Marsh wrote this about calling Steve H:

How about asking her to talk to him as a Christmas present to you?

Tell her you need her help in dealing w/ things better.

Me:

I talked to ww today and got to talking about a MC we went to months ago. I told her that she was not very good. WW said "that one guy you talked to on the phone is good isn't he?" I said yes and that I would love for her to talk to him. Just to hear him out nothing more - no pressure. Make it my Christmas present - help me understand a few things better." No responce, but not a no from her. I'll bring it up again.

I'm suprised that she even talked at all about MC.

M2L

Do you own HNHN or SAA? A lot of stubborn people won't read them if you ask them to, but will look at them of their own doing. So, I would recommend leaving them out and letting your wife's curiousity get the best of her. The power of suggestion, like a subliminal message.

I'm so glad you asked her to do this for you.

A phone call is alot less threatening than an office visit is.

I hope she'll agree to it.

She just needs some hope, and a point in the right direction.

When you bring this up again, be sure to keep it about YOU...YOUR need, for YOU...

I like Jim's idea too...leaving those books around the house.

I'd even try to "hide" them... finding something hidden would make me even more curious. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/pfft.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

~ Marsh

I am soo in agreement with this hidden thing! M2......listen to MM and J95...i am going to do the same thing.

Remember what MM said.its so true....She is choosing to stay with you now.

Hang in there my brother.

So ww calls me - very soft remorseful voice and says:


I would understand if you wanted to leave me.

NC sound like anyone you know????

Talked about OM and OM not being the person she thought he was. The OM in this case is a Dr. So I had that going against me. Most other people are less then, not in my case, or so I thought until today when ww told me that.

WW also told me that for the last few months she was angry at him and now she feels just sad for him. Sad at the person he is and that we have come so far (Plan A working). My wife also told me that she really feels totally different about OM than she has in months.

I think she is starting to see the WHOLE thing differently and seeing it for the mistake it was. I kinda hope she is starting to crash. I almost need to see a crash happen.

Off to shopping with her and the kids.

M2L

That sounds very promising. Hang in there and keep doing what you are doing. Hopefully she will talk to the Harley's. They are very good at talking to the WS.

M2L,

I think you don't understand something. Her talking to Steve H is for YOU, it really is. No matter what she says or does not say to him, he will understand the situation better. If he says something that helps her, great. But, really this is about YOU, and she needs to fully understand this and so do you.

You are expecting him to change her, that will NOT HAPPEN...until she is ready. What you can expect and allow is for Steve Harley to change YOU. That is what you are seeking. You need to see it this way and so does she.

It does sound as if you are putting some deposits in the love bank. That is good, I believe I posted to you SKM's chronicles, if you learned anything from them, it is that this takes time. Keep up the deposits but stay a bit withdrawn. Also see if she will help YOU by talking to SH.

Please think about this.

God Bless,

JL

PS: Please remember they consider their counceling "coaching". Only those willing to be "coached" can be coached, that would be you. It is not your W. She also needs to hear this as well.

M2L,

What JL wrote was and is 'profound'. Many of us already know how often and how capable JL is at putting things so precisely (not the word I wanted.....to tired to spell the other one - <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" /> ).

So for what my measly 2 cents is worth, please read JL's post again and consider deeply his words. They will have more of an impact if you choose to apply them. An impact both to you (1st) then to your W (the real one).

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

All the best,
L.

I took the day off work to spend with my wife shopping, lunch and such - the 15 hours together part so I will bring up the talking to Steve H for me part.

JL - I see it your way and it makes sence.

thanks all,
M2L

Mey M2L, THAT IS GREAT!!!!!!!!

I am happy and excited to see progress, even if it is snail pace.

Prayerfully when they do emerge from their "cocoon", we would be able to tell them about us here. Come to even visit me sometime. I would put you all up and let you tour here with us.(No hotel expense and some GOOD authentic Jamaican spicy jerk food)!

You know it is easy to forget but remember........You change YOU. you cannot change her........does that sounds familiar?

I am really happy for you.i really am......oh yes , in the future i hope you "GIT SOME!!"

