Nope, not dead JM, felt like it for awhile...sounds like you can relate. I'm sorry to stay away, I didn't even mean to, just found myself too busy...but I also needed a bit of a break...

I mean't NO disrespect, OK?

"i don't get it. he is the most moody person since he has been sinning up a storm."

I'm guessing that you DO get it. The guilt eats them alive. Deep down, subciously, whatever, they KNOW that they are wrecking their family.

Draw strength from this OK! I'm starting to get it. I mean don't relish in it, just know that the turmoil happens when they are less foggy.

THIS IS GOOD!!

Plan A is "kick there A$$ with kindness."

"they think it is going to make them happy....HAPPY....SOOOOO...why the heck isn't he?"

EXACTLY! You're still on track, you kick A$$!!

"Jacob said...well the last time i asked you said you wasn't......"

J kicks A$$! hehe

"why is he here every single day? why does he spend every evening with us? why does he want to be here but not sleep here? why has he starting flinching if i touch him again?"

Because he wants to be. He could CHOOSE to be somewhere else, couldn't he? He doesn't know how. He doesn't want to leave. Neither does my W. Too fun eating cake, BUT they also care about us. They're trying to find their way back.

We have to help them. But they have to DO it.

Sometimes helping is tough. Sometimes we have to be tough on them. I don't mean being a TAKER, I mean finding out how to enforce our boundaries.

"why has he starting flinching if i touch him again?"

Withdrawal? (you mentioned the OW's in counseling? Right?)

So I'm going back into battle mode, you comin' or what?!

I read somewhere recently (was it on this thread, dunno...) that 85% of Plan A'ers (according to Harley) must go to Plan B b4 there are results.

OK, this sucks obviously. But, given the passive-agressive people we are married to...

...I don't think we are part of the lucky 15%. Please think about this and how to do it.

You are NOT alone!! So many good people here! You are WAY TOO GOOD TO BE LIVING THIS BAD!!

Good freakin' luck with the kitty putty. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

Be good, be strong, and be.

PS. I got to say A$$ three times in this post to a Christian woman! (maybe you oughta listen to someone else?) <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Hi guys--:)

I have no advice to give, just moral support and wanted to say that I'm glad that you have updated the thread. I lurk and read here all the time and I kind of get worried when I don't see any movement in a while. Good luck and know that there are people checking in and caring about how you're doing--even if they aren't posting much.

JM--You can do what you HAVE to do--you deserve to be happy and it sounds like if you plan B your WS that you'll get the results you want. I think that you'll totally wake him up if you go to plan B now. Of course I'm still plan A'ing my bf so maybe I don't know, but from everything that I've read here--it's time! Do it before you hate him so that you won't feel like you've wasted all this time. I hope you know what I mean by that. Good luck, I'm rooting for you.

((((hugs)))) Hurting Unit

Just 5 more days and i'm at the beach....much MUCH needed vacation. and all expenses paid to boot!

You just know things are getting bad when your sittin' around listening to "monster ballads".....Taking me back to my youth....hehe!

Jay and i are hanging in here...would like to say things are getting somewhat better...but i'm not sure they are. H is still taking everything and giving nothing in return.

I'm so drained that i just don't know what i'm doing anymore.....but i'm not going to continue living like this...i can't my mind, body and soul just can't handle it....

definitely going to enjoy my vacation, my little man and my mothers money..HA!...going to rest and i'll keep you guys posted on whats next with me and Jay.

thanks for checking on me and the prayers....

CJ hope your doing okay....and by the way, i checked in on your bands site...congrats on your single...and hey why haven't you sent me a CD? huh?

gotta go...Jay is lying here on the bed screaming "mommy turn that yucky music off"...not a Tesla fan i guess... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/pfft.gif" alt="" />

later guys! Jaysmom

Hi JM,

Very glad to hear from you, sorry that things are not going as well as you'd like, but I'm happy to hear that you are going on a much needed vacation!!!

I so hope you can relax, and I hope that you have time to truly recharge...I worry that you are feeling too overwhelmed...

I'm so drained that i just don't know what i'm doing anymore.....but i'm not going to continue living like this...i can't my mind, body and soul just can't handle it....

