catgirl,

The first time I expoused to my WW's family and work she went nuts and denied it since I had no proof of an PA (just an EA) and she claimed the infamous "just friends" line also. I've discovered that many people who don't undertand affairs believe there is nothing wrong with EA or being "just friends".

Then I taped her having a PA with OM in my family vehicle and when I confronted her she said she did it to "hurt" me for my initial exposure. I then re-exposed (with the encouragement of MB members) to her family which has driven her A deep underground and surely made any contact between her and OM a difficult at best.

I know one thing for sure, if the WS stays with OP it's not because of exposure. In many cases, exposure will provide long term gain for short term pain.

Two,

Has a NC letter, approved by you, been sent to OM? My FWH had already ended his A prior to d-day, but because I didn't know, was still planning on limited contact with OW because she did freelance work for him and desparately needed the income. OW had been dreadful and demanding for most of the affair and basically love-busted FWH right out of the affair. Once I knew, I insisted that if we were even going to try and recover, there would be NC of any kind and if FWH wouldn't agree to that, then we would separate and divorce.

OW was already divorced so there was no one to expose to, but over two months she continued to harrass us in one manner or another until FWH sent a NC letter and after that we haven't ever heard from her again.

Frankly, it sounds as though your FWW is still in withdrawl.

Who

Who,

Yes, a NC letter was sent and I approved. I agree with the withdrawal. God, how long can I expect that to last? When do you say enough is enough. If she still has feelings for a person who was willing to rip your family apart and none for you (the person trying to maintain the family), when do you say 'go and be with this wonderful adulterus person, me and the kids will be just fine'? I want our family to stay in tact but how long can you go before your love bank runs dry? I was just wondering, maybe her feelings for jacka$$ would change if other people knew about it. On the other hand she has maintained her side of the NC agreement.

Two

How do you really know she has maintained NC? I am not sure you can really know.

Your right, I can't tell for sure but I'm pretty sure there hasn't been any. For arguments sake lets say she hasn't. The question still remains. If she is in NC but still has feelings for OM, do you expose to her family? I have a feeling it would do more harm than good right now.

I misunderstood the question being discussed so this post was deleted. Post below about question runing on thread at current.

two,

Since my FWH had no positive feeling remaining for OW the last several months of their 8 month PA, he didn't experience withdrawl from her, so I guess that I was fortunate. The whole experience was so devastating for me as it was that I have trouble even wondering what I would have done if I had had to deal with him still caring for OW or that maybe he would prefer to be with her rather than me.

I am so sorry. This must be very hard for you. I guess that since she is abiding by NC, that you should wait a while longer since it has only been two months.

I think that you will know when enough is enough for you. Someone here once said that you shouldn't divorce until you can do it without feeling anger or pain.

Keep posting and reading here, it is very helpful. I forgot to ask you if you are in MC, if not, it may be very helpful for you both.

Who

Like I said above, I went through those exact thoughts for a long time. Ultimately, I did tell OMW. W is very pissed at me right now (she just found out 4 days ago). I guess she'll get over it, we'll see.

I thought there was NC for the 2 months too. I was wrong. There was contact the whole time. W doesn't seem to think that matters since it was just an EA and they were "just friends".

As of now, if I had it to do over again, I would do it and do it sooner than I actually did.

Every situation is different, so who really knows. But I would do it and I don't think I would have hesitated at all if it had been a PA.

About exposure, if you are sure there is NC and she is going through w/d then it might be seen by her as something else, like your trying to get back at her.

Do you feel that she still is pursuing him? IMO, then exposure would be necessary.

Do you feel that she is pouring her heart out to you about it but she is struggling with NC and letting him go. If so, she may need to talk to someone and you may need to be patient.

What is your concern about it, just that it hurts you to hear it or that she may go after him? What are your thoughts about it?

READ the post titled:

THIS is UVA's "war room"

I just bumped it up

it is excellent

Pep

Cat, I lurked on this site for a year and more before I started posting. In all that time, through the thousands of threads I've read, I know of no occasion where exposure was the vehicle that drove the WS into the arms of the OP.

I know what you're afraid of. You fear it will foster a sense of "me and you against the world" between the two of them, right? Actually, the opposite is what occurs. The thing is, exposure punctures a perfect little fantasy world.

Things always go right in fantasies. There are no disapproving looks. No one distrusts you. You’re the perfect couple. Time spent with each other is sheer bliss. The “friction” of living day in and day out with someone doesn’t exist. It’s that time when you had your first date with that person in junior high all over again. Work is wonderful too. It gives you opportunities to email or make calls to the OP. Heck, the boss doesn't keep an eye on you. Children and puppies come bounding to your side to adore you.

When the rock is turned over, though, and the light of day shines down on the slimy side of the stone, all the bugs run crazily to get away. All of a sudden, you’re busted! You begin to feel oppressed. You aren’t the perfect twosome anymore; you’re the two people who are cheating on your loving spouses and deserting your families. People watch you, distrusting everything you stand for now. They don’t like you nearly as much as they did before. Now you’re something not quite clean and they let it be known in the looks from the corner of their eyes, the not-quite frowns on their faces when they have to associate with you.

