Myrta - has Stanley forgiven you? Or are we hearing "fog talk?" I have not followed the happenings of the two of your for some time, so I may have missed the reaching of forgiveness that was being withheld.

Star*fish, it’s good that you’ve read mkeverydaycnt’s history to understand where he is coming from…it’s good that you reach out to him and shows care & concern for him…but I just want to make you aware that I’m VERY hurt and saddened by his posts and attacking behavior towards me yesterday and before. I feel I don’t deserve it and that it was uncalled for…VERY uncalled for. I have feelings too you know and the fact that I’m a FWW who had a relapse recently doesn’t give him the right to focus his anger and pain on me and attack me, disrespect me, insult me and make false assumptions and accusations about me… I posted the first post on this thread yesterday to correct him (and Bigkahuna) on the things he lied about me and to correct him on some incorrect assumptions he has about me…I just stated the facts and posted respectfully…but he wasn’t interested… He reacted by showing anger and made false judgments about me again…WITHOUT giving reasons for his assumptions and accusations… <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

Unfortunately I have a "thin skin" and was negatively influenced by mkeverydaycnt's wrongful behavior towards me again... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" /> And unfortunately I'm not the type of person who believes to just put someone on the "ignore list"...that is not my style...and that's also not my style in 'real life' (where there isn't "ignore buttons" to make a person "disappear")... I will rather deal with the person and get to the bottom of the problem.

Star*fish, you know, he is not the only one who is wounded by things from his past, I’m too and if he would EVER take the time to read my history to understand where I’m coming from…he would see that I was severely betrayed in my life too and still carry pain and wounds from that… In fact, EVERY ONE (BS’s AND WS’s/FWS’s) have pain from their pasts and EVERYONE are ‘wounded’ people in one way or the other…EVERYONE have their “crosses” to carry… Therefore I think it’s important for everyone to at least TRY and treat each other with dignity, respect and sensitivity…especially since we all are created by GOD and are “WORTH IT”.

Suzet,

I had hoped that reaching out to mk and taking the time to get to know him....treating him the way I'd like to be treated BY him....would actually help this situation more, and help you more, than just joining yet another argument on this board. I'm so very tired of reading the arguments of late. Please don't feel badly.....the time I took to get to know him was spent on both of you....I hoped you would see that.

If you can understand where some of the hurt/anger/sadness orginates....it can take away alot of the "sting" and reaction you feel. It is one of the ways I've dealt with feelings of being attacked. Sometimes, meeting anger with anger....just creates more anger....when what's really needed is some compassion to diffuse the anger.

I honestly care about mk....and those feelings are a direct result of the fact that I cared enough about <you> to invest the time to find out more about what was fueling this conflict. I knew your story....I didn't know his.

We're all people here.....and everyone of us has a story. No matter what kind of letter designation we have or what style of posting we use....we bring our experiences with us.

Dear Starfish, I just want to assure you that I did see that...and that's why I've said it's good that you’ve taken the time to read mk’s history to understand where he is coming from…that you've reached out to him and showed care & concern for him... Because of this and your posts to him on this thread, I do understand better now where some of his hurt/anger/sadness originates. I want to thank you for that.

The reason I responded to yesterday, wasn't because I didn’t see that or felt badly, but to make clear to you that in spite of my better understanding of mk’s situation and the anger/pain he carries, I still feel very hurt, saddened and disappointed by his behavior towards me...especially since he never apologized and feel his behavior towards me was “justified”…and wanted to make me disappear with an "ignore button". I just feel that no matter how much a person is "wounded" by his past and no matter how much pain/sadness/anger such a person still carries as a result of that, is NEVER a reason and/or excuse to project such feelings onto another person who carries "wounds", pain, hurt and sadness from his/her past too...

I still struggle with self-worth problems from time to time (as a result from my past) and although I’ve received IC a few years ago, I still try to resolve/overcome some issues within myself...but sometimes I struggle… And probably this is the reason for the reaction and “sting” I feel for his attacking behavior towards me…in spite of the fact that I understand where some of his feelings comes from… I feel he directly tried to attack my feelings of self worth as a person…especially when he said I’m not “worth it”…and that hurt…even though I “mentally” know his words is not true...and probably something Satan wants me to believe…

Yes, I 100% agree with you Star and you’re correct. This is an area I probably still need to work on – to show compassion to a person who doesn’t appear to have ANY compassion (or at least some understanding) left for me… However, I don’t think I’ve ever met mk’s anger with anger…I never insulted him in return.

