Just ignore it. Smile. Give her a hug. Be sympathetic and empathetic. You have made great progress. Your wife is coming back. Be happy.

Doing all that.
PATIENCE!!! PATIENCE!!! PATIENCE!!!

I always did want everything doing yesterday, I guess this is something where I can't do that and have to go at her pace

BigK wrote:

"I have been hard on him for his own good."

I know and I hope you didn't think I was criticising you for doing so.

That's the trouble with you Aussies, you really struggle with being direct and saying what you think <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

No MindWarped - I never thought you were criticising me.

Are you saying I shouldn't apply for a job in the diplomatic corp?

Bwhahahahahahaha

Thought I would give my latest update

Monday was our 19th wedding anniversary. We flew out to Paris on Saturday, spent Saturday afternoon and evening just chilling out.
Sunday we went to the Prix de L'Arc de Triomphe horse race at Longchamps. I won a few euros, MrsBrae lost a few euros, so lucky in love and all that. On the Sunday evening we had a nice meal at a Brasserie near the hotel.
Monday we walked the length and breadth of Paris and then had a lovely anniversary meal on a boat down the Seine.
All in all a very nice weekend.

MrsBrae has not had her recurring dream that she was finding so upsetting for over a week.

This morning MrsBrae seemed a bit down, I asked what was wrong, she said that she thought she would have her feelings back for me by now, we are 13 weeks into NC. I told her not to worry about it, give it a few months and things would be much better. I said to look at where we were 6 weeks ago compared with now and that I thought we were starting to reconnect.
Things in general are much better, we talk lots, we laugh a lot and get on fine, the main issue is still her lack of feelings for me and her still feeling like I am just a friend.
Before I get 2x4'ed by BigK or BP*, I am trying not to let it worry me too much and am just getting on with life. I did ask her if there was anything I was doing wrong with regards to EN's or LB' and she said she couldn't think of anything

Brae, I smell that there is manipulation in your W constant communication of her lack of feelings for you.

If she were truly repentant and truly cared about you she would reserve that radical honest hurt for when you ask her, or for when she has studied, found a new way to try to regain those feelings and needs you to participate.

Is there any chance she is still in contact brae ?

Glad you had a fine time in Paris <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

BP*. She did not just come out and tell me. I noticed that she seemed a bit down and asked why.
There is always a chance she is still in contact, but I really don't think so. I certainly can't find any proof or even anything remotely suspicious, during the false recovery there were many things I was just too naive to see it.
Things are far different than during the false recovery, in many ways we have re-connected, we had a lovely weekend in Paris, I would not have believed it possible 6 weeks ago. I can see her making an effort, i have seen baby steps, it is just as though we have reached a plateau that we don't seem to be able to get past.
MrsBrae has always been opposed to MC, she did not want to discuss what she has done with a stranger, but she said yesterday that if things don't improve in a couple of weeks we maybe should try it to see if it can help us take the next step

W did elaborate later on what she was saying and why she was down.
She explained that she had had NC for 3 months, she could see all the effort I was making and the effort she was making(maybe not enough as I would like or as often as I would like), she said that the trip to Paris was lovely and she had enjoyed every minute of it but still the "OOMPH"(her words) wasn't back and after all of this surely it should be. Other things she said made me think she was feeling guilty about the situation she had put us in.
I suggested we try and just have some fun together for a few months and see where that takes us. She agreed.
All in all things are not too bad, we both have bad days but these are becoming less and less frequent, we have fun together and spend lots of time together. Most of the time my W is back, although WW rears her head occasionaly.Where we are now is somewhere I probably thought not possible a couple of months ago, it feels as though we have come a long way but we just seem to be struggling to make the next step, it is as though we have climbed a mountain but just cannot make that last push for the summit.
She told me that she cannot think of anything I am doing or not doing or am doing wrong.
Maybe we just need a little more time, if things don't change in a couple of weeks we have talked about phone counselling with the Harley's.
BP* asked if there was any chance of contact, I suppose there is always a chance but I really don't think so, things are so much different to during our false recovery, it is hard to say how but many subtle differences, I can see the effort she is making and in many ways we have re-connected, during the false recovery there were many suspicious things and my gut instinct told me there was still contact, I just believed WW would not stoop to such levels, I now know she would and am very sceptical about everything she says and does.

