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Silent:

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

LG

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Hi SL!

I am thinking of you.

Want to Recover - That was a great post!

I really believe in the old "It's always darkest right before the dawn" saying. You may not yet even be near that darkest time yet but I believe you can make it through.

So what is PWC right now? At the very worst a fairly considerate roommate who very much loves your son. It could be worse, and it quite likley will get better. In time.

You have the time and a stable home to rebuild your sons whole family.

You deserve so much better, and if I could do anything to help I would, but this is what you have right now.

You are one of the strongest and brightest and most caring people on this forum.

You can do this.


Testosterone boys! Testosterone! It aint just for nose, ear and back hair anymore!
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Oh, sweet lady, I wish I knew what to say to you. I think of you often and pray for you, too.

I don't really have any advice since I've never been in your situation. I'm pulling for you, though, and reading your updates.

Be sure to take care of yourself. Those mini-breakdowns are not all bad - the frustration and fear need to be released somehow. It forces those things we try to bury up to the surface so we have to deal with them.

I don't know if you have, but I would suggest telling PWC about this - how you are feeling - the done-ness, what you feel your son is learning from the process, ask for suggestions, give your own.

He can't know if you don't tell him.

Sounds easy, doesn't it? I know it is not easy. Especially, if he won't talk, or give suggestions, or be ACTIVE in any way. Even if he doesn't, I think you should at least tell him. Your despair is probably reflected in your attitude towards him and your son. Don't let it fester and build more resentment, that resentment wall builds pretty quickly.

Huh, guess I did have something to say - take it with a grain of salt since I've never been where you are.

((((SilentLucidity))))

Take care,
Fox

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Chrisner, thanks so much for all of your support. I know that it may get worse before it gets better. I just don't always believe in myself enough that I can make it through. I come here and am reminded that there IS hope, and that is what I need the most, and it has helped me immensely today.

Foxy lady,
I am so grateful that you could drop by and give me a hand. I do know that I must find a way to talk to PWC about this. It is unfair of me to keep this to myself. If I want intimacy, this is a prime way to work it.

Just because you are not where I am, does not mean that you haven't read enough or thought on it enough to have good, solid advice.

After the mini breakdown, I did feel some relief. I went into the kitchen later that day and wrapped my arms around PWC, and held him for a minute. I said nothing.

Like I said, my resentment could be keeping ME from fully investing myself, and that will not help us.


Me-BS-38
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I don't know if you have, but I would suggest telling PWC about this - how you are feeling - the done-ness, what you feel your son is learning from the process, ask for suggestions, give your own.

He can't know if you don't tell him.

This is exactly what I was thinking. I "blew" (body shaking sobbing in despair) a couple of times in the early days and my FWH was "astonished". He told me he had no idea I was feeling the way I was. He thought everything was hunky-dory. This is your HUSBAND. Your PROTECTOR. He NEEDS to be a buffer sometimes.


Widowed 11/10/12 after 35 years of marriage
*********************
In a sense now, I am homeless. For the home, the place of refuge, solitude, love-where my husband lived-no longer exists. Joyce Carolyn Oates, A Widow's Story
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I will talk to him, I just don't know how to approach this. I feel that he will see this as a message that it's okay for HIM to quit. FEAR. He has quit before, many times. I dunno. I'll find a way.

He was nice to me yesterday. It was a strange, familiar feeling to be comforted by him when I'm down, or ill.

I'll find a way. I cannot lose my cool with him; he runs, or becomes so discombobulated that he can't find the words or REACT in any way. I'm not even ANGRY with him so much as sad.

I'll find a way...


Me-BS-38
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Silent:

PWC doesn't have the SKILLS to deal with Emotional Distress.

Most men DON'T.

Please read Schoolbus's one day during recovery:


"I'm a BW.

I wanted to weigh in here on the letter idea.

About two or three months ago, I was feeling very low. It was about the one year anniversary of d-day, combined with the holidays, and his cancer surgery anniversary as well. I was about as low as low can go.

I was thinking of walking away from the whole mess.

I BEGGED FWH to just tell me 3 things he liked about me. Just list 3 things on a sticky note, 3 things that were "okay" about me, that he didn't find "repulsive" or "disgusting" about me (see what I mean about feeling low about myself????).

He was in shock!

I thought it was because I asked him to write it down. So I said, "Could you at least, right now, just NAME ONE THING, so I can hang onto that?"

He wouldn't name one thing. Just shook his head, and remained quiet, with his eyes looking at the floor.

I was devastated.

He left the room, and I cried. He couldn't get past the fact that I thought he didn't love me, didn't think he could find even one thing likeable about me, and that I had disregarded his whole year of efforts to show me his remorse over the affair. That I had ignored his efforts, had not seen his changes, and that he had NO chance to fix things.

