Still seeking - are you still there?

This is Lady_in_Red.

I'm about to try to go to talk to a priest this week. I've reached that point where I think it's finally possible to talk about our marriage, what has happened to it, to us, and where I need to go from here.

Tomorrow is our 18th anniversary and I'm feeling sad. It's hard to talk about this to anyone who hasn't gone through it. The last two years have been ******. But my kids seem to be doing OK, which for me, became the most important thing.

I just need to talk about it now, and try to find the right kind of help for myself, and try to come up with some kind of plan.

I tried to talk to my husband again on Saturday. I can't say that the response I got from him was positive. The answers he gave me were that no, he is not interested in undergoing anything resembling an analysis of what has happened to us. He does not want to engage in anything where there will be "blood on the floor". He does not have any feelings for me anymore. He does not want to discuss the past, or why he got married, or how he felt, or what he thought when he got married. That's history. He told me a few months ago that he would move out if he could, but he can't afford it. He seems to find it acceptable to sleep in the spare room and carry on his life here, giving the boys what resemblence of family life that he can without sleeping with their mother. He does his own laundry, eats meals with us, is generally cheerful.

He doesn't know that I told the boys he had an affair last year, because I'm too scared to tell him. The boys were good about it. They needed to know because it answered a lot of questions for them. My older son was amazingly mature about it. My younger son cried in my lap. My relationship with both of them has improved because there is finally honesty between us and they have reasons now for my behaviour. They are both protective of me and have become very affectionate, hugging me a lot. My older son is now 14, and taller than me now, really growing up. My younger son is 11. He is the one who is more confused. But he also has a lot of friends, one especially good friend who he shares a lot of experiences with, and I am close to that kid's mom. He has also confided in his school principal, who talked to me afterwards. He's had a lot of support from school so they are aware of our marital problems and have been quietly supportive. My older son's school is not aware of our problems because I have not wanted to jeopardize my husband's teaching work, which is within the community of private schools in our town. If I told my older son's school officially, the other people my husband works for might find out, and I haven't been ready for that to happen yet. But my older son is doing very well in his new school, receiving sensitive support from his new instrumental teacher. That teacher is aware of our marital problems, also I think my older son's English teacher knows, because he is a friend of someone I know who knows (we live in a small town - probably a lot more people know than I realize, come to think of it.) Anyway, what I have been trying to do is build my sons' support network for them....

I told my husband a few months ago that he accused me of not having a plan, but he was wrong. I do have a plan and that is that if we sleep apart for two years, then he can sue me for divorce without me having to sue him on the grounds of adultery or list his unreasonable behaviour, because I really don't want to harm him or damage his career. He came home from work that day, walked straight into the kitchen and pulled me into a big, long hug. I don't know what that meant...I think it meant he wants a divorce and he was thanking me for that. It also told me that if he felt like it, he could easily walk into the kitchen EVERY DAY and hug me, but he chooses not to....

I feel really sad right now, though....kinda having a hard time. But maybe I've passed a kind of milestone today. I prayed in church today at Mass and thanked God for every person in my life, for giving me a wonderful sister, and a wonderful mother, and for each of my beautiful friends, for the chance to know them all, and for my two magnificent boys. I also thanked God for my husband, because through him I've learned a lot of lessons about myself I needed to learn in life, and I can't say I'm sorry I have been given these beautiful children. I just thanked God for giving me so much, and for also letting me be betrayed, because now I can understand those who have been betrayed, and for letting me suffer, because now I can feel with those who have felt suffering. I know to some people that might sound corny, but it's taken me a long, long time to get to this point, because I really feel I didn't do anything to deserve being treated this way and I've been really angry about it for a long time. If I'm really honest, I am still angry, but I'm less angry than I was.

It's been a long time. I have a ways to go yet. I wondered if you were still here?

LIR

LIR,

I'm not SS but it is good to hear from you <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> but sad to hear about your current sitch. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

Ok, looks like you are ready to for a life changing decision. Need some support?

L.

Is your husband also Catholic?

Larry

It's so hard sometimes to know what to say.

I just got home from visiting MIL in the Hospital, and I don't have time to talk at length, but I'll get back to you.

God bless you and keep you safe.

Thanks Orchid, you are some of the best help there is. She can use your soft touch.

