Mel,

SH really wanted my wife to be the one to expose herself to parents, but with me present. He felt there would be great value in her doing so rather than me because of her previous comments about me being controlling, etc..... He said to try and get MC (a third party, any third party, but a professional would be best) to convince her to do the above. She really wants to play the blackmail game. I reminded her she was not locked in the house, I just was not going to put up with certain behaviors anymore, such as separate lives, emotional separation, physical separation (ie the bedroom), contact with OM, (obviously), not working a plan together, etc.... She was either going to chose OM or me. If she choose OM, she could get out last Thursday night or anytime. She even tried to pull the "I am not commiting to anything in granite". I said fine, to me that is a choice she is making and therefore she can move out and go to OM. When we got married we committed to a life together and I am not accepting anything less than a commitment to work and remain married. I understand she has the feelings issue, but I am not playing the game of "not being really committed". She will either work on a plan or be gone. I see no blackmail there. I just am not going to lie for her. I don't call this Plan B, it is my Plan A with some thump and boundries. If she moves out then I move to a Plan B. This may not be a full MB principal but I am at war and some if this has to be on the fly and the regulation books (like at Normandy) have to go out the window sometimes when at war.

Don't get me wrong, I want her to have feelings and ultimately stay because of her love for me, but she is so stubborn and protective of her turf, I feel she has to be blown off the stump. I feel I have done that.


Back on track. Regarding the few days working toward exposure:

Because my meeting with SH was yesterday and we had a MC appt today (someone she trusts and talks to) that today would be a good chance at that.

I know she is using the health as a crutch. She also fears one of 2 things. Either she never told in the first place what was going on and her parents have no idea about the A or she is afraid they will really come down on her hard like they did her sister 3 yrs ago. I believe the later. I think she told about "inappropriate behavior" but did not call it what is was and down played its role in our sitch and up sold my "personality flaws" as the reason for her struggles.

She admitted she was wrong tonight and knows it was wrong about the affair. She knows not to push the button of "it was nothing" or "it wasn't an affair". She even told me tonight she regretted that we had the kind of marriage that she felt she needed to keep things from me. I said AMEN to that. She did not know what to say.

I really feel like exposure will come sooner rather than later, but I want to follow SH's plan. He says she can't hear what I am telling her, so me trying to get her to do so is falling on deaf ears. SH says he thinks he can get her to see the value. I personally think she will not expose herself. I will have to do it, but I will wait a few days. But like I said, tomorrow, I get to talk to my SIL and that meeting and exposure of my knowledge about her involvement will go a long way.

Thanks for the at a boy Lady. You too Mel. You gals are great. I hope my WW becomes a active member some day and gets to follow you guys and some helpful and sometimes sharp banter.

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

WOL, that sounds great. I second your decision to stick with SH's advice. He is smart, strategic and knows what he is doing. In fact, when you think about it, his plan is downright brilliant because your W does think you are controlling. Even though she has pretty much ceded control of her life over to you and then blames you for that. I am so glad you reminded her that she is not locked in the house. She has played that card for years with great results. No more will that card work for her and I am relieved that you recognize that.

What you are doing are exactly in line with Marriage Builders principles. You are squeezing her affair and making it as uncomfortable as possible. Now she is facing the consequences squarely and has to decide if she wants to give up everything for this silly affair. That is the kind of pressure she needs to feel.

Just don't forget the carrot part of Plan A, ok? <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

You are doing great!

Hey everyone, I need a little help with something. I really think my WW would be curious enough right now to read some post. What I was thinking if there were some really good historys coming from the WS angle where no hope was there for the WS. No feelings, love lost, love crushed by not meeting needs and then recovered.

I found Dorry's and I thought I remember a couple of other very good ones.

Does anyone have any ideas or links to share that I can forward to her via email.

BTW Mel, I very much have the Carrot of Plan A out there. I was really showing her what she would be missing out on if she left. The new me <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />. Just kidding a little, but I am providing a safe landing zone for her with improvements I am making along the way.

