usually when they say "i love you but I'm not IN love with you" it means they're "in love" with someone else.

I agree with what others have said...he might be having an affair, he might not....but he sure is making you believe it's entirely YOUR fault. Has he discussed HIS ACTIONS in the break up??? ...I"m sure he wasn't a perfect angel.

IMO, if you want to work on it, and he's NOT having an affair, use this time apart to "date" again. Get to know eachother again, go out again.....Talk on the phone late at night. If he is having an affair, you'll find out I'm sure. you might want to stop by annanounced at his new place sometimes...see what's up.

good luck to you though, it sounds like you've come a long way.

It was actually "I love you but, I can't live with you" Same meaning though. I did get confirmation that there is someone sniffing around my territory. Let's just say I fought fire with a towering inferno.

In a way, I am glad he left. It has given me a chance to grow up. I was very young and naive when I married him. I am now the head of this household and I rock at it. But, of course this separation is very dangerous because my H lives the bachelor life now. Coming over to a noisy house full kids most of which don't belong to you could be a real turn off at times. Me, I love every minute of it. This is what life is all about.

Well, what a fool I have been...I thought that being with his beautiful wife in our nice home with his children, would have him jumping off the fence. Well, I was sooo wrong it only made him want to sit there even longer.

Everyone who said there was another woman you were right. She is around 10 yrs older than me. I made it very clear that I don't want him to see her anymore. He told me that sounded like an ultimatum to him So, I said it isn't and how would you feel if the shoe was on the other foot? He later said he would stop being "friends" with her if he decides to come home.

I have decided today that I won't accept this. I will not waste another tear on this. He has had 3 months to decide what he wants. There is no way we can build a new relationship with him living elsewhere seeing another woman and taking the kids over there with him.

I will not enable him to sit on the fence and ignore his responsiblites. I have been holding off on getting an order for child support. I haven't done it because I know it will send him through the roof. But, he has not been paying on his own and it is about time he deals with that reality. He even charged me for materials for some work he did on our house.

Who is the OW? Is she married? What does she do? Have your children been exposed to her?

Ginger, the best thing you can do is bring this affair out into the wide open air and make it clear that he has abandoned his family for this woman. Affairs thrive on secrecy and that is the most potent weapon you have against the affair.

Expose to his parents, your parents, the OW's parents, siblings, close friends etc. It is hard to be bad when everyone is watching on with disgust. It forces the affairees to see how sleazy they look in the eyes of normal thinking, non fogged out ppl. It also prevents him from bringing OW around his family and friends. He will have to hide her out like the shameful ho she is.

And I agree you should get him for child support and protct yourself financially.I would also ask that your attorney specify that these children are NEVER to be exposed to his unsavory affair partner. The kids should not be dragged into his affair.

I am sorry you have uncovered this, but very glad you have found out the truth. At least you have a chance knowing the truth. It really infuriates me, though, that he withheld this pertinent information about YOUR LIFE from you. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" /> you had every right to this information about his affair, since this concerns you.

p.s. a common tactic of wayward spouses is to introduce their children to the affair partner in an effort to normalize the affair and give it an air of false respectibility. The children are used as PAWNS to bolster the "respectibility" of a filthy affair in order to make it more acceptable.

If your kids are over 6, they should be told the truth about the affair, lest they grow up morally confused believing it is ok to have affairs.

Ginger, no. You must be more strategic than this. Calm down and do not give up! You have done the right thing in being pleasant and trying to attract him back. THAT SHOULD NOT CHANGE! You will not get him back by being angry and issuing angry ultimatums. That WILL JUST BE HANDING THE OW A WIN! You will make the OW LOOK GOOD.

NO.NO.NO. Let us help you do this strategically to get the best result. There is no reason you should give up. You have just been handed NEW WEAPONRY by finding out the truth, so this is not the time to just give up. Now that you know what you are up against, you can change your strategy a little to inflict harm on the affair, but other than that, you should stick with your Plan A a few more weeks and THEN go into PLAN B.