SS

Hello, Orchid. It's good to see your name...thank you for coming here. I think so. I've been handling the situation the way I thought was best for my boys, because of what happened to us at their school two years ago....it's a long story....but basically, my sons were both at a high-profile boarding school in our town because of their musical talent - the older one was a star performer, the younger one, I wanted him to have the same opportunity as his brother, and because of the turmoil at home in 2001-02 from my H's EA's (and abuse) I wanted him in a safe and secure environment. That turned into a nightmare for us, when they got new staff at their boarding house. I had concerns about the way all the children were being treated, and through no fault of mine, ended up in conflict with the new staff. This wasn't just me, the new staff had conflict with several other sets of parents, as well. The school management took the position that the new staff member was young and needed time to learn how to do his job and his mistakes should be forgiven. I did that, but things went from bad to worse, and I became extremely concerned about the welfare of my children, as did other parents. The night after I asked for the security of the boarding house to be reviewed, as I had found out someone had unauthorized access to the house, I received an anonymous e-mail threatening my reputation if the new staff decided to leave their post. Another parent went to Social Services and I supported them - 6 other sets of parents also supported this effort. The national newspapers got wind that something was up and a public scandal loomed. This never happened because the national newspaper decided not to run with the story...papers are afraid of being sued for libel, and no crimes were committed in this case. It was just bad management and a number of unhappy children and parents...

The short story is that I decided it was not safe to leave my kids there. They were desperately unhappy and I was, as a mom, deeply stressed-out. My kids were living away from home, but in a deeply damaging situation for them. After the Social Services investigation, SS revealed our identity to the school, and the new staff would have been able to target our children for bullying, so I decided I had to take them out. The new staff kept their job, but were formally cautioned, and the school had to agree to a further government inspection within a year, had to make significant improvements in the procedural running of the care of the children. The inspection report which followed a year later was good in most respects. The school had made many improvements it was supposed to make. But the report flagged up a significant failing in the care of the children which it said "must be addressed" and that was discipline within the boarding house. Reading between the lines, this is a direct criticism of the "new staff". I felt vindicated when I read that report. Sad for the children still there, but vindicated about having taken the steps I did. My head rested on the pillow peaceful that night, knowing I had done the right thing for all those kids. I hadn't set out to get rid of the new staff, but to hold the school accountable for how they treat the children. The "new staff", who have been in post now for 3 years, are now moving on to a new job as head of department in a local junior school. I may still have to have professional association with this person as I work in the senior school attached to that school. I have a lot of support from my boss who supported me throughout that whole ordeal. But this is a small town, and a high-profile town. I can't talk about this in any more detail. It's over and done with now anyway and not relevant to my sitch. It's background for what happened to my family. But it explains why I have endured what a lot of people wouldn't have endured.

This was a massive and stressful experience. When we brought our kids back home, they needed stability. I had thought for several months that something was up with my H - he did all the distant stuff he'd done before when he was involved in an EA. I found something on the computer a few days after we came back from our summer holiday proving his involvement in another EA. I flipped. I just felt so betrayed. I was worn out, had gone through this incredible battle, during which I had had to publicly defend HIS behaviour, and I had been torn apart by the school, and he was having another EA behind my back! I flipped because he betrayed me while we were trying to protect our children. To me that was the ultimate betrayal. I kicked him out of our bedroom, tried to get him to go to counselling, but...nothing. He was a true WS this time. He indulged in his long-distance affair for at least 9 months. He admitted it in June of last year. I think its over now. But we are at total stalemate. I didn't give him a "roadmap" back, maybe I should have, but I couldn't. We are living in the same house but in separate bedrooms. Under normal circumstances, plan B was what I should have done, but I thought that would destroy the children. After what they'd been through, they needed dad at home. So I've endured this compromise. I'm still not 100% sure splitting up would be the right thing to do, even though I'm 99% sure my H is a lost cause and I sure don't feel any attraction for him anymore. I love him, I'm just not "in love" with him. I know that's long, but I felt I needed to fill in the gaps for you.

Yes, Larry, my H is Catholic. And very Catholic. His whole life is about being Catholic. His behaviour towards me and his attitude towards our marriage are totally at odds with what he says he believes. His career is also within the Church.

My H has resisted all efforts to put our relationship under scrutiny. It's clear to me he will avoid pain at all cost, no matter how much pain that causes me, his kids or himself. He has serious, serious personal problems. He's trying to cope as best he can, and be a good dad as best he can. He's totally lost. I am not sure he can be helped. I still have compassion for him.

Hi still seeking. Thank you for being there. I'm sorry about your MIL. I hope she is better soon. You don't have to say anything. I just needed to make contact with someone before I go seek help here. Thanks for being there. Being able to make contact here will help me find the strength to go talk to someone here.

You don't have to say anything. I just needed to make contact with someone before I go seek help here. Thanks for being there. Being able to make contact here will help me find the strength to go talk to someone here.

I know I don't have to say anything, but I nearly always do (as you would already know.) <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Time is always tough these days, but I promise I'll get to it soon.

How are you these days?
I would really like to know.

Not just your marriage, and your children, though these are very important.

You had/have other goals for yourself. How are you coming?

How is your faith?

Are you getting help when you pray? Do you know there is someone there, on the other end?

Would you be able to live on your own these days?

I can think of lots more questions, but need to go for now.

BTW, MIL had surgery on her foot to correct a bone problem. It is not serious, and she is doing well. We were doing a routine visit.

