VS,

Go read RookKev's post. Sound familiar?

Will do Dog.

BTW- She has called twice this am and left messages asking to go to thew dog park. I have not called back and don't think I should. Everything is always done on her terms. Time for her to start doing some thinking and wondering for once. I need to start calling the shots...

Why not go to the dog park with her (being the best you, confident, attractive) and then having to cut the time short for something else you had already planned to do??? If she is giving you some time together...use it to meet any ENs she will let you meet...conversation.

Leaving her with a good impression of what she is missing...and wanting more of the confident Vince!

You could tell her (when leaving the dog park) that you will have some time after your plans (late evening). Tell her that if she wants to grab a quick bite later to text you this afternoon. This way SHE will have to take the initiative AND you are leaving her the opportunity to have some ENs met by the confident Vince.

Well, its too late now. I'm very hurt from what as happened the last two times we spoke(Wed.& Fri) that I won't be able to meet any needs right now and need to cool down. She said some things that were just unbelievably hurtful. Yes, fog talk maybe, but hurtful none the less. I think a little cooling down couldn't hurt. Also, it makes her wonder a little bit and lets her know that I am not always going to be there to answer the phone and jump at the chance to meet her at the dog park. I am a little shocked however that she didn't stop by after (she was at park 3 hours ago). Oh well. I really expected her to, and even cleaned myself up and straightened up the house <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Maybe I will give her call later and say "sorry i couldn't meet you I was doing XXXXXXXXXX. Maybe we can get together later for dinner or something? I got xxx movie I can bring over?" Saying that, all while trying not to sound desperate or disappointed when i get the expected response of no, and I like like its no big deal.

Also, it hard to meet her needs right now, especially when her needs require help from getting over other man. Not sure how to handle that one.....

We'll see though, I haven't thought this one out 100% yet. The way she has been acting is unbelievably hurtful the last 7 days or so. Way worse than before and a total turnaround from just 16 days ago. Not sure what has happened, but I am assuming the A breaking apart is taking its toll. Although, when she called twice this am, she sounded very upbeat, so of course I am thinking she got her 'fix' last night with OM. Ah, the mind is a wonderful thing, isn't it.

Go away stupid thoughts!

Have great day everyone!:)

VS,

You said earlier
Man Oh Man, do you have this messed up. The problem isn't that you have emotions or that your emotions are sad or that you cannot control them. The problem you have is that you are "LETTING YOUR EMOTIONS CONTROL YOU."

If you learn nothing else from this site,it is to get a plan and then stick to it. The emotions will be all over the place, but your brain should be functioning and it should be able to produce a plan for recovery and stick to it.

Ever heard the term "cowboy up" "man up"? Do you know that they mean? They mean no matter what your emotions are telling you or doing to you, YOU FUNCTION, YOU FOLLOW THE CORRECT PATH, YOU FOLLOW YOUR PLAN.

It is time for you to start to function young man, and that starts with making a plan, and sticking to it. Get off dead center and get to work.

God Bless,

JL

VS, read what follows with the understanding that you have my sympathy. I've been through it.


Apologizing for being unavailable? Asking if you can come over? Giving her another opportunity to reject you so you can pretend you don't care? Are you ****ing kidding me?

You seem to have two settings: submissive, and angry. Unfortunately neither will get you what you want.

You're trying to follow Harley advice without bothering to think about how it all fits in with the dynamics of attraction between women and men.

Look. For practical purposes you are a man who wants to "date" your wife. Like you're crushing on her. And right now you're behaving like a dude with a crush. You'll do anything the woman wants, as long as it gets you close to her. But in winning those little battles--taking every opportunity to get together with her in the name of meeting her "needs"--you are losing the larger fight. Most women, wayward wives especially, are not attracted to men who do everything they want. They either ignore them altogether, or they take advantage of them and then discard them.

You have to cultivate an environment in which you are the one doing the selecting, not her. You should avoid putting yourself up on the auction block and waiting to see if you get picked (e.g. "Can I come over and have dinner with you?"). Always, always, you want to be the one doing the picking.

As long as you're communicating with your wife, she should be aware of interesting things you're doing, and once in a while you should invite her along. It is far better if you're going to do the thing with or without her. It's going to be fun and interesting, and she can either participate or miss out. Get it? This is an easy rule to remember, and it makes all the difference in the world.

Now stop letting that chick push you around. It's pathetic. She's CHEATING ON YOU for goodness sake. You want to "meet her needs" fine, but don't do it at all costs.

I understand my emotions are controlling me! If I could stop that, I wouldn't be here asking for advice and support <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> The words of encouragement and support from the members on here are helping me get through this and realize what I need to do to get my plan together.

On another note, she texted me tonight asking me to call her, I just responded with "why, is everything ok" She said "yea, just call me later if you want".

