Since you took a keen interest in my return to the Church, I wish to bring to your attention several experiences that I have had of late.

First, I did as I had said I would do, return to mass for several services. I can tell you that while I felt compelled to do so, the issues that I am dealing with and the leadership of the church makes the experience less than a positive one.

So, here goes.

The local leadership has taken it upon themselves to hire an investigator to re-investigate all claims made against priests in the church. This was after they dismissed the grand jury report (note that over half of the grand jury were Catholics) as being anti Catholic rhetoric. Now, the reason for this action on their part... to get to the truth... NOPE... It was an attempt to minimize the potential financial impact of pending legislation in the PA courts that will open a window for civil lawsuits against the RCC that were previously barred as a result of a statute of limitations. When I was called the other day regarding this investigation I immediately involved my IC on a conference call and stressed the obvious holes in this policy. Unfortunately, it was not before over 20 calls were made to other victims of assault at the hands of these monsters.

Now, my first question to you is... is the RCC and all that they stand for put into question by the actions of their leadership? And when I say leadership I mean at the highest levels... from the Pope forward. The Cardinals involved in this scandal have shown complete disdain for justice. The Popes in power have acted in a way that seeks only to protect church assets and not the flock. This is more than opinion too... this was the view of the grand jury as well and frankly, while the window dressing has been added to help hide the reality of what continues to happen, the real truth is the church has been slow or hesitant to act on removing certain priests and helping those injured by their failures. How is anyone to put faith in a system that is corrupt from the head (pope) to toe(local churches)?

I have NOW been asked to join yet another focus group within the church... and guess what, I rejected them on the grounds that until they show that the leadership is serious in dealing with this cancer, they are asking me to be part of a sham. This problem exists throughout the country. If you are not familiar with a group called SNAP, I would suggest as a good Catholic that you make yourself aware of them. How can anyone in good conscience give any money to this church when it has been proven that some of these funds are used to help cover up terrorism against our own children.

How do you reconcile belonging to an organization that has conspired to cover up and facilitate criminal activity? I have spoken to priests that are now having the same dilemma entering into their lives. In fact there have been more than a few priests that have left the priesthood over these very issues. Some no longer consider themsleves Catholic.

I know for a fact that in the parrish neighboring mine, one of the priests that drove the getaway car for what could be the most vicious sexual predator in the local archdioces has been given the title of Monsignor. Do you know who gives that title to a priest? Now the church is aware of this issue... I have spoken to everyone (locally) but the cardinal to date and all I hear are excuses about how this decision was made at higher levels. This is today's RCC Ant. How can anyone support such an organization?

BTW, can you tell me your feelings about the rapid move to canonize John Paul? Are you aware of his role in the scandals? And if you are, how does this act reflect on the church?

You praised me for my passion... well, this is an example of that passion coming forth.

I will leave you with this link and let you read just some tidbits to give you an idea of the scope of the problem. Pay special attention to the overviews of the cover-up by the leadership.

http://www.bishop-accountability.org/pa_philadelphia/Philly_GJ_report.htm

I look forward to your comments.

MEDC

MEDC - Sorry for the intrusion but I felt a need to say "thank you" to you for shining a light on a problem that NEEDS solution, not talk or cover up. I personally had no idea that it was this extensive and pervasive.

Thank you for the link, it will take some time to read through all of it, but I agree, everyone should know the truth about the entire situation.

What is it that is said around here so often? Exposure.

God bless.

okay i spent a few minutes on that sight and am completely sick!!!!! I can completely understand how people who have delt with situation such as those will stray from God, but the fact of the matter is none of that has to do with God..... These are human men that are taking advantage of their position and it is sick!!!! I just pray that God gives them what they deserve!!!! I dont think it is fair to think that because these men are choosing to do this that you should stray from God though..... They are two different subject matters.... imo

My experience brought me closer to God... just not in the RCC. And if you think that is sick... the entire Grand Jury report which is almost 500 pages long wi=ould curl your toes!

FH... you're welcome and thank you.

the complete report

http://www.philadelphiadistrictattorney.com/images/Grand_Jury_Report.pdf

a review of the church's response to the report

http://www.philadelphiadistrictattorney.com/images/DA_s_Response.pdf

oh, and by the way... one of the responses of the church was to have read at all masses that no Catholic was to read the Grand Jury report!

Ignorance is bliss.

I apologize... i misread somehow about straying from God... But Kuddos to you for sticking with Him and not allowing some religion and the beliefs they choose to stray you from the truth!
im not sure if i want to read these reports if they are worse than the others..... it is just so horrible..... and so many places all they know asreligion is catholic..... it just breaks my heart!!!

this should be mandatory reading for every Catholic before they slip another dollar into a collection envelope. the review of the church response while not graphic (and the report itself can be very graphic) tells alot about the men running this outfit.

I hate to say it since there are parts of the Church I love...but the term "evil empire" comes to mind everytime I think of the Church and its keepers. There truly has been a great vacuum that has sucked God out of the leadership of this organization.

okay..... i must be a seeker of punishment.... because i read some more of that stuff... and guys seriously.... not good lunch reading!!!!!

SO SO SAD!!!!

My experience brought me closer to God...
How so?????? By allowing yourself to fall into the bitter root that James warns against?

MEDC, we live in the ultimate apostacy that Christ has warned about. Make no mistake, we are in the end of times. Nothing will seem to be about what it it used to seem like. We have strayed well beyond the atrocity of sodam and gormora(sp).

But for you to lose your faith over this, is beyond my understading. are you totally willing to lose your faith in God over the actions of men?

I understand your backgroud in law enforcement. A little known fact about me, is that I was military police during the vietnam war. I saw something about law enforcement, 30 years ago.