SS

LIR

(Just previewed my post - gotta get those quotes sorted out, but looks kinda pretty on the page)

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/pfft.gif" alt="" />

W just called to me and said "I'm going to bed."

That means I am going also.

Ah - so much to say............... so little free time.

Once, a long time ago............ we had a discussion about the refiners fire. Perhaps you remember it.

Humor me a little bit.
From Malachi.
Can you recall who it is that is to be purified?

It does look pretty on the page - and thanks for the information.

One last question before I go.

Do you realize how much God loves you, and how much he desires your happiness? Would it help if you were to recall that dream............ from so long ago?

SS

Good for you! I think this was the final undoing of our marriage. When H started to compose, he started staying up late alone, and I would go to bed without saying goodnight, so as not to disturb his concentration. He would come to bed quite late. At the time, he was falling in love with OW1. I didn't realize it was so serious and thought I was giving him the space he needed to compose. I think he thought I didn't care about him - anyway, I let him slip away, and once he was gone, he was gone. Before that, he always wanted me to come to bed when he went to bed, because he couldn't sleep if I stayed up....


I remember it. I think it was me who was supposed to be purified....refining out all the hard bits....I've been thinking about this a lot lately...when I started to pray on Sunday, thanking God for giving me my H, I thanked him because it is through my R with my H that I have learned a lot about myself that I needed to know, both the good and the bad....I'm not saying I am any more "good" than I was 20 years ago, and I'm not sure that I wouldn't make the same mistakes all over again, but there are some very important lessons I have learned and I think I do try harder to adhere to how I believe I should behave instead of giving in to my own anger and self-righteousness...Harley, I think is the best straight-talking teacher on this score...all the stuff about LB's - angry outbursts, disrespectful judgements, selfish demands...you can do all these things in the spirit of self-righteous anger and be the wronged party, but they are still LB's and they are still uncharitable ways to react...I've had to try to clean up my act and change my behaviour. I'm pretty sure that my despair comes from the fact that none of my work on myself seems to have had any impact on how my H feels about me or how he chooses to behave himself.

Even though right now I feel like our marriage could have been a big mistake, I also thanked God for letting me make that commitment 18 years ago, because He allowed me to see that it was a commitment I could make....

I am not going to say I have no regrets. I have a lot of regrets and I am trying to learn to live with that....ultimately, deep down inside me, although I know my H is entirely responsible for his own behaviour and his own bad choices, I blame myself - because I did break off our first engagement, forseeing the whole scenario that is now happening...with older OW always on the scene, and with H not being able to be faithful...what I didn't forsee was the depth of my H's violent reactions and emotional aloofness...still, there was enough there that I should have listened to my intuition...so I feel responsible for bringing these children into the world and for their fate...I think the deeper truth is probably that I loved my H not despite the fact that he was bad, but BECAUSE he was bad. I found it exciting and wanted to be the ONE he would stop being bad for....lots of women are attracted to the "bad boy" - that is part of the refiner's fire - to be honest and admit that about myself.

I spoke to my Dad about this on Sunday and he told me that while that may be true, and that while I knew he could be "bad", I didn't have any way of knowing the depth to which that would go...so in that I have to forgive myself...

Did you see the movie "Volver" with Penelope Cruz? It's in Spanish....beautiful movie. You should watch it, if you haven't and try to get all the way to the end. I watched it a few weeks ago and I really think it is the first movie I have seen where I could say the director REALLY understands women - how they think, how they feel. Everything about that movie expresses the strength and beauty of women...and how they blame themselves for the bad things that happen to them, for the bad things that men do to them. THAT is where he really understands women. He understands that they DO blame themselves, and why they do...because they blame themselves for not following their intuition, for NOT KNOWING what they should have been emotionally alert towards...he also shows how great their dedication is to each other and to what lengths they will go to protect and help each other...its a beautiful movie.


I don't think I do realize how much God loves me, except that I dimly and stupidly understand that He gave His only Son so that we could be reconciled to Him and as proof of His love for us. I don't know what happiness would really look like for me. I don't remember the dream you are talking about...I remember that I had a dream, but I don't remember what it was.

I'm going to go to bed now. I always write too much anyway, so you will probably be relieved that this is short! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/crazy.gif" alt="" />

I feel completely exhausted today - my boss is really ill and I'm worried about her. We went up and running with a new computer system on Monday and it is not going well, and she is ill, had to go to A&E on Sunday night - so my colleagues and I are trying to cope without her...its very stressful. I came home today and went straight to bed, feeling like I was going to collapse. I asked my H if he could make dinner and he was very good about it. My son brought me dinner in bed, so I have had about six hours to just lie there getting my strength back. I'm now going to go to bed and try to get a good night's sleep.

Because of the situation at work, I haven't been able to call and make an appt with the priest...that's what I need to do...that's my first step...because there are theological issues I have to sort out with him about our marriage and about the issues of repentance and forgiveness....