Abruptly, the fact you’re doing something wrong is an issue between you and the OP. It’s not nearly as much fun and it gets worse. Sneaking around to see the OP isn’t exciting anymore; it’s just sneaking. Some WS’s actually begin to allow a little reality to creep in at this moment and they desert their partners in adultery and ask their betrayed spouse to take them back. Others are more resistant and one must implement Dr. Harley’s Plan for recovery from the adultery.

What exposure doesn’t do is drive the pair closer. Oh, okay, it might (for talking purposes) an hour or two. However, it quickly dawns (sometimes only subconsciously) on the two adulterers that the other person is the root of all the pressure that’s just begun to come down on them. You don’t like spending time with someone that makes you uncomfortable, and you can’t be comfortable in his or her presence anymore.

Cat, expose this obscenity to everyone who can pressure the adultery and influence the pair to stop. If you want to revive your marriage, smash their relationship with exposure and get to work. The folks out here on MB come to this place for the sole purpose of helping newcomers get through what the veterans already have experienced. Take advantage of their experience and expertise, okay?

Don't put it off. In my situation, my H's A went on for a YEAR! And one thing that really nags at me now (one thing among many) is that there was a chance to nip in in the bud that was missed when the OW's H found cellphone evidence, but failed to expose it then. The A was only a few months old at that time, she told him that "we're just friends" (sound familiar?) and he believed her. When I finally found out (11 months later), OW's H apologized to me--told me he was so sorry, and that he should have told me when he first saw evidence.

And he should have. Not that I blame him at all, mind you. He was my best ally. But I had a right to try and protect my marriage, and I didn't get a chance to do that until my H had been cheating on me for a whole year.

The A was finally exposed when someone saw my H and the OW together in public, dancing, hanging on eachother, etc. Even though it wasn't proof of a definate A, when word started circulating around, that was all it took for my H to end it. Exposure works.

Good luck,
CSJ

O.K., just one more thing...

Just bear with me...

Just say, I know this is a reach, but just say, that nothing physical has happened, that they just talk on the phone alot as friends. I know it's still an EA, even though H insists it's not, won't I look like a fool exposing this?

Instead of folks trying to answer questions piecemeal, Cat, how about you lay out all the facts as you know them? When in doubt, provide more detail rather than less. Trying to do this one question and one sentence at a time is not the best way to go about this.

All I have are cell phone records for several months. They talked frequently.

Don't know if there are emails etc. and I never caught them together.

H moved out a few months ago, so I have no clue what's going on now with them.

catgirl, how do you feel about him now? Do you love him? Do you want to Plan A the M, do you want it (the M)? Do you have kids? What was his reason for moving or did he give you one? How was your M together?

Ya know I've been thinking about that question pretty much non stop for the past few days.

If you would have asked me 2 months ago, I would have done ANYTHING to save the M. Now I'm not so sure.

I *think* I love him, but I don't trust or respect him. I don't know if I ever will feel the same way about him again, and because of that, I don't know if the M can be saved.

I always said if my H ever had an A, that would be it, it would be over. I know an EA is an A, but call me stupid, guess I could handle that better than a PA. As I said I don't know if it's gotten that far yet. He says the "just friends" line.

Our M was O.k. We had our problems. I wasn't the "perfect" wife I guess.

We have 2 kids. I think that's why I want the M to work. Don't want the kids to say their parents are divorced and everything else that goes with it.


He moved out to get away from me to see if our marriage can be saved or not. A trial separation. I asked what he intends to do with this time. Will we see each other to work on our issues (he hates confrontation), or not see each other? He said he doesn't know yet.


I have been plan A'ing pretty well I think. Really focusing on me. Getting to what I need and I think meeting his needs too when we do see each other, which isn't often.

Cat,


Have you read the dynamics of an affair....the stages they go thru. I have seen it here many times so maybe someone will post it again for you. If you allow the EA to continue, it will almost certainly evolve into a PA, nearly all of them do given the right environment and enough time. Besides, if his friendship with OW makes you uncomfortable, he should respect your feelings and end it.

Who

15 Steps to Unfaithfulness

TooSoon posted this a while ago and it gives you a sense of what the stages to an affair look like. I think Mr. W once said it's a slippery slope and once you get on it doesn't take long before you start moving quickly.

OK, Cat, which of these is worse, IYO?

“…won't I look like a fool exposing this?”

or

“He moved out to get away from me to see if our marriage can be saved or not. A trial separation.” turns into a genuine divorce?

Rate these on your badness scale and then act, or not.

Some input for you:

IMO, he moved out to consummate the A. It has long been a PA, and I’ll bet all comers $10 on it.

I guarantee you sure won’t look like a fool to the 47,551 members of MB before you if you expose. Quite the opposite, in fact. And if it helps save your H, he will eventually say the same.

You children will worship you no matter how it turns out.

In a nutshell, Cat, your love bank balance is fast approaching zero. You said the equivalent in one of your posts above. You can continue to let your account become overdrawn while the rest of your M evaporates or you can implement tried, trued and many, many times proven advice.

As they say, killing an A is simple, but hard. And it is often messy. Sometimes you have to drive a stake through it with your own two hands. It’s not for the faint of heart.

With prayers,