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McBecca Offline OP
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Hi everyone, I haven't posted in a while. So much has hapenned these last few weeks. I don't know where to start, I will copy and paste an email I sent another MB poster who tried to encourage me to post the latest. To make a long story short, BH says he had NO intentions in recovery all along, he said all he was doing was buying time so I would see OM for who he is so when he would finally ask for a D I wouldn't go running to OM.

He said he cannot get past everything and that he is afraid this will only all repeat itself in a few years and that right now he is still young enough to find someone else etc.

Also, part of his anger is that OM told EVERYONE where we used to work (BH worked there too) about the A and OC. Somehow this info came back to BH who is usually a very private person and he is furious about that. He knows why OM did this (looking for pitty, being the A-hole that he is etc) but he says he's just had enough with the entire thing.

When is upset he does bring up OM and how stupid I am for having chosen such a loser and if that's whta I want then go ahead be with "Mr. sensitive" (he is referring to OM).

What I find fascinating is that he finally got me to confess that OM is NOT an option anymore and that no matter what happens I will NOT be going back to him or even moving back where he lives (where all my friends and support is quite honestly) that I would stay here because I want him involved with our children. I guess I assumed he knew this but just a few days ago he got me to admit that while we were talking about it. So I admit that and then WHAM a few days later he wanst a divorce. He says he doesn't want me to think he is being cruel by lying all thse months making me think we were in recovery etc but he says that he didn't see any other way to do this.

The thing, is I am not sure there is anything I can do at this point. What if he is telling the truth and all he wants now is just to be happy? I have put him through so much, I wonder if I should just get out of the way and let him be happy with someone else some day?

Here is my email, tell me, at this point should I just not fight it and let it be?

______________________

Well, this is the explanation he gave me. We've been getting on each
>other's nerves lately and frankly, I was starting to wonder what was going
>to happen myself because whenever I brought up counseling again, he would
>say no way. Ok, that doesn't sound like someone who wants to have a
>better marriage right? so one day we were talking and I brought up his
>passive agressive attitudes as he had made several comments that let me
>wondering what he really thought about something (me going back to work).
>He got very defensive when I brought it up, and it actually reminded me of
>how he was before all this started when trying to discuss something with
>him was a no-win situation because he would use his passive agressive ways
>to anger me and ultimately make me regret bringing anything up.
>
> We basically argued and got no resolution that night just went to sleep
>angry and pretty much stayed that way since. He was "cordial" and didn't
>give me the complete silent treatment as he usually does, but he was
>withdrawn. I thought I just leave him alone. X-mas came and went and
>although he acted somewhat "normal" I knew something was on his mind.
>
> New Year's Eve right after we went to bed just out of the blue he was
>cuddling up to me (wanting sex) and I said (jokingly) did you read that
>article I gave you to read today? (it was an article about the chemistry of
>the relationship when you deal with passive agressive attitudes and how it
>described us to a T and what to do to try to improve things) and he said
>angrily "don't you think i've done enough", so it started. He said a
>bunch of things, like
>"oh you want me to be like OM? you want me to be Mr. sensitive? look at the
>piece of ****** he turned out to be" etc... other things along those lines,
>he was angry so I just sat there and listened to him. He then went ahead
>and said he was just waiting a few months to tell me this because he didn't
>want to do it right away for fear I go back to OM. Now he feels I won't do
>that or if I do, at least I would do it knowing very well the kind of
>person OM is etc. he said he never had any intentions to stay in the
>marriage, he can't do that after what i've done, he said he's met with his
>lawyer all the lawyer is waitng is for him to tell him to go ahead so he
>can file.
>
> I was rather shocked, I started to think back to all these months and
>putting things together. It all made sense, him not agreeing to
>counseling, him not wanting contact with OM about Emma, it even made sense
>now some of the comments he had made which sort of brought up this argument
>in the first place. He told me he wants to wait until I get a job to sell
>the house and we can split all our assets etc. We talked all night
>basically didn't sleep a wink. He told me what he wants as far as custody,
>visitation etc
>
> He said he feels we are just toxic for each other and that there is no
>way either of us are going to change and he wants to have what i had in the
>affair, someone to adore you no matter what you do or say and if things get
>too much he can just ended and not have to "work at it" as he would have to
>do with us.
>
> He has been rather pleasant since then, he said he was sad but that
>there was no other way.
>
> I didn't even know what to say, part of me thinks he is right. The way
>things are right now, it is not healthy for us, sooner or later one of us
>will just lose it. Would counseling help? of course it would, but he has
>lots of fears that what if this happens again, cut your losses now rather
>than later etc. He said he is certain this is going to happen again, he
>doesn't trust that things could ever improve.
>
> I am devastated and very scared to be honest, but certainly not
>surprised. I updated my resume yesterday, he helped me. I applied to a
>few positions already and will probably continue to do this until I find a
>job. Part of me things this is the best thing to do. Without counseling,
>we cannot do this ourselves, I know that very well. I guess I am also glad
>he did wait because I know in my heart now OM is not an option, I told him
>I won't move back to Georgia regardless because I don't want to be with OM.
> I don't even want OM finding out about the divorce, I want to keep him
>out of my life. BH will continue to be in OC's life.
>
> He is actually very pleasant right now, since we are going to continue
>to live together he said he won't make it unpleasant, he is going to just
>continue as "normal" until the summer or so when we can sell the house etc.
> We hugged last night and still were intimate, I guess take advantage
>while we are still living together... don't know seems rather odd but I
>went along. He kissed me as normal this mornign when he left for work and
>said "I love you" as he left. I guess just habits.
>
> So that's where we are... I am sorry this got long, I don't think he is
>having an affair, but I do think that if given the chance he would want to
>be. He says no way as it goes against his principles and that is not what
>he is going to do.
>