Then I think I need to find a different kind of counselor and start trying to deal with putting myself back together inside, regaining my confidence and trying to learn some the skills that I am lacking in...one of the doctors in my new surgery is a licensed psychotherapist. I might approach him, but I wanted to get my physical symptoms diagnosed first, because I didn't want them to think that the physical pains I have been experiencing are psychosomatic, or that I am attention-seeking.

The other place I thought about going to try to get counselling was the women's shelter, where I might be able to find counselling with someone who understands the experiences of women who have experienced abuse...I expect they are very busy and probably have a lot more women who are in much worse shape than me...I don't know if they would have any room on their schedules.

And my last thought is that it is possible that my H has something organically wrong with him - like maybe he has Asperger's Syndrome, or some kind of autism...I have read some of the Aspergers website forums, and some of the things the partners of people with AS have written sound like they could have been written by me - the explosive anger experienced in response to my emotional needs when I am experiencing my own negative emotions. My H doesn't really (as far as I can tell, I could be wrong) fit the picture of the controlling abusive man - for example, he is not jealous and he doesn't try to control my movements. His explosions, which have been few, but frightening to me, have been when I have needed HIM - I read that AS people react very negatively to others' negative emotions because they feel overwhelmed by them. They handle their own negative emotions alone and feel that you should, too. So when you have negative emotions - like stress at work that you need to talk through, or grief, or tiredness - and you try to talk to them, like you would in a normal relationship, they feel you are dumping on them and get mad at you. Now that describes my H to a T. He is not interested in how I feel, and although he sometimes tries to understand, he can only take so much...if I push him, and I have, he reacts very badly. If he had AS, that might explain a lot. But I doubt that he would submit to any tests. He's too frightened of finding out anything about himself. That's one possible take on the sitch.

Anyway...just some thoughts..and those are the things that I have thought up about trying to seek help for myself that I felt like I needed to seek support with...I'm afraid.

Good night. Thank you so much for being there. When I said it was short, I spoke too soon! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

LIR

Speaking of the refiners fire -
I remember it. I think it was me who was supposed to be purified....refining out all the hard bits....I've been thinking about this a lot lately...when I started to pray on Sunday, thanking God for giving me my H, I thanked him because it is through my R with my H that I have learned a lot about myself that I needed to know, both the good and the bad....

Those who love God, and seek him with all their hearts will be purified, and refined.

re·fine (r¹-fºn“) v. re·fined, re·fin·ing, re·fines. --tr. 1. To reduce to a pure state; purify. 2. To remove by purifying. 3. To free from coarse, unsuitable, or immoral characteristics: refined his manners; refined her speaking style. --intr. 1. To become free of impurities. 2. To acquire polish or elegance.

We often react poorly (emotionally) to the heat it takes to refine us. Sometimes we think we won't make it, that we will burn up along with the rest of the impurities.

When I asked about a dream from long ago, this was what I was referring to -
From March of 2004
Are you a Christian? When I was 16 I had a dream - I was running around inside my house, crying out for help (you got an idea what kind of life we were leading then) - my brother said to me, stop, don't you hear the knocking on the door? I stopped and yes, there was someone knocking on the door. I opened the door, and there was a huge STOP sign outside. I stopped, it disappeared and then, before me stood the most beautiful sight I have ever seen before or since - a King stood outside my door, in all his glory. He looked like the King in a chess game - that shape, very tall and looking down at me - this radiant otherworldly being standing there - in MY world, on my doorstep. He seemed to be wearing a long cloak that reached the ground - so he had this chesspiece King shape - not a shape like a human body. There was nothing "human" about him but his eyes, which were dark and so full of love for me I couldn't believe it, but felt in love just gazing at them - and why was he so beautiful? Because he was made up of jewels - living jewels of every colour of our universe, known and unknown - tiny, moving specks of living radiant light that crawled all over his robe in a kaleidescope of psychedelic colour - I was mezmerized, because I KNEW these jewels WERE his body and that they were alive! And on his head he wore a crown of fire-jewels that leaped up and down all around his head like living flames. I asked him if he had come to help me and his eyes just told me how much he loved me. I stepped outside my house.

That "vision" has stayed with me all my life, Pep - I was not a Christian and knew nothing about the Holy Spirit and had never heard of Pentecost. It was years before I sat in a Christian church and heard the gospel story of Pentecost. I called him my Fairy King and carried him around in my heart. Now I know who He was, and I'm sharing him with you because in my heart I wonder who those jewels on his robe were - in our Church, we refer to ourselves as "the body of Christ" - all believers are "the body of Christ" - maybe when we die, we become one of those jewels that I saw......

He lets us be tried, and tested, and refined, that we might become one of his jewels.
I believe the word for diamonds is "Flawless."

I agree with you that Harley is the best straight talker on LB's, and assorted baggage. I always wanted to be better, but I didn't understand what was going on. Reading Harley helped me understand, and change.

