Tell me, why would a BW love the child ONLY IF the OW is not involved? Does she love the child, want to know the child or not? She'll love the child as her own, only if OW gives the child up for adoption? That doesn't make sense; that's a stipulation for love.

A BW who wants NC has NO LOVE for the OC, period. Why would an OW choose to give a child up for adoption simply so the father can be a part of the child's life? The BW (especially in this case) wants to give ZERO to the OC, why would an OW hand her child over to a family like that? A H who cheats, lies and a W who resents and wants nothing to do with the child. Why would that be an appealing scenario for an OW to choose over abortion or to adoption into a STABLE family?

We OW's had our babies because we love them and we want them. We cherish their existence, unlike the xMM/H's and BW's (for the most part). Plenty of women have children where the fathers have died, does that mean those women should give their children up for adoption- because there's no token father? There's more to life than have the DNA donor as a father figure, there are real men who love children and step up to care for them even if it's not theirs biologically. To base a woman's decision to keep her child or abort(or adoption) simply on the sperm donor's decision for C vs. NC is asinine.

If the father doesn't love or want the precious babies, OH WELL- WE DO!!!

Post deleted by Justuss

CLO - Because those babies deserve TWO parents, who are MARRIED to each other - committed, by law, and by covenant. Nowhere in that relationship is there room for a third wheel - and mothers who love their children value the role that fathers play in their children's lives, so they don't go messing with another woman's man, depriving their potential children of a covenant father!

Yeah - I know - talking to the wall that will never ever understand something as simple as MORALITY! ALL children deserve MORAL parents - so give the baby to two people who can give them that!

I couldn't have said it better myself! Do you understand, now, CLO?

You know, I didn’t post to start a debate. I didn’t ask any OW on this board for their opinions on whether or not you agree with mine & my H’s decisions for NC. This is the only decision, for now, that allows me to try and stay in my marriage and do the work to see if it will work. Staying with my H and keeping my family together is what is best for MY CHILDREN. We are MY ONLY concern. We are in counseling and have been since a month after D-day (almost a year now; we’re on our second one) and we are closer than we were in the past (and we were close). So staying together is also what is best for H & I too and I don’t just have to do it because it is what’s best for our kids only.

Needto, I didn’t realize you were an OW else I would not have responded to you the way I did. I don’t want to punish the OC; her mother birthed her into that. We pay CS, but I don’t feel OC is “entitled” to an increase every time H gets an increase. That should be the benefit of our kids & us. If it’s going to OC, when do my kids benefit from H’s financial betterment? Should our kids continue to be punished financially for OW & H’s mistakes? Clearly, the OW’s plan was to keep this baby AND keep it a secret (I wish she had), but of course, life is kicking her in her as* and she NOW realizes it’s too hard to answer her child’s question about “where’s my daddy?” when the cousin’s get picked up by their dad’s. Well she CAN’T change her mind NOW! She was financially capable of taking care of this child without H’s money. Even bought a house on her own. I don’t think money is her issue. She filed to “punish” my H for choosing not to jump and be in HER child’s life. NOW she finds her child needs a father. She NEVER told my H she was even pregnant. She told him when the baby was 2 mths. old demanding he be in her life (refusing to take a DNA test). He didn’t even have the opportunity to voice WHAT he’d like to do about the child and something tells me that if we give in to her first demand they will never stop. In MY view, the problem is hers. She needs to start looking for another man to be there for them because it’s NOT going to be MY husband. He was just a sperm donor in my opinion. Don’t you usually have to pay for sperm at a bank? Well I think she owes US money. I pray EVERY DAY that she finds a decent man to marry who can be a father figure to that child. That’s all I can do. I didn’t get married to be part of a triangle and I don’t feel obligated to have to be forced into one because of their mistake. If his need to be in OC’s life outweighs his need to continue to be a faithful husband & father then I will hold the door open for him and that’s just what I told him (after he told me he didn’t want contact). You said I’m making the OC suffer? No, her mother is making her suffer, me suffer, my kids suffer and H suffer. So you think if I open my life up to them I won’t continue to suffer? Who’s responsible for stopping my suffering? I am (& husband) and our decision, at least, lessens our suffering more than opening my life up to OW/OC drama. Please don’t tell me “you’re an adult and that is a child”. You’re right. But this adult is not responsible for stopping that child or her mother’s suffering and sorrow. Her mother is also an adult and was one when she made all HER adult decisions. I say LIVE WITH THEM!!!!! Just like I have to. She waited 5 years to file because the child is getting old enough to ask questions now and she has a fuc*ed up answer for her. I’ll bet she didn’t contemplate these problems when she was making HER DECISIONS. Sorry, but this is her problem. She’s just visiting it on us. She should have gone to the sperm bank like she was supposed to.

To everyone else who responded and given your SINCERE and REASONABLE advice, THANK YOU.

