Carnation..

It is really not possible for me to check the NC thing..and I wonder if I would anyhow.

Maybe I don't want to know ? Maybe I have stopped caring?

I don't have a chain on him..if he wants someone else - well, you know the story.

Your's won't talk, either, eh?

Eibrab

Paradise..

I wish I was taking a very long walk, too !

Somewhere by a beach with sunshine.

Eibrab

Eibrab - A thousand hugs to you.

Mine not only will not talk about it... he won't even admit it - and, he is my main source of information. He likes to drink his beer, and when after doing so... the truth comes out in little (or huge) things he says when his guard is down.

Not too long ago, I mentioned in an off-handed way something about his *old* girlfriend -- and he snapped back at me -- whoever is filling your head with all this crap, you and that person will probably go to ****** for all of this -- I said back -- well ~ that would be you !!!

You know honey,,, after having lived this for soooo long... I have come to realize (for me) that I would much rather be the BS than the WS... I think the life they have chose is pretty sad and dark for them... hurting others (and yourself) takes its affect on you sooner or later...


Much blessings - car

Duk - the way I see it.. she was just running from her troubles, troubles she herself helped to make. She took -what seemed like at the time - the easy way out.

She has given you lemons - now just add some vodka to that lemonaide that you made !!!

I agree with Eibrab ~ you are a man among men. we love you

car

Thanks Carnation!

You would think that you and Eibrab's H's would have at least some compassion somewhere in their lives but you sure don't see it do you? I don't know how either of you do it. Just goes to show how good people honor committments and can be forgiving to the WS's in their lives.

Me, I just could not stand it and lost that early and have regretted giving up so quickly for quite some time. Maybe the last two years have finally proved my first instinct correct, but it sure leaves room to second guess yourself regularly.

I would have to admit that I am much like both of your H's in that I do react quickly and aggressively to someone pointing out and reminding me of my mistakes and transgressions. I have learned over time that I have certain "hot buttons" like anyone has. The problem with an A is that a man has to learn to address what has become his biggest "hot button" and discuss it with his spouse so that they both can heal. When I try to imagine myself being in this position I know I would be doing many of the same things as your H's if not for the IC I have been seeing and the reading and listening I have done here on this board. We men are most times too stubborn and proud to admit we need to learn about emotional issues with our spouses. It's a case of "well if she wants to be with me she has to learn to deal with it on her own". Stupid and selfish I know, but I was there once a long time ago.

Women have so much more compassion and grace than men that you can overcome this just by trying to be the person you have always been with your H's. He needs to see that you can still take him in your arms and look into his eyes with the same look that he saw when you first knew you were meant to be together. Hold these two idiots like you mean it and show them that they don't want to lose the best thing they ever had- YOU!!

Hey Duk..

This can seemingly be done while not speaking, correct?

I didn't see a script <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

You are the best...and I don't really want to do this right now.. I'd need a beer, and I don't even drink.

Eibrab

Beer??? Did someone mention beer? I just finished 9 hours of manual labor destroying several hundred boxes of accounting records. I am going directly to my 30th high school reunion planning meeting. It is in a bar and yes I am going to drink several beers. Have a nice weekend everyone.

Eibrab- What I am suggesting is better done in complete silence, your eyes should do all the talking.

Duk..

I have wanted to type out a long explaination for my feelings for the past two days, but whenever I get on here I realize that I possibly don't have any.

Isn't that sad?

I have fought so long and so hard for my family.. I just don't know how to fight anymore.. it never seems to get better in moments of strife.

H actually told me in front of my son during this last go around, that I should remember that he is "powerful, important and that he could have another woman here tomorrow."..

Honest.

Yes, when things are good..they are much better than before the A... when things are bad, they are ten-fold worse. My only trigger anymore is the fact that MOW has shown up everywhere.. She has managed to become an officer on the community little league along with my H. They attend the same meetings!

I sit here in bafflement as to how her H handles this.

Now my H will say that they have nothing to do with each other.. that's a line of bs - and I don't mean betrayed spouse.. and that "I am the only one with a problem."

Hence, I have given up... I stop trying to worry or care. I sadly don't like him much anymore and that makes me feel like a failure.

This thread is entitled "how do I make the pain go away?'... I'm not sure we ever can.

I am not all that sad as I type this..I am almost in a phase of wonderment... like I just don't know where my life may take me next.

I just know I can't stand this mean man anymore.

Eibrab

Paradise & Carnation!

And Dukhunter, if you care to giggle with me a bit.

Today I attended the first of three classes to be certified to be a hotstove baseball umpire. I was the only woman there and the gentleman running the deal called me a YOUNG lady...

I just HAD to put that down in print...