SO I called her at 10:30 and she was unpleasant and just wondering why I haven't answered my phone. That was pretty much it. I asked her what she did all weekend and if she wanted to do lunch tomorrow, to which I got a "no". So I left it at that and told her to have a good night and I would talk to her later. Another negative to the list.

VS

Thanks GrayCloud. Got it and working on it.

VS,

Here is the real problem. If you said you wanted to divorce her and leave her I would not be on your case. You have said you want to continue to be married to her. Well if that is the case then YOU must not allow your emotions to control your actions.

If you continue to allow conversations such as just occured to continue, this marriage will not make it. Why? Because the more you allow her to abuse you, be mean to you, ignore you, the more your love bank is going down, and when it is empty this marriage is OVER.

You need to explain to her, that IF she calls she will be civil, she will be polite, or she will be hung up on. Set your boundaries. You need to tell her how the "cow ate the cabbage" without love busting her. But, more than anything you need boundaries and a plan and until you have those, do NOT CONTACT HER OR SPEAK WITH HER.

Now get to work on your plan, and I would strongly recommend you call the Harley's, or post a thread asking for help with a plan to recover your marriage. By the way have you exposed her affair to her folks, your folks, and other family. I don't recall although I might be mistaken.

Plan, plan, plan, then execute. Please do this.

God Bless,

JL

Great post JL. That is just what I'm looking for. Unfortunately, I have not had this (unfaithful spouse) happen to me before and I have really found out that I am not as strong as I thought I was. Nothing tests you metally like this does.

I am setting my boundaries and will not allow her to talk to me like that. But its a fine line because I do not want to love bust and be mean about it, just firm I guess.

Even last night, she asked why I hadn't called in 2 days, and replied with "the way you spoke to me Friday was and is unacceptable. I will not be spoken to like that ever again". So I'm not a complete spineless jellyfish!

I am heeding all of yours advice, its just a matter of me getting it together and DOING IT!. Its not for lack of effort everyone. I'm just not a strong person I guess. I had always thought I could deal with anything, as I have had a pretty rough life so far and have worked so hard for every single thing I have. So its not like I was born with a silver spoon in my mouth and never faced the harsh realities of life. I was just so unprepared for something like this, as it is a true test of one's strength and resolve.

As for our "Love Bank", I'm pretty sure its on life support, but she must care somewhat, or else she would not have called and texted as many times as she did....but who knows, when I talk to her, it really seems as if she has checked out. I asked her point blank last night "Do you want to see me ever? Cause if not, I won't call you anymore or even bother trying. Its not worth either of our times and aggravation". I said it polite, but to the point. She said " Yes, I want to see you".

So it goes.......

Thanks for the advice and slap in the face...I need it.

VS

This is all rather counter intuitive. Please reread graycloud and JL's posts.

The way you describe each interaction with your wife sounds patheticly weak...and unattractive. Please man up...as JL and others have suggested. Do not allow your emotions to rule you. It took me a while to realize that just because I have emotions and compulsive thoughts and ideas....crappy potential conversations in my mind....it doesn't mean I have to act on them or allow them to control me. They don't have to become your reality.

VS,

Have you ever had to diet and lose weight?? Well, this situation is JUST LIKE dieting. Ever see anyone successfully lose a lot of weight, by saying "I'll just eat a little less, and everything will be fine." Nope.

To really diet you need a plan, you need to change behaviors, you need to focus on the goal.Why a plan? Because a plan helps you get over the cravings, the weaknesses, and the desire.

Well, in this particular game you find yourself in, it is the same. It is not a matter of strength. It is not a matter of controling your emotions. If you don't have a plan, you, me, anyone will fail. Why? Because we have nothing to focus on when really tempted to do something, in this case appease. When you develop a plan with time lines, evaluation points, and decision points, your emotions will not change but you will be able to focus on your plan, and take it one day at a time. At that point you have a better chance of recovering your marriage or at least knowing you did ALL you could do to save it. You win either way.

It is time to start your diet VS. Every time you feel the need to appease your W, you remind yourself of your plan. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

It helps, it often works, and YOU WILL come out of this much better than you otherwise would.

Please think about this.

God Bless,

JL

OK.

I 100% understand that what I have been doing to this point have been wrong. I get that. I understand 100% that I need to be strong, confident, attractive and a man with a rock solid plan. Understood there.

The problem for me is getting there. I'm working on it everyday. I have just yet to master the Jedi mind trick that is pretending everything is ok and the fact that my wife has not committed the unthinkable or treated me like dirt on the bottom of her feet.. I'm working on it, but it wont happen over night. When I talk to her, its not like I go into it thinking "ok, I'm going to act all sad, pathetic and like a lost puppy dog". The conversation is going so poorly on her end, that it naturally progresses there. I try to make light convo's, but she returns my words with "ok, I gotta go. uh huh, ok. what? no." My challenge is that when I see her attitude as counter-productive and not positive, I need to cut off the contact, right then and there if possible. If not, I need to change subjects and at all times, keep my emotions in check and not love bust.