Hi Waiting, Breathe buddy - you are doing great.

Just one thing though. Don't take any more waiting for feelings crap from her. That was just fog babble talk from her. She has to understand that...

1. You are going to do everything to break up the affair and exposure is key to ensuring that happens. Agree with SH allowing her to do it with her parents with you present. But you have to expose to bust the affair up. Nothing else you do will be as effective.

2. OM is a piece of s**t for going after a married woman and is beneath contempt. He is not just some innocent party trapped by her - my own wife still feels way too much responsibility for her affair. The OM in our case clearly planned and executed the affair and would not take no for an answer - doesn't exonorate my wife - she still said yes to the affair but the OM was the cause of it starting in our case.

3. This is most important. Get this into her. If you both follow the MB principals, the feelings of love WILL come back. But it's like the chicken & the egg - which comes first - love or acts of love? It's pretty clear to me that you are both going to have to meet each others EN's in order for love to return. This will be uncomfortable for her but she is going to have to do it. I've told you before my wife did that for me. I know what that cost her & I know what I am talking about.

4. She's going to be in a fog and withdrawal - let her get over that before you waste too much of your energy on EN's - as you know Love Bank deposits are impossible to make during withdrawal. Can you 2 get away for a few weeks alone together?

5. Remember the Total Honesty thing - she has to sit down with you and come clean - blow by blow about all aspects of the affair. I recommend doing that right now while she is still in withdrawal as it will cause a lot of love bank withdrawals - but better now than later.

6. It will get better waiting. With the affair all busted up and you snooping, checking up and verifying, making her accountable for her time, love is inevitable if you meet each others EN's

7. WHat did she get up to while you were away hunting recently?

8. Keep her on a short leash. Very, Very short.

If anything I have said conflicts with SH, ignore me. He is the master at this point.

I wish my wife could come on and give you some encouragement but we are not living at home at the moment - moved because of OM next door neighbour - I work from home still & kept all computers here. OM just sold his house and will be gone forever in a couple of weeks so we will be coming back home.

Wife is still a bit shamed and embarassed anyway.

Dorry's story is a good one.

Not too sure about WW snooping around marriage builders though - it's mainly BS's here and some can be a little harsh to the waywards. You also don't want her to know everything you are up to or have been up to here - best to let stuff unfld with SH maybe.

Mate, I'm so relieved for you. My D-Day was around the time you started this thread I think. We are 4 months into recovery. Our situation was bleak with wife moving out to live with OM. But God is able to do exceedingly abundantly more than you ever ask or think and All things are working together for good for us and they will for you too. In 3 months you will look back and all this misery will be a faint memory. Just believe.

Blessings buddy.

WOL-

WTG man!!

One thing I want to make sure I understand...you are exposing, regardless if you're wife agrees to work on the marriage or not, yes?

If the answer is no, then this DOES sound like blackmail. Now, don't get me wrong...a little extortion to do the right thing works like a charm...LOL! But personally, I'd be working under the MO that you're GOING TO expose regardless...but what you're asking for here is that your wife come clean on her own, with you present so that you can SEE that she's being honest with them this time.

Did SH recommend that you NOT expose if she agrees to work on the M with you? Or how was this supposed to work exactly?

Regardless...it sounds to me like you're moving in the right direction!

Don't worry. I is not going to happen again. I am done on that front. SH is going to handle that next week and I am not playing that waiting game "no pun intended" any longer. I will keep my screen name from now on as a reminder, but it is really not going to happen unless she pushes through and acts on love. She knows what I think on that front.



I will not take no for an answer. Either she will or I will, but I am going to try to let things work out per SH's plan.


Yep, Isn't it pathetic how they (WS's) want to protect the precious OM/OW. Even in the face of knowing it was wrong they still want to protect and not cause that [censored] hurt/pain/financial ruin. Makes me want to throwup. Pardon my harse language but it does. I believe OM plotted also in my case as is still playing her at the expense of our marriage. I plan on ruining him to the best of my ability without getting myself in trouble in an effort to end the affair.


