MyFWW's affair has changed me and I have been working on me for two years now. I help with the dishes and even with the cooking now and then to make my wife's life a little easier. Continue to work on yourself.

My threat of additional exposure to her everyone at work and her family finally got the best of her. She agreed to quit her job to try and work on the marriage. My wife fell back in love with me and she didn't believe that was possible when she felt so much love for her OM. Today, she is happy that I fought to keep the marriage intact. She still has a difficult time forgiving herself.

TS

MAzingrace-
I love your story...Thank you so much for sharing.
It is people like you that fill my heart with hope and fuel to continue to try to save my wife and family.
You have to be a strong woman, and god bless you and your family.
Your story is very touching and sounds very similar to mine. My wife has had SO MANY people coaching her out of my marriage. I still can not believe how everything lined up at one time to finally push her over the edge and finally give into Satan. Her new job, The timing of me LBing all over the place, OM being at the right places at the right times, His wifes failure to expose him, my daughters failure to expose him, my job promotion that required even more time. I could go on and on with crazy details that made her take the step to finally give up on me and accept adultry. Destiny in a way.

Being difficult is an understatement. She is so hard to deal with right now. I totally believe she is TRYING TO JUSTIFY herself by making me show her what she hates in me.

Last night she was content to sleep on the couch again. No pillow at all or blanket, only a small throw. I asked her to go up and take a bed.. She just says, I am okay. I know she is not. She has a bad back and I can see in walking in pain right now. I said, I do not understand why you are so stubborn and against sleeping in a bed.. NOT WITH ME AT ALL.. She said, I am okay. Don't worry about me. I can take care of myself. I said, good night and went up.
After about an hour on the computer I went ahead and took her favorite pillow and blanket down to her. She was awake. She said, what are you doing this for? Why do you keep doing this stuff. However, she lifted her head up and accepted the pillow and I covered her up and told her good night and rubbed her sholder for a moment.
This morning I woke up with the dog poking her head under my hand for attention. I opened my eyes and my wife was laying on the bed next to me watching me. As soon as she seen I was awake she got up and walked out of the room.

What do you think she was doing... Why would she leave as soon as she new I was awake?

Later I went down stairs and WW and daughter was on the couch together. We made small talk and tossed toys around for the dog to fetch and play. Daughter helped keep a friendly conversation going with all of us. Daughter and the dog as the center of our attention, it was easy to be light hearted and fun. This lasted for nearly and hour. WW asked if I would check her car over before she goes to see her mom. I checked it out. Later she asked if it was okay that daughter go with her. I could sense that my wife was now gone and OM's girl friend was now back in charge.
I was right. She started trying to pick fights about thinkgs like why I leave the sink unclean. How she is only one that cleans it, also I leave the coordless phones on the charger to long and ruin the batteries... Just any stupid thing she could use to get angry with me about.
I pretty much avoided her. She stops me in the kitchen and starts in about my bank account again..
She says, you surprise me. Any one that is trying to save there marriage would never go get a new bank account and not tell there wife, or not even add them to the account. Again what is the real reason you had to get a secret account or accounts? You probably have hidden money all over that I don't know about. I felt bad that I was not giving you more money... SO WHY DID YOU DO IT.
I said, ther is nothing to hide. Like I said, before.. I went over all the details again. She says, well you have always hide money and this is just another thing that you do in secret and not include me. I said, I will give you the statement or what ever you want to see. There is no big secret. You have not been willing to be a part of anything financial for years. I will show you what ever it is you want to see... She said, no I don't want to see nothing.

