|
|
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 35,996
Member
|
Member
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 35,996 |
nia ... you're cool <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 3,862
Member
|
|
Member
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 3,862 |
First, I don't see why Mimi or Marsh are feeling alienated, Mate, I think you misread what Mimi said.. You have not alienated ME but I am finding myself hesitant to say some things to you this evening.... And I said I felt the same way...NOT alienated, only hesitant to say some things b/c we don't want to hurt LS. ~ Marsh
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 35,996
Member
|
|
Member
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 35,996 |
[color:"blue"] I heartedly recommend she make this effort to BE friendly and warm and lovely to as many people in town as possible [/color]
[color:"red"] and not limit her efforts to people who already *like* her[/color]
[color:"purple"]but expand the list of those who see Sis as a GREAT GAL [/color] ~~~> [color:"green"] to as wide a net as possible [/color] [b]
[color:"red"]especially including any man who talks to her husband on a regular basis .... including DOG BABYSITTER !!!!! [/color]
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 2,150
Member
|
|
Member
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 2,150 |
Oops you're right. Guilty as charged. First, I don't see why Mimi or Marsh are feeling alienated, Mate, I think you misread what Mimi said.. You have not alienated ME but I am finding myself hesitant to say some things to you this evening.... And I said I felt the same way...NOT alienated, only hesitant to say some things b/c we don't want to hurt LS. ~ Marsh
[color:"#39395A"]***Well, it's sort of hard to still wonder if you were consolation prize in the midst of being cherished.***
- Noodle[/color]
Devastation Day: Aug 26, 2004
[color:"#2964d8"]"I think we have come out on the other side... meaning that we love each other more than we ever did when we loved each other most." [/color]
[color:"#7b9af7"]
~Archibald MacLeish[/color]
Very Happily Married
Me FBS - 44
Him FWS - 51
I married him all over again, May 07
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 3,834
Member
|
|
Member
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 3,834 |
MARSH, MIMI and MATES:
LilSis was having a bad day.
And doing wrong in certain areas with her Plan A.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
You have not alienated ME but I am finding myself hesitant to say some things to you this evening....
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
But debating it around here is grade school.
If there is something you need to say, say it. You have given LS terrific advice all thru this thread.
If somedays, it doesn't seem right to post something, RIGHT NOW, maybe later will be right.
Sometimes Piling On isn't the way to make it better for LS.
And, this Speculation that RT is history?
And that WH is going out the door, anyway?
Interesting, but totally irrelevant.
Three days ago, RT was outside the IL's house. Yesterday, WH was at the coffee shop.
Doesn't seem to be curb kicked to me.....
LS:
Reach out to those friends who told you to drop WH "toot sweet"
Send cookies to Jim.
Because in the first case, you may get an ally that can give you valuable support on the ground. And the physical hugs that everyone around here can only give you electronically. And, if after being silent to them for 6-7 months, you tell them what you have done and how you have changed, THAT will get back to WH. And they can respect you for that.
And in the second case, and "Jim" thinks your still off your rocker, who cares? You did the right thing....
And PEP is giving great advice.
OK, my rant is over....
