Those were conversations EARLY on. We've got a temporary agreement. I'm not happy with it though. Hopefully my lawyer will get off his DUFF before any more court dates. I've gotta get tough with him. He is fighting for my life and the life of DS. I shouldn't just be another day at work for him.

Yep, but of course it eats you!

I don't like your lawyer. He doesn't sound tough enough. Let him know that you want him to be a bulldog and fight for everything and drain WH of his will to leave you. He will be happy to roll up the extra hours. If he doesn't get off his duff, find someone else.

I know it is a dilemma about draining as much money as possible. Sure you may get less if you wind up divorce, but consider it an investment to keep your family together that involves some risk. You decide what is an acceptable amount of risk.

Go to HR and get your PI to get dirt and contact info on OW. But remember, you need to plan A your WH, but don't get dragged into any relationship/divorce conversations.

OK, as I gather my Plan A list (still studying here), need a few suggestions...

1 - should I always enthusiastically take his calls?
2 - should I offer anything or just answer his questions?
3 - should I agree to anything he wants as far as visitation? we finally had a hearing that gave me primary custody. He gets more than standard (because I allowed it before). I've given him an overnight every week (early on this benefited me). He would sometimes want him other nights for "dinner". Should I be flexible or say, "only what's stipulated?". I do need him to adjust a bit for me sometimes with pick up / drop off times.
4 - I've not confronted him yet about the A. Should I stick it to him every chance I can. Like on Fri when he picks up DS, remind him, "oh, remember, you're not allowed to have DS around OW anymore"
5 - ask him about work?
6 - justify why I've done things, for instance, taking the tax $ and putting where he can't get it to have $$ for legal bills. He makes about 7 X what I do. He has access to a lot more $$ than I do. The next time he brings it up I want to say, "remember, back in Dec when you told me numerous times to get a lawyer, well that $$ is to pay that lawyer that YOU told me to get".
7 - expect him to do things, like help get the dogs to the vet, tell him about things at the house, like the things breaking, the dead mice I find in the back yard, etc.
8 - do I let him know that I need him or let him think I can live without him?

This is all just so much to think about / analyze. He's read the psych books, etc. He obviously knows how to work the program. My head's still swimming. I worry about doing / saying the right thing, etc.

Well, that's a good start. I know I'll get lots of advice tonight.

God Bless You and I pray for each of you going through this struggle as well. I just with the WS would get their heads out from (you know where) <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" /> and stop wasting precious time. Restore these families. Divorce is NOT best for the kids, it does NOT make things easier.

Kiliki,

I read much of your story. I know what you're going through. My FWH did the same thing. I just wanted to give you hope, tell you how it went for us:

Mr. RLT did the same thing, out of the blue, I'm not happy, blah blah. Moved out, had a woman. Found out after he left. A long story, if you're interested let me know and I'll fill you in more. But he ended up breaking it off with OW, stayed in his apt. for awhile. Began reading the Bible. Started his journey with God. We also lived a very secular life with no God in the middle for 25 years.

Long story short--he was in a hotel room, we were done. Gaput. Finished. I was calling my lawyer the next day. So he had this epiphany while he was in the hotel room. He said God spoke to him. He changed, Kiliki. He turned around 180 degrees after those three days. He came home. He committed himself 100% to the marriage and his three kids. He goes to church, reads the Bible daily. This is something he used to laugh at others about. He thought they were a bunch of "Jesus Freaks" who didn't know anything. Now he's completely different.

He's been home now for 8 months. I have a new husband, a new life. Yes, the consequences of his actions are still bearing down hard. We have a financial mess to deal with as he stole 20 grand from the 401K and racked up the credit card to finance his affair. He gave me and STD. He created a horrible relationship with his kids. He has to work a second job to help pay off debt. He has to deal with my moments of sheer disbelief, still, about the horror that he created. But ... God is good. He has turned this into something good, if you can believe that. My marriage, my family all intact, is a true miracle of God.

I'll pray for you, Kiliki, and for your husband, that he can have the same moment my husband had, and come back you you and your family.

God Bless. Don't give up hope. Anything is possible with God in your corner.

RLT.

More questions...

* do I drag my feet with the lawyer? WS is going for D on "no fault", he can file in Nov. I'm having to go for D based on adultery. I have to do this to get what I need for me & DS. I can give him a D in 3 months, but I'm not giving him the satisfaction. Then he could have DS around OW. I've not discussed timeframe with my lawyer. I don't know what I have to do.

* do I have any confrontation with OW? (I know who she is. She's babysat my DS before, I've been to her house, I handed the PI all the info on her)

* I've not told WH in a very long time of my desire to save the marriage. I did early on and he shrugged me off. "why are you willing to change now, etc". Do I let him know at all that I want to save it or just do Plan A and "show" him?

RLT,

YAY!!! These are the stories I like to hear! I'm so glad everything worked out for you. So glad he came out of his fog & to his senses.