Then says you will not stay this way. I give you two three months before you go back to your old selfish ways. Just like Ex-SIL says about her Ex-H. He was Mr. wonderful for about three four months then he relaxed and when back to his old basturd self. Just look he treats his new woman just like Ex-SIL.. Very badly.. You will be just like him and do the same.
I said, okay WW.. You will see if you choose to see, that I am for real. Besides you are comparing me to a man that's pet name for his wife was Pigbitch. My pet name for you was Pookie. They had a totally different relationship than you and I. She said, well you will not last just like him. I said, time will prove me right you just wait and watch.
She gave me some crap about her car being junk and how when she wanted a new one I would not help and now I want to help she does not want it. I said, WW I am sorry that we did not get you a car before it broke down. She says, well it has always been junk and a piece of ******. I said, I will help you right now. She says, I don't need your help now. I said, just know the offer is on the table. I will help you how ever I can. Find one, deal on one, what ever.
She says, I will not be able to afford one now. I will have to pay for my own car insurance, food, cloths, and rent to Jana when I move in. It will just have to get me by. I said, okay. I can atleast repair the car for you so it will run through the winter. She says, no I can't pay you for that. I said, I would not charge you anyway.
She says, no don't worry about it.

That is pretty much it. She is now at her mom's. Which was pro-marriage and on my side a week ago. Let's hope that she still is and WW can have some fog cleared for her today.

GOD BLESS ALL OF YOU...

TS- Did she ever file for a divorce and or leave the house to be with OM and or on her own.
Mine left the hosue and lived with OM for 8 days straight and spent 10 nights with him while living here.
She did file for a divorce under direction and finances of OM. She however, has stopped the petition.
WW claims to be moving out again. She has been looking all over for a place to rent. I believe she will leave no matter what I do. It is pressure of OM and pressure to try to see if she can be with out me and OM make her happy. She has wanted the test drive with OM for so long. I know she is still wanting that. However, my threat of taking full custody by her choosing to shack up with OM turned her back around and back into the house.

Thank you for sharing your success story with me and us. Good luck to you and GOD BLESS YOU AND YOUR FAMILY.

My wife never filed for a divorce but I later found she had been hiding cash from me and preparing for her move. My FWW's OM wanted my wife to move in with him. She stayed with him one night only and that was because I caught her apartment and furniture shopping online and that was after she said she was going to work on the marriage. I booted her out and that was the night she stayed with him. She learned that he lived like a slob and knew that she should go to an apartment. The next day she put down a deposit on an apartment. I would have likely filed had she moved out.



My FWW's OM was putting huge pressure for her to leave me. My wife ageed to go to a concert and to stay in a hotel during the affair. The OM was really ticked off and jealous. How dare I take my wife away from him!! He even showed up at the MC to let me know he was very much in the game still.

Keep fighting her hard and use every and any tactic to scare her into breaking the affair and staying with you. Fight fire with fire. Treat it like a thief has enetered your home to hurt your family.



I was very lucky and desperate. The threat of more exposure worked for me the best. She was not bothered, due to the fog, to leave her kids, her husband, her house, her furniture, her God, church and religion, or her dog, but she feared more exposure. (Dr. Harley really understands this and he is right).

When the OM showed up in the parking lot of the MC, that was the day I found the courage to give her an ultamadum. In front of the MC, I said, "It is time to choose Him or your family and if you choose the OM, tomorrow I will expose your affair to everyone at your job and in your life, including your elderly mother, will know of the affair" (Condensed version). Had she not cared what others thought of her, we would be divorced today.

Don't give up hope. If you feel like it is too far gone, take the I don't care attitude and let her see you preparing the household for a life for the kids and you. She has to fear she may lose the kids and that is your biggest stick right now, I believe. Don't be afraid of bluffing her into thinking that you and the kids may even move away to a new area for a fresh start and to eliminate the memories she has put you through. Fight hard and dirty if you are at the point of no return.

TS

Just got confirmation that WW left daughter and her friend at the mall last night for 2 hours.
Daughter and friend went to the movie while WW went X-mas shopping..wink wink... She bought no gifts and has no charges on her bank account of CC.

I just check daughters cell phone... Guess what there was a call made to OM at 7:35.. WW was gone for an hour tonight suppose to be at the store getting more hair color...

Her addiction to this guy is just unreal...

Sorry I've been absent from your post for a while.
I'm very busy at work and family.