That will give you the best chance to protect yourself and the best chance to save your marriage, if it can be saved. You have a DISTINCT ADVANTAGE over the affairees because you have a PLAN. They have NO PLAN except secrecy. You can ruin that tomorrow!

This should be your focus:
The Carrot and the Stick of Plan A by Pepperband

The carrot of Plan A


Meeting your wandering spouse's emotional needs.

Making "home" a warm and inviting place to be.

Placing emphasis on what has worked in the marriage.

Showing consistent self improvement in areas where previously lacking.

Stop lovebusting behaviors.

Communicating with a calm reassuring voice and relaxed body language, even in the center of a verbal storm created by the infidel.

Becoming the person any reasonable spouse would want to come home to.

Remaining open to the possibility of recovery.

Offering forgiveness and understanding.



The stick of Plan A


Exposing adultery where it matters most. Exposure that takes the form of a swift and sudden unexpected tsunami of truth.

Not appologizing for exposure or speaking the truth in a kind yet direct way.

Directly communicating the hurt and devastation that the affair has caused.

Not accepting blame for the infidel's choice to become adulterous.

Let the consequences of adultery and infidelity fall freely upon the heads of the adulterous.

Establishing boundaries that disallow the affair to effect children of the marriage, financal security of the marriage, and otherwise ruin innocent bystanders.

Standing up to infidelity as a beast that must be slayed for the good of the family.


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Plan A is both a *carrot* and a *stick*.

Ginger,

You are in the right place to get great advice!

Everyone here Knows your pain, as we have all felt it, too

My WH is no different than your right now ,,, and like others.

The folks here can help you through this most horrific time of your life

There are no guarantees to the outcome, but you will have come thru this knowing you did all you could to save your M

I am no where near recovery with my WH, but feel better knowing I have tried and will continue to work thru these proven plans. If I get my H and M back, great! If not, I will have grown and improved for My future and that of my DD


Prayers and hugs to you!

Thanks for this it really helps. You are right I do have a plan. I do plan to continue what I have been doing at least for a little while longer. I have the carrot part down to a T <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> The stick part needs a little work.. Plan B will be good for me. But, I do think it will be the end of my marriage. Which I am getting preapared for.

Good girl! It would be helpful if you just decompress for a day or two and start cogitating on the STICK portion of Plan A. Then we can help you put together a PLAN. And please, no lovebusting in the meantime! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

The stick of Plan A


Exposing adultery where it matters most. Exposure that takes the form of a swift and sudden unexpected tsunami of truth.

Not appologizing for exposure or speaking the truth in a kind yet direct way.

Directly communicating the hurt and devastation that the affair has caused.

Not accepting blame for the infidel's choice to become adulterous.

Let the consequences of adultery and infidelity fall freely upon the heads of the adulterous.

Establishing boundaries that disallow the affair to effect children of the marriage, financal security of the marriage, and otherwise ruin innocent bystanders.

Standing up to infidelity as a beast that must be slayed for the good of the family.

Well you have to let the past stay in the past to some extent but you also have to learn from it. I think you mean learn from your mistakes and move on - that's a good thing. I hope you don't mean shove it all under the rug, put on a happy face, and pretend none of this ever happened.


Sounds to me like you're already doing it. The house is clean, you're doing great with the kids. The only thing you might change is figure out what his top one or two ENs are and try to incorporate them into your personal makeover.

Have you exposed the A? You should!
If so, who have you told?

Who *can* you tell? For starters -
OW's: husband, children, employer
WH's: employer, parents

ML: I now have a plan for the stick. I just hope it can works quickly. Because, the curtain is coming down much sooner than I anticipated.



That is the problem there isn't really anyone to tell...

I don't understand. Why isn't there anyone to tell? What curtain is coming down?

What is your plan for the stick?

