Thanks J.

"working through each minute/each hour/each day...."

Does this mean you are in no contact now? Are you committed to telling OMW and your BH about each attempt at contact by OM?

Getting yourself out of the fog takes being honest...first, with yourself...you can use this board to help you be honest with yourself...

And have honesty returned to you, in kind.

LA

Right now when we "talk" it just seems to come out wrong...sounds like accusations, and anger!...so I am working on the NC...and living every minute/every hour/every day...

This is the pathway to finding your authentic self again..

you can not process the many aspects of this situation till you cut the contact which fills an emotional aspect...

the cycle is vicious...

continued contact brings more pain...but on one level that intense pain feeds the notion that obviously this "RELATIONSHIP" MUST be different...or why else would two people risk so much...

partly because you can not see how much is of your own energy put in to it...

ALL taken from your marriage...as he does the same...

no one can tell you to stay married...who knows what type of real marriage you have or are capable of having...

but until you live walk authentically in the world...

people love say that society hates affair because they are sinful...
but people hate affairs because they destroy people and cause great pain to all parties....

no contact
one minute
one hour
one day
one week...

have you told him NOT to contact you....

how many doors are still open to you

get a plan
get some stability

ARK^^

2Crazy,

Finally Learning said this to you:
These are very profound words. Most folks can see the harm infidelity does to others, but it's much harder to see the personal harm that it does. Whenever any of us act in ways that hurt others, we also hurt ourselves. We undermine our own self esteem and value. We create shame and self loathing. We question our own worth. We destroy our own happiness as well as the happiness of others.

Ayn Rand talked about the concept of "non-contradictory joy"......the only real kind of joy. It is a joy without guilt or consequence. It is a joy that doesn't harm ourselves or others. It is a pure and completely fulfilling joy.

I know the A has given you pleasure, but it's temporary and it's not the same thing as joy because it goes against what you know is right and wrong. Pleasure without joy is an empty place. Even the moments you feel happy will be marred by guilt and conscience. And ultimately any happiness is spoiled and unfulfilling. Each meeting creates a massive high and then a precipitous fall, and you feel as though you've "lost" yourself and who you are. It harms you in insidious ways that you may not even be able to see. It takes away your authentic self....someone whose actions match their beliefs. It takes away your peace and pride in who you are....your integrity.

As much as all of the other people deserve to be happy....so do you....and you can't get "there" from "here".

You are getting some good advice from some nice ladies.
Some have earned the crown of the F before WW.
Wouldn't you rather have that than the Scarlet Letter?

What I don't understand is this statement:
"and withdrawls are still very strong... "

How can you be having 'withdrawls' when you are still meeting OM
behind your husband's back and continuing
the emailing with him?

When are you going to go No Contact and tell your
husband that you have been having sex with OM?

AND tell him the entire truth that the affair has
been going on for 10 more months than he believes?

All I am asking you to do is to be HONEST with
your husband. We want HONESTY first, only then
can healing begin.

Dear 2Crazy,

Fog is what happens when a decent person – and I think you are a decent person - tries to justify indecent behavior to keep the addiction going.

The [color:"green"]friction[/color] between

your conscience
your love for your H
your love for your children (who are also affected by your selfish behavior)
your engrained need to be an ethical person
your wish not to harm anyone who has never harmed you (your BH, your children, OM’s wife, and even OM whom you are not letting be an honest and decent person either)
your need to be honest and open, especially to your H, the father of your children

AND

your need for the kick you get from getting your EN's filled by OM instead of BH

create a FOG so thick you need a foghorn and/or beacons of light to navigate until it clears and keep you from crashing.

Some posts here will sound harsh like a foghorn to you.
It’s people outside the fog saying “Hey, you fool, don’t go there! There are rocks! You’ll crash!”
You cannot see the rocks, only hear their harsh words.
Do you believe there are rocks there ?
Do you believe they can see what you cannot see ?
Do you believe they are actually trying to help you ?

And some posts will be like a beacon of light in the dark.
As the fogs clear, and you recognize them for what they are, you can use them to find your way home.. to yourself and your M.

Okay.. so you want to clear your head and get out of the fog?
I'd like to put a few thoughts in your head to help you do that.

