You know what is particularly sad and sickening about this? She admits that she knows her H would not want to stay married to her, yet she has denied him that right and that choice. She is keeping him in the marriage based on a LIE for her own personal convenience. I honestly cannot think of anything more manipulative, disrespectful or cruel. She has denied him the right to determine his own life by withholding facts from him. She is treating him like her PET, a piece of property.

But truly, by keeping her secret for her, you cause yourself more harm than good. She is a fully loaded pistol that could be fired at any time. What would be sad is if she shot you again after you had every opportunity to disarm her. I hope you make that choice, want2bstrong, not only for yourself, but for the sake of her H and her future victims. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

You are right MelodyLane! I never considered future victims. I agree that I need to tell the OWH. But, I want my H to do it with me & he is reluctant because of our pastor's advice.

Ok, SNT:

I have intenionally been avoiding your posts because my "POV" on things has often been seen as "too harsh" or not "supportive" enough to struggling Newbies. I am currently under a mandated 7 day "supervisory" period before being allowed to post to newbies. Unfortunately for you, the restricted access has been lifted.... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/pfft.gif" alt="" />

Well, you've been here long enough and contributed enough to know "what the deal is"...so I am gonna step on in to your thread now....

I agree wholeheartedly with your wife and everyone else's perception of things.

Your ACTIONS today said alot.....Remember, to me (and likely your wife)....your word is worth about as much as a dirt trader in Pakistan's 401K plan.......aka ZILCH, NADA, ZERO.

I have watched you use the term "fog" on a number of threads here and in a way "allowing" yourself and your conscious a generous "way out".....after all, in your own words......"it wasn't me who did those things, it was the fog".....well, it would be nice if that were really true, BUT it WAS YOU who did this, and now it is YOU who has to try and repair this.

YOu f-ed up bad here (with the affair)....but I know that you know this, and me hammering you about this is of no use to anyone....However, you need to KNOW that ACTIONS like today that DO NOT protect your wife and SHOW her what you AGREED to in trying to win her respect and trust back will indeed put you back to "PRE-SQUARE ONE".

Now, all is not lost......but STOP trying to be "logical" about it. STOP trying to continue to be selfish and weasel your way out of accepting the consequences of your actions. Stop using BS execuses of "getting shot" to do what needs to be done.

If you are gonna shot, you might as well be a man about it and go down doing the right thing... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" />

Become an open book, and STOP trying to protect YOURSELF and the OW here.....you are doing it, and those of us who are looking at this from the "stands", see it plain as day.

You feel terrible? So what.........imagine that feeling magnified 10,000 X and then you may get a glimpse of what your wife has been through.

"Sack up", and do what you need to to here....OK? Trust me, it will matter to your wife in telling the OWH.....untill you do, your wife will have nagging doubts EVERYTIME there is the slightest inkling of uncertainty....She will always think that it means that you held out telling the OWH just to "hedge your bets" and "keep the backup" in case things don't work out.

Boss.......YOU CANNOT AFFORD THAT UNCERTAINTY.....You're like a cancer survivor who responded to an "experimental drug".....BY THE BOOK ONLY HERE....You have given up the liberties to do otherwise. If I was your wife, you'd be out on your A$$ and would be paying alimony and Child support now....you should still be counting your lucky stars that your wife is that more forgiving and a better person than me...and now you are even tempting that.

I commend you for being here and trying to do what is right here...but, you have seen that "doing it with logic" doesn't work. You've done enough damage to last a lifetime to your wife....now it's time to try it another way.

I can promise you that if you think you are gonna get "past this" with the nice tidy "fog" explanation, explaing away your choices with the "it wasn't really me" you have another thing coming...It is all going to come out...IT ALWAYS DOES...and if it doesn't....you die praying it never does.....Not a way to go through life.

Think about these things for a few minutes.

There are "logical" reasons why you feel so terrible, but they are not what you think.

I am not kicking you when you are down here, but you need a 2 X 4' here, .......harsh? maybe, but tepid all things considered...

Remember.......TOTAL TRANSPARENCY..."TOTAL"....

100% repsonsibility......Time is ticking....your on the clock.


Lem <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

You know what I would do? Your H can't be expected to willingly bust himself and trying to force him to do so will not only be futile but will cause unncessary fights to no good purpose. I would suggest just doing it yourself and then telling your H. You have a higher moral obligation to warn this man that he has/is being victimized than to placate his victimizer [your H]. The man needs to be told, regardless of whether or not your H agrees or wants to do it. The most important thing is that the man is warned so he can protect himself, and that is the obligation of anyone who knows about it.