I know now (after I’ve read something mk said about me on Myrta’s thread yesterday) that he feels angry with me and thinks I’m “foggy” and “self-centered” because the OM’sW still doesn’t know about the past EA (which I can certainly understand) but at the same time it shows me that he have a lack of compassion and understanding for me and my H's situation and circumstances…and that he especially shows a lack of compassion and understanding for the fact that I don’t want to go against my H feelings and betray him again by doing something he will not allow/agree to at this stage.

I know you care Star… Thanks for that…and thanks for the time you’ve invested.

I understand…this was never an issue for me. What I HAVE said is that if mk would ever take the time to read my history to understand where I’m coming from…he would see that I was severely betrayed in my life too (unrelated to infidelity) and still carry pain and wounds from that…just like him. As I've said yesterday, we ALL have our “crosses” to carry...

Very true.

I'd say it was more a deliberate "choice" as opposed to "allowing oneself". To say you allowed yourself implies you "let it happen TO you".

JMVHO,
Jo

Yes, you're correct...it was a delibarate choice on my part. With those words I didn't mean to imply otherwise. To me it meant the same.

I wanted to respond to this thread.
When I was in a state of not reaching some healing from my husband cheating on me, I was easily triggered into absolute fury when I saw people cheating or seeming to justify their cheating. The first whiff any such thing I was bitter and vindictive, I wanted to beat those people up so badly.

What I gained over time and over addressing MYSELF rather than those people, was a couple of things.:

Everyone screws up, some of us quite badly. Adding to the damage by being vindictive and abusive to the people who I felt were triggering me just made me angrier, more desperate and increased my feelings of having the RIGHT to say whatever I wanted to them no matter how cruel or damaging...all under the umbrella that as a BS I had the right to pass judgement and if I could save a BS even one little smidgeon of hurt by beating the heck outta their unfaithful partner, then I was justified.

I understand now that is not true and acting out my pain against someone who has not personally harmed me did not help me at all. It damaged my feelinsg of self esteem and I didn't like how I felt because of that.


I have read a lot here and I read the Suzet thread a while back and the Kiwi one.

I am not asking for flaming or being attacked by those of you who are actively struggling with deep pain. It is how you feel, perhaps some of you would best serve yourselves and others by spending a little less time on triggering threads until you have healed more.

I think when someone you know on these boards goes from putting pressure on you here to straighten yourself out to betraying your trust here by invading your real life situation by calling up your partner to "expose" you to them...well I think that is totally out of line. You have to wonder at the rage and cruelty inside a person who would do that.
For the person here who had that happen to them, I just want to say that I think there are people who have true class and grace under fire and right now you are one of them. I think you are one heck of a lady and I respect you for how you are handling things.

And remember this is how I FEEL. I am not going to respond to any attempt to argue or debate with me over it. For those of you still struggling with such pain and anger, I truely hope you find healing.

Somewhat of a contradiction there, wouldn't you say BO.


Then immediately following, BO writes:

And this is just my opinion...not any more factual than yours... just a belief....

Any person that does not expose infidelity when given the chance to do so is enabling that behavior and is complicit in the harm caused to the BS. Yes, I was harmed... but that does not mean that I cannot be objective and look at a situation where a BS is being actively harmed by one of the people on this board. They SHOULD be called on that behavior until it is corrected. Her actions are very offensive to BS that were left in the dark. Her justifications were weak at best... and her morality was situational.
As far as the person that called the other BS in question... her morals are right on the money and she was THANKED by the BS and the FWS alike. Her actions prevented a bad situation from becomming worse.



You say it is rage and unresolved feelings that cause someone to act in this way.. I say it is morals and a strong resolve to not be silent in the face of another being harmed. The vast majority her applauded her actions and I consider that person to be among the most valuable assets to this board.

Anyone that feels that it is okay for a BS to remain in the dark to the betrayals inflicted on them... has in my opinion... and this again is just my opinion... no place on a board for infidelity recovery. That is addressing MYSELF... and being convicted to do the right thing is what it is all about.

I will tell you that I was a victim of sexual assault as a child... by a priest. Does your line of thinking that just because a particular priest did not harm me... but is harming others that I should not take action to prevent that from happening. Is not what you call "rage" against an injustice.. be it infidelity or CSA, the fuel that allows those victimized by assaults to no longer be victims... to become instead examples of what we should all strive to be... our "brother's keeper."

