I think at some point someone asked me if she was worth it, and really, I ask myself that over and over again.

While there's no dispute that she did a willful, conscious act of betrayal, when I look back our marriage it was no bed of roses either. She showered me with much love, affection and care, and most of the time all she got back was barely a grunt. While I told her I loved her, I didn't buy her gifts, flowers, I didn't take her out on romantic dinners -in short, I didn't treat her like the queen she is (to me). I was often pushy and many times could not accept that her point of view was important, only mine. I had to have my way in almost everything, pulling a long face or giving her the silent treatment when I couldn't get my way till she gave in. Its hard to admit, but in short, I was a complete @sshole.

In contrast, the OW had a lot in common with her or tried her best to have. When she joined the company and I met her during the early stages, the OW was very tomboy-ish, dressed like a dude and had mannerisms more like a man than a woman. But slowly, the more she hung out with my wife, she started to wear dresses, and started to look more ladylike. I'd like to believe it was all a ploy to have more things in common with my wife, to shop together, go to the gym together, to connect better with her.

Suddenly one day I found that I couldn't talk to my wife anymore, she was no longer the loving wife I thought I had, and it SCARED the heck out of me. Too late when I later learned about the affair.

Hence, when I think of how hard it is for me to go through this, I think of the last year when we drifted and she continued to love me, getting nothing back. I guess thats what keeps me strong. If she could do it, I can sure as ****** try to at least return some of that love. Does it make sense?

Affairs are a real wakeup call for BS's and it allows the BS to change neglecting habits and to attempt to win back the spouse. You are competing with fantasy love and it is tough to compete with.

You are being niave about wanting to protect her carreer and having her quit at her liesure, etc. Recovery will not even begin until your wife or the OW quits the job. When you threatened her with exposure, she got scared and threatened you with the loss of your marriage. That is typical for WS's to do. She fears exposure and she doesn't want to be labeled a lesbian, I am sure. I would start exposure with her family. You want to bring pain and reality into the relationship so the fantasy can be broken. If you ad scrutiny from others, then you bring reality to the affair. The affair must have a price. Once you tell someone close to her, she will know you are serious. Maybe she has a best friend you can tell and ask to help talk some sense into her. You can expand on exposure if she doesn't respond. Unfortunately BS's becomes enablers because they fear divorce so they don't do what Dr. harley teaches. Exposure is not to punish them but to disrupt the affair.

Expect no reconnection until she leaves her job. Sorry to tell you this, but I delayed recovery because my FWW convinced me she could work with her OM and break off the affair. He didn't want it to end and pursued her daily, just like your WW's ow is doing to her. The emotions of love are strong and addictive for the WS and the BS. Her late nights and work meetings with vendors are likely not even true. WS's will lie daily to protect their feelgood relationships. She is clearly manipulating you because of the yoyo actions you are describing of yourself. Maybe she needs to think she is going to lose you. Start reading up on the 180 degrees concept.

TooSoon

I learned the hard way about NC. I wanted it desperately, but neither would give up their jobs, and the workplace affair started up again after a few months of non-committed MC. By the time she was fired, they were already together again. I was amazed at the depths of the lies I was told (and believed--didn't listen to the 2x4s). Now I am headed to Plan B as she moves out.

Thanks again to the FWs who post their experiences. It gives me a lot more confidence to continue trying and that my real wife will wake up at some point.

SDGuy

this my WS EXACTLY!!



he is still with OW <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />


i plan A'd my butt off, i made really big changes once i accepted my part in not meeting my H's needs....but his contact with OW continued and he was unable to feel anything for me when he still felt he was "in love" with her

she came first and i was only in the way

no contact is the only way to allow your marraige to be restored

18 months later and no true remorse and mine is still with OW too. I don't know that WH is the type that will ever be able to look at himself....still see's it as being my fault. Infact...just a few days ago he sent me a text message that was meant for OW.

I hope your WW wakes from the fog. Not sure if anyone else has asked this question...but is she questioning her sexuality?

Hi all,

Thank you all for the encouragement you have given to me. It really does help to keep me going, and I think I do see a light at the end of the tunnel now.