Could your H be reluctant because he is holding out hope of a future replay? I would point out that this is usually the reason. The risk of a recurrance is always greater if the spouse does not know, because your H will be free to pursue the OW. Her H would be none the wiser because as far he is concerned, they are just friends.

SNT,

He has the right to know. He has the right to decide if he wants to be married to a WW or not. It is his decision. You need to tell him because she won't. It's the right thing to do. You know it, I'm sure. But it is also the hard thing to do and that is why you are resisting it.

Be strong and do the right thing for everybody involved (yes, even the OW). As long as she doesn't have to take responsibility for her actions, she won't be forced to examine herself and her life and take the necessary steps to work on her problems, whatever they might be.

I can hear that you are still torn about your decision to tell the OWH. Read and re-read all of the above. Talk to your wife. Pray. Then, trust that whatever decision you make (not what you do because you feel others think it is the right course of action) will be the right one.

I do agree with everyone, though. I can understand how your wife would be very hurt by the OW breaking NC and the car, etc. As you read and pray, are you beginning to understand how your previous logic may have been faulty? It's got to be hard for you as a WS to be going through such a hard time of realizing how many bad decisions you are capable of making. It sounds like you have recently begun to make great ones. Forgive yourself for the blunders of yesterday and get back on track, if you still want to be married.



You said you felt like you were "spiriling". Hang in there, SNT. Your wife has been hurt again. My guess is that she is encouraged that you told her so quickly about the call from the OW but that your responses of 1)taking the call, 2)giving her more time with the car and caring about the OW's predicament, and 3)protecting the OW (which is the only way your wife can see this) by not facing the truth with the OWH has made her question whatever progress toward R you have made.

Remember, whatever hurt reaction she had to yesterday wouldn't have happened if she didn't want your marriage to recover. Would she be mad if the reality of you caring for the OW didn't matter to her? No matter how her reaction sent you "spiraling", you can bet she is too.

Don't give up hope! I'm with Dorry...ask your wife to call with you. If you decide this is the course of action to take, TAKE IT NOW and end your wife's pain at this unresolved issue.

Just wanted to reiterate Dr. Harley's words that Noliving posted:

"From my perspective, honesty is part of the solution to infidelity, and so I'll take honesty for whatever reason, even if it's to relieve a feeling of guilt and depression. The revelation of an affair is very hard on an unsuspecting spouse, of course, but at the same time, it's the first step toward marital reconciliation.

Most unfaithful spouses know that their affair is one of the most heartless acts they could ever inflict on their spouse. So one of their reasons to be dishonest is to protect their spouse from emotional pain. "Why add insult to injury," they reason. "What I did was wrong, but why put my spouse through needless pain by revealing this thoughtless act?" As is the case with bank robbers and murderers, unfaithful spouses don't think they will ever be discovered, and so they don't expect their unfaithfulness to hurt their spouse.

But I am one of the very few that advocate the revelation of affairs at all costs, even when the wayward spouse has no feelings of guilt or depression to overcome. I believe that honesty is so essential to the success of marriage, that hiding past infidelity makes a marriage dishonest, preventing emotional closeness and intimacy.

It isn't honesty that causes the pain, it's the affair. Honesty is simply revealing truth to the victim. Those who advocate dishonesty regarding infidelity assume that the truth will cause such irreparable harm, that it's in the best interest of a victimized spouse to go through life with the illusion of fidelity.

It's patronizing to think that a spouse cannot bear to hear the truth. Anyone who assumes that their spouse cannot handle truth is being incredibly disrespectful, manipulative and in the final analysis, dangerous. How little you must think of your spouse when you try to protect him or her from the truth.

It's not only patronizing, but it's also false to assume that your spouse cannot bear to hear the truth. Illusions do not make us happy, they cause us to wander through life, bumping into barriers that are invisible to us because of the illusion that is created. Truth, on the other hand, reveals those barriers, and sheds light on them so that we can see well enough to overcome them. The unsuspecting spouse of an unfaithful husband or wife wonders why their marriage is not more fulfilling and more intimate. Knowledge of an affair would make it clear why all efforts have failed.

After revealing an affair, your spouse will no longer trust you. But lack of trust does not ruin a marriage, it's the lack of care and protection that ruins marriages. Your spouse should not trust you, and the sooner your spouse realizes it, the better. "

SNT, the right decision is to tell the OWH. Not telling him is only adding lying to mix, which is compounding the crime. You are not doing him any favors by keeping this secret from him. He can't very well work on his marriage if no one will tell him the truth about it. Nor can he protect himself from you and his W if he doesn't know what you have done to him.