BRae:

I'm going to say this, not to knock you down, but to show you how long and hard this road is:

Your Quote:

"All in all things are not too bad, we both have bad days but these are becoming less and less frequent, we have fun together and spend lots of time together. Most of the time my W is back, although WW rears her head occasionaly.Where we are now is somewhere I probably thought not possible a couple of months ago, it feels as though we have come a long way but we just seem to be struggling to make the next step, it is as though we have climbed a mountain but just cannot make that last push for the summit."

You ARE climbing a mountain.

But what you percieve as the summit, and that isn't very far away, is just a base camp.

One of several.

Right now, your W is along for the march up the mountain. That much is evident. But you have been carrying most of the equipment up the hill.

That's your role right now. And you have done well. You have also made the choice not to be angry with her yet, with this role. I commend you for that.

But the next base camp? SHE gets past withdrawal, and decides to start carrying a portion of the load.

She may only pull off a package of food, or the tent. But you will know when that happens. The pack will be lighter.

Then you start climbing, more together this time, to the next base camp. W will pick more things out of your pack, and carry them as well, as she is getting stronger. You know more of the way you are going, and she likes the lead you are taking, and wants to help out alot more. This is an area where the uphill progress slows from the speed that you had before the first base camp. THe footing is tougher, the air a little thinner, but the sun is shiner, and view is much better.

Then you arrive at the next base camp. THis is where WW no longer appears. She is carrying her half of the load. Maybe even more of it. Your blazing the trail, and she knows that you need the extra energy for that.

You two are in a totally different R then you ever had before.

W may be really interested in talking to the Harleys, now. So that forgiveness for you, and remorse for her, is given and accepted.

Now you can start talking about reaching summits. About the final base camps on your plan to get there.

You have come so far. You never expected to get this far, not so long ago.

Recovery is harder than breaking up the A.

But it's a much better path to be walking on then the Divorce path.

Keep up the good work. Be careful with your own emotions, and maintain the calm, and the plan.

LG

Brae,

You have to get in the mindset that this is a rollercoaster and it will be up and down for maybe 2 years or longer. There is no quickfix.

Work the program and keep on course.

The other thing is your wife is probably comparing the drug" fix she got with OM with what she feels for you and is confused about not having that "buzz" anymore. If you both continue to meet each others needs, love will come back and so will some of that oomph.

LG, BigK.
Thanks for your comments, great description LG. I wasn't under any illusion that we were close to the summit of this, I was trying to indicate we had reached a plateau where we seemed not to be moving forward.
Things on the whole are pretty good and I am grateful for that, we have even started talking about Christmas, a couple of months ago I did not see any chance of us spending Christmas together.
This morning I was laid on the bed and W was getting ready for work, she told me she felt really sad this morning and didn't know why, she then came and laid next to me on the bed and just held me for about 5 minutes, then got up and started getting ready for work, I asked her if she felt better and she said yes, this is one of the few times she has initiated anything and I left for work with a smile on my face.
As I said we both have good days and bad days but I am grateful for where we have reached.

see Brae - know this - your wife will experience a ****** deeper and longer than anything you have experienced. Her affair was an aberation. She will crucify herself over this eventually. It is starting to settle on her. My wife can really help her with this if she is willing.

BigK. Thanks again, I know you have made this offer before and I haven't forgotten. I will try and offer this to my W, if I feel the time is right. She has been opposed to counselling because she does not want to air her dirty washing and talk about what she has done.
Thanks for the kind offer and I will see if I can persuade her.

Growing tired from the fight and feel like throwing in the towel.
Could do with some advice, support, help!!!
We just seem to have come to a halt, A is over and W is maintaining NC, she has re-committed to M in many ways, she is sure that she wants to save M and make it work and I can see her trying, even if at the moment is is not as much as I maybe would like.
We are getting on fine as friends, but that is it, I am doing my best Plan A, no LB's and things on the whole are ok, but, and this is the crux of it, W still cannot find that passion. We don't seem to have moved forward in the last couple of weeks, I have asked W if there is anything I am doing or not doing, she can't think of anything.
I am not sure where to go, I am feeling tired, I don't think there would be any benefit in Plan B, because all the conditions I would set for her to return, she is already doing.
A couple of weeks ago I thought W was coming back to me but we just seem to have come to a grinding halt.
Advice needed!!!