Oh yeah my pockets are lines real well <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" />. I never told her to not protect her family. I just reminded her to watch herself. Her post LYNNG had nothing to do with MB principles, but rather a agenda of in my opinion screwing the oc out of cs.

I've investaged this law quite a bit and have talked to several attorney's over it. Not only law attorney's, but Estate attorney's when doing my own will and life insuranc policy. I would hate to see anyone get them self into trouble over something that could have been avoided.

I never once told her not to protect her own family. Please show me where I did that and then I will apoligize. In fact I said I can understand the fact that you need to protect your family! Once again, you take what I said and take it out of context! STOP DOING THAT! I was not rude to her, or anything else. There was no need to start a war over my post. Please stop attacking me!

Kayla, as far as your opinion of me being a phony? May I ask you why? My colors don't change anywhere I go. My feelings and opinions are just that and don't change for where I am or who I'm talking too. I'm far from being a phony. As far as my feelings about cs. I feel the same for any child. Does not matter where how or who the child comes from. I have also said many many times before that I feel all children should be considered when calculating the cs as well.

This is an old argument. It always turns out the same. Just because I don't agree with the tatics used does not mean that I'm wrong or right. It's my opinion. All I said is do what you feel you need to do.

It also makes no sense when you come on here and say that the oc does not deserve. Guess what the facts are facts. The Mm helped created the oc. You say you don't want the oc to get a cost of living raise. That you don't want to take away from your children. You husband did that. NOT OC! NOT OW! Your husband. Now if he has children before the marriage would you do the same thing to avoid having to pay a cost of living increase when it comes up? Would you honestly do that to any of his kids?

Foreverdamaged, I was not trying to insult you. I was not rude to you at all. If you would have never known I was an FOW you probaly would have not taken my advise out of context now would you?

Kay when you say morailty, remember your including your husband in that. He took part in the "morailty".

People, I don't remember ever saying anything about contact versus no contact! Correct me if I'm wrong. I never brought it up. It's a moot point. HELLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLO!

Foreverdamage, just because I'm a fow does not mean I condoned MY behavior. Just as your HUSBAND, I paid my dues for what I did. And believe it or not, I was not giving you my opinion. I was giving you advise from the actualy laws. My xmm almost ended his butt in jail for "TRYING" something simular. If it weren't for me agreeing to put the money he owed my child else where for her, he would have had to explain to the Judge why he lied and moved things around after he was served. By what his attorney told my attorney, His CPA as well did this all for him. And it backfired because it was not truthful. I don't blame you for not wanting to provide YOURS for this child. All I'm saying is your husband took part. It's beyond me why she waited so long. But I guess that is neither here or there. And common sense would have told her if she does NOT need the money that by having him served 5 years after the fact is not going to make him a father. The law does not make a man be a father, just be finaancial supportive.

NTMO - You distinctly said that this woman should be mindful of the needs of the OC - and I flat-out told you it was shameful for you to put any kind of guilt trip on her - she bears NO responsibility for that child; that child's existence impacts and diminishes the quality of life her own children will have.

So again, I ask you to back off of your agenda to constantly remind us that the OC deserves a good life - her mother chose to have that child receive a diminished quality of life the moment she chose to KEEP that child, knowing that an essential part of the parenting would not be there, or in hopes that she could deprive legitimate children from that vital part of life in favor of her child.

The attitude that CLO demonstrates - that loving mothers don't give up their babies so that they can have TWO parents - that fathers are not vital, necessary parts of the equations, just simply ATMs that they get unearned cash out of every month, is what allows women to continue having children from extra-marital affairs, and why we have a social crisis in our country, and in fact any country which fosters casual sex.

Babies need their dadies. Women who love their babies see to it that they either get in relationships with men who can fulfill that role without harming another family - or they give the baby up for adoption.

Oh - and the woman who brought up the children who don't have fathers due to death - well, that's not an issue for discussion on THIS board, is it - just a distraction from the painful issue and solution involving children born of infidelity.

***edit***


So bash the MM all you want; take what you think you can get away with "for the sake of your little one". If she has any kind of moral backbone in her at all, she will not appreciate these circumstances at all. As a woman, I am as capable of earning a full household income as any man; if I were in your place, I would NEVER take resources away from legitimate children to care for a choice I made to keep my child. At the same time, I'd make myself attractive for a legitimate relationship with a good man.

And if I was a younger woman, with little career training, and could not provide that financial care BY MYSELF, then I would make the choice to give the baby up for adoption - as much as I love my son - he needs and deserves a father.

As it is, I know that my existence and especially my mother's EMA contributed to the premature death of a father, who's children desperately needed him.