I was devastated because I was just so depressed that I was feeling worthless and could not see his side at all.

I thought we were NOT communicating.

But he did hear what I said. I was sitting there focused so much on myself, my pain, my devastation, and FWH was listening - and I thank God for that. I thank my FWH for his ability to see my pain and do what he did.

He went to his computer and started on a list.

He came back about 15 minutes later, and told me that he couldn't write it fast enough to make it "okay" tonight. That he would just have to hold me for now, and dry my tears, but he needed time to think about the list. But that he WOULD write my list. I focused only on the fact that he had to THINK to come up with something he liked about me (you see, I was in so much pain, I still thought he just didn't even like me). I was wrong.

Turns out, the list was not a list at all. It was a love letter with three things he loved about me. Each paragraph started with "I love you because..." and he finished each paragraph with so much more than just a list.

The last sentence said that he had trouble keeping the list to just three items. That he had trouble listing the "top three", because there were so many that could have been the top three. And that anytime I wanted, he would add to the list.

I have not needed him to add to the list.

Because he has been there for me, and has done everything I have needed him to do to help me through this mess.

So yes, write the letter.

And tell him why you love him. Tell him the best things about him - about who he is INSIDE, what he DOES that makes you love him.

Because he needs to know that you see it.

And, because he needs to know that you REMEMBER it.

And because he needs to remember it himself.

And because YOU need to remember it, too.

SB"

So, LET him comfort you.

LET HIM KNOW you just need the comfort.

LG

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Following on the coattails of LG who has spoken to you with SUCH GREAT WISDOM, I came on here this morning to tell you this. It seems SOOOO CLEAR that PWC finds it pleasurable to NURTURE YOU...the cookies..the phone call yesterday...He EVIDENCES his LOVE through NURTURING...

Let him TAKE CARE OF YOU..ask him to TAKE CARE OF YOU..let him know that YOU NEED HIM...let him know that you DESIRE his HELP...

I think it's a huge part of the ADMIRATION NEED..being the KNIGHT IN SHINING ARMOR...like the cave man going out to get the meat for his family (?)....ALL PART OF GOD'S PLAN...


I made it happen..a joyful life..filled with peace, contentment, happiness and fabulocity.
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Wisdom, Indeed, Mimi. The same wisdom you and LG have been giving me for well over a year now. How grateful I am to you all for talking me through and down off of the ledge. I'm passed the strange remorse I was having.

I did feel cared for yesterday. It was nice to feel that way again, and it has bolstered my confidence that I CAN DO THIS.

If this is tough and awkward for me, it HAS to be that for PWC. I know this; I tell myself this often, but I lost track of SELF this weekend, falling back into that place where I give power to the past, and dwell, and get mired in it. It was so scary. That is why I came here first, before I DID anything.

I like the idea of writing him a letter of hope, of love, listing three things, three reasons that I love him, and nothing else. No past, no future, just today.

Thank you LG, so very much.

Thanks to all that have chimed in here and helped me find my way to this next 'thing'. I feel stronger today. I do need him, in many ways. I know I can go it alone, but how sad is that when you can tough it out with someone beside you, and you are attempting to throw that away based on emotion. Again, my sense of reason told me to come here before reverting to past behaviors and setting US back.

PWC IS doing it, he is there, he is loving his family in the ways that he knows how to, and may learn better over time. I have to have faith. That's tough when you never depended on faith before. Everything was so black and white then. Now, so many shades of grey exist, so many choices, and ways to go about doing the same thing. It's good to have 'guides' to help me.


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I have decided to answer Frozen's questions regarding becoming a buyer, here, on my thread.

It's not easy to be a buyer when only one spouse is working the MB's plans; there exists no POJA, no rules of engagment on his end, so I try to lead by example. This way will, obviously, take more time and effort, which can be exasperating, but it's worth it to get my M back.

Quote
• Is there currently an issue in your marriage that you are dissatisfied with but haven't wanted to bring it to your spouse's attention?

A Buyer is emotionally honest with themselves and with their spouse

[color:"green"] No. All of MY issues with the marriage have been voiced. I have told FWH on more than one occasion, with care and concern. [/color]


* Is there a situation in your marriage you are dissatisfied with but are just tolerating?

A Buyer understands that sacrifice leads to resentment

[color:"green"]Yes, the lack of SF and affection. This has been voiced. I have ‘offered’ myself up, and GIVE affection from my end. I do feel that resentment builds. Don’t really know how I can remedy this, beyond letting go of the subject and coming back to it at a later date. [/color]

[color:"green"] Also, I feel that we could benefit a great deal from counseling; this would give him a chance to voice his issues, and give me a chance to make appropriate changes, or POJ A with him. He refuses. [/color]


* When your spouse tells you that they are dissatisfied with something you are doing, do you get defensive?