I know you don't really get this yet, but you need to get away from her and the constant interactions where she is trying to wear you down.

I can't wait for you to get to the point of Plan B. I get a little annoyed with long Plan A's....I just don't believe in it. You need to take control right out of her hands, while still demonstrating your positive changes and attitude.

Like I've said before...there's nothing more for you to do. I'd be very anxious if I were you to make the OM screw up their relationship. Its gonna happen, why delay it?

Dazed,

I really think you are looking at all of this in the wrong light. You are focusing on HER. Isn't it time for you to look at yourself and realize a few things.

1. Isn't it true that you LIKE NOT being always angry?

2. Isn't true that you are actually enjoying being a father to your daughter?

3. Isn't it true that you like yourself more now than you have in years?

4. Isn't it true that you are not ever going back to the way you were NO MATTER what happens because you are more comfortable in your new skin than you were before?

Finally, I think you enjoy NOT fighting with your W although she keeps trying to fight with you, am I right?

Dazed, I realize you don't want to lose your W, but no matter what she does realize what you have gained. I think your daughter sees you in a new light. I think you see yourself in a new light. Dazed, don't you see that no matter what your W decides, you have gained from this. You won't realize all you have gained for some time yet, but you will.

She will not come out of the fog, nor will she give you a chance until OM zero's out is deposits in her love bank. That is why plan B is going to be in your future. Meanwhile , get ready to ENJOY christmas with your daughter. I can tell you the years fly by and you miss these years with her, so make the most of them. Dazed, quit worrying about your W, enjoy the season, and savor the time you have with your daughter. She seems young at 12, but she will be 18 before you know it. The neat thing, is that the man that is her father has changed and her memories of you from now on are going to be very pleasant.

Dazed, what you don't yet understand in your despair over losing your W and you have lost her, is that you are starting to build a legacy for your daughter and yourself that will last a lifetime. Enjoy it, relish it, savor it. Let your W take care of herself. You are on a new path now and it is a good one. Your W may decide to rejoin your life and travel down the same path or she may not, but Dazed you should enjoy your new path, the new you, and your daughter.

So don't focus on her, although she is trying her best to make you blow, find humor in her attempts, enjoy treating her well, but enjoy the new you and your daughter even more.

Time to step back and really appreciate the changes. If you do, you will find many things changing in your life, not just your marriage, but your daughter, your friends, your focus, the joy you get out of life.

Please if you have never believed a thing I have told you, believe what I am telling you now. Your strength can and will come as you learn to enjoy where YOU are now, as you learn to enjoy your daughter. The marriage will take care of itself. You have no control over this, just yourself.

I am proud of the changes you have made, and I am betting other people are noticing them as well. You have no idea how deep your changes are going to reach, but trust me they will enhance ALL of your life.

God Bless,

JL

Dear Dazed,

I hope the "story" of my personal experience did not confuse the issue you face. I agree there will need to be a crisis to end the crisis so-to-speak, and I will defer to those here with more experience than I. I'm sure Plan B, as it's called, can be implemented without anger just as a good parent can discipline a child in love. After reading your last post about your wife leaving your daughter to cover her deception, I would agree that you have no choice BUT to do what is necessary to protect your daughter. And I think Just Learning's reminders to you are true and inspiring.

Have confidence.

MAzingrace

Dazed-

I feel for you man. I was lucky that my wife's OM was smart enough to back off when it came down to it...I didn't have to contend with the constant garbage and lies that you're going through now.

I don't have any good advice really. Keep documenting EVERYTHING. The calls to OM you've seen, the times she's lied, the times she's left daugther alone so she could spend time with OM, etc...

Personally, I think you're coming up quickly to a point where you're going to have to tell her point blank to end the affair or get the heck out. Tell her that you've done all you could, write your plan B letter, and tell her that enough is enough.

I'm not one of the experts here...just giving you my opinion man. At some point, you're going to have to do something to save your FAMILY (you and daughter)...because all of this toxicity is horrible for your DD too.