Last edited by McBecca; 01/04/07 11:31 AM.

WW (me) 36 BH 37 Married 16 yrs 3 children, 12DD, 4DD, 7 mths DD (OC) D-day 8/05 2nd D-day 10/05 *OC* 3rd D-day 6/08/06 DD *OC* born ~~ If I had known then what I know now ~~
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Wow! I think this is the first time I have heard of a false R on the part of the BS. {{McB}} big hugs for you sweetie. I think for the sake of the kids the two of you should get some counseling before heading for D.


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I know it sounds very weird to hear it said straight up like this but...

I wouldn't sweat this too very much.

His timing is about right for some SERIOUS rage/withdrawl and having the threat of the OM removed by having YOUR perceptions of him alter probably tips the scales enough for him to be safe to allow himself to get into this headspace.

Most BSs go through this...I certainly did.

Remember back to your WS days. Your actions and your words were neither logical nor coherant were they? What you said you wanted and what you did didn't really add up did they? Crazy rationalizations? Check. Ridiculous hindsight schemes? Check.

A BS in this frame of mind is REALLY a WS you know. They may not have an OP [yet ..and that's a BIG possibility...revenge As are pukingly common] but their thought process is probably identical.

My suggestion is a good plan A followed if necessary by plan B.

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McB,

I am sorry to hear this, but I think if you are calm, avoid any DJ's your H may well change his tune. He may not realize this but ANY relationship or marriage worth having and being invested in takes effort and sacrifice. OM did NOT have it as good as your H thinks.

You must realize that your H hearing that
Quote
Also, part of his anger is that OM told EVERYONE where we used to work (BH worked there too) about the A and OC. Somehow this info came back to BH who is usually a very private person and he is furious about that. He knows why OM did this (looking for pitty, being the A-hole that he is etc) but he says he's just had enough with the entire thing.


Opened a lot of wounds. Be calm, have patience, and give this time. I have a feeling your H may well change his mind yet again. He won't admit it yet, but I think the man still loves you, he just doesn't know how to get around the events are keep any self-respect. He may even go through with the divorce and then realize he now can start over with you and have a relatively clean slate.

Why am I saying this? Well, perhaps I am an old romantic, but I think this is a face saving action. All of his old workmates now know he was a cuckold, and that you had another man's baby. He is having a hard time facing their knowledge of him as a cuckold and him accepting OM's baby.

Divorce may be the face saving way out and yes remarriage is a distinct possibility. So don't burn any bridges, actually no matter what don't do that. Your H needs to be in those kids lives as do you.

Time and patience McB, that is the watch word.

God Bless,

JL

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Agree that this latest bit of being drug face first through the gravel of soul crushing public humiliation was a likely trigger.

