WOF5,

I'm so glad you are back. You have been a great encouragement to me.

Honestly, I don't have a clue what the truth is. The stories have changed three different times.

#1-- in April--three different women that were not emotional involvements, but physical ones (obviously to protect his present affair)

#2--in June after I intercepted her text--it was her in all three affairs and he is currently involved; has always been her; and he loves her and not me (later he said he made it sound so bad because he was angry and wanted me to kick him out)

#3--in July when he wanted to come home--he was emotionally involved for a month 13 years ago and for a couple weeks 6 years ago and both times decided it wasn't what he wanted; and now since January, and this spring it became a physical involvement (he said he didn't even REMEMBER what he told me in above #2)

So, what's a woman to do with such a liar?! Do I go eenie meenie miney moe? Should I pick my favorite story? Should I just chuck it all and give up? He doesn't even realize that at this point, the truth doesn't even matter, but his TELLING ME THE TRUTH DOES. Do you know what I mean. I have already had the whammy of I've not loved you for years and it's always been her, so if that ain't the truth, nothing could hurt more than that did.

Just returned from the soccer field. Husband showed up (I was expecting that he would). He pulled out his chair and sat right down with us, just like he belonged there.

I was pleasant, not extemely friendly like making a bunch of conversation, but not at all hostile. That's about all I can muster today. I will see him again tomorrow at our other son's soccer game.

If nothing else, he will continue to see a put-together woman that is NOT falling apart, but intends to survive just fine.

mamabear - The truth is that he wants both of you and will say and do practically anything if it will keep both of you stringing along.

If you look at it from that angle, it will make a lot more sense.

He is NOT trying to "choose".

He wants to have two women in his life - a wife AND a girlfriend.

Many, many WS do this.

Yours is no different.

Just don't fall for that "I don't know what I want" crapola.

Please.
Mulan

He is.

Oh, I don't hear that at all. He appears to know exactly what he wants. He wants a divorce, no wait; he wants a "quick dissolution". He is "exhausted and done". Exhausted from what? I don't know. It sure ain't from working on our marriage. More likely, exhausted from trying to keep up with the lies and the facade.

Yeah, I know. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" />

SMB,

Very few of us come to MB with a plan that’s working.

That’s why you learn the plan and work it.

It has a high degree of success considering the alternatives.

And as a bonus, you get to learn about how people behave in relationships like you never likely understood before.

Stay strong, work on yourself, work the plan, and things will get better no matter what the outcome of your M is.

SMB

You want the truth from him? Ain't gonna happen. That is like asking a drunk how many fingers you are holding up. The truth is a variable for him at his stage of (im)maturity. Its like the teenage female asking the teenage male if he really loves her. Yea, right. . .

He is making it up as he floats along in the fog.

Larry

Hi Larry,

Thanks for responding.

No, I don't expect the truth from him right now. And if he gave it to me, I wouldn't believe it. I may already know the truth, but am not sure which story it is.

I was responding to WOF5's quote below where she says "isn't it true".



The only truth I know is that I have no idea what the truth is. I can't base any of my decisions on "the truth" about the affair or my husband. I don't even know if the man I have loved all these years was the "truth"--the real man. So it is even hard for me to say, "yeah, he's worth fighting for." So even my Plan B at this point will have nothing to do with the marriage. It will truly be about protecting myself from his manipulation and control.

Plan B is about preservation of his account in your Love Bank AND protecting yourself...

His account in your Love Bank, however, has been overdrawn for some time now. But as your plan B (protecting you) unfolds and the truth reveals itself, IF the man you thought you knew all these years returns, you could have deposits into that overdrawn account begin to change your mind.

Actually, not only does Plan B protect you from his control and manipulation, but as others have said, it also protects YOU from YOURSELF due to your despair and devastation. It also protects your children from your making a wrong decision at the wrong time based on changing data.

Keep posting, SMB. You can do this.

Ace

I was sitting on my swing in my backyard this morning reading MB, when some strange man comes in my yard. He asks for H and says he is there to measure for spouting. I say H doesn't live here anymore. He says he spoke with H yesterday, and he was going to meet with him this morning. I say go ahead and take whatever measurements you need.

H shows up a few minutes later. They talk outside for a while and kids run out to see daddy. H comes in and goes to garage for a minute (don't know what for). Then gives kids hugs and says bye. As he is walking out the door, he says "Bye, D" (my nickname that only he and my dad call me). The last few weeks he lived here, he didn't even say bye to me when he left.

Now I do NOT consider this a sign of anything in any way. But for a BRIEF moment he sounded like my H and not WS. His tone when he said D is what I recognized. He has been calling me by my full name whenever he needed to speak to me. But for the last 20 years, he has called me hon, dear, or D. Perhaps it was just a reminder for me that somewhere in there my H still resides.

I am happy that it appears he may have new spouting put on. But I would have liked to know that a strange my would be in my yard at 7:20 a.m.

So, I will continue to be at least pleasant, and maybe even be able to muster a little more for Plan A for a few more weeks.

Thank you ALL for posting to me. I will try to post often through these next few weeks to help me get through the last of Plan A.

WTG SMB!!

You have plenty of time to make monster decisions. It's best when you make them with a sound, rational mind.

A little Plan A, then a dark Plan B.

It leaves all of your options open.

It is going to be hard to Plan A through this one.

13 year old daughter is not talking to her father. She has said she doesn't want to go to his place at all. I have told her that I won't make her go, but that at some point, after she gets through some of her hurt and anger, she will want to spend time with him.

Well, father saw her at karate class tonight and told her she HAD to come to his place this weekend. I am going to email him telling him that he needs to give her a little space and some time. But I expect he is going to demand she come over.