The Plan has two parts, Plan A and Plan B. Once you have been in Plan A for awhile you will want to go to Plan B. It is a 2 part plan.

Well, through some PI work of my own I have hard evidence of his affair. Once I take care of some financial business, I am going to expose them. My evidence isn't conclusive and they will probably try to deny it but, this ugliness needs to see the light of day.

However, seeing it for my own eyes has given me strange calm. For the first time since all of this started, I now know why he left. This isn't the first time he has broken my trust in a major way. I am not sure I will ever be able to trust him again.

--GA

Great job! Ginger, before you expose come here and we can help you strategize. I bet knowing the truth makes things look very different, doesn't it? Things that did not make sense before now probably suddenly make perfect sense.

I can understand why you feel relieved. You at least have a chance if you know the truth about your life.

While you are getting your finances secured, I would suggest putting together a list of exposure targets. You would want to include his parents, her parents, close siblings, your parents, and your children. It is best to expose to all on the same day in order to treat the affairees to the maximum impact and prevent them from pre-empting you.

I would tell the target that you love your husband, want to save your marriage and am hoping for their support. You will want word of this to get back to your husband. This will cause great conflict in the affair.

Your evidence might not be conclusive, but if you have enough circumstantial evidence to come to the conclusion that he is having an affair and has left for that reason, I would simply state that your H has been having an affair for some time and has abandoned you and the children for his mistress. State this matter of factly.

Remember...you don't have to convince him he's having an affair...HE already knows it.

You need only convince him that you KNOW he's having an affair.

The wall of denial is difficult to traverse sometimes. Infidels always have this hidden belief that unless you actually catch them in bed they can deny anything and everything else with the "we are just friends" line.

Sometimes it helps to expand what you do know into the realm of what you only have a hint of. For example, I told my wife in the spring of 2005 that I had acquired a copy of all their text messages back and forth from our cellular company. In fact, I had only snooped several messages off her phone directly and the cell company doesn't actually save nor archive old text messages. Using the info I did know I was able to convince her I had them all and the cat was completely out of the bag.

Good luck,
Mr. Wondering

I have two targets in mind. I am thinking about doing it at the end of the week... But, I kinda don't care any more. This feels like the final nail in coffin for me.

Well, I chickened out with one of my exposure targets. I informed his mother she was pissed but, nothing will come of that. I also confronted him. Of course that didn't go well. Some may not approve but, I also told the kids. He has been taking them over to the ow's house every weekend he has them. I know the older one fully understood what I was saying. The younger one thought we were already divorced???I wonder who told him that...

It wasn't until I took myself out of the situation and calmed down I realized... Everything everyone has been telling me about the ws totally applies to my wh. He is no different. He is in a fog. He still needs me to fill some of his needs that is why he started coming around again although on a limited basis. He really enjoyed the drama too.

I have uncovered more lies and some really disgusting stuff. I will never be able to trust him again. Besides he isn't the man I married and looking back that transformation started long before he left. I don't want the man that he is today. I don't foresee the sweet man I married ever coming back, that one left the building years ago. I just want to move on with my life.

Thank you everyone for all of your help!

Ginger, expose the affair to everyone in both your families including the OW's family. Her parents should also know that she is having an affair with a married man. Do this, Ginger, and don't back down. It will be very effective and will force the affairees to see themselves through the eyes of others when forced to explain themselves. Exposure is very effective in ruining the fantasy. Affairs THRIVE on secrecy.

You did absolutely the right thing in telling your children. They should NEVER be exposed to your H's filthy affair. A wayward will drag his children into his affair in an attempt to normalize it and give it a false air of respectibility. I would make it clear to him that your children are to NEVER EVER be exposed to his sleazy mistress. She is an UNFIT ADULT for children. Don't allow him to use those kids like that, Ginger.

ML - which is better email, phone or a letter to do this? I think I am going to do it. It isn't family though...and this will start a firestorm most likely directed at me.