Maybe it was the lipstick <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Eibrab

PS I am quite sure H won't be happy with this, either.. lol

Hi Eibrab,

Life does take us in funny directions doesn't it? You are becoming an umpire, something I did all thru my teens to earn my fun money and pay for gas. I have embarked on a spring cleaning re-decorating binge. Maybe I have spent too much time talking to you girls! My son thinks I'm gay now. He couldn't believe I put a dust ruffle on a new bed I put in the spare bedroom. He really didn't care too much for the pattern on the comforter either.

I can understand and empathize with you on your H. After all you have been thru and all you have endured to be talked down to and disrespected is disheartening to say the least. Hold your head up and never accept that he could ever replace you. He knows how special you are or he'd have already done just what he said. A woman like you just does not exist on every corner. Believe me, I have looked. And what is out there on every corner are women like your OW. Finding someone with a character and heart like yours, and who likes to hunt, fish is another story.

It's still early in your recovery so let things evolve and keep your patience. Everything I have read about recovery has said it's the BS that does most of the work and takes the brunt of the emotional toll. If I have ever spoken to anyone capable of this it is you and Paradise. Both of you have more strength and courage than anyone I have ever seen.

Duk..

I have two very close friends who are gay.. I adore them. H is scared of them.

Therefore, I may be able to offer a more objectable opinion on your decorating tastes than that of your son.. My dear friend, Bret, would have used a soft, pastel chiffon or the like for a dust ruffle.

Please assure me that you've used a manly plaid or solid?

Eibrab

PS I really needed your words tonight...

Strriiiiike three !!!!!

Good for you, young lady !!

Yes, everything Duk said I totally agree with. (as I almost always do)

What do you REALLY want to happen ?

The very wise Bob Pure on here often asks this of those in turmoil -

What would you do if you were not afraid


Thousand of hugs, honey.. is it ok to hug the umpire ??

Carnation..

I have to pass the test first..but I will take the hug.

I suppose what I REALLY want is for THIS man to respect and love, even like me. I don't get that impression very often.

My Mother always says it isn't me.. it's him.


I'm thinking on this, I really am.

Eibrab

Uh , if the pattern is more striped with some light colored flowers on a burgundy background does it mean I need to start worrying????

My son thinks so! I just want to have a house to come home to that looks organized and clean. I really don't feel the need to live like a 20 something kid again. Dirty dishes in the sink bug me to no end and so does dirt and whatnot under foot on the hardwood floor. Labs and hardwood are not a good combo.

Always listen to your mother, they seem to have a sense about this stuff that borders on uncanny. My mother has had my EX pegged from day one. EX had the huevo's to go and "apologize" to my mother while Dad was in the ICU with pneumonia. All Mom said to me was "she's in your past now and don't look back". I wish I could have heeded her words a whole lot sooner.

Be patient and just as caring and loving as you always have been.Above all else make sure you pay special attention to your children. Sometimes in all of this they get forgotten and pushed to the side when they need you the most. Let time heal all of you before you make any big decisions. The right path for you will become more and more clear if you just let things happen on their own.

We all care a great deal for our friend Eibrab! Hang in there, we'll be here when you need us.

Hi Dukhuntr,

Sorry it has taken me a while to respond. I have been pondering, why people behave in ways that are destructive to themselves and others. For several days it has been chugging away in the back of my mind.

It boils down I suspect to us all wanting to be happy and we think if we do this or have that or capture this person’s affection … it will make us happy. Yet lasting happiness is an outlook, a state of being that you create yourself. If you get it right, it does not relate to the things or attachments, such as parental approval or the excitement of a new romance that we may crave.

Most people just don’t get it. As a result, they twist and configure their thoughts, emotions and behaviors in all manner of convoluted confused rational to justify doing what they think may make them happy. Usually, only to find that it doesn’t, so they move on to the next object of longing or avoidance.

I am sorry you are missing your wife. I know it is hard. I have found myself several times during the winter …looking around the room at the cottage .. on a Saturday night ..filled with friends all joking laughing and having a good time, thinking; “He is missing this .. He should be here. Why would he want to miss this?”

Impossible to explain someone’s logic, when for the most part it is not logic but merely a mixture of wanting and hope for some magical external mechanism that will create a lasting sense of self worth and contentment or that will take away what ever it is that scares or worries them.

Perhaps the wisest response is to be happy that you had a satisfying marriage for as long as you did. For me, I think 25 years is a good run, perhaps expecting it to last a lifetime is simply not realistic.

Burgundy, sounds masculine to me... big grin...


Big Hugs…

Paradise.



Dear Eibrab,

I hate the mental picture I have of you curled up, shivering in that truck all night. Nor I do like to hear about hubby being rude to you.

I have said this before, but I truly believe the Harleys have infidelity and the appropriate responses to it pretty much nailed. The first rule is no contact. Your husband keeps putting himself in situations where there is going to be the possibility of contact.

As long as he does that, you and your family are not going to move on. He is constantly tearing open the wound. At some level, he knows this. He must.

