had I walked away in the first year, our DD would not have been born, then ...

geez AD...I'm not saying good things don't come out of hanging in there...
You know I am very pro-marriage.....
but you have worked hard
and you have found your boundaries...
you have moved with honor and respect...and earned your way out..

Lots of people stay in not perfect situations...and as long as their eyes are wide open...
then blessings to them....
and some know or come to know they can not survive there...
and if you were to find yourself there..you'd have my support...
as long as you know what you are getting in for ..that's the whole key...

either choice is right...
and no one can say differently................

leaving the first year can be too knee jerky for anyones personal recovery..and God knows I'm the last one to think children need perfection..for there is none...they just need people to love them....

ps...your personal Ad...

I think you sound adorable...
and the biggest attraction there is out there...

BEING HONEST!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

ARK

In all the years of your marriage, HP has never once brought up my OM or my desires to have him dead, and dangled them over my head. Of course, he's got plenty of other stuff that he complains about regularly and incessantly, but he's never touched the "big stuff" EVER. So it can be done. Do YOU think you could do it? Not sure how you could convince her, but you can at least tell her it's been done before! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

I'm sure Neak and Neaksis were glad they were born, even into a den of spitting cobras. Their brothers are glad to be alive, too. I'M the one that feels guilty about it, for their sakes, not mine. For MY sake, I'm thrilled to have them, and cherish every moment we can spend together. Generally. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" />

Take care.

t&l

Nicely put, Dear Sir or Madam, as the case may be:

When I come to the end of The Sad Saga of OtherSusan the Stupid, I may seek permission to quote your wise analysis of people who choose to stay where things aren't inherently all that great. In my marriage, at this point in my life, my eyes are wide open, or at least as wide as someone can hold them when she's half-asleep all the time. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" /> Thank you for your blessings.

t&l

Hi T&L, ark^^, FF and silent friends,

Proper replies to your comments will follow shortly, but first...


Well, I looked at my other thread, was going to post my progress for the day, but decided to do it here. If somebody misses it over there, I'll give them a free ticket to this thread. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

So, I went out a whacked the bushes with a lopper a bit, then realized that the chainsaw was called for, and since it's electric and all the long extension cords are (were) at the other house, I had a shower and set out on errands.

I picked up a washing machine, good basic, solid old-fashioned (cheap), but new.

Stopped by the grocery and got myself some tasty food.

Hit the other house, got the mail, extension cords, grill <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> charcoal and whatnot.

Came home, unloaded. Now, it is a nice thing to know, and I doubted it before, but I can, all by myself, unload and install a washing machine - at least on the first floor. Upon investigation, the $50 used dryer I bought a few weeks ago was condemned, and I returned to the store for a dryer. Now, my laundry is spinning and I don't have to go to the laundrymat or ask my wife (for 29 more days) to do it.

I think that was a reasonble afternoon and evenings accomplishment.

I still have got to move the fridge from the other house. I've been making do with a little dorm-sized fridge for 3 months now. After that, this will be a pretty much fully equipped house.

I bought a big chunk of meat at the store, and tomorrow, I might see what I can do with the grill - maybe invite some strangers in from the highways and headges.

-AD

Ok, alright. I bare my soul and what do I get? Sarcasm! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" />

BTW, that's "piques", not "peaks", (I think).

-AD

Maybe I could have done it. It would be cool if I could.


Aaaawww. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/blush.gif" alt="" />

Wow! He's the MAN!

Seriously, I wonder now if I had just told her calmly, "OM must go", and then carried on with my life being the best H I could be.... Actually, I don't have to wonder, I think she would have been pleased with me. <sigh>

-AD

Hi AD,

Just wanted to add my support to you and your situation. I am not even going to attempt to come up with something profound given the eloquence of the heavy hitters that have graced your thread. Though I will steal something from one of your American Presidents, Roosevelt I believe, that has always captured a spirit which I attempt to emulate and seems appropriate for your labors:

"It is not the critic who counts: not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles or where the doer of deeds could have done better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood, who strives valiantly, who errs and comes up short again and again, because there is no effort without error or shortcoming, but who knows the great enthusiasms, the great devotions, who spends himself for a worthy cause; who, at the best, knows, in the end, the triumph of high achievement, and who, at the worst, if he fails, at least he fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who knew neither victory nor defeat."

I salute your efforts both past and present AD.

Thanks, Binder for the kind and supportive words.

I'm feeling OK right now.

Sleep will soon be attempted.

-AD

Not sleeping yet.

I just realized that when this is final - in about 29 days now, I'm likely to have a bit of a meltdown. I need to save vacation for my holiday visitation times with DD, but I'll probably need to use some time off for the meldown. But maybe I can just skip it. Seems a waste of time, LOL.

We filed for D - 7 years and one month after we became engaged, and it will be final before the 7th anniversary. I don't think it's a 7 year itch. It's more like taking off the itchy shirt after 7 years of scratching. Lots of metaphorical possibilities here.

