Oh God. I don't know what to do. I found out where the elderly man lived (OWs mom/stepdad). After church (went to church other than my own) found the old man's house. My H wasn't there. Left and was driving down highway and I met him going in that house's direction; he didn't see me.

I turned around and followed him. When he saw that I was behind him he did not go to that house but turned around and went to a store up the street. OW was w/him.

He told me that he thought our M should be over. That it wasn't going to work. That he had thought that for some time. I went to H's vehicle to talk/confront her. Rememeber, she's a counselor of sorts. She was quite calm. My H was his usual jerky self. it really hurt that he was a jerk to me in front of her.

She assured me that today would be the last day they would have anything to do w/each other. Said she wasn't the OW. She was a friend only. Said my H is a wonderful treasure of a man and that she thought we had been apart x 2 years. I told her that I see him every day, talk to him multiple times, still have a relationship with him. She said she didn't know. Said she didn't know I loved him.

Long story short he told me he wants it over. They left together and went back to her mom's house. He said he would call me later.

She asked me if I loved him so much why wasn't I still w/him? She said that if I loved him so much I would focus on him and not the stuff his kids did. His kids have been a major problem with us. Basically, they used him and me in the process. There's been a lot of bad blood there. I told my H a couple of weeks ago that I would do whatever I could to repair things w/them and try to move forward.

I told her that there were things she didn't know about and things that were none of her business. My H defended her!!!! God that hurt.

I think he has told her all sorts of one-sided stuff. He did tell me a couple of weeks ago that he thought she was someone he could have a relationship with.

He just called me and said he would call me later and that we need to talk. He said everything would be okay and that everybody would end up happy. I have no clue what that means.

I am so hurt, so confused, so lost. I have no one to talk to about any of this. Absolutely no one.

Please help. At least give me a shoulder to cry on.

Just forgot. WH and OW did not want her parents involved. They involved them, not me. But, they are elderly and aren't a part of this that I'm aware of. Just a safe place for the two of them to cavort. So don't know what I'll do if anything about that.

When my H called me a few minutes ago he asked who I had told. I told him no one. Not sure if I'll tell anyone or not. I'm just so crushed by seeing my fears confirmed.

I don't believe her for a minute that she doesn't have her sights set on my H. She's divorced. He apparently fits in well w/her family. How sweet. I have her VMs on tape telling him how much she loved him. When I mentioned that today she got flustered then said she "loves everyone" and tells everyone that she "loves them". She said she does love my H but as a friend. I didn't tell her I had VMs taped, just that I heard them.

Asked me why when I found my H at her house one night why I didn't come in.

I was trying to mention to OW that my H said the reason she left the VMs was to make me thing someone else wanted him so I would make a decision either way. H cut me off and I dropped it.

L2, people here have been asking you what plan you are in. You have no answer for us, but you do continue to run around in a full-blown panic and then wonder why nothing changes.

Plan A.

Plan B.

Pick one. You have got to take control here and you cannot do that when you continue to rush around in a panic instead of getting a Plan.

No one here can help you until you calm down, start to think, and get a Plan. Then there will be plenty that you can do to HELP things, or at the very least help YOURSELF and YOUR CHILDREN.
Mulan

L2S, is THIS the way you want to live the rest of your life? And your kids...is this what you want them to learn and take into their adulthood with them? If you choose to stay, this is it, the real deal. You'll get what you pay for, or worse yet, PAY for what you get!

Sweetie, I'm not trying to be hard on you, but this is kind of a "fog" all of your own.

Like what was said before, it's been suggested many times to get into a plan of some kind. And I think with not just the emotional and verbal abuse you have suffered, but along with the physical abuse, as well, you should seriously consider Plan D. This is NOT healthy, for you or the kids.

This is just my take, but it is TIME, right NOW, to break thru this fog, and start to see things with your head and not your heart. Lay it out and develop some sort of structured arrangement. You said yourself the other day, that the possibility of seeing some of this for yourself, might give you that little push you needed to proceed. Well now you have it. You actually SAW them together. What's it going to be?