One suggestion

Make a plan to do it Friday night with your wife as advised previously. Your wife and you should go away for the weekend and do it from afar. If OWH is going to go nuts and shoot you he'll likely do it in the first couple days so protect yourselves by being out of town. Emphasizing this concern alone might also quell your wife's anger that you did not do it immediately.

It is likely, very likely, that OWH will react exactly as we all do. Devastated and betrayed but not violent. Don't buy OW's fear tactics. The movie scene where the BS goes out to hunt down OM is not reality. Going out of town or just to a hotel for a couple days, with your wife, may provide a settling ounce of protection.

Mr. Wondering

I'd say

It's out of your control..if you wife chooses to tell or not...
you have no say in it...
it's a free planet..

free enough for people to engage in affairs..
free enough for people to pay the piper for the dance.

And if you want true recovery..then you best keep your mouth shut to your wife...except to support her decision to tell and make no word of not revealing...

other wise you heading down a path of power struggling and diverting from the real issues at hand...

this is a huge marker in your understanding of the devastation of the effects of an affair..

minimize the effect on your OW's marriage..and the harm she brought in to her own home
and it mirrors that you believe it is of little consequence to your own marriage...

it is actions that define all of us............

and if you protest and give your wife grief over this it will be seen only as you offering protection to the OW..while once again villifying both of the BS...it is as harmful as contact with the OW>..

.and truthfully you can not protect the OW for it is her own actions and choices that put her where she is....

and if she chooses not to tell..then you should
ARK

The horror stories that make it into the press about Wronged Spouse Shoots Lover are remarkably infrequent, when you consider how much infidelity apparently goes on.

It's my observation that those stories more often involve Wronged Wives attacking the rival. Wronged Husbands seem to go for the wife more often. But I haven't done the statistics.

SNT, if the OWH thumped the daylights out of you but left you intact, would you consider that acceptable? (I'm not suggesting that's reasonable, just trying to help you explore what you're really feeling here.)

TA

Again, thanks for your responses. I just wanted each of you to know that I am reading this thread on a frequent basis so your responses do "count"!

I still am struggling with this. I don't feel like I am protecting the OW because in my heart and in my mind, the A is completely over.

In response to the violent claims, I just think "WHO KNOWS?" I don't know him. I know he has A LOT of guns. I don't know how he was brought up. I don't know what type of "reasonable" thinker he is. I talked to my mom this morning about this and she said that some close friends of theirs not too long ago had a situation similar. The H had the A and the OM came to his work with a gun looking for him when he found out. Scares me to death. I would gladly put my hands in my pockets and get a good ol'fashion butt kicking because I think I deserve it. But I don't deserve to get shot and the OM doesn't deserve to go to jail for shooting me.

I think I can see the necessity of telling the OWH by my W if the A was still going on. IF there was still C which was affair-based. The only C was yesterday and any attempt to make it personal or romantic or whatever was completely squashed. If the A was still ongoing, it would need to be exposed to the OWH so that it could be put to a halt. However, the A is completely over. There is nothing to stop. There are no calls to put a stop to, there are no e-mails to end, and there are no visits to hinder. There is nothing. If they are working it out (and I have NO idea if they are or aren't), then why should I throw fuel on their almost extinguished fire to get it roused up again? Does that make any sense?

Well, you guys are great and I appreciate you discussing this with me. I just wanted to let you know to keep the replies coming if you think of something that will help.

SNT

SNT,

I understand your fear, but still he needs to be told. Since your wife is willing to do it, let her do it in person. She can assess the situation and talk him out of harming you, if needed. I had to talk the OWH out of cutting my H's...

If your W tells you that is better that you take a little vacation until he calms down, then that is just a little inconvenience compared to the pain and suffering your actions have caused. You need to start doing the right thing, even if it's difficult or inconvenient.

Think of a way you will feel safe. Have a plan and minimize the risk. But do it.

MelodyLane,

I don't believe my H is holding onto anything future with the OW. It has been over for 2-1/2 years & every conversation after the fact never included any personal talk. She would call with some lame story about work (in which he was no longer there) & he would try to get off the phone as quick as possible.

My H told me he is disgusted with himself & the thought of her disgusts him. He was never in love with her but using her to find a way out of our marriage (according to him) because if he cheated he knew he would have to leave (his logic at the time). Then, after he went too far with her (no intercourse but oral sex), he said he conscience blew wide open & he didn't want anything to do with her any more & he realized he didn't want to leave me or lose me. He didn't even end it with her, he just started avoiding her & they never talked about it again. It wasn't a loving, emotional relationship - yet! So, I don't think it ever got to the point where many get with feelings of love & addiction.

Also, at the beginning of this year, he was saved (born again) so his perspective has changed about our lives & his role in it. I think he is a changed person, but still working through many issues. This is why he came to me & was honest with me about the past.