Last night we had dinner and watched a movie. I guess I was so mentally and physically exhausted, driving myself crazy wondering whether or not she was going back to the OW that I didn't give as much time to consider my feelings of being betrayed. Last night something as simple as having dinner together and trying to make small talk suddenly made me feel so weary and tired... and defeated.

We drove home in silence and I crawled into my bed as soon as we had got home without a word. She was concerned, telling me she didn't want me to lose myself. She knows what she did was wrong, and that she did not have an excuse. She didn't want to think of the consequences, she felt so alone, didn't know where our marriage was going, couldn't communicate with me, and took the first avenue that presented itself.

I told her I was tired, tired of telling her I love her, tired of telling her I want our marriage to get back on track, tired of being suspicious all the time, and tired of wondering all the time if she was still going to continue the affair, or relapse back into it. All I could feel at that point was that I despised her, hated her for doing what she did. I told her she had won, I would give her a divorce because I will not allow myself to drown because of what she did. I would not allow myself to drive myself crazy over this, it was affecting my work, I couldn't concentrate on anything for 10 minutes without wondering where she was or what she was doing, I wasn't eating well (I've gone down an inch at the waist in the last 5 days). I was just tired and defeated.

She was silent for a while and said that she had forgotten that spark of romance. When we first got married, when we were dating -all that had changed. She said we were both travelling in different directions and she didn't know if she could put up with a husband who was in a perpetual bad mood, who was everything I described in my post above. She took the first chance that came along just to have that feeling of being loved, of being cared for and it was all of that, rather than the physical affair that had resulted. It never went beyond making out in the car, on 2-3 occassions, and only that for that 2 weeks. She grew close to the OW as they worked together and it wasn't until 2 weeks ago that she realized just how close they had grown together. For now, she was quite sure she was over the OW, she realized it was not the person she fell in love with, but the feeling of being cared for and pampered.

I asked her what was it she wanted. I said I know now what an @sshole I had been, what a terrible husband, but that I didn't deserve what she did to me. For the first time she said that she wanted to work on our marriage, that 65% of her wanted that, and the remaining 35% of her didn't think we could last even were we to get back together. She said she agreed that we needed some counselling to get our marriage back on track.

I honestly believe that the OW is out of the picture already, and even more so when my wife changes jobs. She is waking up from the fog and has realized that her 2 week affair was something that couldn't last, couldn't go on. I'm looking forward to the weekend when we both can get some real rest and really work on our marriage without the spectre of the OW hanging over my head. My biggest problem now is not worry that she will go back to the OW, nothing like that, but to really ask myself if I can really forgive her for what she did. That will take some time.

"I hope your WW wakes from the fog. Not sure if anyone else has asked this question...but is she questioning her sexuality? "

Nope, not at all. She has also confided in her best friend.. it was never like that. She got her emotional needs met, and it didn't matter if it was met by a man or a woman.

hope you are ok by now....i am still suffering....

Strangely enough, I woke up today feeling ok. I am sure she was being honest, and that she does not feel for the OW in that way anymore. Although I can't say for certain that our marriage will get back on track quite so easily, nor whether I can still get over the A just yet, I know that we have a chance if we both work towards it. I don't have anxiety attacks like I did the last few days, and the urge to call her every hour is fading. Doesn't mean I trust her 100%, but my instincts do tell me that maybe I can start to re-trust her again.

I will keep you guys in my prayers tonight. I hope we can all have a happy ending at the end of this long bitter journey. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

someone here once said to me that sooner or later they do wake up and their choice is :
A) Look at the horror and radically change, voicing it , et,al.

B) See the horror and dive back into the fog to play their fantasy guilt, it is easier to do this than to face the fact that they "screwed up"

C) See the horror and have a very intense fear of repo cussion.

D)Realize the horror years later and to ashamed to admit it, so they move on.

E)Know about this on their death bed and confess their faults before meeting their Maker.

You see, at some point they do look back and think about it and FEEL SOME form of remorse. It is if they choose to tell you.