You shouldn't have to continue living like this!! It's not fair, I agree. I encourage you not to quit, though, your choice, I not sure what to say that is inspiring...so I'll relate how I feel sometimes...

Sometimes I would like to just split my W's head open, this makes me so angry <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/eek.gif" alt="" />, and I think about how drained my LB is, and I was wondering what I had left for my W after all of this...

I was on our balcony, (enjoying a smoke, like a loser <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/shocked.gif" alt="" />) and I started praying, for God to give me some help, to tell what I needed to do...

I turned my head, and saw a spider, busily spinning it's web, just working HARD!! And it hit me...GOD HIT ME!

Spiders have one season to raise their family. ONE SEASON!!! NO room for error. Everything must be done precisely, and it has to get done. They must catch enough food to provide for their young, and they must build a web every other day, lay eggs...y'know whatever they do...

They have NO time to screw around!! (pun intended.. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />) Well, maybe once with their ONE mate!!

Their whole life is dedicated to creating a family, and they are relentless, they don't know how to quit, and their inspiration (instinct or whatever) comes from this SOLE (soul?) purpose. They CANNOT fail.

When they are done, and the eggs hatch, then they can rest (hibernate) OR some species, perhaps, pass away. The rest of the family work they leave up to GOD and take on FAITH.

Thank you Jesus!! This gave me purpose! OK OK, I'm not spiderman, but you know... I am nature, this is also my purpose, and everything else is superfluous.

The message I took...God will help me achieve my goals, but my legs must do the walking, I MUST do the work!! HE will take care of the rest.

I don't how it will turn out, but if I do my part and make my family my highest priority, my children WILL do well.

That's all I needed to know.

I'm not judging you JM, I just feel your exhaustion, and I'm worried about you. I read so many others here that start to question if they care anymore. The responses are always the same... you have to 100% KNOW you're done before you are done...if you even 10% want your family, what do you need to do? (I really don't know, I'm honestly asking! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" /> But please think about it...for me, I needed a rest, now I'm back!)

I also realized, that when I feel this way (watch me project onto you here, sorry, no disrespect), worried what my feelings are for my W, that I am talking myself into the same state that my W is in, where she doesn't care, where she won't work on the marriage...that she feels entitled to end our family...

...but then I have to remember what I'm trying to convince her of, the MB principles, that this despair is normal, expected, and we should embrace it, it means we DO care. LOVE IS A CHOICE! We know how love is built, and we know how to build it, and as I keep learning here...

THE ACTIONS COME FIRST, NOT THE "IN LOVE" FEELINGS. That's what we are trying to tell our WS's, isn't it? We have to BELIEVE it too.

Have a great rest...Jay, come on, Tesla is awesome, "Modern Day Cowboy"...one of the tunes I learned on guitar when a teenager...

I suppose I could email you an mp3 of our tune if you'd like..."Road to Redemption" is a great Plan A song, I've decided it's my theme!

Let me know...take care.

CJ...spiders freak me out. I would've seen it and went running like the girly girl i am....

so i'm glad you told me what you got out of it....hehe!

I was whiney last night...i sometimes get that way after H leaves to go and SLEEP at his mom's. I totally get the "splitting head open" thingy....like when i am glarring at the ballbat across the room thinking how i would like to use it on WH's head....

anyway...really i am doing well. I still love my H very much and still want this M.....I don't however want the man he is right now...but i still have hope in him, hope in God that he will come around.

You seem to be in a very good place with yourself...i am very happy to see that. or hear that...whatever...you know what i mean. You seem better than i have read in the past. Good for you. hang in there...you've got alot of support here!


Jay's not a big "80's hair band" fan .....he made it thru Tesla's "love song" but he looked at me as if to say...mom i draw the line with Skid Row....that was it for him....and then the whining started!!!

Send me the email...i'd love to listen to your music...heck maybe you can make Jay a fan...we'll see!

Jaysmom

Hey JM,
Just wanted to drop by & say hi, I emailed you - did you receive it?
Today's my 2nd anniversary of D-Day... what a two year period it's been!!! One year of h*ll, one year of peace... whew. There is a light at the end of the tunnel for you, trust in God and keep praying.

MSA

Just a quick update for anyone who cares....

had a great vacation, plenty of thinking time....

maybe too much.

throwing in the towel.

i'm done with Plan A....

skipping Plan B....

going to Plan D...on my own.