You keep asking what does it take for the fog to go away?
For her to "get it"...

You have done all you can do. You're done. Just keep being consistant.

You MUST stop focusing on her. Your focus must be on daughter and yourself. Did you know that for an adolescent girl the most important parental relationship is her FATHER? You are going to be the model she uses when selecting her future partners.

So...get your act together. You've got your mantra and your mission.

Let her go fail. Its the only way for her to come back.

Lexxxy is onto something here, Dazed.

Look, Plan B is not far off. And right now, you have doing a pretty good Plan A. But I have to admit that it is now time for you to transition.

Time to start being independent of yoru wife. How? Well, look. Even before I went to Plan B, I began to sort of pull away. Sure I had been and was still meeting needs of hers...still racking up points. But I also was beginning to show that I was prepared to take our family in a different direction than her, as we came close to the crossroads of Plan B and then divorce. That heightened her pain!

No longer was I meeting needs and making all of this mental and emotional effort into her. All of a sudden, I was out with friends a lot. And my kids and I made plans to do things, without her involved. Even though she was still there, she could see that her husband and even her kids, were pullign away from her mess and heading down a different road...the road the family had been on all the time.

Loneliness began to set in. How can that be, if she was still seeing the OM? I asked myself that many times. But she told me later that she was feeling lonely (Lexxy, you might be able to help more with the reasons behind this feeling). I suspect that it was the fact that the OM could never fill in where me and the family were beginning to leave. He couldnt do it, and she was beginnign to realize that. I believe she was beginnign to realize that she was with a stranger...alone.

In the meantime, her family...the one she had helped plan and build, was beginning to leave her behind. And then, all of a sudden, a Plan B letter was dropped into her lap stating that our relationship had now moved to one of no contact. In her mind, another step toward being even more alone.

What did she do? She initially ran off for a 4 day trip to Florida to meet his mother and family. And his two daughters, who lived with his ex-wife. But she came back from that trip even more lonely. She was beginning to feel what it would be like without her family.

It took some more time...but she eventually came around. Dazed, she is going to have to continue to feel the loss. She is going to have to continue to have that hole open up inside of her, the hole that you were filling. The Om is just not capable of filling it. The best thing that could happen at this point is that he tries to fill it...and your WW sees how totally inadequate he is.

So, I am of the mind that it is time to start showing some independence. Let her see firsthand a confident, happy, committed Dazed. One that loves her, but also one that is man enough to stand up and do what he needs to do, even when his wife has lost her mind.

I believe that this is the road you will have to take in order to leave your WW behind...and possibly find your wife again.

In His arms.

SORRY ABOUT MY LONG POST.. I think I was working on it for a couple hours while you all were posting. I will go back and read... THANK YOU..
__________________________________

I hope you all had a good holiday and safely made it back home. Monday's after a long holdiay week end are always tough... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Hey Lexxxy- Good to have you back. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> Your a big help! Your perspective appears to be very similar to that of my WW. I have probably already told you that before.


MAzingrace- Thank you for sharing your experience. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> I understand that your sitch is not mine, However your insite helps me understand what it is like on the other side of the fog.

Last night my WIFE returned and wanted my help. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/crazy.gif" alt="" />
(There was so much said that I probably can not recall every detail as it was said.)

We shared some together time as parents and then openly with out anger talked about "us" the rest of the night.

I will try to recap:

It all started when she recoginized that I wanted privacy to make a phone call. After 15 minutes on the phone she began following me around. She had a look on her face that looked hurting and wanting to talk. So, as soon as I ended my phone call she immediately asked if that was girl...
My answer was, do I ask you to tell me who you are talking to on the phone. She says, no. Can you tell me honestly if that was a girl. I said, Yes, I can tell you that it was a friend of mine. Would you like me to push redial to prove it.. She starts crying and wanting to hug me. Says, I know its not fair, but I am not ready for you to find someone else. I need your help. I am so confused... I want to hold you and lay down in bed with you but it is not fair to you. I do care about you and I don't want to keep hurting you. I held her back, and told her I am here. It's okay WW. You can come to me, I am here now. She says, I don't want to hurt you any more. I said, I am here, you are not going to hurt me by coming to me when you need me. I know you are looking for a way to make this end and the pain go away. I can help you if you let me.