Think about OM's Wife
Like Pep once said: "Don't think of OM as "your OM". Think of him as XX's husband."
XX being the actual name of OM's wife. Perhaps you can start by posting about OM like that… Anne’s husband this.. Anne’s husband that…

Try to get inside the head of BS's (by reading here, for example)
OW in my case was also my best friend (or so I thought) at the time.
That was a double whammy - like my WH stuck a knife in my heart, and she stuck one in my back.
The fact that they would lie to me and do things that they KNEW were incredibly hurtful to me..
That they thought that it would be ok just as long as they didn't tell me..
It made me feel like I had to be some horrible person, that both my H and my BF felt entitled to do this to ME.
It made me feel like they had absolutely no concern or respect for MY feelings...
or even my safety regarding STD’s, as they didn’t even bother to use a condom.

Learn about what fog does to a person
Just an example..
After I found out, OW/BF said "I didn't think it was wrong because it felt so right."
She really meant it.
She never felt she was doing something wrong all during the A, and for some time after D-Day as well.
After all, she didn't "steal" my H away, did she? So she thought that didn't make her a "bad person", like "others who break up M's" !
At my first talk with her after D-Day I couldn't believe all the things she was saying to me.
I didn't know about MB or about fog, but I felt like she was drugged or something.
It was so weird to hear this person who had been my friend for 15 years now justifying what she did to me and to her BH in the most illogical, childish way.

Just a little teeny foghorn here dear....well maybe NOT that teeny...

you posted this: " ...I will continue to post...I am actually a very strong person...most people would say "unflinching" (hah!) and I am way deep in the fog ...hopefully, my insight will help you and others see into the "other side", just as you have let me see inside the BS's window...this process will indeed give me the strength I need to gather up the courage to be TOTALY honest, with my BH and break the cycle with the OM."

YOU ARE IN CONTACT WITH OM...no healing...I REPEAT NO HEALING CAN BEGIN AS LONG AS YOU DO THIS...You are sure in the fog...and I can see it hugely as the number of TIMES YOU WRITE ABOUT YOU (SAYING "i" AND "ME") and not about dealing with emotions of your dh or how to help HIM...right now, it's all about YOU....

Right now, until you decide to forever end contact with OM, you will be a taker...and it only gets worse hon.

My xh? yea that guy. He got worse...if that could happen.

he remarried the pregnant ow...b/c she gave him ultimatums...I KINDA FIND THAT FUNNY NOW....as I was the one who dished out the first ones he didn't respond to well...he never went total nc.

and my xh continued on full blast ahead in WS taker mode...and he began cheating on the ow....and almost broke her jaw last summer when , how dare she, prevent him from having yet a third, fourth affair?

You can choose to either be SMART.....AND FEED THE ADVANCED PART OF YOUR BRAIN....the thinking part...and sever ties with om and go nc....or you can be a "neuro junkie" as I call em' and FEED THE REPTILIAN PARTS OF YOUR BRAIN...THE JURAISSIC PARTS (something I also call em) and do the same thing, so as to create those feel good hormones and transmitters that flood your body with the justification to lie.

it's all based on brain chemistry dear. and you're a full blown junkie. junkies quit by going cold turkey. and they have withdrawal. be a slave to it or you get out. it is that simple.

my xh got completely worse b/c he believes nothing less than hero worship should be delivered to him 24/7...and he's been a horrible father off/on...now he's just awful. he told my son some horrid things this week and my poor little boy cried himself to sleep two nights...he was almost unconsolable.

DO YOU WANT TO BECOME A MONSTER? THEN CONTINUE. DO YOU WANT TO SAY "I WANT TO QUIT THIS AFFAIR, BUT I AM NOT GONNA BECAUSE IF IT FEELS THIS GOOD IT MUST BE THE RIGHT THING?" OR DO YOU WANNA STAY IN THE AFFAIR B/C IT STROKES YOUR EGO...my xh is all about ego stroking.

between the brain chemicals keeping him high, and the ego stroking, he's happy...sitting on his imagined throne, saying to himself all the day long, "IT'S ALL ABOUT ME...IT'S ALL ABOUT ME...IT'S ALL ABOUT ME."

do you want to join him? it takes MASSIVE AMOUNTS OF FAMILY AND PERSONAL DESTRUCTION TO BUILD THAT THRONE...and your decision to NOT sever the tie to the affair is stone by stone, day by day, hour by hour building that imagined throne...one stone for lies, another for sex with om, another stone for breaking your kids' hearts, another stone for hurting your Husband, another for crushing your H's spirit, and another stone each time you enter the fog and fantasy world your MARRIED OM have where you plan a future that can never be....unless he's further along than you are in building HIS IMAGINED THRONE OF DESTRUCTION.