See #1 above for my feelings on that. I aggree.



I know, that is the bad part. Now we have to do thw withdrawel thing again. I will do what I can on EN's because it is tough to tell what she is thinking. I wish we could get away. Unfortunately we cannot at this time.


I have tried to get all info out, ie sex or whatever may have occured. She says all info is disclosed and short of truth serum I don't know of another way to find out.



That is my prayer and hope.


Nothing, she was pretty wrapped up with the kids. I am sure she called him, but her free time was very limited. She got to see what life without me was like while raising 2 active boys. It is pretty much what I have been doing for 3 years while she was running around doing horse shows and having an A.


Doing the best I can there. She is hard to keep up with because of our kids schedule, doctors appointments, etc... At least the OM is 4 hours away, of course I know that can change and people do drive long distances to see lovers, etc.. but I hope that is not the case. But neverless, I am doing what I can.


So far everyone has been pretty much in step with SH but will do.


I think I will back off on her running around on MB site and keep Dorry's story handy for later. Especially since she is in the fog right now.


All of the above gives me hope. Thanks so much for sharing. God's speed on your recovery.

WOL

Owl, thanks, I must have been responding to BK when you posted. See below.


Yep, I am exposing either way. In fact I am waiting for a specific time to expose on the OM side of things too. I am starting with his Dad and make an appeal to him to try to curb is son's behavior.

I do have a question about that. Once I start exposing OM on his side of the world, do I let my WW know or let her find out on her own. I was thinking let her find out on her own sort of as a gauge to let me know if OM has been in contact with her. Of course if she asks me about it I would tell her the truth. Just curious if I should let her know when I start bombing OM's territory.


She knows that I want her to do it and so do the MC's and she knows that it will happen with success in the marraige or not. I am just giving her the chance to do it herself in order to show myself as not being controlling but she knows that it will happen either way. SH wants me to let someone convince her of that.


No what he said was, that you expose to the point where she is responding to MB principles. That can be 1 person, 2 people , many people. I think he wants me to save some bullets. Today's haircut/visit with SIL is going to be very strategic and SH gave me advice on how to handle that.



I certianly hope so. I know I feel better and more sure of myself right now. Before I felt I was feeling my way along. Now I feel like my eyes are opening and I am looking the enemy square in the face.

My thoughts on what the enemy is: (The enemy is not my wife, but the sin of the affair) I am out to destroy the affair. Not my wife, nor OM, etc.. God will ultimately take care of OM's behavior just as he will mine on what I have done wrong in my life.

Any action toward OM is an effort on my part to end and kill the affair. Others not familiar with MB's (such as my wife, her family, OM's family/customers/friends) will perceive all this as being vindictive, hurtful, etc... but it is all part of war. I am fighting a war to save our marriage so we can build a better one. I will stop at nothing less. I may not win the war but I will certianly put up a good fight.

Thanks for your support.

This is exactly the right attitude!! It is so important to identify the enemy, and the enemy is not the spouse, but the affair! This is why I get concerned when I hear BS' say they don't want to "hurt" the WW by exposing. They are not hurting the WW, but the AFFAIR, which is HELPFUL to the WW and the marriage.

This is a letter I am going to give to my SIL in a couple of hours. Please let me know what you think. I have edited out names and replace with SIL, BIL, WW, etc....


12/28/2005

SIL,


Thanks for cutting my hair today. I have not had it cut since August when (friend of mine) buzzed it at (our annual golf trip) with the clippers. Man that was an experience. I hope you were not too uncomfortable doing so.

I just wanted to tell you in writing so there is no confusion about the purpose of what I am about to say.