Not to try and win my WH back....

just to let go.

don't see WH ever changing and my heart has taken a beating that i'm not sure will recover.

thanks to all of you and your kind words and advice and especially prayers! Jay and I wouldn't have made it this far without them.

take care!
Jaysmom

Can we keep in touch? I will email you if you say it is OK.

Well this will either get you free or make him wake up forever and commit - of course you probably won't want him then - too late - whatever you decide I am here to support you,

Linda

I'm glad that you seem so set with your decision--meaning that I'm glad you aren't having any doubts about what you want. I've been checking daily to see if you've been able to update and I wish nothing but the best for you and Jay. I have total confidence that you are going to be just fine--better than fine in fact. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> Good luck and keep us updated. I don't know about anyone else, but I'm kind of addicted to the Jay vs. the cat stories. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

HU2006

Hi JM,

Just offering my support, I too had been checking here to see when you could update, as I knew you were on vacation.

Keep posting, your choice, you have a lot of fans here!!

I hear your decision, I hope whatever happens that you find the happiness that you deserve. I also hope your H realizes what he will lose, no matter what the outcome is.

I'm praying for you and Jay, I wish the very best for you both...keep us posted if you have time!

guys...are you kidding me...of course i'll keep you updated!...i'm addicted to this place! besides the fall of the A WILL happen and you all will be the first to hear about it!

staying very busy...hey its summer...just because my H is a [censored]...doesn't mean i'm going to stop living...besides...a very nice looking guy told me i had great legs the other day... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" /> my life is looking up...heehee!

Jay and i are headed out this weekend for my sisters...so WH will be without us again...something he will have to start getting use to.

He's still coming here everyday just as he has...the difference is that i just don't care. He seems to sense it. Has been really angry since we got back from the beach. Not angry all the time...but just acting very angry at times...answering questions with anger....

don't know what thats all about...but don't care.

i'm glad you like the cat stories....

just the tip of the iceberg of my life...no kidding.

got stories that you wouldn't believe.

gotta go to bed now...but i'll check in with you guys soon!

take care all...and thanks for the prayers!

jaysmom

So, JM update us, how are you doing? Still praying for you, I know when you go through divorce, even if it is what you want, it is not easy.

SP

<<<<<<<BUMP>>>>>>>>>

(((((((((jaysmom)))))))))))))))

Well guys...just thought i would drop by and say HI!

hope you all are doing well...hanging in there!

Just to say that i have now officially joined the crazies...and am awaiting the ride to the local mental hospital! Yep...thats pretty much where i am.


Jay and i are doing okay. Although....Jay has started "spilling the beans" on his daddy! I wondered how long it would take my sweet, wonderful child to ask questions, or to tell some things i knew he has been around....things i didn't want to hear.

he refers to her as "the yucky old woman" God how i LOVE my son! isn't he the best...he told me just yesterday...Mommy your so pretty and "yucky old woman is beeeeyucky" don't you just love him!

my 4 year old is very detail oriented....so not only did i get that she and daddy sit and talked while i played...but she smokes...he told me he didn't like it and hid in the playhouse....SEE even then he knew that something wasn't right.....(all of the things he was talking about have been 6 months or more ago....) He says he hasn't seen this woman in a "long time" i mentioned the time around his birthday on here...he says that he hasn't seen her since then...so....4 months ...or so....

oh...but the ol' WH still seeing her. Gut never lies. He's so totally devoted to her....and me. Yep...still down here...down here right now....been playing in the pool earlier...usually every day.

and i know.....i said i was over...and done with him...but no...i haven't filed. I can't bring myself to do it. i'm the closest i have ever been...but not there.

but he is absolutely killing me. He wants me and Jay...he just wants us on his terms....and i just keep allowing him...although....its getting harder...

i'm starting to feel like i hate him....

thats sad guys.

i don't know what to do....

Yesterday...Jay wanted to take butta's and gracie swimming in the pool....he tried really hard...i found them both outside (they are inside cats who...NEVER...go out....) they were just tooo....fat for him to hurl in...thank goodness.

prayers to you all!

check in later guys!

Jaysmom

So good to hear from you JM!!

I'm at work...went for a quick break, I was thinking about all the people on here...I've been lurking, but too exhausted to post much...