Don't do the OC any favors by pushing this further. There are ripples yet for you to experience as a FOW. When your daughter has to make sense out of the incomprehensible pain you were a part of... If you are a good mother, you will teach her a strong moral code, but if you fail to do that to cover , minimize or excuse your sins, you will create chaos of biblical proportions, the sins of the parents, visited upon the heads of the children to the third and fourth generation... Ever wonder how this curse comes about? I live it every day - even if I've forgiven and live a happy, successful and moral life!

NTMO - I was the one who said you are a phony. Need I copy and paste a quote(s) from "the other board"?!!! Oh no - gasp, awe, etc. Don't think it's necessary. I think most of us see through you.

You know if you spent half of the time and effort you spend on here giving your "opinion(s)" on legal advice, what married couples should be doing when it comes to OC's, etc. etc., you may accomplish or do something productive in your life.

We don't want to hear anymore of your whining about MM being just as responsible as OW or as you call yourself FOW. Listen lady, you and you only have (had) the utlimate choice in the pregnancy. You weren't forced to spread emmm wide. But . . . you'll never get it. Take responsibility for YOUR choices. I would be so ashamed to behave like many of you OW's or FOW's.

You know what it boils down to - $$$$$ and doing everything in your power to continue the drama and make sure the MM's family suffer for YOUR CHOICE. I FIRMLY believe that. After all is said and done and MM doesn't want anything to do with you, (you were used because you were easy), then the fangs and claws come out. Parenting can't be forced, so your only recourse is to go for the $$$$ and continue on with the drama.

Bottom line - The OW/FOW chose the life the OC would lead, knowing full well she slept with and got pregnant by a MM - - he wasn't AVAILABLE.

Men - - you know they have two heads, but can think with only one at a time. Well guess which one they were "thinking" with when the loving act took place. HELLLOOOO!

KaylaAndy, Lynn G keep on keeping on.

Forever-Damaged - you're doing well and thinking logically.
Apologies for the threadjack.

Hi Forever. Sorry to have you here but welcome. I haven't posted in awhile but your post touches home with me. I may jump around abit so please try to follow. First off go to the attorney. TRUST ME. But do be careful. I went to three and only had to pay for consultation to one. The first lawyer was all about divorce. Trying to talk me into getting it all since he committed adultry. The second was all about the OC. Treated me like a bi**h for trying to protect mine. The third did a legal seperation so I would have the winning CS order. See I don't know about your state but here the first CS order wins. Meaning if she already has a CS order your screwed. In my stich I found out about A and OC when I received the DSS papers requesting CS so there was no order yet. Yes I paid an attorney $1200 to go threw with this but feel in the end it was worth it. I found out without a CS order for me and my three kids this ****** and her 1 brat would get $600 to $800 a month and if I ever did leave him I would only get about $600 for my three. Where's the fairness here? But since I filed first I get $1700.00 and she may get about $200. Yes it may seem like fraud to most but so was the affair. Fight fire with fire. If the ho thought she would fu*k her way to get my assets that I've worked for 13 years she was wrong. And sorry to those who feel "poor OC". We the wives are not doing anything to them. They have their mother (1st and foremost) and sorry [censored] fathers to blame. See these OW are the real losers. If you start sleeping with a married man (loser) and DECIDE to get with and keep a baby (bigger loser) then your no more then a high payed ho. See these woman use the baby as cover. It's not about the baby at all for them. It's about the money. If it was about the kid first off you would have made SURE you didn't get pg by a family man. Come on ladies we are in control of our body. If you did by some strange reason get pg then dont keep it or if you do realize YOU are making the choice to be a single parent because I know at least 95% of these men say right out and early they don't want it. But funny how their imput dosen't matter. They get no choice. Men are dumb. They want all the sex they can get so these affairs to them really are nothing. However when the golddigger acting like the perfect woman come along and gets pg by lies and deception then waltzes in and ruins a family all for their personal gain, how are we the wives the bit*h's for protecting what WE have earned? Do you feel because they serviced our men like a cheap ho off the street they suddenly deserve what I"VE worked hard for? See in the old days if the kid is a bast**d sorry no rights. Not even CS. But oh no now a days our courts help the ho's. I mean in my state she was going to HURT my three kids and the state tells me it's none of my business. They told me it didn't matter how many mouths my H has to feed or how many kids we have. They are all on her side. Also the going back and revising her CS because you file for CS i know here dose not matter. The first order will always win. And secondary orders don't matter. My girlfriend's baby daddy did that to her. He took her back to court to revise his CS to her because he got married and had another baby so he felt that he had a legal family would prove he couldn't pay the $408 a month because he had other mouths to feed. The judge lowered his CS $8 a month. That's it. So do go to an attorney. Look hard you should be able to find one with free consult.
Anyway let me go. People hate long post. I feel this is the place for them. I mean we are here to vent.

ForeverDamaged

You continue to look out for your family. Good for you.

Your children should not be asked to sacrifice their own well-being.