I would like to ask your forgiveness about how I have treated you and BIL over the last couple of years. I offer no excuse because there is none. I was hurt and angry by what I saw the family going through especially WW. There was hardly a night that would go by that she did not cry about the situation or her estrangement from you and it tore me up. Seeing that made my anger toward you and BIL and the situation grow even more. I hope you and BIL will find it in your heart to forgive me.

I don't expect that things will be back to "normal" whatever that means, but hopefully we can move forward and at least be able to be in the same room together without feeling uncomfortable. I have released myself of my anger toward the two of you a few weeks ago. That is why I was able to come Christmas Eve without any fireworks or visual daggers being shot across the room.

I have many regrets about what I have done in my life. I am sure most people feel this way if you live long enough. One of my biggest regrets was getting involved with trying to keep you and (former BIL) from getting divorced. While on the surface that sounds good, I have paid a very severe price for that. You see, blood is thicker than water and I am the lone person standing, just as BIL said would happen. Your parents, WW and everyone have reconciled to you and BIL. Our efforts to persuade you to stay with former BIL failed. I do not wish you and BIL any ill will at all. I just wish I had said my peace and WW done the same and let the chips fall were they may.

I just did not want to see a marriage fail that meant so much to the whole family, nor did we want to see Nephew1 and Nephew2's parents split up. I hope you can see that.

Now I find myself in a similar position. My WW has had an affair, which you are aware of with a horse trainer in TN. I can't bring myself to even type his name. As you know, I discovered the affair back in Sept and since then Ww has gradually told me facts related to the affair. I have been under the impression that WW was working on our Marriage via counseling and had agreed to have no further relationship or contact with the OM (other male). I have since found out that she has broken that promise to me and lied to keep the affair going. To make matters worse, I found out that you have known about the affair and even enabled it by contacting him for her while she was in the hospital in town back in July and August.

Needless to say, I was shocked and further shocked that you have talked to my WW about him since then almost like he was a boyfriend and even asking WW to tell him you said Hello.

SIL, I know you know this is wrong and not the kind of behavior someone trying to work on a marriage should have. I am not asking you to get involved at all. In fact, I really want you to please stay away from the topic of our marriage with any of us. If for the sake of no one else, please consider my DS15 and DS13. They do not want to see their parents divorced. I do not either. It will be bad enough for them to know one day about their mothers affair if she leaves, but even more hurtful would be to find out their aunt knew about it and enabled it.

I hope you can understand why I am asking you this. I want us (you and I) to be able to have a relationship again, but the latest revelation, if this continues will make it impossible to do so. I do not want to be estranged from you any longer. I hope you will see the virtue in what I am asking you. One day if WW decides to stay and work things out with me, we will all be grateful. I just hope and pray that day does come.

Yours in Christ,


WOL

on the exposure - I wouldn't give her any forwarning - she will tell you not to and it will then be a lb when you do it. No. Let OM get PO'd and ring her and you will find out that way what she thinks.

Exposure is to bust up the affair - not vengence or anything else.

Regarding letter to SIL, I wouldn't do it. I'd make it verbal. I wouldn't give her anything in writing that she can turn against you later. But that's just me.

Praying for you, WOL!

Thanks for the advice. I will use it regarding exposure on OM. Regarding the letter, I have already done it. I put in the letter the same things I have said to my WW as of last Thursday and even last night, so nothing there would be a surprise to her if she tried to turn it agaist me. I am sure WW will be furious with me, but I am prepared for that and will make no appoligies.

Mel, Thanks for the prayers.

You guys are great.

Last night went pretty good. I don't think SIL had talked to my wife yet about the letter. In fact I don't think she has talk to her this morning either. WW seemed to be in a good mood this morning, brought me some meds I left at home.

She did not seem distant at all. She went to the funeral home yesterday with our DS13 and his friend. Our son had a friend at school who's mother passed away and Christmas Day from a stroke and Grandfather passed away on the 26th. It has been real sad in our community. Anyway, there was a big crowd at the funeral home for visitation and when WW came home we were talking about it and she made the comment that going there sure puts things in perspective. I said yes it does, but to be honest, I am not sure what she meant by it.