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 3,862
Member
|
|
Member
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 3,862 |
I SOOO thought of this last night!!! The way he's been acting...much nicer, more willing to come by....RT would be having a HISSY. So here's how my paranoid BS mind works: He's already broken it off with RT, and he's alreay completely written me off as a early adulthood transgression, and he's just decided to enjoy his single life. He's done with me, no turning back. No matter how "nice" I am, he WANTS to be single. Thus, not wanting to put me in a postition to hurt myself...he KNOWS that he's never coming back (as he's said a hundred times)
This is VERY VERY scary to me. If he's done with RT, why would he not even CONSIDER coming home unless it WAS an exit affair and he's been done for a LOOONG time? Sorry...assumptions...but thoughts do tend to run wild...ideas??? No, I don't think it was an exist A. I think he has just believed that it wasn't possible to recover his M after what he's done. Look at what he thought about your BF's M and their chance to recover. I found it very interesting that he had been asking about their M...I asked you if he had asked about it recently, but didn't get a reply. I think he is wondering if it was possible to recover it. I think he's not convinced it is possible yet and that is why he is still holding back from you. I do wonder about what's going on w/ him and RT tho. That drive by she did the other morning, combined w/ all the time he's been spending w/ you. Could be he's pulling back from her...in order to try to sort through his feelings. About his mood...I wonder if he's gone on ADs. ~ Marsh
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 15,310
Member
|
|
Member
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 15,310 |
First, I don't see why Mimi or Marsh are feeling alienated, but I respect their feelings on that. I'm not feeling ALIENATED...My thing is..I don't want to HURT Sis' feelings by my posts..I like her a lot..I don't want to ADD to her HURT and it seemed like she was communicating that.. However, LS' husband ain't quite so wayward as my husband was when I read him that letter, right now. He's not Disregarding LS lately. Not like a WH deep in infatuation. There are hopeful signs that the 'thrill is gone'. My husband said the affair was like crack, it was never as good as the first time, and he kept going back trying to see if he could recreate that first high. My husband is a recovering addict (after more than a decade clean you still have to call it 'recovering'..) and he was familiar with this addictive phenomena, though and maybe that helped him identify it and realize it wasn't what it was "cracked up to be". Pardon!! About this...What's going on with her H NOW? IMO, he's definitely still a WAYWARD but actually NOW he is MORE LIKE my FWH was THROUGHOUT most of his affair..He's now become a CAKE-EATER..allowing Sis to meet some of his ENs..which is EXACTLY what we wanted prior to PLAN B... I don't think the THRILL IS ALL GONE..that will come during PLAN B..but RT is not the ONLY ONE who is providing the THRILL...he now has TWO WOMEN after him..and he is beginning to like this...During PLAN B, Sis is GONE..he MISSES what she has provided..RT's JOB is to meet ALL OF HIS NEEDS and she FAILS... Well that's about as honest as a WH gets. He's already seen how hurt she was the first time, and it was scarey. And he's now in a position where whichever way he turns "someone gets hurt". Exactly. I remember my WH stating this dilemma. It's GREAT that he sees that Sis can be hurt, too. This is how RT could have won out..if Sis had let him go, communicating that she is through with him and doesn't NEED him, D is OK, etc. That's how WSes get handed over on a silver platter... He's got to feel OK about HURTING RT..because one of them has to be hurt..I eventually did ask my H, "WHY ME?" and not her..My H felt bad when coming to terms with how he had "USED" the OW...I think PLAN B was the answer, him realizing who she REALLY was..not ALL GOOD... FACING THE REALITY OF WHO RT IS will help..and SIS will come across in his mind...shining like a beacon..stepping out of her bubble bath with smooth legs... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/blush.gif" alt="" /> I wish I understood the investment he has in Rat turd. STILL ADDICTED....UNTIL WITHDRAWAL...ACTUALLY ADDICTED FOR LIFE..according to Dr. Harley... From the wayward perspective, the key motivator for an affair is usually that the illusion presented by the affair partner is the affair partner treats him as he wanted to be treated by his wife all along. But most of the time they don't get to the point where they leave for the OW, and in your case, he didn't necessarily leave for the the OW, he moved into his parents' house after all. I wonder if your WH thinks he was having an exit affair, that he would have left anyway? I wonder about whether your husband has ever seriously wanted to get married to Rat turd after all the divorces are final. Most people, once divorced, are reluctant to jump right back off the deep end. This is good for LS, because RT clearly has her sights set on something permanent, and only adds to WH's current conflict. At the same time, he seems a bit stubborn, and fearful: "It didn't work out well then, so it probably won't work out now." You say a lot here Mates..some I agree with..some not... I definitely don't think this was an EXIT AFFAIR..this affair is STANDARD MBer's..fitting with the ADDICTION theory as you have