Shattered.....I swear this coaster ride is making me nauseous. Yesterday I was on top of the world. Today I feel like I'm at the bottom of a pit.

I think my H deserves some credit but I have probably given him too much too soon in my own mind.

If one spouse leans toward the other too much, that spouse will normally fall down alone. When BOTH spouses lean towards each other equally, no one can knock them down.

Let him do his share of the leaning, Mopey! He's earned the right to do his share of the work.

KWIM?

SD

Shattered.....



I'm not totally sure what you mean by this. Could you please clarify it for me?

Good stuff. Thanks.

What I mean is take some time and come up with a short list of expectations, what you need from your H to feel your marriage is headed for recovery.

Things like accountability for his whereabouts when he's not with you, things like full access to all his e-mail accounts, all his passwords, stuff like that. Also, make note of what you need from him in other areas...like filling out the EN questionairre, or marriage counseling, or individual counseling, whatever...it's your list!

Then, take some time with him and explain all of these things to him, and let him know you are not his mother, and aren't going to remind him daily, or more, of these expectations. Tell him you will be observing his reaction to your list of needs, and his actions will tell the story about his committment to the marriage.

This is the "work" he's earned the right to do. Make sense now? I didn't mean to be cryptic about it... my apologies!

Best wishes,
SD

I sort of had a list going in my head on this already. I fear that if I tell my H what is on my list that he would perceive that as controlling. I guess this list could be considered internal boundaries for me?



You know......I have asked him many times to be transparent with me about his day and told him I didn't want to have to remind him to do that. He still has not made much of an effort here.

I have some of his passwords but that doesn't mean much. If he wanted to, he could make a bazillion email accts at his work and I would never know.

IC for him is the biggest thing on my list I think. I've learned alot about him in the last few months that scare the ****** out of me. I'd like to explore this subject later as it brings up hurtful questions.

Thanks for clarifying this for me. I was thinking this is what you meant but wasn't sure and didn't want to assume and miss something.

Thanks.

You didn't miss a lick...in fact, you seem to have good instincts....follow them!

SD <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Seems pretty important to me that your husband (me) knows what your expectations are, considering you are going to use them to decide whether you want to stay married. Or is it your intention to keep him guessing? That feels pretty cruel to me.

Not telling me these things is the same thing as me not telling you my feelings. I feel like you're holding a double standard with this.



Does it being "her list" include keeping it to herself, until it needs to be refered to?


You're right. I have not. I'll make sure it doesn't happen again. I will need to keep it in a time line format throughout the day. It's easy for me to do that way. Please disregard the things in it you feel are irrelevant.

I know you already told me you didn't like it done that way. I need to do it in a way that's easy for me to do.


It's important to me too. Especially after reading Turtle's stuff. I'll be looking into what's offered through benefits this week.

"Seems pretty important to me that your husband (me) knows what your expectations are, considering you are going to use them to decide whether you want to stay married. Or is it your intention to keep him guessing? That feels pretty cruel to me."

WS - Please tell me that you are not accusing your wife of being the cruel one. GRRRRRRRRRRR. GIVE ME A BREAK!!!

I'm not actively in an affair and haven't been for about 1.5 years. I'm trying to do my part in repairing our marriage. If I'm still considered a WS, please confirm this. It's not how I understand the designation.

We have a history of hidden expectations. Me pretending everything is ok, and her waiting until one goes unmet and expressing displeasure. Expressing displeasure was her way of making change. Mostly through AOs.(She has gotten better at that.) To expect someone to be held accountable for hidden expectations is setting the stage for failure. IMO

I don't want to fail. So ya...I'm a bit anxious about this. Does anyone blame me?

I think it would be a lot easier to either meet, or decide not to meet, expectations that are known. Rather than get hit with that bat upon failure.

If your spouse were to indicate he has a list of expectations in his head, that he expects you to meet, wouldn't you feel a bit uncomfortable not knowing what they are?

I omit obvious ones. Like the expectation to not allow another woman to meet my ENs.

Please smack me around with a 2x4, if I'm missing the point here.

I stand by my words. It is cruel to hold expectations over someones head without indicating what they are. Unless, of course, there are no consequences in whether they are met or not.

And actually...no. I was not accusing her of being cruel.

It feels that way to me though.

Have you each sat down and filled out the Emotional Needs Questionaire? If not then how do you expect know what her needs are?

Might be a good place to start!

Yes, we have. We also feel we're meeting those needs, when we're not having "affair talk". 2 weeks strait affair talk now.

15 hours has been hit/miss and mostly painful the last couple weeks.

We've also had an incredible breakthrough. As mentioned in an earlier post here.

Have you read His Needs Her Needs?

Very important info here. Very good for even the best of Marriages.

Yes. We purchased the lesson series. I've read both books through, and I believe she has as well. We've highlighted stuff in them. Made notes. Discussed things we've read.

We've done the first lesson in "Love Busters" and I've started on the 2nd lesson.

I'm very excited about that aspect of this. The rebuilding part.

I did not fill in enough detail while telling her the story of the affair, and lied about specific details. I think that's been covered now, but that's where we sit.

I have reread most of this thread. I feel that the big thing for both of you would be to get to the point of totally honest and open comunication.

This is all just my Opinion for what it's worth!

WS, You need to realize that to Mopey your' A is fresh as if it had happened a month ago while to you it is a year and a half since you ended it. She will have to go through all of the process of dealing with the emotions and you, Sir, need to be Patient and Supportive. You must be Honest and forthcoming about all that she asks about your' A. Leave nothing hidden as unimportant if she asks. Since as you said the last 2 weeks have been talk about the A expect this to continue until she has been satisfied that you have given her the details she needs. I know for me I kept asking about certain details over and over just couldn't get the questions answered somehow. Finally after some months I was able to move on Put it away so we could move with our M. Most say that you cannot rush this stuff. You must work through it. This is necessary for her to begin to trust you again. Only when she has been given the chance to get through this stage can you begin the long road to recovery.
Then the real work begins.

Mopey, as Mel and the other's have said you will need to work on you to not LB every time he let's go with a new revelation from the past and it is bound to happen. You also need to remeber that his A has been over for some time and some details may be some what blurred with time.

Be sure to come here to do your' venting so you can really get over this thing, recover and have the M you both so sincerely want.

WS; I also think that transparancy in a M is just being where you say you will be, can be available at any time, giving a general itenerary about your intended routine for the day. I really don't think a detailed log of your' daily activities should be needed but if that is is what Mopey wants then do it, but don't be sarcastic about it as that is how it came across in your' post.

Both of You; His Needs Her Needs a must read if you have not done so!!!!!!!

Have a Happy New Year!~ If you work on it, it will be better than '06.

Hahaha....just realized....my initials....WS.

Ummm...please disregard the former question about WS vs. FWS.

Forgot another point about transparancy. There is no such thing as private communication in a M, IMO. All communication be it email cell phone logs or what ever must be made available to the other partner if they want to know about it. This must be an absolute unbreakable trust in a open and honest M.

About spending 15 hours a week together. Any activity, cleaning the house, doing the laundry, walking the dog, as long as it is together and you are communicating is great. We personnaly like going for walks around the neighborhood and just talking about our day, politics (yuck), or what ever.
Just being together getting know each other all over again daily, that's how it all started in the first place.

BTW, Sorry if I am talking your ear off.

I just keep thinking of stuff and out it comes.

Just tell me to shut up and I will.

I can hardly wait until we get to the point of being able to enjoy ourselves together again.

Right now, it's a rollercoaster. She's got the front car and I'm hanging on behind her.