You know, we love ya' here, L2S... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />this is why we respond and keep at ya'! Because we care. So, think about this, and post back. We're here for ya'! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Jennifer

I have no plan. I am running scared. Scared to lose my M, scared to stay and try to make it work.

I finally talked to H about 10:15 last night; finally came home. Said OW said she would not call him and would not take his calls. Said she was sorry that I was hurt by their friendship. OW assured me they were just friends. Funny, I can't have a friendship w/OM but my H can be friends with whomever he wants.

H said he does not want to make M work. Said he wants D. Said he wants to come to church Wed and talk to OM with 3-4 other people in the church who have told him things. Then, he probably intends to tell OM in my presence all about what a sl*t, wh**e I am and reveal some of my distant past mistakes to him and then leave and later in week file for D. That's just my guess.

I don't know R between H and OW. I can only go on what I've been told.

Are you going to start thinking of a plan?

L2S...you keep falling off the first page. I hope you're doing ok...Jennifer

I'm surviving. I have put myself in a very bad place by opening back up to the possibility of working things out. I was hesitant but now want to and now he is hesitant. He keeps saying if I need an answer right now, the answer is D. Doesn't want me to come back home, doesn't want to go to MC, doesn't want to talk about R. Just doesn't to everything.

Not sure where that leaves me.

My gut tells me it is b/c of OW and that at the least he is infatuated w/her. He says "no" but I don't believe that. I believe he is comparing the 2 of us and I am coming up short b/c she has never had to deal w/or has been exposed to any of the crap that makes up our life 2gether.

He has mentioned us setting up separate checking accounts. I always felt a part of why he didn't push was because of the $. With him saying that I am not so sure now. It would be a struggle for him w/o my $ going into the house.Don't know what to make of that.

I'm really, really confused about everything. If I could talk to someone at MB right now I would but don't have time to make the arrangements. Don't even know if it would be worthy the $ to do that.

I wish I could just turn my feelings and emotions off.

I've made it through today!!!!! Yeah!!!
I'm at the house right now. H should be here in a while. I'm not really sure what to do. I know I've been asked if I'm in Plan A or B and I've been told that I need to get a plan.

I've also been told that if I would back off and act like I don't care he would start coming back around. He still gets angry over OM type stuff. Is that a sign that he still cares or just that I disrespected him in front of others? I don't know.

He is still saying that he wants to go to church w/me tomorrow and plans to confront OM w/me there as well as 3-4 other people from the church who came to him and told him stuff that I was saying and doing. He asked me if I had called the OM to tell him what he planned. I said "No" b/c I haven't. Don't know if I should warn him or not.

I don't know if he will really go through with it or not. He's doing it b/c I confronted him w/OW Sunday. But, no one knows that I did that except him, OW and whomever they told. I didn't do it around anyone and he was w/her; that was his fault not mine.

I really think that part of why I am where I am now is b/c I heard the VMs from the OW about a month ago and started thinking that I might actually be losing him to her. I really think that's part of it and that's sad on my part. There are things about him that I love and admire. There are some good things about him. There's lots of bad, too. But, I've got problems of my own that I need to work on like the lying and the way I dislike his kids, the way I'm too judgemental over some stuff.

I Know I'm just rambling and don't mean to. I guess I need to get through tomorrow night and see what happens. My gut feeling is that he is going to go through with it and then tell me in front of the OM that he wants a divorce. The ultimate slap in the face. He will say bad stuff about me, maybe spill the beans about my past and then walk off and leave me standing there.

L2S...This is a "Payback" he is about to give you, because you happened to see him with OW. I don't think his anger about OM is a sign that he cares, but an excuse to use, to condone HIS actions. He's a scorekeeper, which is pretty sorry for him, beings he has to make stuff up to "confront", in order to get even with you. He has no buisness keeping score, when he's on the losing side! He's now grasping at things, and going out of his way, JUST to justify his actions! He's even going so far as to "One up ya'"! By making a scene...at CHURCH!

L2S...Get your plan in order. I do believe your attraction to him right now, is based on a competitive level. Because someone else is showing interest in him. That is NOT a very solid ground to base a relationship on! Your life is NOT a competition, to see who can win a loser. In the end, he is most defintely NOT a prize!