I'm not saying I am any more "good" than I was 20 years ago, and I'm not sure that I wouldn't make the same mistakes all over again, but there are some very important lessons I have learned and I think I do try harder to adhere to how I believe I should behave instead of giving in to my own anger and self-righteousness...

You are not flawless yet? (SS smiles)
I suspect not, but God's grace is sufficient in the end for those who seek his face. If you continue in service to him, and to others, he will seal you his, and you will not be lost. You will find what it is that you want most.

I've had to try to clean up my act and change my behavior. I'm pretty sure that my despair comes from the fact that none of my work on myself seems to have had any impact on how my H feels about me or how he chooses to behave himself.

Remember in another time one who said "Come, follow me."
He gave all he had - and for those who follow him, it is more than enough. Some accepted his gift, but others rejected it, and hated him, and sought his life. Are we greater than he, that our lives should be easy? Our path smooth?

The fire must be hot enough to do it's work. It is after all, the refiners fire.

I realize you understand, I hope you don't mind a review. I am NOT preaching.
In my office, there is a copy of a painting of Christ walking with two of his disciple. He teaches, they listen, and discuss. I imagine we are walking along that same road. We converse, we learn from each other. In mind it is a good conversation. We are edified - God's spirit is there, and we learn from him, and our faith is strengthened.

I think someday we will be free of time, but for now it must be taken into consideration.
Soon, I'll break this off, and leave for all or part of the evening. - and leave a
"too be continued" on the end of it.

I am not going to say I have no regrets. I have a lot of regrets and I am trying to learn to live with that....ultimately, deep down inside me, although I know my H is entirely responsible for his own behavior and his own bad choices, I blame myself - because I did break off our first engagement, forseeing the whole scenario that is now happening...with older OW always on the scene, and with H not being able to be faithful...what I didn't forsee was the depth of my H's violent reactions and emotional aloofness...still, there was enough there that I should have listened to my intuition...so I feel responsible for bringing these children into the world and for their fate...I think the deeper truth is probably that I loved my H not despite the fact that he was bad, but BECAUSE he was bad. I found it exciting and wanted to be the ONE he would stop being bad for....lots of women are attracted to the "bad boy" - that is part of the refiner's fire - to be honest and admit that about myself.

I think all of us regret some parts of our lives. For sure we all fall short of what we could have been. Isn't that what Grace is all about?

I spoke to my Dad about this on Sunday and he told me that while that may be true, and that while I knew he could be "bad", I didn't have any way of knowing the depth to which that would go...so in that I have to forgive myself...

We do have to forgive our selves. It's not always easy though. How are you doing on that one?
When you pray, do you ask for help with it?

I'll be gone the next three days. Hope to finish this before I leave tomorrow.

Faith is kind of like a moonbeam. Sometimes it is hard to hold on to. When you pray after you read this, will you ask him this -
Will you ask "Father, are you there?"
I promise you can know that he is. I promise.

SS

PS, I quoted your dream without your knowledge or permission. If you wish it removed, please let me know.

Later edit -

Were I to be home the rest of this week, I might just do short posts, and ask you a lot more questions. Since I will be away (at a church sponsored youth conference) maybe I'll just talk for a while. I hope you don't mind.

I sincerely hope you find out why you have the pain in your side, and that it can be repaired, and your suffering eased. It takes a lot out of us when we have to endure that from day to day without rest. Especially it takes a lot out of us when we are not getting help from our partner to deal with it.

It was so good to hear you were working on your MA. I have considered going back myself, but right now it is not near the top of the list of what I want to accomplish.

I am glad you are on good terms with your father. Or it sounds as if you are. I admit that relationship worried me a great deal - based on what you reported shortly after your mother passed away. Are things a lot better, or do you just talk to him because he is willing to talk?

Hmmm, questions seem to always creep in. (SS smiles)

I'm going to go to bed now. I always write too much anyway, so you will probably be relieved that this is short!

It wasn't me that said you write too much. I always thought it was good for you to type out your thoughts. I still do. I think you agree with me too. (another smile.)

Sorry your boss is ill. We got our new computer system up just about a year ago. It was NOT FUN. Glad she supports you so well, and helps you. Glad you do the same for her. Really - isn't that what it is all about?

BTW, I Have not seen "Volver".
I thought about that for a while.
It makes sense that most directors don't understand women. I think MOST women don't understand women, and I know for sure than most men don't.

I do think many women need to trust them selves more. Are you one of those? It seems like you are getting there. Just an observation. That's what believe I see.

One of my cars has a flashlight under the seat. Er - I mean a torch. On a cold winter night, I needed it, and got it out and pressed the switch, but all I got was a feeble glow. It seems I had neglected to take care of it, and keep the batteries fresh. It's difficult to change a tyre in the rain, in the dark, and it took a long time.

Sometimes that same thing can happen to us. Often we look outward at all that we face, and neglect to charge our spiritual batteries. The savior told a story of the five foolish virgins who took no oil with them while they waited for the bridegroom. When the time came for the wedding feast, they were without oil, and their lamps were useless.