I liken it to saying "who ya gonna serve girl." and a few years back, there was a song by nine inch nails...and it totally described my xh as he pathetically built this throne of deceit, the invisible throne of deceit and pain stone by stone.

chorus of this song? "Bow down BEFORE THE ONE YOU SERVE...YOU'RE GONNA GET WHAT YOU DESERVE."

destroy the throne and regain your life and family. only answer. only cure.

Here is some advice. Start doing all the "normal things" that you do with OM with your BS. You may find out some incredible stuff about a man who wants to spend eternity with you (why else is he still in the picture?)

Have an affair on the OM.

Thorstein, sometimes someone writes something that is like a million flashing bulbs going off.

It is brilliant in it's simplicity and it should speak to WS's like nothing else does.

I just sat there smiling and nodding when I read it. This board always, always amazes me for the wisdom that comes from strangers.

This post has become a beacon...when I am feeling that I am being swallowed up and the only way out...is to bail...I think of the advice given here..and realize that I must go through...to get to the light...

It has been 72 hours and counting of NC. I still check my e-mail every hour..and wait for the phone to ring...

But I also listen to the many voices that are now in my head saying..."one minute...one hour..one day..at a time"...
I try to fill my heart & mind with thoughts of the good things about my marriage and my wonderful husband, who so desperately wants to make this work...I know the path is not an easy one..but is one I am willing to travel.

2crazy

It warms my heart when I read your post; you are doing the right thing, stay the course.
You’re worth it you’re family is worth it.
You are a brave woman, because you are deep into the fog but somehow you ‘re
Managing to navigate through, you said in an earlier post that you are a strong person,
Well you are going to need all your strength here, please keep posting, your struggle,
And your progress.

If you have any specific question to a BH please feel free to ask.

((((2crazy)))).

Tony.

Hi 2crazy, i'm glad to see your latest update.

keep posting!!

Hi 2crazy
how are you doing today?

Tony

thinking of you too 2crazy.

Justpeachy,

YOU are the wom(MAN)! You are right on. I just don't get the attraction to a man that would cheat, hurt a woman and family that loved(loves) him, has stood by him, etc. This man is getting a specific need met, not by working with his wife on their marriage and saving his family but by going next door to 2Crazy to get the best she has to offer and then return home to the safety of his home.

It will never cease to amaze me at the excuses that WS's will use to justify the affair first of all and then defend the indefensible OM or OW who cares only about themselves. Make no bones about if you were not filling a specific need of the OM he would stop calling you. It is about him. Now for 2Crazy it is just the opposite, it is all about her and her feelings.

Affairs are one of the most selfish acts one could ever commit towards a spouse. Just ask those that have been on both ends of one how it feels from each end. You can justify until you are blue in the face and at the end of the day the A will always be wrong and hurtful and more times than not end in disaster for everyone involved. People in A's have their heads in their (as you like to say) arses. It is truly that simple in my mind.

Alcoholism is real too...the pull of the bottle... but does that make the drunk driver's victim(s) have any better understanding of the disease? Should the fact there was drinking involved as reason for the crash be covered up by the drunk driver to avoid any type of fines or revocations...you know...hassles?

What about the next time the alcoholic gets behind the wheel, will just one little drink matter? For who?


I'm a FBS, FWS in AA so I know all about addictions and pulls <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

It has been 72 hours and counting of NC.

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

this is for YOU
for YOUR own sanity...

ARK

Hi everyone..

Been keeping myself busy, or at the very least trying too. 5 days of NC...driving myself crazy with all the wondering, like why doesn't he just write me anyway? Maybe I should let him know this is making me crazy?....

I try not to take my frustration,and anger out on those at home. I sooo want to call him and ask him why this is not ripping him the way it is ripping me....

For any of the BS's out there, who do not thing that we the WS feel the pull, or feel how "real" the "withdrawl" is ...think again. It is very real, and at times it would be easier to slip back into the depths of the lies than to make our way through this.

But..I am holding my ground....reading the stories of those who have been there...and trying to draw strength from those around me.

When I feel the urge to contact the OM, I find something else to do...when a song plays on the radio...I change the station....when a thought comes into my mind...I try to think of my husband instead.

It is not easy...it is a day to day struggle...and one I hope I can continue to get through....

No, 2crazy, don't contact him.
Keep your word, let time pass.

I had read this ADVICE on a different thread to keep SILENT (NO contact) it kept me from emailing him, it helped me retain my self respect after my last email to him telling him it WOULD BE my last.

Now, much time has passed and I am using my time in much more constructive ways than writing him or watching for emails from him.

You CAN do this, 2crazy, each day that passes will be a
little bit easier for you.