You cant enjoy forever somthing conceived in secrecy and darkness (the excitement factor) and expect it to last.

IMHO.......Its temporary.

So do they wake up? I say yes.......the question is when?

You cannot deny reality forever.

Right now all she wants is to be left alone. Says that different people deal with things differently, she doesn't want to talk about it like I do, but I can tell she IS tired.

She also said that she was aloen with the OW in the office before coming home today. And they talked a bit about the 'situation'.. she said she was tired from all the talking, and apparently the OW apologized for putting her in this position. She said it was not entirely her fault (to the OW) etc...

Oh well, I figured if she WAS still lying to me, then she's lying to me. Maybe she really wants to be alone to sort out her thoughts and feelings, or whatever. Nothing much I can do at this point so I will just watch and be vigilant. I told her that she was talking last night about how great it was when we first got married and how she said she missed that. I told her that this was a wake up call to me, and that I would do all I can to repair our marriage, BUT unless she cuts off all contact with the OW, we cannot begin to move in that direction. After that, she has been a bit miffed with me the entire night <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

What are you supposed to do when WW refuses to change her job and sees the OM (from EA) every day. That the WW refuses to acknowledge the friendship ever progressed to an EA. That the friendship falls into a gray area of right and wrong, and now acceptance of the friendship is a condition of reconnciliation.

She's reading the articles on Infidelity that I printed from this website, of her own choice, after she had just chucked them to one side from when I left them on her bed 3 days ago. Good sign maybe?

I will start to implement parts of Plan A today. I will NOT initiate any conversation about the M, or the A, nor ask about her feelings. She wants some time off for the gym and to survey a place (alone, she says) for her company year-end Xmas party. I can't stop her if she IS meeting the OW, but perhaps she's really trying to get some time off alone.

Anyway, I'll give her this weekend to recharge after a really busy week, and we'll see how I'll proceed on Monday. Thanks all for your support so far <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

I needed to ask my FWW a million questions and I had new questions every day. The MC made it clear to me that I couldn't stop my FWW from leaving if she wanted to leave, but she also said I was entitled to know the answers to my questions. She got my wife to agree to answering my questions for 10 minutes a day so it didn't drag on all day long. Something you might consider doing too.

Your biggest dalemna is her ongoing communication with the OW. As long as she can see her and talk with her, she won't be able to get her out of her head and reconnect back with you.

TooSoon

Hi TooSoon,

Let me relate soemthing that happened today. Last night when we had dinner, and she told me she talked to the OW when they were alone at the office, I told her she MUST leave her job and cut off ALL contact with the OW. I saw it had an effect on her, cause right after that she was hostile to me all night long, wouldn't acknowledge my good night kisses, wouldn't look at me and tried not to talk to me all night until she went to bed. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/pfft.gif" alt="" />

It lasted until this morning when I dropped her off to do some shopping and I asked her if she wanted to be by herself and she said ok. So I just dropped her off and went my own way, having lunch with an old friend. Up until that point, she has still given me those silent looks like as though I was the baddest person in the whole world, but I had decided that morning that I was going to go about my business and ignore those looks and act aloof (and I felt that way too!). We met around lunch time and she gave me a quick hug before going shopping and we only saw each other when she picked me up later. By then I was a bit tired and more than a bit irritable and was a bit sarcastic in the car ("Why don't you recommend a place for dinner, since you're been having so many romantic dinners lately?" etc... that kind of stuff). I knew I was doing more LBs but I was a bit fed up from being ignored all night and all day, and what was with that quick hug in the afternoon, a chance for her to feel better about herself and then switch off again?

I had told myself I would NOT initiate any conversation about THE topic again, so was a bit surprised when we got home and she asked me if I wanted to talk. I said sure, sat down and asked HER "So, what did you wanna talk about?". She said that when she felt that she wanted to try to move on I get sarcastic on her and its like before this thing happened. She was obviously trying to take me on a guilt trip, so I kinda blew up and told her off, saying that at least I had been bloody trying to make things right. I had to swallow my anger and sense of betrayal and to try and give her love and affection and all the while I get the cold shoulder. Well guess what? I'm bloody human too!! She was a bit taken aback at that.