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McBecca Offline OP
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But I also know BH is a very vindictive (spelling?) person and so most likely will either want to have an affair or at last make me feel like he is having one so I can feel half the pain he has felt.

Part of me wants to tell him "go out and date, find someone and then ask me for a D" because I know that part of what he wants is to have the opportunity I did. to have someone completely crazy about you who thinks you are god!

I took the news as good as I could have, I am going to re start IC to help me through this just in case, I did update my resume, started job searching. I am going to work on the "logistics" (finding an area where we can live, babysitters etc) as I am sure if the D does happen, all those are things that need to be take care of.

I am a bit concerned that it may take me a while to find a job but he says he is not in a rush, he says even if it takes months, no big deal. I told him it was easy for him to say that because he forgets that we can get on each other's nerves quite easily. But he says he will not do that, he doesn't want the children to know what is going on until it is all said and done etc.

I am an emotional wreck right now but I won't show him because I don't want him to do what he did back in August which was try to comfot me lying about R. Instead I figure I have to at least pretend I am strong, I can do this, and that no matter what happens, I am not changing my mind about stayign here away from OM.

I was putting the X-mas tree away and it was so hard to fight back the tears. Our last X-mas.

It seems rather cruel to have to live together while this goes on because I can't "move on" mentally or emotionally while still pretending we are a couple. He calls on the phone and says "I love you" as he is ready to hang up as if nothing had changed. I know it is a habit that is hard to break. He has nearly said it to work collegues by mistake so I know it isn't like he is doing it on purpose but still... weird situation.

At least now I know what I am dealing with. I had doubts all along, I didn't know HOW someone could just want to Recover after all but now it all makes more sense.

B


WW (me) 36 BH 37 Married 16 yrs 3 children, 12DD, 4DD, 7 mths DD (OC) D-day 8/05 2nd D-day 10/05 *OC* 3rd D-day 6/08/06 DD *OC* born ~~ If I had known then what I know now ~~
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Becca - you have received some excellent advice here. It's just words.Plan A him McBecca. He won't be able to stop himself falling in love with you if you are meeting his EN's.

(((McBecca)))


Me: 56 (FBS) Wife: 55 (FWW)
D-Day August 2005
Married 11/1982 3 Sons 27,25,23
Empty Nesters.
Fully Recovered.
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Becca,
I'm so sad to hear your news, but am glad that you have trusted MB with your sitch... you are not dead in the marriage, as you think....
I believe that one of two things is happening...

ONE: Your BH is hitting his freak out stage, as Noodle pointed out

TWO: He's in an affair right now and has slipped into his fog, with rationalizations (easy for him to come by, given your marretal history)

I think that you may want to peel back your ears and develop curious eyes to see if there is evidence of an OW...

The signs are there.

Hate to say that what you describe sounds a lot like what my WS said to me.... and it sounds like what you once said to your H back when you were in the FOG....

HUGS TO YOU BECCA!

We are here to keep you on the beacon path!

Heartsore


BH = Me 38; WW = 35; DS = 5, DD = 3, DD = 14 mo.
Feb 2006 = EA/PA started
May 19 & Aug. 15, 2006 = D-Days
Nov. 3, 2006 = Divorce Papers - (EA/PA ongoing)
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Some BSs do. [just go out and HAVE the experience] The temptation is extremely strong. Not just for the "no fair" factor but also because the entire concept is so farging ALIEN that frankly...I think a lot of BSs want to know what all the hubbub was about. What was soooo great and compelling and important that it warranted permanent destruction in their lives?

The anger and vindictiveness is real..but I think it's mostly justification. I think the curiosity and ~possibilities~ that previously had been written off and dismissed are now back on the table for consideration.

Now think about that for a minute.

The option to have a justified OUT of your own choice [rather than something that's being done TO you against your will]...the possibility to date again...the fantasy of this can rival ANY affair fantasy..at the very least one in it's preliminary/comparable stages.

And what does any good wayward do at that time?

They greatly embellish the insurmountable problems in the marriage and the irrevokable damage done.

Right?
Right.

I'm telling you that having survived a spouses waywardness is *half* the battle...the other half is surviving your own.

I am very serious that this will be YOUR turn to have a nice front row seat for ~precisely~ the sort of uncertainty, heartbreak, betrayal and well..just PAIN that accompanies being married to a wayward spouse.