My plan currently is to call her occasionally. Let her call me occasionally. If the opportunity presents itself, ask her to do something or vice versa. If the response is negative, I don't love bust, I run as far away from the negativity as possible and try to make it positive again. If that is not possible, I end the contact/communication before it becomes love busting or a situation where I come off as unattractive. And at all times, I want to come off as strong, confident, in control and calm.

Its not rocket science, its making yourself do it that is the hard part. Fooling yourself into thinking that you haven't had your life turned upside down, and the person you a trying to court, is not responsible for it. because, after all, that is what you are trying to do. Act as if nothing happened and bring this lost soul back to reality and a loving life that they once had, but chose to throw away.

Thanks for the advice, keep it rollin in:)

VS

There will be a time....once in recovery,when she will have to take full responsibility, show remorse and repentance. You can then get all the details you like as well as let her know how deeply you were hurt by her choice to have an A and all the pain you've felt.

But, you aren't even close to being there. This is the time to work on yourself. Do stuff for yourself like starting to workout, or get involved with something you haven't had time to when you were busy with her...either a hobby, a group activity, as cause of some sort...reconnect with guy friends you may not have seen for a while or make new friends.

VS,

What is your plan for today, for tomorrow?? You see you need to put details into this plan. So that every day as you wake up you KNOW what you will do, and what you will NOT do. You need to set a time line to evaluate what is going on.

At this check point you need to be asking yourself: how am I doing? What is in my future? How am I working on getting there? Has the W shown any changes no matter how small? Is it enough for me to hang on? Do I want to hang on? If yes, why? If no, why?

In short, you need to make detailed plans, and this includes your boundaries, your goals for life, your goals for this marriage, your timeline for staying or leaving. Make this plan, then be willing to modify IF compelling reasons occur.

Do you see what I am talking about? I hope so.

God Bless,

JL

Trix - I'm already ahead of you. I bought a ton of supplements to get back into weightlifting, which I used to be REALLY into. So I'm starting that today. I have reconnected with 2 people in my life that I cut out, one of them being my father. Another hobby I am adopting is fixing up my house to sell. I can't stand being in the house we built together. The house needs a little work here and there that I have been putting off, so I'm going to get started on that as well. The sooner I can sell this place, the better. I also live in the boonies, so I would like to get to the city (Chicago) where more of my friends are and my social circles can be a lot larger.

JL - I'm not sure how I can plan daily, as I have no idea what to expect from her that day. I know what I can and will do, but she is a variable. I do see what you are talking about. I do keep track of how things between us are going, hence this thread (journal almost). Then I can see what positive or negative sign there are/were and make adjustments to my timeline and if I want to continue putting effort into this.

Like I said, my plan is to be more confident, stop ALL love busting and start calling the shots and not let her dictate my life. I control my life, therefore, I will dictate what I do and when I do it. I haven't given much thought on what I will do day to day as I plan on playing it by ear, but using the above to guide me.

I hope you all know that I read your posts very thoroughly and if it seems like I am not, it's just because I may not be portraying that correctly in my responses. I really read every post and take them to heart and use them in my plan. So I apologize in advance if you are reading this and saying "this idiot just doesn't get it". I get it. I know what I need to do, I just need to do it.

As a side note - I talked to her this am (our cat was missing and she was calling to see if I found it). The conversation was light and fluffy ( how are you, you busy, what are you doing for lunch, etc.). I told her she had some bills and things she needed to get from the house. I said I would come over and bring them by tonight. She said "OK, I'll give you a call later". So, right now for example, do I just sit here and wait for her to call? Or do I pick up the phone and say "Hey, I'm going to swing by and drop off that stuff around 7pm, are you going to be around?" I think the second one would be more of what I am talking about and talking control, but I don't want to come off as pushy or needy by calling and saying I am coming over. I mean, how do you determine those minute details? I obviously have been out of the dating game, since, oh, forever (met her 8 years ago in college). I know what needs to be done (my plan), but just not sure how things, such as this very minor situation, should be handled. I guess I need to just think in my head like an A hasn't happened, and she is just some woman that I am interested in. If that is the case, then I probably would not call her and let her call me, as I wouldn't want to come off as needy and such. I would wait for her to call and then go over there. BUT...I want to see her tonight and start in on my new plan of attack, so if she fails to call, I don't see her!! Jeez......nothings easy! Am I over evaluating things?

I want to continue to post in this thread on what happens (both how I react and how she does) so I can use this as a barometer for what I need to do and heck, maybe someone else can even learn a thing or two about mistakes or success I have!