She said that when I told her last night she could never see the OW again, the realization kicked in. As she said this, she got weepy, which further strengthened my resolve to do it -couldn't shed a tear for me or our marriage, but cry for the OW? I told her that bad enough she was lying to me, she was lying to herself so much she couldn't even tell what was the truth anymore.

She asked me what I meant and I told her "You told me the other day I was wrong to think of you as addicted to the affair, but in actual fact, you are! Even the thought of leaving her now is causing such pain, if this goes on you will definitely go back to her, if you haven't already". She nodded agreement to that. I then added "I want to help you, really its in MY best interests to help you overcome this, but you MUST know that you shall have to have NO CONTACT whatsoever with her again". Again she nodded, then tried to justify saying that she needed time to think and felt I was pushing her, using the old threat that if she was pushed too far she would just let everything go, me and her. I told her, that I cannot control what she does nor what she says and that if she wanted to continue the affair, I couldn't stop her.

HOWEVER, I told her there were 3 things I wanted to say to end the conversation.

1. If she procrastinates, sooner or later she will go back to the OW cause she is addicted to contact with her. I told her our marriage CANNOT recover until there is NC with the OW and the longer there IS contact, the higher the chance she will go back to her.

2. She has to stop lying to herself and just consider: Even if our marriage fails, does she really think she has any kind of future with the OW? How long does she think something like that will last??

No 3 really got her attention:

3. Like any addict, they will not kick the habit until they are thrown into rehab and the door locked. If they keep taking small fixes all the time, they will not kick the addiction. Hence to enforce and expedite her changing jobs to start the NC, I told her I would reveal the affair to her parents, sister, all her (very close) church friends and to her colleagues, especially her general manager. If I cannot make them voluntarily separate from each other, I will get the manager to do it for me. There was a moment of fear on her face as she realized I was dead serious and not the least apologetic like when I said it last time. She then tried the "you're pushing me into a corner" line to which I replied "Well thats really too bad. You have to know that there is a consequence to your affair, and perhaps this will make it real to you that I'm serious."

She asked me when I was going to do it and why was I pushing her to which I said that there was no fixed timeline. If I feel that she has gone back to the OW, or is on the verge of doing so, I will make a trip to her office to speak with her boss. I will destroy the OW's reputation in the process as well and that I have nothing to lose but everything to gain. I hoped she will be able to see someday that I was doing it FOR her and not TO her.

Imagine my amazement when she suddenly picked up the papers and went through the job listings! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" /> Man, they're right, they will pull all kinds of crap on ya, trying to make you back off of make you feel guilty. She then sat for 3 hours straight at the PC doing up her resume, which she had not done at all since last week. If I hadn't threatened her with revealing everything to the ppl she cared about I doubt she would be so 'motivated'. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

Anyway I also got the OW's number and I'm going to call her up tomorrow. I'm going to tell her that my wife and I are trying to right the mess that they both had done and that I didn't want her pulling her stupid fake drunk-lesbian stunts or anything of the sort again. As an added incentive to stop, I'll tell her I know where she lives, where she works and even whic church she goes to. If she keeps trying to seduce my wife, I will make sure that everyone will find out that she's nothing but a desperate lesbian who targets married women and since I work in the industry she does sales in, I will make sure that everyone hears about it and her career will be finisged. I have nothing to lose from this but she has everything to lose.

Any opinions? Should I go ahead with the call to get her to back off? How else should I proceed with WS?

Also, do you just let them go when they say they need time off to think and consider? I told her that SHE IS NOT UNIQUE! Hundreds and thousands of WS's had done and said the very things she had, so I wasn't buying anymore of it. I said that if she wanted to meet up with the WS in secret, there was little I could do to stop them, but to remember the consequences.

You should NEVER threaten exposure.

You just expose!

Now that she knows what you will do, she may decide to head your exposure off by spinning her A, her way to her boss and family.

If you ever do decide to expose, it will have a much lesser impact than if you did it as a surprise.