-AD

I guess that would depend on the height of the peaks her interest could attain once it was piqued! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

t&l, the English teachers' daughter

A few days have passed and I don't see any indication that W is going to make any last ditch efforts. I'm not surprised.

She just got off the phone - calling me about a bump on DD's lip.

Sometimes she calls - and I get the clear impression that she's just talking to be talking. For example, yesterday afternoon she called to suggest that she bring or send an assortment of DD's clothes, so that DD doesn't have to carry everything back and forth when she comes to my place. I agreed, and thanked her. She went on and on about it. It was clear to me that she just wanted to talk - and quickly agreeing with her was not going to end the conversation. After a half-hour, she asked what I planned to do that evening, and I replied that as soon as I got off the phone I was going out to do yard work until it got dark. I think she took the hint.

Today, W came by here - because my office had no power and I was at home. She dropped DD off while she (W) went to the university. But she came an hour early to use my computer 'cause her internet was down. And said she was hungry, so I cooked her a quick bite. (I don't know why I did that.) She still has not arranged childcare - is thinking of taking DD to class with her for one class that meets twice a week in the afternoon - and has signed up for a night class too. So, I've got DD for a couple of hours tues and thurs nights now, and DD stays overnight on Wednesday. So, for the duration of the semester, I would be seeing DD thrice weekly (once overnight), plus half the weekends. If I'm a nice guy, maybe I should suggest switching nights so that I have DD overnight on Tuesday nights. Maybe. I don't think WW realized yet that I have DD on Labor day. It's in the schedule, but I'm sure she doesn't realize that I have a 4-day weekend with DD coming up. And, would I be a bad guy to actually go somewhere with DD - and actually be gone for 3 days? Oops, too much yardwork and stuff to do - not practical. <sigh>

Hellooooo!

I ran you all off, probably by describing myself a bit too, er, unflatteringly.

Well, I hope none of you was in N'awlin's, or Boluxi, or Gulfport...

-AD

AD, I just don't know what to say. Your W is out of her mind, and I feel sad for her. She halfway knows what she's giving up, but can't figure a way not to do it anyway.

GC

That's the way it seems to me. She has always had a hard time visualizing a situation that she is not yet in. She only knows the now, it seems.

She will get an envelope in the mail one day and it will hit her that she has divorced me (or technically, that I have divorced her).

I haven't kept my reports up to date here. Sunday afternoon she called, and said that she hadn't heard from me since Friday and wondered if she should call or wait for me to call. I replied, "Well, I had no reason to call. Why are you calling?". She replied "I'm sad." She had a lot more to say, but honestly, I forget what it was. I'm way past the point of making notes when she calls and then spending hours analysing (sp?) what she said.

-AD

What's the "toughest" you've gotten toward her in all this?

I remember Pepperband describing the crisis in her M not too long ago. The part that struck me was where she said her H tried to justify his A, but knew that if he did, she'd rip him a new one, and that he'd have it coming.

I don't mean to suggest your W would respond well to righteous indignation.

But AD, I don't know what your limits are. I don't mean to imply you don't have them. I just don't know what they are.

What will you not accept into your life?

GC

GC,

I'm not sure what you mean by "tough".


I have told her that I do not intend to spend my life alone - and that I would be overjoyed if I found it possible to even have more children. I think that shook her. I don't know if it is "tough".

I've told her that I don't intend to have anything to do with her nor to even think of her except as it relates to our child. I don't think she liked the sound of that.

"Tough" is divorcing her, like I said I would. I've told her that OM must go. On Feb 21, she promised NC "as long as we are married". By March 21, she had visited OM's appartment (for 1 to 2 hours each visit) a dozen times. She knew that I was finding this out, but she didn't know how (and still doesn't).

The factors that lead me to leave were that
- She broke her NC promise.
- She threw away her ring.
- She treated me very badly while we were on vacation back in May - in a particular situation that I don't want to get into here.
- She routinely insulted me, told me that she hated me and flew into rages.

Actually, the first one was enough.

She was not only going to OM's appartment when she was supposed to be in class (and flunking the class too - for which I paid), but also one night that I know of, leaving the house at midnight and going to OM's place for 2 hours - while DD and I were sleeping. I will not accept the condition of living with a wife who sneaks out to see her boyfriend at night while I'm sleeping. Of course, any contact with OM was unacceptable, but that was especially egregious (sp?).

Perhaps I could give her more righteous indignation, but, in defense of my emotional health, I've detached from her to the point that I really don't care what she does as long as it doesn't affect me. I'm too far down the slope to divorce.

Before we filed, she was saying "we might as well go ahead and file - we'll still have 30 days to change our minds". I told her "If we file, I'm not going to change my mind. If you want to change your mind, do it now." It may sound absolutely trivial in the face of the seriousness of all this for our child, but if she's going to let me pay the $250 filing fee - with the intent of coming up on the last day and saying "let's reconsider", well, I just don't want to play that stupid game.