Projecting the blame on you is just a defense mechanism, a way of avoiding responsibility and confusing the situation. He is being mean, because he is unhappy with himself. Sadly, you are the one bearing the brunt of his unhappiness.

Personally, I would sell up and move out of state. Frankly, Mayberry is just not big enough a place to be able to get away from this mess, particularly if she persists in her efforts to have contact with him. I know it is a drastic measure, but it has worked well for other couples.

Starting fresh… would be the best idea for everyone including the kids. It would allow you both to let go of the past and move on. You can let go of the hurt and he can let go of the guilt. Living as you are is just not fun. Life is meant to be fun..

Umpire.. cool.. I see a little blond ponytail swinging back and forth as you call someone out.. big smile.


Big Big Big Hug,

Paradise

Journal .


It is almost 3.00 a.m. here. We are eating peanut butter and jam toast. Blue gets his peanut butter on a spoon which he slowly and fastidiously licks clean. He is crying now in a most pitiful fashion because he would like more please.

It makes me smile.

When life is good, we always want more.

I tried to go to bed without success. Lately there are nights, I find I simple cannot settle down.

I think, I am getting to the point where I finally believe my marriage is over on every level. For a long time, deep down, I think part of me, thought the whole thing just a bad dream, I would wake and it would dissolve in the morning sunshine.

I have been reading Eibrab’s last several days of posts and sighing - sad. Eibrab used the word “wonderment” it has struck a nerve with me somehow. It is so apt, you just kind of look around and think whoa .. how did I get here. She sounds defeated and numb.

It worries me.

Time maybe for a holiday? A regrouping - a little Carribean jaunt with the kids? The big LUG gets to stay home!!!! He is not worth taking seriously right now !!!!!

Neither Carnation nor Dukhuntr sound that happy of late either. I wish I could just give everyone a real hug and look them in the eye and tell them it will be OK. It will be OK.

There are still moments where I miss Midnight, the feeling of being a happy family we had, or I thought we had. I miss having my eyes kissed awake and being handed a cup of coffee… every morning. Often, just as I wake up a brief moment of longing crosses my mind.

Yet more and more, I believe our lives are the constructs of our minds, our thoughts. They are of our own making. Hard to believe when someone has betrayed you, left you feeling raw and brutally used, but it is true. We create our reality.

The real trick is deciding, what you want reality to be and accepting that you are the one who makes it!

Nowadays, I am working with lists, trying to take baby steps to a new future. What I don’t have clear in my mind is what that future will look like.

This weekend, I am going to start a wish book; an album of pictures, ideas, things that will make up that life so I can visualize where I am going. It sounds corny I know but I think it will help. I am going to give Blue his own page.. I bet his pictures will all be of the beach ….

Hi PB-Duk-Carnation & Eibrab: Sorry to hear that everyone seems to be down in the dumps. I too have been depressed. I have had my good days and bad days. Seems that there are more bad days. Only because you keep flashing back to that question. "What happened". I'm counting down to when I go before the court for the my divorce ( May). Which each day it seems to be moving faster. I know that it's what I have to do if only for piece of mind. How much pain should you endure from your husband/wife before your eyes are opened. It hurts everyday just to think about it and know it's coming. I've been going to my therapist and doing alot of reading and trying to prepare myself emotionally for whats to come. You thought he/she was the one. Off to fantasy island you went only to find that you were the only one on the island. So I'm taking it one day at a time and focusing on my kids. I know that I tried and was always there for him and thought I was enough but it has to be both ways in the giving and receiving. PB I also have been having restless nights. Hope it's only temporary. Talk to everyone soon.

Paradise - I hope you can find the time to post here more often. Your writings - along with you - are priceless.

and, thanks for the hug - and the wisdom (again)

Thank you Heavenly Father for sending Your angel, Paradise to MB to help wounded souls.

Sincerely, carnation

Eibrab:

I've been listening to a series of talks given by Gil Fronsdal a rather well known zen master at:

http://audiodharma.org

They are free. I've downloaded them into my ipod and I listen while I run in the morning. One in particular .."Letting Go" I really quite liked.

You mentioned you liked the book Peace in Every Step.. I think you would enjoy many of these talks. They may help you deal with the very heavy load you are carrying...


Big Hugs.. You are in my prayers Hon

Paradise...

Morning PB, Eibrab and Carnation!

Just lost a long and soapy post for some unknown reason and I am glad I lost it now. Been doing a lot of soul searching the last few weeks because of the time of year(D-day).

The conclusion I have come to is that this boy needs to let the past stay in the past and enjoy what is happening for me now. Life is good! Fishing, golf, the yard. Everything is okay and if I just see it for what it is I would be a whole lot happier.

I do miss talking to all of you and hope to hear that Eibrab is doing well especially! Have a happy Easter! I will be out in the sticks of central Nevada fishing with a group of friends from work. Poker, cigars, drinks and fishing. What could be better????