Thanks again everyone <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

VS

OK. So she called me last night after work and asked if I was going to come over ( I really didn't expect her to call). I didn't act too eager, but of course I said yes. So I went over there and spent about 4 hours with her. We kept the talk non-important and actually laughed and had a good time, shared snacks, watched a movie, some minor touching (her legs on me, me holding her legs), but I asked her to sit right next to me a few times and she kinda scoffed at the idea. Not sure how to read that, but she was touching me in some way the entire time I was there, albeit with her legs mostly. Not much arm action.

Anyway, the movie ended around 11 an she was tired. I said "ok, so you going to bed?" She said yea...and I was kinda hoping she would invite me to bed as she has the past 4 times I was there. She didn't. But I took the dog out for her and she went in the room. I brought the dog in the room and she was laying in bed and asked if I wanted to look through this book with her for a little bit before she went to bed. So I jumped in bed and we looked through the book. We were close, but not like 'that'. After that, I kissed her a few times, nothing major, but on the lips. We then watched some TV and she said "why don't you just stay over, I don't want you driving home, your too tired. I said "no i have to go". So she walked me to the door and we shared a few more kisses,all initiated by me pretty much, she wasn't exactly shying away, but nothing major. We joked as we hugged by patting each other on the back saying "see you later buddy, old pal". Like we were never lovers and married. Keeping it cool and fun. I asked her what she was doing the rest of the week and she said "nothing, I'll give you a call". So we'll see what happens there.

So - what is the point/summary? No love busters, we enjoyed each others company, we kissed a little, there was some hesitation towards any affection from her and definitely could tell there was not much feeling coming from her, but a small victory none the less. By the end of the night, she was definitely opening up more towards me, especially while in bed, but again, nothing other than a few brother/sister type kisses.

Sticking with the plan and probably won't contact her today and just play it by ear, but maintain my "cool guy" routine and be confident and sure of myself. I'm working on myself now, and if she wants to be involved, great, I'll take that as it comes. But I'm #1 from now on, not her and this horrible situation as it has controlled my every move for 3 months.

Thanks for listening -

-VS

Keep it up Vince, you did good. Confidence and strength equal power and control.

Good Job!

High Five! LOL

Its not easy, and it is making me more emotionally involved and making me want to be with her more If she ends up spending another night with him, which I feel is inevitable, its going to really hurt,but I need to prepare for it.

Last night was the first step of many. I have set a deadline of May 1st to continue making myself do this and implement this plan spot on. Then, May 1st, I am going to look at my journal and in my heart and really evaluate this situation, knowing I gave it 100% and did so with the correct plan in place. If, at May 1st, I see some positive movement towards reconciliation over the last 6 weeks, I will continue my plan. If not, I believe I will have to cut this off and let her go. But regardless, I will make sure until then I give this 100%, avoid all love busters and give her everything I got, and come off as confident, sexy cocky and emotionally stable and strong.

As for today, I emailed her today asking how her day was and if she was tired, as she expressed to me last night that she was only going to get 5 hours of sleep cause we hung out so late. I also made a little joke referring to something that happened that night between us. She emailed me back immediately and said she was tired, but was glad we hung out and didn't mind going to bed so late, so thats good. We exchanged a few more emails which were funny and light. Overall, I say it was a good set of 6 emails and I made sure I didn't respond to her last one, as it leaves her hanging a little <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Anyways, tomorrow is a new day. I have no idea when I will be able to see her again as we both of things going on the next two nights and she hasn't hungout with me on a weekend for a month and a half, but we'll see. I think last night finally let her know that its not 'weird' to hangout with me and that we can have a good time together.

Who knows...

Take care everyone,
VS

To keep up with my 'journal':

Well, no call from her last night, but she didn't really say she would other than "I'll call ya later" in passing in our emails yesterday. I can't say I wasn't disappointed, as I felt we had a very positive night Monday night and thought I would get a call. I'm not going to sweat it though, sand just keep moving forward positively. I'm not sure I'm going to contact her today, as I don't want to come off as 'easy' or pushy, but I don't want to lose the momentum we gained Monday night, but there is nothing I can really do about it at this point. She is busy tonight, so i wont be expected any contact tonight.

Well, lets see what today and tomorrow brings. I['m hoping for some sort of reach out on her part,b ut I think I need to refrain from contacting her for obvious reasons, but its so hard. I really felt like Monday night went well, and I don't want her to build back up those walls that i feel I knocked down then. I understand this is a 'marathon' and not a sprint, but its hard to see the big picture while taking this day to day. As for the next 4 days, I know tonight is out of the question, tomorrow night, I'm busy, and the weekend nights are usually not a time when she likes to hangout with me anymore. But we'll see. Maybe I can break through that wall!

Anyways, thanks for listening, and if anyone has any suggestions, please let em know!

VS