You are being highly critical of your H, Sis...

Does he view his job as being a dead-end job or do you?

I highly recommend the books LOVE AND RESPECT for you and THE CARE AND FEEDING OF HUSBANDS..

Does he feel that he is your intellectual INFERIOR? Does he feel that you look down your nose at him and he has to compete intellectually to get your approval? Because that is what I am hearing, LS.

I will just tell you that my XH did feel that way. And didn't like it one bit. I gloried in flaunting my intellectual prowess. He wasn't impressed. He was, however, impressed and ATTRACTED by the admiration, romance and FUN that the OW offered.

I mentioned that my personality was more like RT's than yours because i thought it might help you in some way.
seems like it has.

I am a SAHM....under educated...never finished college....yet, I love a spirited discussion about current events etc....uh,that includes People Magazine for me. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />
I am affectionate,flirtatious and spontaneous and I don't like to be left out of recreational activities.

Now, what would someone like your H see in me when he has someone like YOU?

He feels superior and it feels good to him?
(for a change)
Maybe you really are giving RT more credit than she deserves. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" />

I guess I intended it more as a figure of speech....maybe I need to think about why I framed it that way. I am not minimizing those things, but I do think that WH has a need for whatever it was that I was trying to describe earlier. (It's getting late...and I think we are going on about 10 pages of posts today)

Prime example: after the election, WH said to me, "I guess you were excited with me on election night with the Democratic sweep?" Don't kill me (especially now that I revealed my political affiliation), but I was pre-MB at the time and I totally LB'd him...something like, "Hmmm...why talk to me about it. Doesn't RT have an opinion?"

So I think that's still there for him...he works campaigns and watches every debate and....RT is CLUELESS.

That kind of stuff DOES stimulate WH.

Wow, I am so tired.

He does. Absolutely. He hates it. He is literally counting the days until he can retire with full benefits.

He may well be stagnating intellectually...but that's his issue not yours.

So his job isn't stimulating...have all the books just rolled off the planet?

OW is nigh braindead with the exception of flirting and you know why that's such a rush to him?

imo? 'Cause the only thing in the whole world she is looking at or thinking about is him, what he wants, how to keep him satisfied.

You want to know how she did it? She felt along your marriage for even the tiniest weak spot and just kept working at it until she got him depending on her for one thing...then another...then another until before you know it...all his loyalty tranferred.

Will trading in your conversation potential for an eyelash curler resolve that?

Nope.

What has she got that you didn't?

Singleminded ambition...she would sell her sweet grandma into sexual slavery for the opportunity to meet one of your Hs ens.

She made it a point to get close to him...to know what was on his mind and where he was at emotionally.

If he had an interest in astronomy she would be able to test out on a physics post grad degree by now...lol.

What I think is that she wanted him. So she made herself into whatever seemed to work.

I think he may have been dealing with some depression and the affair brain boost made him feel not only great...but alive again.

It's so formulaic you just want to puke after a few years of reading the same story over and over.

That singlemindedness is not sustainable.

Sooner or later her sense of entitledness will spill over. Or his will.

Still worth considering is this...where does romance rank in LSs world...and what does it look like?

Do you think you may have believed some lies or social stereotypes that just aren't serving you?

How certain are you that she is CLULESS?
Maybe he has introduced her to politics and she is enjoying it w/ him.

LS,

Let's take another track in thinking this through.

Think of OW like a Gestapo agent with a PHD in psychology - she knows her outcome is full surrender on the part of her victims. Each she has to treat VERY differently - and YES she is after FOUR victims here - your husband AND you - and your children. And the other heads she gets to count - your ILs - all for her consumption.

Now that you see her as that kind of predator, and you know your husband is fully in her snare - taken in, and programmed subliminally to see you as the enemy.

That's why she's so confident. Because her programming work on your husband was complete before you knew what was happening. She knows that to react to anything you do may break her programming hold on your wayward husband.

However, that's not to say that Gestapos have no feelings. But it takes a lot to get them out of control. She has no shame. Nothing is beneath her.

You have to become VERY unpredictable. Panties are out. What about bras?

Seriously, the only thing she's likely to freak about is him spending time with you. Even then, she may encourage it as a sign you're finally seeing the light and caving in to amicable divorce.

Time - Do the boys like football? How about some prime DADDY family time with a superbowl party he's never seen before at his own home, with his own boys? Have the boys create some invitations with crayons and glue-on things or stickers, and invite him to come over to their house to watch - because the game gets out so late, they have to sleep in their own beds, etc...