Don't throw our the baby with the bathwater! there is still hope in Christ, about our chrches and about our faith in Him.

All Blessings,
Jerry

BTW, Fh, I noticed you once aging couldn't resist the chance to bash the RCC. I have deleted you from my e-mail. It was a good thought though.
Blessings

Jerry,
I am a little confussed.....MEDC said it brought him closer to God just not RCC... Can there not be other religions that he can choose to follow Christ in? I just am trying to understand where you are coming from.....

LITW

lostintheworld,
Of course it can, I don't care how MEDC finds his way to Christ, I really don't. But the bottom line is he finds his way there, irrespective of the RCC.

We all find our way in whatever manner we can. Thus , I hope he finds his way, I just wish he would'nt condemn MY WAY.

All Blessings,
Jerry

Okay.... I think I understand now.... I sensed some anger or frustration within your message and could not understand why.... but I know if I felt someone was attacking my religious views that i would be a bit on the defensive side too.... I understand the baby and bath water comment now (I think) basically you are saying that though all these priest have done wrong dont throw out RCC in whole because there are a lot of great things they have done as well... right?

Jerry, I too do not understand your message. It ignores what I wrote and I'm not bitter... I am appropriately angry.
I found my way to Christ after leaving the RCC. So I am really confused by your post.

MEDC

And Jerry... I have respected you and have treated you with respect. I have not condemned your way... I have merely pointed out facts and brought them to light. The fact that you are saying that I have condemned your way shows that you just don't get it. It is the words and actions of the RCC that condemn it... I have not the ability, the desire or the strength to condemn you way.
If you can still have faith in the Pope and the RCC after knowing the facts, that is your call. My brother is one such person and I believe with all my heart that he is saved. But don't be one of the whining Catholics that feels that just because someone brings to light the truth that they are condemning you.
The church has thrived on keeping her flock ignorant to her actions. That is what has condemned the RCC. Because if they were honest and came forth into the light... the real value and spirit of the church would shine through. Instead, the Pope and his gang continue to live in darkness. This is not speculation Jerry, it is fact based on their own actions. The RCC would have loyal follower in me and many others displaced by actions if they would just cut the [email]cr@p[/email] and not only do a good job cleaning house... but to next install people of character that would never stand for the things happening even today. But instead we have puppets at the head allowing the very people that orchestrated this mess to be canonized or promoted to even higher levels within the church. It is ignorance and an unwillingness to demand appropriate action from the church that has left it in its current position of well placed mistrust in our country. Apologists for the church have condemned it.... not me. I do more in a day to help save the RCC than most will do in years.

MEDC

MEDc,
I hear what you are saying and I think it best to know, at this point that I do not differ very much from what you are thinking. You seem to feel that i am somehow diametrically opposed to your thinking. Let me reassure you, I am not.

For me this issue, however sahameful and disgraceful, is NOT WHAT GOD EVER INTENDED FOR HIS CHURCH
!!@

Having said that, we must somehow groupe how this could have ever happened in the first place.
I truly believe that we are living inthe apostacy of the end of times. Look for a moment, at other Christian religions. Have they been somehow supurlous to all other christain religins?
How about the Anglican church, dividing itself all over the world because of the "acceptance" of homosexuals in the clergy? What about the Jim Baker's of out times going to prison in tears? And of course, let us not forget about Tammy Baker and her crocodile tears as she waltz off to the bank with millions in her pocket.

It's a sign of the times MEDC. It's the apostacy we live in. But, IMHO, it will not last very much longer. will you still be a brother in Christ? We can all make it to the end if you are willing to endure.

All Blessings,
Jerry

With all due respect, Jerry, just where did I bash the RCC?

Child abuse of any kind, by anyone is intolerable, don't you think. That MEDC asked a very legitimate question is NO different than asking why the Government would not take strong steps to protect children from abuse. That he asked others within the RCC to do what they could to help hold decision makers accountable for protecting God's children is NOT bashing on his part, it is what it would seem anyone with any compassion for children would do.

So what exactly is your beef with me this time, as I said not one word about the RCC?

As for deleting the email address, that is entirely your right and decision. To my recollection, I never sought you out for any discussion via email. I hope you work through your questions and get the answers you are seeking. It seems obvious from your post here that you do need to get the answers you were seeking.

God bless and may God lead you in His way.

FH,
You have never lost the chance to somehow oppose the RCC teacing that "yes indeed, you can lose your salvation, if one decides to oppose all the commandments of God." Your premise has always been, that once saved, you could never do anything to put yor salvaton in jeopady. Is it not?
I have always had the utmost respect for your biblical knowlege and the truth of your conviction. Would I hav esought you out if I did not truly feel that way?

But yor track record on these forums is always to dimiss the RCC view of salvation in jeopady if you disregard the commands of God. In spite of the born again theory. How many times have you stated that in spite of your rebellion to God, once you have accepted Jesus as your Savior, you cannot lose your salvation?

Is this truly what Christ taught us? That once we become a believer, in spite of our life , we cannot somehow lose this. This sounds exactly like the maffia in NY, who went to church faithfally every sunday, in spite of the murders and atrocities they committed. Huh........

I for one, do not get this type of thinking, and believe in al of my heart, you and they are very wrong.

Thanks for all of your help,
All Blessings,
jerry

Yes, it is truly what Christ taught.

Gospel of John, chapter 10
25 Jesus answered them, I told you, and ye believed not: the works that I do in my Father's name, they bear witness of me.

26 But ye believe not, because ye are not of my sheep, as I said unto you.

27 My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:

28 And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand .

29 My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand.

30 I and my Father are one.