I'd love to know a little more about your story. (you can email if you like) Mainly, what you did, what you think changed his mind. Had you done anything legal?

I've tried to not throw my newly recommitted Christian life in his face. I wasn't going to tell him I was Baptized. I had to tell him so he could bring DS to the church (a little earlier than normal drop off). He said he was glad I'd found a church I liked. He knows I used to really enjoy it. He's sorry he just wasn't as "in to" it as I was.

The whole "jesus freak" bothers me. There are some folks out there that can go extreme, but not all Christians are like that. Christians can have fun too. It's not all about hanging out at the bars.

I hope to be sharing my success story soon and helping others myself. I know that's another reason why God is allowing me to go through this. I hear from people around me, my parents included, how they are valuing their spouses a little more. I try to tell them where we failed, that these things happen when you least expect them. We both were committed to each other for life...so I thought. It can happen to ANYONE!!!

Thank you for your prayers and God bless you!

I really wish WH had someone to talk to that has been through this and has recovered from it and can help him before it's too late.

God is GOOD!!!

Why haven't you told him you want to save the M? Of course you should do that. You should also tell him that you know about his affair, but you are still willing to work on things. Let him know that you will fight the divorce and do whatever it takes to save your family. Let him know that you know that things need to be different in the marriage and you are willing to work on those things. If he doesn't agree to come back and have NC with OW, it's time for nuclear exposure.

If you do make it through this, you will need some MC and do a better job at meeting his ENs. Things can't go back to the way things were.

A friend sent this to me!! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

GOD WANTED ME TO TELL YOU

Everything that is going wrong in your life today shall be well with you this year. No matter how much your enemies try this year, " they will not" succeed. You have been destined to make it and you shall surely achieve all your goals this year. For the remaining months of this year (2007), all your agonies will be diverted and victory and prosperity will be incoming in abundance. Today God has confirmed the end of your sufferings sorrows and pains because HE that sits on the throne has remembered you. He has taken away the hardships and given you JOY. He will never let you down.

I knocked at heaven's door this morning, God asked me... My child! What can I do for you? And I said, "Father, please protect and bless the person reading this message"... God smiled and answered... Request granted.

It's just been a while since I've told him. Things I've read is to say it, let them know, but move on. Don't keep saying it. They'll feel threatened. Work on "you".


Absolutely. We've got some great resources at church. There are Marriage Mentors also. People married over 15 years that "mentor" couples. There are small groups for couples, bible studies, etc. I'm excited about doing something like that. Growing closer to God together. He's just got to want that. Right now he does not want that.

Okay, I was under the impression that he didn't know this is what you wanted.


He doesn't want to now because he's having an affair. It's time to use some nuclear exposure to break these two up. After it's over, you'll get your chance to rebuild your marriage, but right now, you need to fire some tactical rounds to put pressure on this affair, especially on her end.

Kiliki, I can email or IM, or phone if you want. Just let me know where to contact you.

RLT

Kiliki,

You seem to be operating under the misaprehension that rolling over and forgiving WS is Godly?

Please understand that it IS Godly to fight for your family and secure all your entitlements (and then some) from a WS. You should get a lawyer that will facilitate this rather than sit on his hands.

As I think it was Charles Colson who said "when you've got them by the balls, their hearts and minds will follow".

Added my email to profile (temp). We can exchange IMs if u want.

kiliki, sent you a qucik email.

I am adding my two cents worth, a little late in the game, so excuse me if I am not fully updated.

One of the things I would recommend is taking the EN questionaire.

Since your husband is already out of the marriage as far as he is concerned, you should answer the EN questionaire for him to your best ability and then focus on his most important Emotional Needs.

The Harley's state that you can recover your love by filling your spouses most emotional needs.

You fill your spouses lovebank when you fill his top ENs, and you drain the lovebank, when you commit lovebusters.

Independent behavior is a BIG Lovebuster.

One thing that jumped out was the fact that your husband displayed independent behaviors most of your marriage.

You mention that most of his week is spent doing things that don't include you. Independent behavior.

Williard Harley suggests that each couple spend at least 15 hours a week doing recreational things together. Doing enjoyable things together makes hefty deposits in the lovebank. He recommends finding a hobby that both of you enjoy to not only fill his lovebank but yours.

He states that anyone can fall in love with the other person if they fill their emotional needs.

My guess is that one of your husband's top emotional need is admiration, and the other woman provided that.

He also says that marriages are at risk when a partner shares time and problems with those of the opposite sex.

Now the marriage is at double risk if the spouse is spending time sharing his problems, and spending enjoyable time with the opposite sex. Once the lovebank is filled to the top, the hormones kick in and its all a down hill slide.

My suggestion would be to read up on lovebusters, emotional needs, Plan A, and Plan B.

You have my deepest sympathy, it is a very long and hard road to travel, but there are many like me that have gone through this betrayal and have come out on the otherside.