Am I saying "I paid for a divorce and I'm going to get one!"? No, but I'm tired of the roller-coaster. Of course, while we're married, we're married - but there has to be some point recognized as the end - and for me, filing was (almost) it. (I'm still wearing my ring, and will until we are really D'ed).

Now there was a night, about 2 weeks ago, when she spent the night here. To be terribly blunt about it, she was previously using "Depo-provera", and I don't know if she is up-to-date on her shots. It is extremely unlikely, but if she turns up in the next 20-odd days with a positive pg test, I would put the D on hold until I know more about that.

I can't think of anything else, other than abject begging, that would turn this around in my mind.

=AD

Hm. By tough I meant being clear about what you'll let in your life. Sounds like you've done it. I didn't mean you should yell and scream or get nasty.

I guess something about your plan to fully detach from her, but not until the D is done, seems peculiar.

GC

GC,

Peculiar? As in, not the usual thing? Or what kind of peculiar?

I'm not exactly liking this path, but I don't know what else I can do. I can shut her out completely - did that for awhile, but now, it doesn't matter much. I'm not trying to "plan B" her - not trying to change her - just trying to be a good dad and let everything go as smoothly as possible for our daughter's sake.

I don't think she's doing anything with OM now. She's desparate for some kind of support, and she doesn't seem to be throwing herself into his arms. She says she doesn't trust him.

UPDATE:

My wife had a meltdown today - pretty bad. I was very worried about her. She brought DD to me - since it was my night - but I could tell she was doing very poorly. She called me on the way home from dropping DD off - was crying hysterically. I was afraid for her safety driving, but she got home OK. I called her a couple more times. She's cutting DD off right now. I hate it when I see her get that way. But, she seemed to be getting better - talking cynically, but not crying anymore. She wants to take DD to story-time at the library in the morning, so she's thinking ahead, making plans - trying to get it together. This was hard for me to handle. She has nobody to call on - or rather nobody she trusts to call on. She has some friends, but when she gets like this, she won't call anybody - because she doesn't want them to see her like this. Only me, and I'm not sure she would always call me. She's afraid that I'll take advantage of her weakness to try to take custody. I will not do that. That would kill her.

I tried to reassure her that I'm not trying to take custody - and as long as she's up to it, she'll be the #1 parent. If she has a problem, depression or whatever, and she's not up to it, I'll step in for as long as needed, but when she gets it back together, I'll step back into the supporting role. I don't know if she believed me, but I'll just take one day at a time.

This kind of meltdown used to happen now and then - in times of high stress. Sorry, I can't let her fall on her face at times like that - not even when we are divorced. As long as she's got nobody else, I'll listen to her and try to help her as best I can. She's very depressed - not quite suicidal exactly, but in a fairly hopeless state. She said she wanted to go to sleep and not wake up - or go do some self-destructive (but not suicidal thing).

The hurricane coverage, combined with the beginning of a semester, the divorce, money pressures, her friend having a baby, etc. etc. - just kind of piled up on her. She can't take stress. It's a PTSD thing. She shouldn't watch the news. I hope she doesn't see anything about the trampling deaths in Bagdad. There were a lot of children in that. She can't deal with that kind of thing.

-AD

No jokes for you today. But I prayed for you and opened my son's (temporarily!) abandoned Bible to find a text for you. Here's what it turned to, in Amos 9:9...

"For, lo, I will command, and I will sift the house of Israel among all nations, like as corn is sifted in a sieve, yet shall not the least grain fall upon the earth."

The Israelites were going to be separated from each other, and scattered among the nations, with such thoroughness that it would be like being sifted in a sieve. It would seem to them that God had abandoned them, and that all was hopelessly lost. And yet in that separation, and all their trials to come, God promised that not even the "least" of those who truly belonged to him would be lost in the process.

We have troubles like that today, too. Often. I claim this promise pretty much every day when I pray, and tell God, "Lord, we're not famous, not rich, not special to anybody but each other and you. We're the least of the least of your grains. Don't let us fall to the ground, and be lost. The Bible says that you won't let it happen. I believe you meant what you said, and claim this promise for myself and those I love, in the name of Jesus."

And then THIS particular least grain goes on about her business with a considerably more cheerful heart than the one with which she started. I LIKE being a "least grain." Well, when it's one of God's grains, I do!

Prayers coming your way...

t&l

AD,

I had read your post the other night and meant to come back and tell you how great I thought you sounded lately. Your attitude is simply the best through this all now. (of course I know that how you seem here might be a little different than what you are personally, emotionally going through with the finalization of this).

Anyway so I got back here to post to you and read your latest post regarding her meltdown, and I just want to say I think you are doing the right thing. Alway have thought that with the way you have handled things, given your wife's problems.

You little girl is a very, very lucky girl to have a dad who loves her so, and a dad who would continue to take care of her mother.

You ROCK!