She asked me to please come help her with daughters hair and can we please talk more later.
Me and wife spent the next hour working on daughters hair that WW was coloring. Daughter was very upset about how it turned out. Me and WW, took turns brushing, dring and straightening. It brought back old memories of us doing daughters hair like we did for years when she was younger. We talked about it and had some laughs about how I would curl daughters hair. I had almost forgotten about washing daughters hair, dring it and curling it.
All three of us acting like a family was so rewarding. There was no tention or stress. Just us acting like a family.

I helped WW clean up the house and I tucked daughter into bed like old times.

Me and WW watched tv quietly for several minutes. We talked about daughters hair. Some small talk.

She asked me about the phone call again. Wanted to know if I would tell her the truth if I had been talking to a girl. I told her I did not want to fight with her that is why I wanted privacy. I said, you have been wanting to fight with me about anything so much lately that I just wanted to talk with out you in the room. She says, Yes I understand. Talking on the phone in private, I new that it must not have been some one from your family and you did not want me to know about it.
(I am thinking to myself; She knows what her private phone calls are all about and figures maybe I am doing the same).

I could tell this was a big issue with her. I so I just told her who i was speaking with. (a guy friend). She says, what about and details? Wanting to be honest i told her who and why. She was okay with that.

She then asked me to talk about "us". Asked me to come set with her. I set at the end of the couch and she pressed her feet up against me as to comfort herself.
She ask me to just start talking. To tell her what I think and feel about anything.
I told her how I thought she felt and the painful struggles she is going through and how hard this has been for her to deal with. That she is confused, scared that if she goes it will be the biggest mistake of her life and could she come back, on the other hand, if she stays could she fall back in love with me and would things change and would she feel like she missed out. Also, she is so scared for daughter and how she will be if she goes. That you spent 12 years of being everything for her and so over protective to not be that mom that daughter wants so much has to really really hurt and weigh so heavy on your mind.
You worry that I will never move on and be happy even if you could. You worry that if you stay you wont find that happiness you want so much. I think part of you is scared to fall in love with again.
I also know that you are looking for all the reasons why we won't work out. Just trying to fight with me just to convince herself to go through with leaving me and prove I am not really changed. Most of all you want the pain and suffering to end. You want normalcy back in your life.
She set quiet. I asked her she wanted to talk now, it is my turn to listen.
She looked near tears and hurting. I told her she looked like she needed a hug. She noded her head. I moved and held her for several minutes.
She said, well you pretty much have it. You know how I feel.
She asked me what is wrong with her in the head? You make it so hard for me. You do things that can not be replaced. Like the way you rub my hair and neck. I love that so much. You are the only one that can to that for me. That is not replacable.
I said, thank you. You are just confused.
She said, but I think about why I should give you another chance. I think you had your chance and now its too late for you. I have someone that wants all my time and has no stupid hobies to make me wait for.
There is also another side of the fence. There is so much I want to tell you but I can't. It is just not so easy for me to just stay here with you now. He thinks that I am.......Well I have made.....um...There are...um..

I said, so you have promised him things. I paused then said, yes you are right. I was not there for me when you needed me. I was wrong. I do want all your time and I would make you my hobby if you would let me.

She did not reply.
After a few moments: I said, I understand that. I know you don't want to hurt anyone. That is just you. You do care about people and you do have a big heart. You do worry about everything. That is one of you best qualities that I have always loved about you. This is how I know you really are a good person. I do understand. You are stuck.
She says, yes you are right. I don't want to hurt anyone but, all I do is hurt everyone.