I have left a message with lawyer asking about the legal side of this.

I figure I have a few options.

#1 force her to go (not planning to do this one)

#2 try to reason with him and hope that when he comes he doesn't force her

#3 send her to a friend's house so that she isn't here when he comes

Any suggestions or comments on this one are welcome.

When it comes to the well being of the kids...Plan A is out the window. The only suggestion I can offer is find a compromise...if he wants to spend time with his daughter and this is not just a power play (which I suspect it is) talk to her and see if she will be willing to do something as a family. You can then offer that suggestion to your WH and see what he says. Bottom line, she is too old to be forced to go over there and spend time with him...and he needs to come to terms with that.
My son is 11 and he decides if and when he wants to spend time with his mom. The children's home is at your house and frankly, your H has no legal right to remove the children from their hom until such a time as a court determines otherwise.
Rememeber....children 1st...then worry about the MB plans.

Lawyer just called me back. Says I need to encourage D to spend time with H, and I told him I have been, but that my concern is if he tries to force her to go. He said he cannot force her and if he tries to, to call the police. I said I hope it doesn't get to that, and he said I hope not, too, but it just might.

I am prepared to do whatever I need to to allow my daughter the right to feel her own feelings and to have some control over her life and her relationship with her father. For her own mental health, I know that she has to get past the anger at some point, and start to rebuild that relationship. But it is going to be when she is ready. He can't bully her through this. It's time for him to feel some consequences for his ridiculous actions. He and D have been very, very close all these years, so I know this is hurting him tremendously. But I also know that he thinks he can just resume authority with his family...well, his submissive wife has left. I was submissive because I believed it was the right way to live in a Christian marriage, and he had always valued and respected my opinion. I was not submissive because I am weak. He changed the game, and I am changing the rules. He doesn't get it yet, but he will. I am in charge. I make the decisions about my children...where they go, who their with. He is JUST A VISITOR. I will continue to be respectful and pleasant. But I will not back down to his bullying.


Just sent this email to H:

Daughter talked with me last night. She said she told you she didn't want to come to your place this weekend, and that you told her she has to.

She is stuggling with a lot of feelings right now. I am asking that you be patient with her. Since you left, she has been telling me that she will not ever go to your place. I have explained to her that although she feels angry and hurt right now, that in time she will want to spend time with you. But I have also told her I will not force her to go if she does not want to.

I think if you give her some time and do not push her, she will get through this more quickly.

I'm sure you realize that legally you cannot remove her from her home. I will continue to encourage her to allow you to repair the relationship, but I will not require her to go if she chooses not to.

SMB,

I hope you are considering having your daughter talk to a professional to help her through this.

LC

Yes, I have the name of two different counselors. I was planning to call this week and schedule an appointment. Time got away from me, and I haven't made the call (will be calling this morning).

The first time he left I was taking my 8 yos to a C, because he was really struggling. This time round he seems to have just accepted this all. But I still plan to get them all in to see someone at least a couple times.

Thanks for your concern on this. I do appreciate your thoughts.

Husband has been at a meeting all morning and so did not get my email yet. He called to tell me that D had told him she didn't want to go and that he was planning on her going anyway.


I basically explained to him the same thing that was in my email. He says to me, "So you're going to a 13 year old make the decision about this?" (in a tone that suggests that a 13 year old should not have that power). And I said, "Yes, I will allow her to make that decision."

Through most of the conversation, it was apparent in his tone that he was trying to manipulate me into submitting to his authority. I think he began to see that I was not backing down (although I remained calm and respectful).

He then tells me that at 13, yes, she does get to choose who she lives with, but that she doesn't get to choose whether she has to go to visitation (he was talking legally). I told him that I thought he was wrong about that. And that if he doesn't give her space but instead tries to force her into seeing him, he will alienate her.

Oh yeah, he also said he thought she was just trying to con us because she wants to go do something else. I told him he is going to have to acknowledge her anger and hurt at some point.

He then says he's almost at the house, and he is stopping by to talk with D. So he takes her outside and talks for awhile. Then comes in and says that its between me and her what happens THIS weekend.

I talked with D after he left. She said they just chatted (as he tried to warm her up, I'm sure). He asked why she doesn't want to go to his house--because your brothers are there, because you want to do something else, etc. She said because she is mad at him. He asked why, but she said she didn't say anything else.

She told me after he left that she just needs SPACE. I can understand that.

From H's tone, I wouldn't be surprised if he contacts his lawyer to get some kind of visitation requirement written up. I have a call into my lawyer right now to hopefully initiate that myself. I was going to stick with Plan A for a few more weeks as he finishes the remodeling. However, I want to keep control of this situation (kids visitation schedule).

He also told me that he would be here most of NEXT weekend to work on the house. I asked what he still needed to do, because most is being hired out. He listed a few things. These are all things that I can find someone else to do for me at no charge--friends & family.

I'm anxious to discuss this all with my lawyer. It feels like it is time.

Oh, and when he got here today to talk with daughter, he starts walking through the house, telling the kids things he expected them to do (pick up games, put outside toys away, blah, blah, blah). I just want to scream, YOU DON'T LIVE HERE ANYMORE.

PLAN B now...just my opinion.

SMB, I just want to applaud you for the good judgment and courage you used when dealing with your DD. You managed to protect your child and validate her feelings about her dad's bad behavior. That is so important when she is being pressured by her dad to accept his shabby behavior and act like nothing has happened. What a brave little girl she is!

sniff....I am so proud of you! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Have you made a decision yet on when you will go into Plan B?