To both of you, it is my own feeling. You can think whatever you like, and you will. Your humble opinion is your own and I respect that.


I am attacking no one, resilient, merely pointing out that I found the act and its intent to be a damaging one on the part of the person who did it. I still do. The first quote you have of my post is where I state what I think, and the second quote is an example of why I think it: an actual incidence where a person who has not healed has used their own pain as justification to act out their pain and anger against someone else when they were triggered.

I don't mind that you disagree with me.

Thank you for your attempt to explain what you posted, BO. But I'm fully aware of what you intended to accomplish.

Jo

Clever girl..I am so glad you understand my point: I think betraying someone else's trust in order to point out to the person you are betraying that the person you are betraying has betrayed someone else is.. IMO either an act of malice or an act of pain and it can be both.

It is similar to the what an abuser says.."YOU made me do it."

I don't think so.

Good day to you.

I am not trying to change your opinion either... but please expalin to me how you find the act damaging when both the FWS and BS both felt that it help them. What was the damage?? How did you come to know ML's intent in revealing this?

Please read what I said carefully. I didn't say I knew the intent. I said what I feel about it from my perspective. "I found the act.."
The statement was not "the act IS".

The only person who REALLY knows the intent is the person who did it.
I don't personally believe it was an act of helpfullness and I don't believe it was intended that way. That is my opinion.
There is no room for debate with me over this.

You believe what you believe and I believe what I believe. I respect your opinion as yours.

Just wanted to also say that I am sad you are having such a struggle with your own situation. I do know how it feels. It took me a long time to come to terms with my own stuff. I hope you find peace. Time does heal, even when your wayward partner bolts off ( been there too <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" /> )so they don't have to take their responsibility.

Well BO, I do know the person that you are talking about and I do know her intent, which was good, caring and kind...I also know that this person is NOT angry and bitter and unhealed as you keep implying and I would thank you to quit refering to my friend in such a way...

Mrs. W

BUT, your "perspective" is not truth. You have no way of knowing anyone's motive unless you are a psychic. And if you are claiming to be a psychic, you are a very bad one because you called this one completely wrong.

My "intent" is not a matter of your "opinion" but a matter of FACT. A FACT that you would have no way of knowing so any "opinion" you proffer about my "intent" is pure blather based on your imagination.

Stick to your day job, BlackOpal, you are no Madame Cleo. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smirk.gif" alt="" />

Thank you for this. I am at peace an in a very good place with all that. MY WP didn't bolt.. I sent her packing. She wants back in and I will have nothing to do with it. I don't find that time heals.. but I understand your perspective... I feel that acceptance and forgiveness heal... she has both of those from me. What she doesn't have is me to abuse any longer.

Sounds like you are in a good place. I am happy for you.

In addition, i would ask that you apply the logic youmentioned a few posts back to the priest scerario I gave you. Again, I am just trying to understand your perspective.

Okay, I will bite... why did you find the act damaging when neither the BS or FWS found it to be? Why did you consider the intent damaging if neither the BS or FWS believed it to be?

I am just curious as to what brought you to that perspective knowing full well that neither the BS or FWS feel that way.

Seems BO isn't satisfied until she has caused more upheaval even if she has to bring up antiquated already hashed over issues. It also appears she has a vendetta towards a certain individual.

Please let it go, BO. Kindly Peace Out.

I know BO can't read my posts since she has me on ignore, but I'll share it anyway.

Mel and I spoke about an hour before she made the call. She was in turmoil. We spoke shortly after and she was so very sad. Sad for Rob.

She did not do it to hurt anyone - she did it to give them an opportunity to heal.

There was nothing malicous about it at all.

It was a very hard thing for her to do. She did not wake up that morning and think "I think I'll go play God in someone else's marriage."

For a week that I know of, she labored over the fact that she knew how to contact Rob. For her to do it was a risk she felt was worthy to take as it was evident that Jen was not going to tell him.

She did not gloat.

She was not arrogant.

There was a very deep sadness for Rob, Jen and their marriage.

It's my own feelings Mel, I won't debate you. I simply don't believe you.
I think your reasoning to convince me is syllogistic, and therefore, by it's nature, flawed.

I don't have time to respond to anyone else, I have a meeting I need to go to.