to know?" Or try asking what she thought about doing it or how did it make her feel? Try to use it as a conversation builder. Even if she offers her phone I think you avoid taking the opportunity to snoop. Snooping in someone's face is so unattractive and desparate appearing.

Maybe you could drop off the Harley books and indicate that since she appears interested in what your up to maybe she'd like to read the books wherein the principles you've been living by are found. Indicate your just going to leave them there in case she gets bored someday and feels like reading them.

ACT

I've already given her those books to read! I don't know if she has actually READ them yet, but she's got them...

The glass is HALF-FULL, remember?

"Hi hon, I see you took a look at my cell phone. I am glad you took the initiative to see that I am trustworthy. It is a great step in the employment of Absolute Honesty and Openness in our marriage. I have learned that AH&O is vital to building a marriage that is successful and happy".

Lemons to lemonade. You must train yourself to find the positive in EVERY situation, and bring it up in a positive manner. That's what my previous post was about. Better, more positive attitude, and training yourself to react in a positive, NOT NEGATIVE, manner.

Be a part of the solution, not part of the problem, Gramm. It is you who sets the tone of your moving towards recovery.

Best wishes,
SD

I think I handled this situation well.

WW actually brought it up!
She said "Why did you call OMW on the 29th?"
I said "I didn't, but apparently you've been snooping in my phone. Feel free to look in there. I have nothing to hide."
She took my phone and showed me a "suspicios" number. I showed her OMW's number from a scrap of paper in my wallet. They were not the same.

SO I ended this by saying, "YOU can trust me. I want to be able to trust you too."
....................
Later in the evening we talked on the phone and she admitted "I can't blame you for not trusting me..."

Baby steps...

Well done...

Stay on task...

Try to minimize the number of times you talk about the A or your marriage in a weeks time. Normalize your relationship, and reconnect, as friends, like you were before you dated. Let this develope like a roll of Kodak film. Stable controlled environment for just the right amount of time. Rushing can ruin the final outcome!

Let it run it's course.

Best wishes,
SD

Quote from Gram's WW:

Sounds to me like she is coming around and beginning to accept her actions as being wrong. So many WS's justify their affairs and never feel or show remorse. Some have a very rightiousness to their actions and blame the BS for everything they do themselves. Dr. Harley has even pointed out in one of his books that even after a great night of romance and sex, the WS lays in bed and thinks about the damage they know they did to their BS and kids. The problem they have is they cannot escape their own mind and conscious.

And in your case Gramm, your WW has lost her lover back to his family and she needs to figure out how to undo the mess and save face for her own stupid actions.

Keep up your good work for it is working slowly.

toosoon