Take care,

k.d.'s heartbreak

K,

I have read thru your sitch pretty fast, but will go back thru again when I have more time

First, so sorry about your sitch, but glad you took Eph's advise to come here! You will find a lot of help, understanding and support

Read the books NOW. Surviving an A, His Needs/Her Needs

Do NOT have any D or custody conversations with WH

Do NOT make it Easy for him to D!

BE the woman YOU want to be, which is going to be (should be) the woman your H fell in love with

Remember how things were when you first met, and recreate that!

Do NOT rollover and agree with everything WH says. He IS trying to convince YOU that this is Best, that you should be Friends, and all that other WH [email]cr@ap![/email] Do not accept that.

Read up around here about Plan A and get started on your own plan

Definately read and be sure you understand The Carrot and The Stick of Plan A.

Can someone find and bump that up for k?

First and IMMMEDIATELY NOW TODAY EXPOSE EXPOSE EXPOSE!

I can not say it enough!

I gotta run, but hang in there sweetie! Keep tight w/you chruch support system, so glad you have that.

Read up and keep asking those questions!

I'll do the best I can. It's been so long since we've "connected". I'm not exactly wure what his ENs are. A lot of it from what he tells me (I'll pull out text) (* HIM - The root of our problems isn’t you being unhappy when I’m not around. Its times like these where I come half way and you are unwilling to do more than the bare minimum to get by. I won’t accept the standard visitation schedule. ) , is that I wasn't "there" for him encouraging him to do things for himself. Well, how easy is this supposed to be when He's ALWAYS doing things for himself. He didn't see the times I WAS there for him. Videoing him earning & receiving his black belt, videoing & cheering on during his 1st bike race last year (early in the morning in the freezing cold). I was always acting interested when he talked about cycling, when the Tour de France was going on last year. Not sure what else to do.

At this time, do I reach out and ask him how things are going? I read that our hometown cycling hero is having some issues while warming up for the Tour this year.



This is a BIG LB for me!!!!! For him, do I need to make it seem that I need him? I know I shouldn't harp about things at home that keep breaking (why would he want to come home to that?) But to let him feel needed? Or will me showing my independence make him jealous, like he wants to be there for me?



I asked the mutual friend that tipped me off what he was in her, she said, the drinking, partying, crude talk. She's just "one of the guys". UGGG


I'm working on this. Still just so much info swirling around, trying to absorb it all.

Thanks for your feedback & support!!!

Ordering now..



I'm trying! I'm dressing more like he's wanted (good for me too!), trying not to complain as much (good for me too!), getting out there & finding true friends (good for me too, just hope I can keep them & not run them off), getting out more, not sitting at home waiting on him (good for me too!)...

It's hard to think back to early on. We've known "of" each other for close to 20 years. We've been together for 15. I'm not sure we ever discussed what drew us to each other.



A lot of this has to do with DS3. Trying to convince me that he needs to see his daddy, that he just wants to see his son, he loves him, he wants to spend time with him, etc. So, this is my cue to say, "yes, you had all the time in the world when you were home, you decided to leave us". He always wants me to give valid reasons for saying he can / can't do something. I want to say, "well, because I don't want you to or I want you to". Just the very reason why I never stood up to him when he was home to tell him I didn't want him to go out. He'd always act like he was asking my permission. I didn't have a valid reason for him to be home, other than, I wanted him home. I had nothing specific in mind, other than being together, watching TV, etc. That wasn't enough for him.


Got it (E sent it to me), read it, need to study a little more & get my plan on paper.




Thank you so much....again I need all this advice from you "pro's". I do not want to give up 15 years of my life and let him walk out & do what he wants!!! I want my family back & God has given me the vision of what our marriage can / should be. He's just got to want this too. There will be a LOT of changing on his part as well, but hopefully he can find God again and he'll see what our marriage needs to be!

Hi, Kiliki, and welcome to Marriage Builders. Sorry you are here. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

To answer your question, showing independent behavior will push him away. It is not attractive to anyone. Men like to feel NEEDED [not in a clingy, needy way] but that they are important in their wife's life. This is most especially a bad time to show IB because he will use it to justify leaving you. ["see, she doesn't need me anyway"] You don't want that.

And secondly, unless I missed it, have you not exposed this affair? Exposure is the most powerful weapon you have in your arsenal. Affairs thrive on secrecy and when exposed, the fantasy aspect is ruined. There are no guarantees, but we have had affairs end THE DAY they were exposed.

Exposure causes great conflict in the affair when the affairees are forced to explain their actions to others. The affair doesn't look so pretty when others are looking on going "ewwwwwwwwwwww." Its sort of like turning on the lights in the crack house! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

The affair should be exposed to parents, [of ALL concerned], spouses, employers if a workplace affair, close siblings, close friends, grandparents, pastors. When you expose to them, ask for their ideas on how to save your marriage. When put like that, they often try to be helpful. It should be done in one fell swoop to get the maximum effect to prevent the affairees from pre-empting you.

This is a critical step that you can't afford to skip, k.