This parable also talks of 5 wise virgins, who kept their lamps always filled, and when the time came, they were ready.

I wish for you to be among the wise - I wish for you to take care of yourself.

This world we live in will hardly slow down and wait for us to prepare AS MUCH AS WE WOULD LIKE TO PREPARE.

However, we must take time to put oil in our lamps, or charge our batteries. You are often turned outward. Your concern is for your children, your boss, your job, and your H........... so many things take your time, and your energy, and your strength.

Please take the time for yourself that is needed. Time to read the scriptures. Time to think. Time to pray, time to rest. I know you will never get enough of any of these, but please take more than you are getting. Take time (as you already have, and as you have related above) to reflect upon your blessings. An hour to think on your relationship to God can be some of the best time you ever spend. Scripture study has enormous benefits.
There are two parts that make up who we are. The physical needs rest, and repair, or we soon are unable to function. The spiritual side is just as important.

I pray tonight that you will be able to recharge your spiritual batteries and so be better able to help those who need your help. That warm feeling that comes when the spirit of God is with us will be a help and strength to you in all that you do.

I believe you will be OK.
I hope God sends a sweet assurance that indeed you will.

SS

I do remember my dream. I am happy that you also remembered it - so it has stayed with you, too...that makes me happy. It's him who keeps me going, or maybe I should say, He is there even when I forget that He is there.


SS - you are NOT preaching - you are sharing. Thank you for sharing....



Since last week, I have been just thanking God for everything. This week has been exceptionally tiring, which is why I haven't come back to answer you. Our new computer system at work is not working out, and my boss has been really ill. So it has been up to me and my colleague to assess the new system and together we have come to the definite conclusion that we should not go any further with this new system. Mid-week, I was exhausted and could hardly put one foot in front of the other, came home and went straight to bed. H and the boys took good care of me...I give my H credit for that. But I have been thanking God for everything....trudging along to work, feeling exhausted and tense, I still thanked Him, and you know what? My stress lifted....I felt calmer, lighter, and less tired. I think that is God answering me.


I am on better terms with my father and stepmother now. My father calls me every Sunday night to check on me. Yes, there were a lot of bad feelings after my mom's funeral, but life is short and he doesn't have a lot of time left. He is kind and caring, even though he's got his own issues. My dad has chosen to start drinking again. I get to talk to him early in his day, so he's almost always sober when I talk to him. My sister gets to talk to him in the evening when he's had a bit to drink, and he can be more difficult then. She and I have come to accept him the way he is. Recently he upset his mother-in-law by tangoing in the nude down her hallway on the way to the bathroom. I figure there are worse things in life than having a dad like him.


That's OK with me...I doubt anyone can track me down from that, although anyone who knew me who really did read it would know. But that's OK with me, I don't mind.

I do feel a lot better the past few days. I got some rest this weekend. My tutor called me at work on Friday and I told her about the computer problems at work. She was a big help and we came up with a plan to put my studies on "temporary hold" - this does not mean I stop working on my MA, it means I don't have to meet the 10 July deadline. Because I know with the problems at work, I am not going to make my course deadline, but as soon as the pressure at work is off, I will make big progress in my coursework. So I feel markedly better now that I have a revised timetable for my work. I try to handle too much stuff at once. I was feeling stressed about having to give up my vegetable plot, too, which I planned to give up in October because it is lying fallow this year because of my health and work pressures. So I feel I might be able to consider not giving it up, and I can get the boys help to clear it this summer...then take better care of it next year. My vegetable plot is one of the things that gives me real peace, so I don't want to give it up, but it's not neighborly to let it go to weeds either...its my responsiblity to keep it clear...

My H also gave me an anniversary card which made me smile. We are no closer to reconciling, but I was glad he remembered. He has also got the loan of a house from a friend, during the summer, a really big house..and has suggested that we go there for a holiday, to get away, all of us....so I have agreed. It's the first time in our marriage that he has done this, which is what I always wanted...time together as a family, not visiting his friends, or older woman and her family, or his parents...just us. We'll see....

I haven't made an appt to see the priest I want to see yet, but strangely enough, my best friend, who is struggling with her own faith, went to see a priest this week, and talked to me about it, so that has encouraged me even more....maybe I am loosening up a little bit...-)

I've got to get some sleep now - have an important meeting tomorrow....but wanted to get back to you and thank you....

I'll be back!

LIR

Glad he gave you a card. This is puzzling to me.
Is he usually thoughtful, and not doing a card would be odd for him, or is it odd that he did give a card?

The vacation sounds really nice too. They say (BTW, who is "they?) say that a change is as good as a rest. I hope it is restful for you.

How did the important meeting go? How is your boss doing?

I plan on doing more comments on the material already given....... we'll see if I can actually pull it off.