Go ahead and get that separate checking account, but don't stop there. Start preparing a plan. It's time to regain control.

Keep posting, L2S...We care, here! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Jennifer

He is definitely all about payback. He holds grudges and is very unforgiving. Oh, he'll say he forgives but, as soon as I make him mad, he brings all the past back up. Now, I must admit I do that too but I do it when he slams me. That doesn't make it right but, I can only take so much before I respond back.

I guess the thing w/the OW that really makes me mad is that she thinks he's all that and a bag of chips. She knows only what he wants her to know which is exactly what I knew when I married him. I later found out that some of what he told me wasn't EXACTLY what others recalled. But, I wasn't exactly honest either. I have a past that I'm ashamed of. I've done some stuff over the last few years that I'm not proud of.

I really don't know why I can't take a long, objective look at what we have (or what we don't have), look at the type person my H is and look at what I will have to deal with, put up with, give up in order to be in his life.

The #1 priority in my H's life is his 20 y/o son. The son has always been a manipulator and user. He has no respect for my H and is around only when he wants/needs something. He knows my H will do whatever he can to help him even when giving in is not in his son's best interest. This isn't just my opinion; same things are felt by everyone close to the situation.

I'm really on the fence about the church thing tonight. I told him Sun night that I wouldn't do it. He then got mad so, stupid me, I relented and said "OK". Now, I want to back track again and tell him "No". Should I allow him to talk to OM w/me there? This is b/c of what I did solely and is payback. Should I allow him to talk to me and OM in front of the others?

Well, long story short, he backed down on going to church and confronting me and OM w/witnesses. Said the reason is b/c he talked to the OW Mon (she asked him to call her and let her know what happened when he got home Sun night) and she told him that he had hurt me enough already.

Not sure I buy all that but I have no way to dispute it. He swears she is just a friend that he could talk to and spend time w/. The part that bothers me is that he has said that she is someone he feels he could have a good relationship with. Don't know if it's true or meant to hurt.

Anyway, he told me to go to church. I said no b/c that would just cause more problems between us. He said he wouldn't get mad and that it didn't matter. So, I asked if he was trying to say that he didn't care what I did. He got mad and said "no" but think what you want. What am I supposed to think? He's cursed me out for months because I went; now that I say I'm not going he almost gets mad.

I just don't get it. I don't know what to do, what to say, what to think. I am really getting down over this whole thing. Life and love shouldn't have to be so complicated. I'm afraid of what I say.

Don't say anything...ACT. Actions speak louder.

As far as OW not knowing everything there is to know about your H, well...LET HER find out! Given enough time, the whole thing will reveal itself. And once she figures it out, hopefully by then, you'll be to the point where you can finally say to yourself, "It's now HER problem, NOT mine."

Actions...L2S, not words. The only thing to be thinking about is your plan. Then the "What to Do's" will follow.

Take care and keep us posted <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />...

Jennifer

You know, maybe there are people who are meant to be together. Maybe given the right set of circumstances my H and someone else could have a picture perfect R and M. His kids are grown as are the OWs. He likes her family. I can bet you though that she hasn't met and/or interacted w/his!!!

But anyway, maybe they could have a good life together. He says too much has happened between the 2 of us for him to get over. He says he forgives me but he can't forget.

I'm willing to work on things and try to move past the issues that have kept us apart. He's not sure. I've done all I can for the past month to do whatever I can to be nice, trying hard not to push or be down around him.

Is this where a plan B would come into play? I would simply "disappear" and see what happens? He told me last night that since we've been separated x 2 years that he has gotten used to being by himself and not having to answer to anyone or have anyone around when he gets home. But, a few weeks ago he was telling me about how lonely he was and how much he wanted someone in his life because he was tired of being by himself all the time. Can't be both so what's the truth? Is he lonely or isn't he? Does he want a R or doesn't he? Is he fancying himself in love w/OW or isn't he?

I dont' know.