We all, both sons and my oldest son's girlfriend played a new game we got for Christmas, Catch Phrase. It was a lot of fun. WW and I went against the 3 of them. We had a good time and then watched Polar Express.

It is just weird that she seems to be moving out of withdrawel real fast, but no signs of her coming around on affection or "love feelings".

I really don't expect anything this soon after 2nd D-day but with little sign of withdrawel it just seems weird.

She called me a little while ago and said she was thinking of having a surprise 16th birthday for oldest DS on Sunday. My family, her family (who I have been estranged from until Christmas Eve), some of his friends, pizza, something simple. You could have knocked me over with a feather. She has wanted to have nothing to do with any of our families together for over 6 months and really been fairly anti-social except to very close friends. Man, she has got me wondering what the heck she is thinking.

Does this sound like recovery? False Recovery? Running from Withdrawel? Any ideas?

Hi Waiting,

Exposure and confession has a way of healing anyone, and that is what has happened with your wife. The lies, secrets, and deceptions have been exposed, and now it's going to be easier for your marriage to heal, because all of that is not hanging over her head anymore persay. That evil snare is not lurking there anymore, bringing a freedom in her soul. I understand more exposure has to be done with other family members. But she has gotten a breakthrough through the exposure, and her confession. (Confess your sins to one another that you may be healed). Hopefully, it is the beginning of a good honest recovery. And hopefully she will keep it that way. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Blessings,
Lady

Ladysheep, are you unaware Waiting is having to re-expose because of continued contact with the other man? I think you're quite a bit premature on the healing thing.

Longhorn,

I am aware, sad to say of Waitings re-exposure of OM and his W. The fact that it was all exposed by Waiting, and confession was made in front of Waiting, God and the MC by Waitings W, leads me to believe that there has been some fog lifted with his W, therefore there does comes a freedom with that.
When you confess sins to the one you have hurt and God, don't you feel better?
This can be the beginning of a healing. However, I don't know how his W will react to his continued exposure to other family members, and of OM himself.



Waiting, I think going to the funeral made your W possilby think of the now and the hereafter. She said it did put things into perspective. You would be surprised what God can use to get through to people, the importance of this life and the way we live. And Waiting didn't have to speak a word, God did. Now she is thinking of the importance of her family, wanting all the family together for DS 16th B-day. When wives are in their right mind, they do want good memories for there families. Hopefully she is re-thinking her position in the family and her marriage... what is important to and for them. And I truly hope it is a positive change that will last.

Lady

Sorry, I don't think that's appropriate yet. One tiny glimmer of light and some folks think the hurricane is over. It's more likely just the eye of the storm passing overhead and there's a lot more hard weather still to get through.

I base my judgments on what people DO, not what they say and this wife has not DONE anything except make an adulterous reconnection with the other man (if, indeed, it ever stopped). I think we should wait and see what happens when Waiting re-exposes before we get overly optimistic.

Likely she will react just like all WS', with anger. But we will find that out for sure when he finishes his very necessary and important exposure to her parents.

Lady and Longhorn

Thanks for your comments. I think you are both right to a degree after thinking about it more. I think she does feel some relief, but when the exposure hits the fan I expect lots of attitude again.

Something else strange happened a little while ago. She asked me out on a date. Well, that is not a completely accurate statement. She had my DS13 call me (she was driving, so she asked him to call me for her) to see if I wanted the 3 of us, DS13 included to go see Narnia tonight.

DS15 is spending the night with friends. I could not believe it. For one thing, she does not like Sc-Fi/Fantasy Movies, only chick flicks, and another thing she hasn't really wanted to go anywhere with me even if with the kids.

Hum???

Oh yea, Go Horns, Beat SC. We are pulling for you guys.

Go GaTech, beat Utah. - We are playing today in the Emerald Bowl. Hardly a BCS bowl but at least we are bowling.