Read up on plan A.

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McBecca Offline OP
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He is at work or at home pretty much. The only chance is during his trips to Chicago but even then it is all coworkers and he is afraid to death of being taken the wrong way as a manager etc. He is very cautios with how he approaches women for fear of being suit by some lunatic!

He also says his morals and religion wouldn't let him do that. But of course, we know someone scorned is capable of anything.

How do I even start checking? Is there a way to check if there is a keylogger here on my PC? I am sure there is but he wouldn't make it so obvious, what else could it be called?

I noticed when he is checking my stuff because the PC runs slow and he says is a "virus" (yeah, I wasn't born yesterday either!) but now I've seen the pattern and how the PC runs during those times. I just haven't a clue how to find whatever software he may be using. As far as credit cards, he could very well pay with the cards for work or other cards he may have, could possibly have a mail box etc... remember he is a private person when things are going GOOD when things are bad it is like trying to find a needle in a haystack!!

I can't believe he would be that cruel to use someone just tohurt me, but then again, I Am slowly starting to learn that people are vicious no matter how much I hate to think they are. I don't have access to his email and couldn't even guess his passwords. His IT experience makes me a great candidate to do all kinds of things we "normal" people couldn't fathom!! for all I know he has another PC hidden somewhere in the office!

B


WW (me) 36 BH 37 Married 16 yrs 3 children, 12DD, 4DD, 7 mths DD (OC) D-day 8/05 2nd D-day 10/05 *OC* 3rd D-day 6/08/06 DD *OC* born ~~ If I had known then what I know now ~~
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He is not an emotional/talkative person so it is hard to figure him out. OK sex as most guys he enjoys but that's about it. Oh and me NEVER arguing with him, letting him have his way ALWAYS. Those two things i know for sure, everything else I haven't a clue!

B


WW (me) 36 BH 37 Married 16 yrs 3 children, 12DD, 4DD, 7 mths DD (OC) D-day 8/05 2nd D-day 10/05 *OC* 3rd D-day 6/08/06 DD *OC* born ~~ If I had known then what I know now ~~
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hunny ... I think this is a 'test' of your resolve

a God-smack

do NOT cut & run

be strong
be true
be the lighthouse

Pep

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Becca,
Noodle is very smart and I recommend you follow her lead...


BH = Me 38; WW = 35; DS = 5, DD = 3, DD = 14 mo.
Feb 2006 = EA/PA started
May 19 & Aug. 15, 2006 = D-Days
Nov. 3, 2006 = Divorce Papers - (EA/PA ongoing)
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Just my 0.02 and I am not the smartest guy on the block but don't underestimate the male response with the stigma of the term "cuckold". There are some men who rather catch a deadly disease from their spouse than the label. Tough situation no doubt about it. I cannot imagine how I could handle it after taking some time to think on it. How does your ILs or other family members feel about this ordeal? Does he have any refuge from this humiliation?


Me:52
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1 Dtr (20)
1 GDtr (2.5) precious little girl
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and Pep gets a lot of questions right when she watches jeopardy and wheel of fortune (LOL!)

Both Pep and Noodle are steering you correctly. Be the lighthouse! PLAN A, just in time for the new year... READ PEP'S Carrot and Stick of Plan A.....

The link should be in Pep's signature... if not, I'm sure she'll send it to you...

HS


BH = Me 38; WW = 35; DS = 5, DD = 3, DD = 14 mo.
Feb 2006 = EA/PA started
May 19 & Aug. 15, 2006 = D-Days
Nov. 3, 2006 = Divorce Papers - (EA/PA ongoing)
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McB,

There is an old saying the the Hall of Fame Coach, John Madden , uses. You need to consider it.

Quote
don't roll out the hoses until you know where the fire is.

Have you talked to him about his feelings concerning what OM did to HIM. Do you need a list to help you recall?

1. OM took his W.

2. OM impregnated his W.

3. OM then tells EVERYONE what he did and that there is an OC in the situation.

In short, OM has done about as much as one man could do to another. Isn't it time you thought just a bit about your H and this situation? I hate to sound harsh, but all of your posts are about what you are feeling, and what YOU fear, and what YOU feel you need to do to protect yourself.