Plus you will have a much more difficult time explaining to your WW that you did it FOR your M and not as revenge.

~ Marsh

Devastated - you will get loads of sound advice here. I felt like I was reading my own story as I read through your posts. For me, it has been 18 months and my WW wants to just pretend nothing ever happened. In fact, her response to MC after 6 months was "I already know all the right answers".

This road is tough and will likely get tougher before it gets better. For me, "Love Must be Tough" has been the best one. Right now she is self-centered and will take what she can get - whether from OW or you - whoever makes her feel good. Buckle down and hold on because you're in for a ride.

The best advice I could give you is don't be a doormat! Respect yourself and know you can't fix her - that's up to her!

Walk strong -

You seemed to have done that well with her. Tha fact she prepared her resume is good. You reached the end of your rope like I did with my FWW. It was only when I gave my ultamadum did my FWW agree to quit her job. After i layed it out it the same manner, I told her I was going to her bosses, her mothers, and her entire family tomorrow. She agreed to give her two weeks notice the next day. This was on a Thursday and she gave her two weeks notice on the next Monday since her boss was off the very next day. Your wife is weak and will fall back in her arms if whe doesn't leave. She will suffer and will go through withdrawal but you can't avoid that. The undoing of the feelings take a long time so you are going to have to be patient with her.

You need to tell her to give her notice. When my wife quit, we lost our insurance and her income which we needed. Affairs are very costly. I say go ahead and call the OW and giver her an ultamadum too, like you suggested.

In the end, the OM walked out without penalty. I wanted to ruin his carreer but I agreed not too. You have your wife backed against the rope with fear. Work her fear against her until she completely fold and quits her job.

Hi Marsh,

Well, I did think about that, but thought that I have that leverage against her right now, if I just expose, she may just think then what the ******'s in it for me now?

Anyway, I tried calling the OW last night, but she didn't pick up. My WS said she was probably at band practice as was her routine on Saturday. I said I would try again tomorrow.

This morning I woke up and walked into the wife's room. I noticed her mobile was face down, when it was face up usually. With her just asleep I picked up the phone and saw that there was one message waiting. I opened it and it was from the OW: "I didn't pick up because I was at band practice. It wasn't deliberate."

Immediately I woke her up from her sleep and demanded to know why and what had she told to the OW. She said she woke up at 5am (couldn't sleep) and messaged the OW that I was going to call her, and to pick up, and that I was going to expose them if they were still seeing each other.

I got angry and said that she was still holding on to the OW and didn't believe her story, and she said no, she was afraid that if the OW didn' pick up that I would do something drastic like go down to the office and tell her boss directly or something like that.

I told her I was fed up. I told her that she must throw in the letter TOMORROW, or I'll expose what they did to EVERYONE. We live and work in a relatively small community and something like that WILL destroy both their careers and reputations. She sat there stunned for a while and I went back to my room. After a while she come in and started to work on her resume again, without a word. She later told me, "ok if you want me to resign, I'll do it" I told her to tell the OW that I wouldn't be calling her after all since she had already told her what I was going to do, she (the OW) would know I was serious when I walked into the office and speake to their boss -let her have some anxiety for a change.

I later told my wife that since she was going to resign, I wouldn't let the OW off scott-free and that I would talk to their boss and tell her about this. She said that the company would probably fire them both. I said, well, if this lesbian think she can just move on without consequences to herself, cut her losses and run, she was in for a surprise.

Its hard cause we are an equal income family, and truth be told with her company car allowance, she brings in slightly more than I do. Without her job, it would be VERY hard to move on, and sometimes I wonder if I made the right decision, that even if she has NC from resigning, if she can't find a job we shall be in dire straits indeed and what good will it do out marriage if we both resent each other for all of this. Many, many things will have to be given up, the car, the current apartment (prob have to rent a room), a whole lot. I'm thinking if I should extend the deadline when she will have to resign by till at least the end of the month.. That will give us more breathing space... sigh..

Anyway, she reading through the recruitment

I have only one thing to say. EXPOSE, EXPOSE, EXPOSE.