I said, that you know inside what is the right thing to do. You know it in your heart, reminding you. I think deep in your heart you love me. She says, yes I do love you. I care about you so much, that is what keeps me here. I am so worried about you. I said, and I am so worried about you.. I pray to god every night to watch over you and help guide you. She began to cry again.
I said, why do you have to keep telling yourself to leave me? She says, I ask everyone to tell my why I should divorce you. I am always looking for the reasons to do it.
I said, I think if you have to keep telling yourself to do it and have to look for reasons every day. That is your sign that you know you are not ready to go. You know inside that I am your true love. It is in your heart frozen under the years of hurt, pain, and influence of others.

We don't work any more. Things between us are not fun and happy thoughts.
I said, WW how could there be anything else between us now. We are under so much stress and the pressure and everything swurling around us is so great. How could we have fun and be happy together?
She says, I hate having this stuff in my head everyday.
I said, We would have to create an oppourtnity for love to grow between us again if we are to have a chance.
The way things are between us each day is not an enviroment for us to fall in love again or even be fun and happy. Constantly thinking about us and having all the "us" talks daily is to much stress and pressure.
She said, yeah. I said, how about this. No more "us" talks or worry about "us" talks unless you want we agree to do it. Let's just live one day at a time.

She told me about her feelings and fears. I told her I understand and have tried to put myself in her shoes to see her side.
She asked why and how I still love her. I told her I too have love in my heart for her and I believe that besides it being true love for both of us, we have a bond that will never be broken. I understand how long she suffered waiting for me. I think about the loneliness and unconditional love she gave me how strong she was for so long. As long as she was my wife I too would love her unconditionally.

She asked about what if she left and we divorced? I said, WW. There are not guarantee's in life. For "us" to overcome that I am not going to say is impossible. There would be just much more pain and hurt to for you and I to overcome.
The way i see it you have two options:
She says, i do. What are they?
1) You take the big step and make major changes in your life and take a huge risk of divorcing. Leaving our home and desolving our family.
2) Choose no contact for lets just say 90 days and give yourself a chance to see if we can grow fun and happy thougts for each other again. We can't even start to see if that is possible as long as this is a triangle. I know you probably are setting there doudting that you could ever have that love for me again.

We talked about similar stuff. I let her talk and i would listen and agree with her feelings and comment my thoughts back when she wanted them.
Right from the start she was wanting me to give her my opinon tonight. Looking for me to tell her what I think. That was a big shift from the norm.

This talk was I think one of our best yet. She wanted to talk without anger and hostility. I got to talk to my wife, not OM's girlfriend.
She shared her thoughts and feelings with me. Wanted me to help give her direction. I demonstrated I am aware of her feelings and how she is reacting based on them. I think somewhat surprised her that BS might actually know something about her.

As she was nearly a sleep, I went up got her PJ's, pillow, and blanket.

I rubbed her hair for a while and she turned so to let me put my arm around her and hold her. I woke around 4AM and went on up to bed.

This morning I woke her. We talked a little more "us" talk. She asked me what her options were again. I ran over a summary again. Then told her we had to face the day and I was going to impliment the no "us" stuff until we both agree to it. That I was going to live one day at a time.

While she went up and showered i left her a card in her make up room. I happened to by it yesterday even before our talk. That worked out nicely.
Things this morning went very nicely with NO anger or hostility from WW. Actually she was nice to me. Even in the morning...

I know the fog will come back. Like Please Helps says, I can count on it.
This was an odd ending to a very bad holiday for me. One that I had not counted on.

I agree-- She needs motivation to get off center. Loving Plan B. That is something to think over.

OMG MM -- EXACTLY!

Dazed -- take control of the family. She is still welcome to join you (at this point...) Be the leader. Every movement of DD goes through you. You are so intimitely involved in DD's life that WW has to ask permission to spend time with her.

I think you've been too loose on letting her be with mom. And Mom is now using her as a smokescreen. She's making BAD decisions like letting DD hang at the mall while she disappears. (DOCUMENTED - RIGHT???) I'm not saying its not OK for DD to hang at the mall -- but don't let WW make those kind of decisions on her own. Especially since she's just using it to buy time with OM.