Do ~every single cotton-picking thing~ possible to protect yours.

That is your right.
That is your duty.
That is your responsibility.

If ~any obstacle~ stands between your children and their wellbeing ... You may feel a noble obligation to move that obstacle away from your children.

That is your role as the parent of your own children.

You are also free to be as generous as you desire to other women's children at your whim, when you feel like it, and for as long as you feel like it. Without obligation of duty or "you must help out". NOT if it sacrifices something for you own children. You may decide to go as far as the law dictates and no further, or you may decide to go further. It is fully your choice to go beyond your husband's legal obligation.

You and your dear husband need to become a team/partnership of extraordinary determination to protect the family you have.

God Bless.

Actually I said her husband does. She does not. Re read my post Kay.

NTMO - I was the one who said you are a phony. Need I copy and paste a quote(s) from "the other board"?!!! Oh no - gasp, awe, etc. Don't think it's necessary. I think most of us see through you.



If you'd like. I know exactly what post your talking about and I said nothing different than I've said here. Why if your going to lurk and "try" to use things, not join in?

You know if you spent half of the time and effort you spend on here giving your "opinion(s)" on legal advice, what married couples should be doing when it comes to OC's, etc. etc., you may accomplish or do something productive in your life.


Geez Nut, you seem to get around a lot as I see you at the other board daily, why don't you practive what you preach. Anyway who are you to say that? Who died and made you God?

We don't want to hear anymore of your whining about MM being just as responsible as OW or as you call yourself FOW. Listen lady, you and you only have (had) the utlimate choice in the pregnancy. You weren't forced to spread emmm wide. But . . . you'll never get it. Take responsibility for YOUR choices. I would be so ashamed to behave like many of you OW's or FOW's.

You and a few others Nut.

You know what it boils down to - $$$$$ and doing everything in your power to continue the drama and make sure the MM's family suffer for YOUR CHOICE. I FIRMLY believe that. After all is said and done and MM doesn't want anything to do with you, (you were used because you were easy), then the fangs and claws come out. Parenting can't be forced, so your only recourse is to go for the $$$$ and continue on with the drama.


I guess your probaly right. But it boils down on both ends now does it not? I see no fangs and claws out unless someone purposly tries to screw over a child of any kind.

HOw would you like your husband to try and do that to your kids? Oh that is different right? How? His blood runs through all of them.


Bottom line - The OW/FOW chose the life the OC would lead, knowing full well she slept with and got pregnant by a MM - - he wasn't AVAILABLE.


Does the MM know that? Also your right I choose my oc's life. She will have a wonderful life. She has family and friends that love her and she does not need for anything. EVERYONE that comes into contact with her love her and can't stop loving her. She is truely a gift from God just as all our children are. Or are you saying differently?

Again, anyone is welcome to read my posts anywhere I post. I have nothing to hide and your words mean nothing unless you have something to back it up with.

ForeverDamaged

This is a MARRIAGE BUILDING and recovery forum. The intent of this site is to give you and your spouse the tools to put your marriage back on track so your family can remain happily intact, even following the horrors of infidelity and all the ugly consequences that brings. Sometimes the marriage is not recoverable, then the site can help you with your personal recovery.

When you sift through the various responses you will get on this site, please use a critical eye to filter out useless static that puts you off your purpose ... and put any advice written to you to the litmus test ---> Is the advice I am getting focused on my personal recovery, or my family unit's recovery, or on my our marriage recovery???

If the advice seems to be focused on and more concerned with conditions and persons ~outside~ your marriage/family relationship ... be less inclined to give that advice as much weight as stuff that helps you and yours.

ForeverDamaged ... My husband had an affair. We are 10 years into a fantastic recovery.

We are in love, happy and very much past the past.

If you want help with how to stay married after infidelity, I very much suggest you listen to advice offered by persons who have lived MARRIAGE recovery.

You are also welcome to post on the other MB forums like RECOVERY or GENERAL QUESTIONS. Those forums have higher traffic and you will get much good MARRIAGE BUILDING advice .... just not so much talk about OC and all of that.

Take care.

Permission from NTMO to post her post from "the other board". Here it is in quotation marks below.

*****************edit*************

**We aren't going to copy posts from other boards unless they are pertaining to and beneficial to marriage building.**

So Kayla,

If you were pregnant and your H died, you would give your child up for adoption so your child could have a father in it's life?

That's virtually what you're saying. Children shouldn't be born into a home unless there is a mother and a father.

How about Grandfathers? Uncles? Step-fathers? They're not enough of a male role model, only a bio dad can be a father figure?

This may be your value of a biological father, but it's not mine.

AND FOR THE RECORD:
I didn't mention CS or anything about receiving money from the xMM.

My only point was that a woman's decision to keep her baby should not be based on the involvement (or lack thereof) from the sperm donor.

moved it.