He understands that I am the reason he is saved & without me he would be headed to H*ll. (his words). Instead of resenting me (like he used to), he says he realizes how valuable I am to him & what I have done for him.

However, he also admits that this doesn't make him perfect & he is working on his selfishness. Today, he told me that he would do whatever I wanted - so we are going to tell the OWH together. I think it's a step in the right direction.

SNT I haven't followed your story except for this thread but I do agree with the other posters.

I also agree with Dorry...your wife doesn't really mean it when she says it is too late...she is testing you.

I was one of those obsessive ones who in my dire pain...often tested my FWH. I didn't test him because I wanted him to fail...I tested him because I wanted him to pass.

Please..your wife deserves for you to do this for her....tell....!!!

SNT, I understand your fear, but have you seen OWH's guns?

Or are you just believing what OW has told you?

She is in fear of losing the father to her children, so I would think she would say any lie to prevent her H from knowing the truth.

example.... If your W had an affair and the OMW knew, and she kept it silent from you. How would you feel?

OM needs to know. And your W needs to heal. If you don't do it...it will slow down, or possibly stop any healing. Only because a lie still hangs in the midst of it.

I hope you do the right thing.

Lady

SNT,

As I see it,this is a matter of two issues: self preservation( not getting "shot") or doing what is right for your W and marriage.

At this point,you know you are not fully capable of making all the right decisions right now,afterall,you cheated.So if you understand that aspect about yourself for now,heed our advice.Yes the A may be over in some sense but one way to put the final nail in the "coffin" is to see to it that OW does not have any opportunity again to use the tactic of threats to contact you or to "get away scott free" in her own life.

Try to see the bigger picture here.People are cheating on their spouses left and right.What if we all just turn a blind eye;hear,speak see no evil? Doesn't this man have a right to know that you were involved with his wife? Wouldn't it be "honorable" to at least admit your guilt and apologize even if the OWH is devastated? Do you really think the husband won't find out one way or another?

You may feel that you are not protecting the OW but you also aren't taking full responsibility for what happened and if that meant that the husband seeks you out then so be it.There are ways to handle disgruntled people.You can notify the authorities if anyone suspicious comes around your home( if he happnes to find out where you live),you can be extra cautious in the first few weeks,change your phone/cell numbers,etc.This is all assuming this man would actually come after you and usually it is only a threat an OP uses to protect themselves.Like Mel said the likelyhood of this man being very violent,enough to kill someone,is probably false since this OW probably wouldn't risk her own life in an A if that were true.

The threat of the OWH finding out his W was cheating with you was always there,it's just actually facing you now and now you want to avoid it at the cost,perhaps,of your marriage.What else will you avoid to protect yourself? See,one hard part to all this R is doing things that benefit the marriage and your spouse but may feel very uncomfortable for you.The true mark of a remorseful WS is putting the needs and feelings of the other first now instead of what you did which was all about you and only you before.

I can appreciate how hard this is for you.But you have a decision to make,what is most important?

O

I see what you are saying, but I want to show you why this is WRONG.

Could you and your wife REALLY work it out if she didn't have the truth? nope - she would always be hanging back - wondering if she was nuts, what didn't make sense...and you would always have something to hide...you would never make it till death do you part...

So...lets say OWH & OW are working some things out- but he has NO clue there was an affair - maybe OW twisted it so there was some flirting....H can sense something isn't right, but can't put his finger on it...they wont make it.

Not that their marriage IS your concern...but part of this not making it IS YOUR FAULT. You can begin righting the things you did wrong by telling OWH's the TRUTH...and giving HIM the chance to decide if he wants to work things out or not based on the TRUTH...and what he chooses to do is non of your business...but it is the LEAST you can do to correct your the wrongs you have caused her H. YES you have WRONGED him.

My husband was ex-special forces...he has done some not so nice things in his life...OM was terrified of my H...my H had to physically hold himself from driving to OM and ending his life...it was more than just a fantasy for my H, it was impulse control...But in the end - he never went near OM.

The truth is more than likely OWH will never really come after you, but if you had a chance meeting, there might be a black eye, which no offence - you would deserve...(this coming from a FWS...)

Like ark said - you can't control whether your wife tells otr not - but she needs to know you will support her and right now - you have shown her you wont...one more disappointment for her...and time and time again, whether it be cowardism on your part, or protection of the OW or whatever...you are STILL not siding with your wife, and that speaks volumes to her whether you know it or not.

Get over yourself and your discomfort and your worries of their marriage - and start to look at your wife. do what she needs.
,

the point is ... telling OW's husband protects your wife ... and you know this is true.

so protect her!