Right now start mentally separating your "family" from WW. You decide the path and direction for the family. She's still welcome to be part of it, but don't consult her on your choices. Structure your time entirely around "family."

Right now make a plan for the whole week. Monday is swimming, Tuesday is shopping, Wednesday is homework project, Thursday is movie, etc.....(whatever you decide....)
Include DD in the planning but not WW. Structure the whole week for a positive family environment. Include meals and homework in the planning. Church activities if you attend.
Visits to other family. Fun stuff too.

If WW wants daughter time, you will have to consider her request along with the fact that she just drops DD off places and leaves. Its better for DD to be with you than dropped.

But go along with your plan -- WITH OR WITHOUT HER. And if its without her, then still go about it confidently and cheerfully.

I really think you need to talk to DD about your plans. She needs to know. And yes, you're the good guy and WW is the bad guy. Oh well. Thats just the truth. Its part of the consequences WW will have to deal with. (The other option is to work on the family...)

WW is still trying to spin-doctor everything and come out smelling good. Stop enabling that. In this circumstance there IS a good guy and a bad guy. She gets to be the bad guy unless she starts making better decisions.

The Family Train is leaving -- she can either get on board or get left behind.

And getting left behind with OM who can't possibly compensate her for her loss is really the perfect way to clear fog.

I know you somehow want to "save" her from her bad decisions. YOU CAN'T. Get used to that. Sometimes it all has to be destroyed to rebuild! You're still trying to protect her. To somehow make all of this not happen. YOU CAN'T.

We talk about having to hit bottom....right now you're more afraid of the bottom than she is. Let it happen!

The sooner you let it, the sooner she will "get it."

You are the one blocking progress right now.

Dazed,

I just posted right before you did...so did Lexxxy. Go back to our posts. Did we not say that the OM will not be able to fill in for you? Then your wife says:
Or how about when I wrote that she isnt ready to lose you...but that she needs to feel that loss. And then you write:

Do you see now, Dazed? This stuff is not new. We dont know your wife. But we do KNOW your wife. We know what is making her tick, what is her problem. And the Harley's have shown the way thru all of that. You two are not unique in this! You have gone completely nuts on here some days, lost in her fog with her. When all of the time, she has been just reading from the WS Handbook.

Do you trust this stuff now? Do you?

Your wife is still with YOU. You are the dominant person in her life, not the OM. You hold most of the cards. Look at what she said:

She is YOUR wife!
Which just lets you know that your wife isnt dead inside the alien. That she is still there somewhere, wanting to get out. You are right, the fog may roll back in.

But what is different now is that for a moment, the fog lifted. That means she can never go back into the fog and it feel the same. Your conversation last night changed everything! Maybe not for tomorrow, or the next day, or the next week. But you planted seeds in the middle of that fog. And while you may see her recede back into the fog again, you must know that the seeds of the destruction of their relationship have been laid.

So, what to do now? Well, keep Plan Aing for a little longer and see what she does. If she begins to recede, then you start doing as we said above, begin to pull away. And set a short date for when you go to Plan B.

Dazed, she does NOT want to lose you. This interaction may have been enough to get her moving. But maybe not. This interaction may just have to be the beginning salvo in what may be several steps you will need to take to win back your wife.

You are not unique. She is following the script. You stay on yours!

In His arms.

Her greatest fear:

You and her divorcing. You going on to have a great marriage and happy family with her on the outside looking in and regretting what she's done.

In the meantime, DD will never accept OM. Her family will never accept OM. She knows this RIGHT NOW. It will never turn out happy. The more DD acts out about this now, the more real it will become to her.

But you? You're taking the high road. After all is said and done, you will go on to find someone new. You will have done it all the "right way." You will have given everything for your marriage. When you find someone new, everyone will be happy for you -- even DD.

Quite a difference in pictures huh?