NC,

I'll keep giving you advice if you let me come down there to stay with you. Is your place an "all-inslusive"? <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

jim,
lets make a deal......pray all our wives will truly become wives then we will have a reunion here in jamaica and we can brag about us attending the same courses online.and how we hook up.

yeah feel free.......come for some prime lobster,deep fried fish seasoned to the bone. with some jerk chicken and salad on the side (pretend to eat healthy.) since most of the stuff prepared are not by the gas stove but open flame the flavours are sealed in and cooked to perfection.......oh yes wash it down with some red stripe beer.

then go to sleep, wake up later hit the dance strip or take in a local play or rafting then rest again.......some torrid SF then fresh up to the clean air and night noises in the country. The kids can watch cable.

We play on the beach in the night then sleep again......repeat the next day........

i pray that our WW look and realize that they have the best of their years ahead of them.

For the sake of all thats good in our children's lives.

have a good one M2L! and Jim.........nuff sun shine till next time.

easy mon.

yesterday I took off work and spent the day shopping with my wife. We shopped a little and talked a lot. A LOT. She just started talking and by the time she was done she said
"M2L I never thought you would change into the person you are. You are so much better than OM was."

That is when she crashed and started crying and saying what a bad person she is and continued with:

- OM is a(*&%^$ and he can go to *&%&^%

-OM is not the person I thought he was

- M2L, you are by far a better father and H and person all around

- She would like to call him just to tell him that she has moved on long ago and is happy now. Here is the weird part for me. My wife wants any revenge to come from the act of her and I living a happy life (that is what has been said on these boards many times) I talked to her about not calling and she agreed - just wanted to rub it in his face. I said NC is best

-my wife said I'm content at home with you right now and I don't want to split up us or the kids.

- my wife cried and said she feels used. I asked why and she said "don't start that with me, you know why I feel used."

I let her know that she is not a bad peron or wife. Yes she made mistakes, but she has made the right choice to get out of it.

She could not take her eyes off me. I missed those eyes, they look like her old eyes.

I have been working for this day for 7 months and I almost feel like - now what? I think I will be there for her and try to fill her LB as much as I can with out pushing too much.

I did look at her during a quite time and said softly ILY. She said I know.

M2L

SF, that's what. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

Seriously, just slowly lead her to marriage builders and slowly get her to buy into the system as well. Keep taking it slowly. Resist the temptation to say, "Okay, we're cured now." Don't get complacent.

Congrats, M2L! Hopefully I will be able to post a similar story in the next few months.

awww, M2L, I'm so happy for you...both of you.

Congrats.

Time to get a new nic?

~ Marsh

I forgot to say thank you to God and everyone here that has helped. I know I have a long way to go, but I feel like my wife will be helping some also.

M2L

Oh M2L, you are so lucky!!!! I am so happy for you!! I hope my hard work gets me to where you are. I just read your whole post yesterday and I wanted to reach out to you. I will be posting some time today on my thread. I hope you get a chance to read it and help me out. I'm feeling very lost, scared and confused.

Thanks I-P,

I'll take a look at you post

I see your very new into recovery - a little over a month. It is hard, but stay with plan A.

M2L,

Hard fought and well done.........continue to transform before Her eyes and rely on God's grace and patience to get you thru this.

CONGRATULATIONS!!!!!!.

hope my WW is definitely like yours.......pray that she too will turn the corner. one day at a time.

any more baking?

MAKE SURE YOU CONTINUE doing what you are doing.

really love you man......so damn proud of you.

M2L:

I just posted. I'm just feeling so confused right now. I want to do a great Plan A and I understand Plan A, but I just don't feel like I'm doing anything right. I don't feel like I'm reaching my H at all. I'm sure you felt that way during your Plan A. Your W still wanted to do things with you though. I don't think my H feels that way anymore. I really feel like I'm losing him. I need to get him back. I really don't feel like I can live without him.

I did make a lot of personal changes. My H said he did recognize my changes and he likes them, but he said they aren't making a difference. They are not making him make up his mind to stay with the M. I wonder if that's because he still has contact with the OW. He still doesn't know what he wants (at least that's what he said the last time we talked).

I'm lost and I really need some help.