A Buyer understands that criticism indicates a need for change

[color:"green"] NOPE. I’ve learned a great deal about listening over the last six months. My spouse doesn’t just come out and say it, I actually have to ask him if there is something he is dissatisfied with. I don’t think he likes to be the ‘bad guy’, so he says nothing. [/color]

[color:"green"] Last conversation we had, after being questioned, he did admit to some dissatisfaction with my weight, and I took it to heart. I did cry, but I immediately took the steps to begin correcting the problem, on my end. [/color]


* Do you ever utter the phrases, "If you loved me, you would..." or "What can I do to change his/her mind"?

A Buyer seeks solutions to conflict that are a win for both spouses.

[color:"green"] Again, I no longer do this, due to my changing myself. [/color]


* Do you ever think that maybe you and your spouse are just incompatible?

A Buyer understands that the way to build compatibility is through successful negotiaton.

[color:"green"] NOPE! I think quite the opposite; I know that we have so much to talk about, to laugh about, to enjoy together. This is what bothers me so much—why can’t I just relax and BE this person. I don’t think it’s that easy. I’m more than willing to open the table to negotiation. PWC is reluctant to talk about our issues without me setting the scene. [/color]



* Do you ever go along with something you aren't really enthusiastic about just to end a conflict?

A Buyer believes that marriage is long-term and knows that short-term solutions will not provide long-term marital enjoyment.

[color:"green"] Yes. PWC lets me know about OUTTINGS the night before, sometimes the morning of, sometimes not until he’s off work and heading out. I’m not really enthusiastic about that. I get NO say in it. I feel resentful that my feelings aren’t considered. I then feel like I have no choice, so I say OK. Basically, he’s already told his friends ‘I’ll be there” and I am a SECONDARY contact in the matter, like I just need the information, not the choice. [/color]


* When you negotiate with your spouse, do you tell your spouse that you don't enthusiastically agree and your negotiation ends there?

A Buyer understands that requiring their spouse to sacrifice is dangerous and is to be avoided.

[color:"green"] There hasn’t been much negotiating happening. Not much to negotiate about. We will discuss where we want to have dinner, what movies to watch, what to have for dinner, but that’s about it, so far. [/color]


* When your spouse approaches you for negotiation, are you disrespectful? Do you roll your eyes, make disrespectful comments such as "You're never satisfied with anything"? Do you attempt to invalidate their request?

A Buyer knows that in order to successfully negotiate, the negotiation process must be safe and pleasant for both spouses.

[color:"green"] NOPE. I’ve learned to be respectful. His opinion matters a great deal to me, and I try to listen with an open mind, ready for discussion. [/color]


* Do you ask your spouse to do things you know they don't truly want to do for you in order to prove their love?

A Buyer knows that love is not measured by sacrifice.

[color:"green"] NOPE. Not that I’m aware of. I know that PWC was resentful of having to call me and let me know where he was. He was resentful of giving me his accounts and passwords. I don’t think that was much to ask of him. I never asked him to PROVE his love, just his trustworthiness. [/color]

* Do you feel as though you have given and given in your marriage and if only your selfish spouse would give a little, you might have a happy marriage?

A Buyer knows how to balance both their Giver and Taker. A Buyer takes responsibility for their own satisfaction and doesn't blame their spouse for their dissatisfaction.

[color:"green"] I certainly DID at one point, up until recently, I suppose. Now, it’s not about him not giving, it’s about not having my most important EN’s met. He’s meeting other needs, which makes deposits, but the biggest deposits would be met in ways that he is aware that I need, but can’t or won’t bring himself to do often, if at all. [/color]

I know that I have a lot of work to do in order to become a buyer again. I know that I am leading our recovery right now, and may be the one slowing the process. I, admittedly, have a great deal to learn.


Me-BS-38
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:Cheerleader: PRESENT!!!!

GOOOOOOO SSSLLLLLL!!!

LOL...I've always wanted to be a cheerleader! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

I learned a little bit reading that post too! I want nothing more than a buyer in my future...YOU KNOW...no more freeloaders! LOL <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

HOW 'bout chew'?


A loving heart is the beginning of all knowledge.
Thomas Carlyle
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Hey Rin,

Hope you are feeling a bit better today, after that dip on the coaster.

I wanna BECOME a buyer. I can't speak for PWC.


Me-BS-38
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Yep! I'm feeling better...I started feeling better yesterday...you know there's away going to be something to push you in that direction...well, I got what I was looking for...


A loving heart is the beginning of all knowledge.
Thomas Carlyle
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