* * * * * * * * * *

Sooooo....what do you do with this?

Start agreeing with her. When she says you'll find someone new -- agree with her. Tell her you've learned so much. That you would really like to share that with her, but if thats not meant to be, then you will go on to have a really great relationship in the future.

DO NOT tell her that you will "never move on..." That you will "never love someone else..." I know you think you're proving the depths of your love and you want to shower her with all your love....(BLECK! NO!)

But if you say that, you are undermining the trust she has in your changes. She thinks that you'll do absolutely ANYTHING to win her back, even be a fake for a few months.

Its far more believable for you to tell her that you've learned a lot, and if she doesn't want the benefit of those changes -- well, gosh someone else will.

Listen to Lexxxy!

In His arms.

MM -- were your children involved in your plan?

Did you sit down and explain your ideas and plan to them?

Everyone seems to think that kids shouldn't be told, or that they should be left out of adult matters. I'm really wondering about that.

[quote]Her greatest fear:

You and her divorcing. You going on to have a great marriage and happy family with her on the outside looking in and regretting what she's done.
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Yes, she has told me about a fear of hers in story format. Suppose to be a nightmare of hers..
HER STORY SHE TOLD ME ABOUT 6 Weeks ago:
Where she see's me out shopping. I am with her replacement. We look so happy to her. We approach her to say hi. She says, you look great how are you doing. I say great and you look good to how are you. She says in her mind. I am so jealous. He does look so happy. I am not happy at all, in fact I wish I was with him now. But I can't tell him because he looks so happy with her. So, I reply to him; "Things are great, I am glad your doing so well".. And as you walk away holding her hand, my stomach gets sick and I have to go out side and cry in my car.
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LEXXXY- I see your point. Besides getting a life and making daughter my 1st priority. I need to make do a better job of letting her know that I am going to keep the family going, and continue to make my personal improvements with or with out her. I have said that before, but I guess not consistantly.
Thinking about last nights conversation, it is obvious she was testing to see if I am going to keep the light on for her even if she leaves our home, divorces me and trys it with OM.

My Ex-SIL actually tells people that her ex-H still loves her and if things with her shacked up OM does not work out, and ex-h is not re-married, she could go back to him and he would take her... Same woman that my WW has turned to for advice...

When WW asked me what if I leave and we get divorced? That is obviously her question. Can I come back if things with OM fail? "THE TEST DRIVE IDEA". She keeps coming back to that. I told her last night that I will always love her for many reasons, however there are no guarantee's in life.
Then suggested the 90 day NC idea.
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Good question LEXXXY- I have been told by many that any damage that WW does to me or our marriage that will be a big hurdle to over come once WW returns.
However, I think it is some what important that daughter know a little about what is happening. I am not suggesting every little detail.
WW mentioned last night that daughter is finally starting to reach out to her and be friendly again, and that means so much to her and she if afraid of losing her by leaving.
I told her that is a real possibility.

My kids were rather young at that time (11, 9 and 5). So, while I did sit down with them and explained the basics of what mom was up to, that I still loved her and would do what I needed to save the family...I also told them that we as a family must continue. So, we began to make our own plans. At first, they would ask "Is Mom coming with us to church?" After awhile, they stopped asking.

I think what you tell them is age appropriate. But you can get them onboard, to varying degrees.

In His arms.

No, you need to continue to SHOW her, not so much talk...talk means nothing to the WW. it is actions. Actions like you were on the phone and she thought you were talking to another woman. Actions like you and daughter getting on with the family business. Actions like you continuing to meet her needs. Actions...not words.


She needs to not know the answer to that test, Dazed. As Lexxxy said, you need to tell her that you would rather be with her, but are prepared to be a great husband to whomever you end up with. As long as she knows you will never move onto someone else, she has no reason to stop cake eating.

Yo uare doing fine. it is time to start uping the pain level for her, by pulling back Dazed and by being confident and happy. Let her WS overactive mind think all sorts of things...let it haunt her!!

In His arms.