Yes...this is where plan B comes into play, at least. You're trying to hard to read between the lines. It's now time to speak with your actions. Plan B would be a very loud action, in a silent way. And you might even find that you'd LIKE plan B. Much more peaceful, and some space to think.

Pulling you back to the top...

Boy, L2S, this is becoming a challenge to keep you in the loop, here! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Good morning all. I'm still here. This week pretty uneventful. Still not in a defined plan yet. I'm trying to remain upbeat and not be clingy.

You know, I was thinking back on the first A and I probably broke every MB rule in the book!! I cried, I begged, I moped, I did all sorts of stuff I shouldn't have done. But, I also did everything I could to be close to him, nice to him, do little things for him to show that I loved him. It worked out in the end but the A was over before I found out and he was trying to break it off but she kept persisting. Even after all this time she still called him last year.

Now, I have a situation where supposedly the OW is a "shoulder to cry on" and nothing but platonic. But, H has said he thinks there could be. According to him OW says "no" until he is divorced at least 8 months plus OW has stuff in her life that she needs to work through before she adds a relationship to the mix.

I was listening to some VMs left by my H to me in late December where he was telling me how very much he loved me and wanted us to work things out. Then, one month later he suddenly wasn't sure what he wanted. Now, he says one day at a time and we'll see where it leads but he doesn't want me to come home and pushing will result in D. That all has me pretty confused.

OW said she would not call my H and would not accept his calls but, H said OW called him yesterday to find out what kind of nut I am b/c of me finding/confronting them last Sunday. Asked my H if he thought I would come to her house, involve her kids, her parents, etc. I didn't involve her, she involved herself. I simply said "no" and left it at that. I didn't get into an argument or conversation about it. What I WANTED to say was that b/c she is a counselor of sorts and has access to MCs perhaps she should lay out the circumstances to one of them. If the situation was reversed would she think something was going on between OW and her H. But, I didn't.

I'd rather let her think she is dealing w/a nut that might "strike" at any time. It's funny though. Last Sunday when my H said something about me riding by her house and he was there, she asked why I didn't stop and come in? Yeah, right. I'm sure she would have handled the sitch in such a way. Wonder why she is divorced if she's all that?

Oh, well. Another weekend in limbo land. Not divorced. Not married. Have no home. I just don't know. I've read things here about a 180 plan. I wonder if it's in the book Surviving an Affair. I need to get that and read it. Might try today.

I'm glad you posted, L2S, and I hope you are doing ok. The book might be a good idea. I haven't read it, but I think it would be good for you to know that you can survive the A, with or without your M.

Take Care...

Jennifer

Bought three books today: Surviving An Affair, Love Must be Tough, His Needs Her Needs. Guess it will be good knowledge regardless of our outcome.

Saw H couple of times today. Spoke to H several times by phone. H is pretty down today. Apparently nothing in his life is going right. Trouble w/me. Work is very demanding and not going well. Lots of errors on jobs by our employees. His son is putting a lot of pressure on him to finance stuff for him or do a quick loan of a lot of $, etc. His daughter is involved w/a guy that has kids and is possibly moving back to a state in the north; she doesn't know what to do; stay here or go w/. Also, H says she is sick but won't elaborate on what's wrong. He has some health issues that cause almost constant pain.

He has lost his confidant in the OW b/c of me. Don't know if they were just friends but, in any event, it was inappropriate at best just like the friendship I had was now that I look back on it. I never allowed the friendship to go anywhere but, the first time my H said anything about it, that should have been the last time I spoke to OM w/o him there but I didn't do that.

I asked him today what he wants to do. He said he wants to move forward with D. Says he loves me but there is a lot that we both have to get past. Doesn't trust me. I don't trust him. I can't handle his kids. He can't handle stuff I allow my D to do/get away w/.

Then, he said he thought the best thing might be for me to move back into our house. That will give us the chance to see if we can make it. Let us see if continuing w/the M is what we both want. Might make us see that we really don't want to be M to each other anymore.

So, today was not great. I told him to let me know what it is he wants me to do. I asked him if he wanted me to back off and leave him alone until he decided what he wanted. He said that he didn't. So, I don't really know what I'm supposed to do.