SS

I'm bumping your thread up instead of confusing the other one.

Actually, I don't think it is wrong to stay with someone for the children's sake, or other practical reasons.

I'm divorced now because my husband never got rid of the OW, but I could have seen staying married.

I think I had my midlife crisis several years before he cheated. I looked at my life with him and was disatisfied. But over months, I decided to make as good a life as possible WITH him. When looking at our family (blended), there was just too much to lose.

Hi believer -

I just posted a reply to JL on stonecold's thread - I don't want to hijack her thread, but I replied there because I thought she might like to see what I had to say...

I think the sitch with my H is that he is a serial cheater - he had one PA, but several EAs before that - after coming to MB in 2002, I learned a lot, and I don't see any of the signs that he is willing to change...I always figured he would have a PA...also his affairs don't last. I can understand why you would leave your H, if he refused to give up the OW - I think I would, too - but I figured H's affair would run out of steam, which I'm pretty sure it did. The thing is, he won't do the work on himself to ensure that he won't have another one. He has affairs because they are easy - because he is brilliant as a musician, attention comes his way, and probably because he is a performer, admiration is his no. 1 EN.

I am looking at my life with H, even though it is unsatisfactory - there IS a lot to lose here, and it's my kids who would potentially pay the biggest price. They are, at the moment, happier for us to stay married, even though it is not perfect.

If H refrains from being abusive, then it is better at the moment for them and me to stick with it. My kids talk to me. JL says this is talking behind his back. What if my H is autistic? That's a big possibility. Is it not fair for my kids to come and ask me questions because they trust me? I have to be very careful not to turn them against their father, but also to teach them responsible, compassionate behaviour. My kids are intelligent and in a lot of ways, more emotionally intelligent and mature than my H - sometimes, OS retreats upstairs to my room and says "Daddy's being weird again..." - I talk it through with him. I always ask him to be respectful when talking to his Dad. This approach yields huge benefits. Very often, after talking it through with me, they go back to Dad and do what it was he asked them to do without fuss, anger or resistance. H has a lot of issues, but he is trying to be a good Dad, and most of what he asks of them is legitimate, it's just that he can get very domineering when he feels he has to be in charge. But if we were to separate, they would be denied all the good benefits they get from having their Dad in the same house with them, and he does have a lot to give. On a site like this, you tend to focus on the negatives, but my H has a lot of positive qualities, too.

So its a tough call. Maybe I am in my midlife crisis now - I just turned 50 (arrrgh!) and I appear to be in menopause - yikes! - everything just quit with no warning last Sept.



<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/blush.gif" alt="" />

The card was puzzling to me, too - it was a little man with question marks over his head - said "where do we go from here?" - open it up and it said "to the Kings Head, the Rose and Crown or the White Horse?" (pub names). Cute card. It made me laugh. I put my arm around his shoulders and thanked him for it, said it made me laugh - he looked sad and sheepish and said "that was the idea". I gave him a card back - a pretty one - I said to answer the first question, I don't know, but are you looking for a map? And that if he wanted to go out, I'd love to.

I did go out with H a few weeks ago - to a concert we were given tickets to - it was the first time we have been out together in years alone, without the boys - we had a lovely time, saw a lot of our friends....got home, and he immediately ripped into me for something, I don't even remember what. H doesn't build on the good times we have. In fact, every time we have a good time, a bad time follows hard on its heels. It's like, he nips intimacy in the bud before it can take root. I am amazed we even managed to get married. But we must have had the right intentions when we started....

The important meeting went well - my boss was convinced to not continue with the new computer system....success for me and my colleague...

My boss is doing much better - now I am sick - I think I just got run down - a nasty virus, but I'm on the mend now...will be back at work tomorrow....

I am looking forward to the vacation....I can't help but wonder what H is thinking....I could decide not to go, but he seems to want me to go, so I have decided to go....I am just going to take things as they come and try to have a nice family time....

I've made a couple of posts here, which have helped me think through things a little. I'm still where I was before, but it has encouraged me to try to go talk to a priest, like I said before.

Hope you are well....

Just to say that I called and made contact with the priest this morning. He is willing to talk to me, but won't be able to until the end of September. I don't think anything is going to change dramatically with my H between now and then, so I told him I am willing to wait rather than see another priest. I want to talk to this particular priest because he is from my home state and will have some idea of my personal cultural background, also he has a theologically "well-stocked mind" - my boys actually go to Mass in the hopes that they will hear one of his sermons - he communicates well and knows his stuff - he is approachable.

I told him I need to talk through some theological issues that I am struggling with in my marriage - I gave him some background, so he is aware of the kind of issues I'm dealing with. I also said I would look into getting counselling from another source, to start dealing with my emotional issues.

So I've made a start.

Good job. He must be very popular, or busy. The end of September seems a long time to wait. But if you continue working on yourself, and making a nice life, it will be okay.

Thanks believer -

He is going abroad for three months and will be back at the end of Sept.