well explained it... How's this? My H left after D day so that he continue with his A outside of my view..to maintain the fantasy..IF THERE HAD BEEN NO D-DAY, HE WOULD HAVE CARRIED ON AS IS FOR AS LONG AS POSSIBLE... HE NEVER HAD ANY INTENTION OF MARRYING THE OW.. or even in divorcing me...the goal was pure pleasure..maintaining the HIGH..living from day to day with NO PLAN... Sis' H is not ruled by LOGIC or REASON..He is ruled by the DRUG..Sis can help him with THE PLAN..the ROAD MAP HOME... Steve Harley to me: "He has no PLAN to end it...tell him that you can help him with his PLAN.." Maybe we can help Sis plant a seed NOW of reminding him that he can come HOME when the ILs return.... I'm not so sure that RT wants something permanent..she is having her FUN, too...but she does want Sis' H to get a DIVORCE..she does want to be rid of SIS... So if I were in LS' shoes, I would give him some pretty blank cards or post cards or even make some pretty business card size cards and I would write bits and pieces of the letter on them. On the first one I'd write, "It's not too late for us." or better yet "It's not too late." I think this is a GREAT IDEA...My vote IS for the SHORT NOTES..NOT THE LONG LETTER.... One of the most fog-cutting things I said to my husband immediately upon D-day, was "I will always love you." And it was true, not that I will always love you so I will allow us to live in an unhealthy mind-funk relationship, but I will always love you, and if in loving you I have to remove myself from you, then I will do what I must. But in either case I will always love you. That is my truth and it is powerful. It was my beacon and he followed it home. MY POSITION..EXACTLY..I even signed his VALENTINE'S CARD.."ALWAYS AND FOREVER"... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />
I made it happen..a joyful life..filled with peace, contentment, happiness and fabulocity.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 3,862
Member
|
|
Member
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 3,862 |
But debating it around here is grade school. Debating what? <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" /> Sometimes Piling On isn't the way to make it better for LS. I didn't think anyone was piling on. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" /> ~ Marsh
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 15,310
Member
|
|
Member
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 15,310 |
LilSis was having a bad day.
And doing wrong in certain areas with her Plan A. Have we told her what we think she was doing WRONG? And will she be able to hear? You go first, LG... Are you ready, Sis?
I made it happen..a joyful life..filled with peace, contentment, happiness and fabulocity.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 5,247
Member
|
|
Member
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 5,247 |
About your WS saying "he doesn't want you to put yourself in a position to get hurt again"...
(First of all he doesn't get it -- that it hurts you all the time, not just one injury that heals and goes away. Its his way of protecting himself from guilt.)
Most likely this situation just evolved out of his control.
He and RT are in this affair, with all these FEELINGS. They "love" each other. They talk about wanting to be together more.
I suspect that RT initiated her divorce. And presented it to your husband as a gift....with the expectation that he would do the same.
So now the pressure is on. In order to keep his "high" he has to live up to her expectations.
So he has these tasks to do to "get out" of the marriage. 1) The first is to start re-writing history. (check)
2) To start creating unhappiness at home, so that everyone will begin to understand that he "has" to leave. But that he tried really hard to make it work, but it just would never work out in the end...(check)
3) He has to actually move out. This is a tough one, but you actually helped him with this one (sorry Lilsis...) The night of the conflict and arrest actually smoothed the way for him to move out of the house. (check)
4) He has to file for divorce.
This whole process is incredibly hard, and he is incredibly conflicted during the whole thing. That is why they depend on the BS to make it easier for them. Maybe the BS will kick them out of the house if they create enough conflict. Maybe the BS will file for the divorce. That way they can share the blame instead of having to shoulder the whole thing.
Plan A puts all the blame and pressure back on the WS. And most WS are not strong enough to handle it all. I guarantee that your WS does not want the responsibility and 100% of the blame for destroying your family. He wants you to share it.
What works to your advantage is that your WH is a man who had character, values, principals, and actually cares about what people think of him. He won't be able to do this, unless you help him.
Plan A takes away all the assistance of destroying the family.
He FEARS stalling this process, because it was so hard for him to get to this point! It was so hard for him to complete those steps. If he backtracks, or stalls, he knows he won't have your assistance to go through them again. Hence his statement about hurting you "again."
What works in your favor is constant pressure against the affair. Disapproval from family and friends -- which is why Pep's advice on building alliances is CRITICAL! Those friends are still in a position to put pressure on him.
What you don't want to have happen is for everyone to start accepting that this divorce is inevitable.