There is no need for Plan B because you aren't trying to crack an affair any more. The hard part now begins and that is recovery.

It's been six months and you are tired, fed up and generally disgusted with your lot in life. BTDT! Six month blues...

At about six months the anger sets in. The doubts start to gnaw at us from the inside...What if I just walked away...What if this turns out to be a false recovery....What if it happens again after all this work...What if???

It'll pass. At least it should. I found it necessary to refocus after about six months and to modify my thinking about a lot of things including what I thought recovery would look like.

Hang in there!

Mark

Thanks Mark,
The worry is that despite my best efforts and now the efforts of my W, she just cannot find the passion for me that was there a little over six months ago. I am running out of ideas and it is making my tired
She has ended the affair and has re-committed to our M, for that I am grateful but am i or is she prepared to live the rest of our lives as friends NO!!!

BigK. Have seen you are online. Your advice, 2x4 whatever as always would appreciated. I have been really down over the last couple of days as we just seem to have reached an impasse

No Brae, trust me, you do not want to hear from me right now. I'm protecting you from me.

Brae

I don't know if you ever had to diet in your life but I assume you know about dieting.

When you're on a diet you don't weigh yourself every day. Thats because a lot of things can affect your weight during any given day, and that can dishearten you when you ARE actually losing weight at a healthy sustainable pace. weighing ourself weekly is far healthier and shows the overall progress better than a lot of interim weighing assessments.

What you're doing brae is weighing your M every hour then sh1tting your pants if theres an ounce added or not an ounce lost.

Sat here in the Sunny midlands I can see how very far your marriage has come in a relatively short time. bear in mind your "false recovery" doesn't count.

You two relate, enjoy each other's company and have ceased all or most hostility. You may not consider that progress, but I do.

Regarding your need for "loving" feelings from your FWW, Brae, have you read up on Dr Harley's principle of the "love bank"? In summary a spouse avoids lovebusters ( which remove "love units" and meets the most important ENs of their spouse ( which deposits love units). Sounds a bit weird but its a good, and proven analogy and process.

Well brae I have to say that your very evident neediness is probably withdrawing love units from your FWWs lovebank as quickly as your efforts in meeting ENs is depositing them. Many folks have told you Brae that neediness is ALWAYS counterproductive in recovery yet you persist in letting your taker out for a melancholy walk every so often like you can't control it. Neediness is sickening to most women, and to recently wayward women it is particularly nauseating.

There is a non Harley book called " love must be tough" by James Dobson that you would benefit from reading. It certainly helped me. It demonstrates how you MUST lock up your taker and how neediness is a dreadful passion killer.

Really mate, you can protest that you're not needy in your interaction with your FWW but your every post is suffused with desperate, clingy neediness to be loved. Its "pathetic" in a "bedraggled kitten" way and I can pretty much guarantee that it is inhibiting your recovery.

MB is not instinctive, Brae, and you need to understand that your instinct is not your friend at this time. You can't help it because you FEEL needy and loveless, you say ? I don't care. Fake it till you make it. If you want to recover your marriage you will lock that up and live your life with a bit of affected swagger in it. A spring in your step. It makes FWS realise on a cellular level that they cannot assume you will always be their backstop ; it will allow love units to grow in your FWWs lovebank and as long as you stop "weighing yourself" every day, progress will be made.

If you can operate in loving Detachment, and lockup your needy taker for a while you give your recovery a chance to grow. If theres no improvement in your FWWs attitude after a wwhile spent doing the RIGHT things, then you need to consider if she is playing you- and still remaining in contact with OM.

Sorry to give you another kicking Brae, but ,mate you're aren't listening or applying what you're being told. Mb does work, but you have to apply all of it, even the uninstinctive bits.

It was an act of will for me to lock up my own taker, and to affect a bit of swagger in my walk, but i did so because it was best indicated for my marriage. PLEASE do the same Brae.