Get a nerf ball they can toss in the house - put the lamps away for the occasion...

No superbowl time with RT - let her stew on it and choke on it - all the while working very hard to keep her smiley face on - after all, she can't seem like she's coming between him and his boys?

No, no...it may be what you are hearing, but it's not what I'm trying to say. We were always on the same page...both enjoyed the discussion and having conversations and listening to NPR and talking about it. I wasn't flaunting anything...we WERE BOTH INTERESTED, equally. No one "one-upped" anyone. We both cared, and we always agreed.

Are you saying that a couple can't have an intellectual connection, that they can't have discussions about SUBSTANTIVE issues, without it jeopardizing their marriage? I don't buy that. And I truly don't WANT that in a marriage. I want someone that I can have a cup of coffee with when I'm 70 and still have something to say, still have something to talk about. Because at some point the girls start to sag and the plumbing stops working and there better be something else going on there IN ADDITION to the fun, playful, flirtatiousness.

RIGHT NOW I need to really DEMONSTRATE the SINCERE changes that I have made...my ABILITY AND DESIRE to BE the playful, flirty wife. But as you said...it's all part of a package...for me and WH...that other part was a significant part of our relationship as well. Maybe call it "intellectual companionship?" This may not be true for every couple...but it was for us. It was a real attraction for both of us.

GREAT POST, noodle!

I think Noodle's got it.

Mind if I copy it? My WH's OW was like that. She even abandoned her 12 year old daughter to be with my WH and take care of his needs.

Quote:
Prime example: after the election, WH said to me, "I guess you were excited with me on election night with the Democratic sweep?"

I think that in the 100+ pages of this thread this is the first time I have been disappointed in you.

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" />

nia: I feel like I must have offended you at some point. I certainly did not intend to...which is why I said NOOOO! I like you, and I don't want to picture you as RT. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />



I feel like I'm getting it from all angles tonight. Maybe I should just go to bed. I will just say it again. I HAVE MADE CHANGES, SINCERE CHANGES. I WISH I DIDN'T HAVE TO CONVINCE YOU ALL OF THAT. I AM ALL ABOUT BEING PLAYFUL AND FLIRTATIOUS. I HAVE SPENT THE LAST SEVEN WEEKS LEARNING ABOUT THAT SIDE OF ME. BUT I AM STILL A HUMAN BEING. I HAVE A BRAIN AND I HAVE FEELINGS AND I DON'T FEEL LIKE ONE IS ACKNOWLEGING THAT. STRETCHING IN A NEW DIRECTION DOES NOT MEAN THAT I SHOULD GIVE UP ANOTHER PART OF ME...ONE THAT I LIKE ABOUT ME, AND THAT WH USED TO LIKE ABOUT ME.

I'm sorry. I'm really, really tired. and now i'm crying.

I agree with you, Sis.

It is the TOTAL PACKAGE!!

Not EITHER-OR...

Check back tomorrow and we'll talk...

No one has ever said that. What we are saying is that ROMANCE *is* an issue of SUBSTANCE. Intellectual discussions may be enjoyable in some capacity, IF CONVERSATION IS AN EN, but it has no more gravity than other legitimate needs, such as admiration, sexual fulfullment, etc. Additionally, ROMANCE is the glue that keeps a couple IN LOVE. This is very important.


And it may very well be that conversation is one of his needs. It may not be a TOP NEED, though, if the OW was able to lure him away by meeting other needs.


IF conversation is a top need. But it doesn't replace other needs in the priority list of importance.

That's an interesting thought. I can't help but imagine that the OW in Lil Sis' sitch is probably the "student" and her WH is the "teacher". It must make WH feel like a man to be able to teach the OW about politics, she's probably making him feel like he is the smartest man on the planet. It's a rush for some men to feel like a woman looks up to them and admires them intellectually. It's probably even considered ROMANTIC especially if OW praises his intellect.

(((LilSis)))

~ Marsh

I WAS feeling a little.... inferior, i guess.

Trust me... I am nothing like RT in the ways that matter.

But, I don't often bake cookies from scratch and DS is not real high on my EN list.
Do you think you could respect me as a person IF I don't measure up to your high standards?

I am afriad your H feels like he can't measure up to them.
I never saw this coming w/ my H....but, why would I?
He was the one w/ the degree and the challenging job.

Please don't feel too sad.....you are still wonderful....and I think you uncovered quite a bit tonight.
Your head will be clear tomorrow and you will be able to figure out your next best step.

I agee btw....you can and WILL have both intellectual substance and romance.

good night.
sleep tight.