Isn't it time to consider that your H is right now a little wacked out from all of this? Isn't time to cut him some slack and see if he is serious? A man dead set on divorce doesn't just say "well we'll do it in awhile". Nope a man deadset on a divorce is down visiting his lawyer and filing.

That has not happened and it may not happen IF you don't give up. The man is hurt, and further you have expressed that he is not the best at discussing his emotions or handling them.

McB, don't roll out the hoses just yet.

Please think about this.

God Bless,

JL

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JL, you just nailed it. In fact both of your posts did, but this last one is spot-on. I could not have said it better.
Yeah...I was a cuckolded husband too.

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None of this is even a small surprise. MB... there are many here that gave what I considered at the time to be a false sense of hope. I don't know whether these changes in your H are forever or just a phase... but I would continue trying to work things out for a time...see if he comes around. Contrary to what you have been told... yes, no matter how well you do right now... no matter how much you plan A your H... he may NEVER fall back in love with you. It stings for sure... but your long range concerns need to be for your children... in this case, all of them. You guys had problems before your A and while I hope they go away.. the A and the child from the A are an added stress to your M.
I would suggest following some of the advice here....but getting your ducks in order for how to proceed if things do not work out. Specifically, if you have not had the OM sign over rights and documents that would deny you being able to collect child support from him, I would get the support information together sooner rather than later. You do not have to file it now... just be ready to go.
Aslo, if your H is NOT taking care of the new born as his own or makes ANY statements concerning not wanting anything to do with your daughter... figure out how you will handle that in the event of a divorce.
IMHO, based on your past posts, your M was on a fast track to divorce even before your affair. There is still time to fight for your M and I would advise you doing so... but have your back up plans in place just in case.
I wish you luck and am so sorry you are going through this right now. I truly hope your H comes around and continues on the path he bagan some months ago.

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McBecca Offline OP
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is why I think now that the best thing I can do for BH is to allow him to divorce me. I think asking him to stay married to me is just another blow to him. I would be asking him to accept what I did and in turn accept what OM did too. Does that make sense?

He seems very set on it only because he's already met with his attorney, he said everything is pretty much ready all he has to do is call the attorney to file. The only reason he hasn't done it is because I am not working right now but if I already had a job he would have filed i think.

He says it doesn't matter if it takes until summer for me to find something, so I guess that is his mental deadline because it also helps let our oldest DD finish school.

So what can I do now to show him that I don't want to give up but at the same time respect his wishes?

B


WW (me) 36 BH 37 Married 16 yrs 3 children, 12DD, 4DD, 7 mths DD (OC) D-day 8/05 2nd D-day 10/05 *OC* 3rd D-day 6/08/06 DD *OC* born ~~ If I had known then what I know now ~~
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McBecca Offline OP
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I am still undecided as to what to do there. BH says he still would want to be involved in DD's life but that she would become MY responsability 100%, he will see her etc but she won't be staying overnight with him like my other two.

So I have to decide what to do in that situation because frankly I am not sure having OM in her life would help at all. Sure, he can pay child support but that also gives him rights to her and considering what an A-hole he has been this far, who knows what kind of crap he will try to pull if he does get some rights. When we first talked about this he had some idea that he could get 50/50 custody and she would be with him for weeks or even months at a time!! I know that is insane and I don't think any judge would agree to do that to an infant! but then again, anything is possible.

So at some point I want to bring it up to BH again so he can clarify to what extend does he really want to be involved in DD's life. Eventually she won't be a baby and will wonder why her sisters can go to Daddy and she can't etc... I will wait a few weeks to bring it up to him again.

As far as OM, I don't even want him to find out that we are divorcing if it comes to that. I think it would give him just what he wants, the knowledge that even though he is not in my life, my marriage still ended. I think for some reason he may actually find satisfaction knowing that!! of course if I do take him to court to establish paternity he will find that out regardless.

I have to think about this yet. Considering he hasn't done anything to keep contact with OC I am not sure I even want him in her life.

B


WW (me) 36 BH 37 Married 16 yrs 3 children, 12DD, 4DD, 7 mths DD (OC) D-day 8/05 2nd D-day 10/05 *OC* 3rd D-day 6/08/06 DD *OC* born ~~ If I had known then what I know now ~~
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