So i check, and whaddaya know!?

I'm sorry things haven't improved...your little boy is his usual brilliant self!!!

I hope there is something you can DO...

Anyway i gotta go...I'll check back l8r...

Post when you can, lotsa fans here <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

CJ

Well you know what to do now, Dr. Bill says that when your love begins to turn to hate, you do plan B to protect the love you have left. No contact with you at all. All visits to be out of the house with Jay and only to talk to you about ANYTHING through an intermediary. He can no longer see you smeel you touch you hear you .. now he has earned exile from you.

As hung up on you as he is - it won't take and she is cold comfort. She will think she has won and it will drive him mad. Not long for him to reaslise he is on a losing wicket. Get ready for the plan B letter. I will post my ten step method of writing one.

Loveya girl - keep going, we can't all do it by the book - we just have to find our own way.


Give Jay and Butta and gracie a hug for me.

Linda

Hi JM~~

I'm sorry that things aren't any better. That truly STINKS (for want of a better word <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" /> ) I know that you know it, but you've got people here who are thinking about you and pulling for you. Note that I said for YOU--you're important and good and people hope and wish for the best for you--and Jay of course. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

I understand where you're coming from in regards to being almost there--I'm in the same place with my bf and it is just so darn HARD to take that final step. I feel like I don't have any confidence in any decisions that I make anymore. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" /> What I've been coming to realize though is that being alone has GOT to be better than this constant pain and turmoil I'm in. Before I hate him I'm going to have to go. It sounds like you're in the same place in regards to your WS.

Your son--what can I say about him except that he cracks me up! I've got this picture in my mind of these 2 enormous cats with panic stricken faces struggling in the arms of a little boy as he tries to throw them in a pool. Kind of like a Norman Rockwell picture. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" /> Thanks for the laugh.

Well, I've got to go. Good luck and keep us posted.

HU2006

bump - where are you Jay's mom?

well hello friends!

Linda...i'm still here, thanks for checking. Here meaning alive and breathing...hope all my good friends here are doing well.

Today is WH's birthday, he and Jay are hanging out watching TV tonight. Nothing much to report about, things unfortunately are still the same with him.

its really strange though. People here kept saying that i would get to a point within myself were i just have had enough....so many times i thought i was there, just to find i still had some hope in me.

Now i can say for real, really real <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />...that honestly i have found that point.

when your driving home, and you hate the fact that your driving home, and he is going to be there....when you can't hardly look at him....not in a sad way....or mad way....

just in an i don't give a crap way.....

you really know your there.

he asks me from time to time...."you hate me don't you"

nope.

it's not hate. its an...'i feel sorry for you' kinda feeling.

sorry that he has ruined the best thing that could've ever happened to him.

sorry that he will ...WILL.... wake up one day and wish he had've stopped this game he has been playing when he had the chance.

it's knowing that i have gone thru the storm, only to come out alive and well and happy....

that i have loved someone literally with all of my heart and then some. that i was willing for soooo long to peice our marriage back and work for what i believe so strongly in.....

and i will not look back with regrets for anything. not ever.

this man gave me the true love of my life....my little man...

to know that he will have to go thru this same storm...only to not come out as i have...because he will have lost everything...and to know that he will have to pay dearly...for this. he will.

you guys here are just the best. the BEST. you helped me out when i couldn't even imagine getting up and living.

and i will keep you up to date...if you want, that is.

i plan on seeing an attorney in the next week or so....figure that is the first step i should take...then go from there.

hope everyone is hanging in there...praying for all of you daily!

i'll check back in later...

gotta go...Jays yelling at me to make his "sqweedo" bites stop itching...

Jaysmom <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Sooo glad to see you - my email came back, someone marked it spam - wonder who could have done that?

Well now is the time - plan B him while you begin to move on. I have to warn you you might still have a relapse - love is a hard thing to kill - and boy does a WS know how to kill it.

The opposite of love is indifference - so you just feel nothing? and then a little twinge of pity for his fog mind, so callous, so self serving.

So email me from an address he can't get to and keep in touch here.

Cats can swim - just don't tell Jay - lol.

I look for your posts every day - so glad to see you, did I say that once?

Been a bit bumpy for me lately, but like you, I rise.

Linda