I regard our marital problems as chronic - chronic dysfunctional with no expectation of change or dramatic upheaval - so I feel I would rather wait and talk to the (hopefully) the right guy....

In the meantime, I need to make a start on getting some IC for myself - again, I think that has to be with someone who is familiar with abuse, infidelity and personality disorders...a tall order...the UK is not well-equipped with psychologists - it's a glaring need in the countrys medical service sector. I don't want to talk to a "counselor in training" - someone who's gone on a 12-week counselling course...or someone who is a student...and the customary way of providing counselling here is to put you on a waiting list and then you get 6-8 sessions - it's crisis management, that's all. I have a friend who was suicidal and "sectioned" twice - locked up for a month - she went on the waiting list for psychotherapy....after 6 months (home on heavy meds) they called to find out what the delay was, were told her notes had been lost, so she had to go to the back of the queue - she didn't get psychotherapy until a year after her first suicide attempt...I mean, that's pretty bad...she's doing very well now...miraculously has made a full recovery, but would have had a much better time of it if she'd had the treatment she needed when she needed it....I think if the mental health services here were better, I would have found the right kind of help long ago. I'm sure there are a lot of other people in my situation.

That's one of the difficulties posting here for someone who lives in the UK. The expectations in the US are different...the UK is a completely different culture (REALLY!), with different provision, different attitudes, different approaches....the personal advice on MB is always good...human beings are amazingly universal in feelings and behaviour, but access to help can be completely different...

Thank you for keeping an eye on me. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

These greetings are always hard for me to type.

I wish to communicate enthusiasm, hope, love, peace and happiness. If we met in person - I would give you a hug, hold both your hands and look in to your eyes as I asked "how are you?" I would wait for an answer with a big smile - communicating care, but also joy. I would wait too........ until you told me how you really were.

This is kind of off topic, but sometimes it feels like you just need to talk to someone. We tend to avoid talking to our close friends about very personal things. (At least it seems like that to me.)

I am so glad Believer is here. (Hi Believer - SS waves)
She cares, and you can tell.

When I used to post to you, I would read what you wrote, think for a couple of days, read again, then post. (This is being typed with a big grin on my face.) I hate to post without a lot of thought - but I don't have that kind of time this month. We did our family vacation the first week, church youth conference the 2nd week, and we try to get a little work done in between. My W and I leave early Friday morning to go on a cruise. First cruise for me - the inside passage from Seattle to Alaska. We will be celebrating our 30th wedding anniversary. Church responsibilities take most of my "spare" time these days. My title is Bishop, but I think my duties are more like those of your priest. These duties get worked in around family things, and my employment. I suppose I am telling you this because my posts are not what I would like them to be, and I don't want you to think I don't care.

So.......... forgive me if I miss things, and don't give as much background as I might wish.

When I encouraged you to put oil in your lamp, I wasn't trying to say you had been foolish. I do think you need to garden, (or whatever works best for you) so that you have time to recharge your emotional batteries. I used to have ulcers, and nearly died from internal bleeding. My Doctor told me I could either die, or find a way to deal with it. I have learned to take time each day to think, and relax, and it has made all the difference.

We often think of God as this entity who loves mankind, and helps in an all encompassing way, but doesn't work with mankind one on one. I hope you feel his help personally - I know he does help one on one.

Think of this -
God knows everything.
We walk down the street, and we see only a little of what goes on around us. We see trees, grass, flowers, and buildings. We see the sun, feel the wind and smell whatever is on the breeze.

God sees the trees also, but he knows which trees have nests. He knows which nests have eggs, and baby birds. He is aware of the sun, but he can see the atomic processes take place - overall, or atom, by atom. We see the grass, but he knows where each ant is, and what it is carrying, and how that helps the ant colony.

The scripture says (from Matthew chapter 10)
29 Are not two sparrows sold for a farthing? and one of them shall not fall on the ground without your Father.
30 But the very hairs of your head are all numbered.
31 Fear ye not therefore, ye are of more value than many sparrows.

God knows you personally. If he were to visit you, he would call you by name. He knows which desk you sat in in third grade. He knows your teachers names, and he could tell you all your test scores from your spelling tests. He knows everything about you - and this is the good part.

He only uses the information he has on you to help - never to harm. Keep in mind he knows what is best for you, and he is never wrong.

I don't know what your theological questions are......... But I do know he wants you to have the answers you seek.

Now, having said all that............ What's for dinner tonight?
(Can you tell I'm a guy? )

I hope you laugh often. I think I know you well enough to know you will do well in the long run. The devil is in the details though, isn't it.

Would you like to talk more about the details?

SS

I just found and caught up with your thread this morning. Hadn't known friend4life was you.

So good to see you here again, LIR....sorry things haven't improved with your marriage.

SS,
Thanks, SS, for your edifying posts. (are you a pastor? if you don't mind answering: what denomination are you?)