You also need to consistantly communicate that there is a way to fix things. To make him happy at home with you, because right now he can't see that for himself.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 35,996
Member
|
|
Member
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 35,996 |
[color:"red"] LousyGolfer: [/color] And PEP is giving great advice ... as usual! pffffffffzzztttt <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/pfft.gif" alt="" /> Here is more for [color:"red"] Sis [/color] ~~~> NEXT time you see the coffee shop owner by chance (remember the barber-shop encounter?) --- make it your business to [color:"purple"]SMILE [/color] at him and to say [color:"purple"] "Hello. How are you?" [/color] the fewer peeps in town that think you are against ~them~ , the better .... Pep
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 35,996
Member
|
|
Member
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 35,996 |
2 [color:"red"] LilSis [/color] comments: 1. "This letter TELLS him who I am, who I've become. My actions will continue to SHOW him who I am, who I've become. The letter provides the context." 2. "Another thing...he has said to his mom that he doesn't believe my changes. I have not been able to articulate my sincerity in person." [color:"blue"] Like we tell the WS who is trying to recover the marriage ~~~> ACTIONS talk ... words don't [/color] and if you want to SHOW H just how much a forgiving person you've become ... reach out to those friends of his that you've mentioned ... DEMONSTRATE your changes not just toward H, but towards others as well (excluding the [color:"brown"]TURD [/color] at this time , naturally) by the way ... I have COMPLETELY forgiven OW ... she does not register on my importance scale weighing any peskier than a fly ... I have no feelings for her other than wanting her completely out of our life .... Pep <~~~ fly-free 11 years <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 15,310
Member
|
|
Member
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 15,310 |
And this is how we work together as a TEAM..
To help SIS make the best use of MBers, based on our experiences with this...
We do have experience with this.
YOU CAN PROFIT FROM OUR EXPERIENCES!!
LEXX IS EXACTLY EXPLAINING MY OWN WH'S PERSPECTIVE AND HOW IT PLAYED OUT FOR US....
If your experience is at all like that, PLEASE READ VERY CAREFULLY AND TAKE NOTE TO WHAT LEXX IS SAYING....
I made it happen..a joyful life..filled with peace, contentment, happiness and fabulocity.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 2,828
Member
|
|
Member
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 2,828 |
Sis - I can't wait for you to read the posts above. What GREAT cheerleaders and advsiors there are here! FANTASTIC job last night!! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" /> OMG!!! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" /> Bookmark that page and re-read it when you need a boost! After what you had thought was a "bad day" you finished it with a flourish! Lexx - I LOVED your last post. I copied it for myself, as this is very much where my WS is right now. THANKS!
BS (me)
ExWS -Drac
DD 9
DSS 15
D Day 11/06
Divorced 10/01/07
"You Can't Fix Stupid" - My Mom
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,155
Member
|
|
OP
Member
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,155 |
so sorry everyone i blew it plan a out the window
i let you all down...and me
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 15,310
Member
|
|
Member
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 15,310 |
What happened???
NO..2x4s...Promise...
I made it happen..a joyful life..filled with peace, contentment, happiness and fabulocity.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 5,247
Member
|
|
Member
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 5,247 |
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 15,310
Member
|
|
Member
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 15,310 |
I was afraid of this yesterday...
It may not be as bad as you think, Sis...
I made it happen..a joyful life..filled with peace, contentment, happiness and fabulocity.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 3,862
Member
|
|
Member
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 3,862 |
so sorry everyone i blew it plan a out the window
i let you all down...and me <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" /> Did something happen today? ~ Marsh
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 15,310
Member
|
|
Member
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 15,310 |
Sounds like something happened cause she DIDN'T BLOW IT yesterday...
I made it happen..a joyful life..filled with peace, contentment, happiness and fabulocity.
|
|
|
Moderated by Ariel, BerlinMB, Denali, Fordude, IrishGreen, MBeliever, MBsurvivor, MBSync, McLovin, Mizar, PhoenixMB, Toujours
|
0 members (),
425
guests, and
58
robots. |
|
Key:
Admin,
Global Mod,
Mod
|
|
|
|
