Grr. Waywards really do make me want to hit things with shovels. I'm glad you're handling it so well.

What does this do for us later in our lives? Learning to deal with such childish, idiotic behavior. There must be some benefit, right?

What kind of cookies are you making.

I made fudge for the first time in my life. Figures I would give up sugar before this. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

I am going to have to find some splenda recipes.

Sleep tight tonight and talk to you soon,

Bugs:

Sounds to me like you are really handling it well. God has blessed you in so many ways. I pray that he will one day find his way home, after he has found god.

Children are smart, they will see right through him, the way mine has through her dad. Just keep God the center of their lives and all will be well.

I found out friday that my christmas present is that I get my final divorce papers on friday to sign...just in time for the holidays....

I didn't want to sign, but as god's word says, "If the unbeliever wants to leave, let them leave." I know without a doubt that mine is an unbeliever right now. I am trying to stay focused, but it is hard. Especially when they call and say that without a doubt they have found the love of their life and are expericing that feeling they've never felt before.... I didn't want to bust his bubble, but as soon as an emotional need goes unmet he'll pop....

In the meantime, I've been asking god to help me. To let me remain focused,and to strengthen me more. Despite everyone else saying that he's no good be glad he's gone, I know how hard it is...I pray that you are not hearing the same. We are both so blessed by God that I know we will see God's best. Let me know if you find it before me.

Bugs:

The TM's, VM's, and the bad things said to the children?

Not control.

HE realizes that he lost that. And all he has left is himself.

And he finds that to be very wanting.

Your plan B is having the desired effects. If you continue doing as well as you have, you can expect to get more of the same. Just keep responding like you have, which is "nothing more than necessary"

And keep loving the children.

The rest is up to Drac.

(((BUGS)))

LG

PS. The phone call after the nasty VM was not to another Woman. It was to some family member. FIL, or someone like that. Who else would listen to THAT? If you were getting INTO a R with this guy and he called you and said THAT, what would you do? So, it was probably FIL. Invite FIL to dinner during the holidays, You, FIL, DSS and DD sitting down at your NEW house. THAT will get back to Drac.

Hey Bugs, you sound well...inspite of everything...like you I think I'm going to need some help as I walk this path...

With POwS in it...if he's going to be in if...

-WE- will be fine...alot of leaning on each other and on GOD...

LG, if you would please, offer your advice on my thread...i would appreciate the support and guidance...I personally think that I just go on with my life as if POWS's not in it...I think that's what James was trying to say as well as BUGS...

Thank you both and have a great day!

Hey LG,,,,

Good to see your sage advice on the board today!

Ok, so the VMs, TMs, isn't control. Then what is it? What's the reason for it?

And why do I need to expect more of the same?

This morning, the perfect example is getting an email from him - -

"What is the planned close date for the property? Do you plan to go through your lawyer to settle up the finance; or are we going to handle it?"

I haven't responded. First question - he KNOWS that I will advise him as soon as I have a closing date, and as he JUST signed the contract yesterday, we couldn't very well have a date set yet. Also, what difference does it make on the attorney or not??


I did email my attorney, asking her what specifically I'll need to do so that it is documented properly per the terms of the divorce. As it is part of the divorce, of course, my attorney will need to be involved to some degree so that it is documented as completed in compliance with the decree.

To me, this isn't a big deal, and certainly not in terms of the 2 questions he asked. OR Am I missing something here?

So you decided not to get an intermediary?

Bugs, you are not in PLAN B.

That's why I keep asking you about this.

This Emailing and such will continue and you will eventually breakdown, IMO.

One of the major purposes of PLAN B is to safeguard your love for him. Keep allowing yourself to be open to this and the bank will eventually go to EMPTY. Does a part of you want this to continue, Bugsy? I wouldn't want that NEGATIVISM to be a part of my life. You are leaving yourself wide open to this and are not enforcing a BOUNDARY.



All of this concern on your part would not be necessary if he could only contact you in case of an emergency. He knows he has the opening to blast you and you are allowing this to happen. Take responsibility for YOURSELF..ONLY!! What part do YOU play in allowing this to happen? It's hard for me to listen to you complain about this because you are allowing this to happen.



You see...YUCK..Score one for Drac. YOU DID NOT HAVE TO EXPLAIN NOTHING TO HIM. NONE OF THIS WOULD HAVE BEEN HAPPENING IF HE HAD NOT CHOSEN TO GET A DIVORCE.

You are not at all responsible for explaining anything to him about anything. YOU ARE DIVORCED..at his choosing..FINISHED... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" />



You're going to spend the rest of little BUGS childhood feeling bad then...if you don't put a stop to this by BLOCKING OUT HIS ACCESS to you...

He is a GROWN MAN..supposedly..YOU ARE NOT HIS MOMMA!!!

I don't even like reminding my own grown sons about things that are THEIR RESPONSIBILITY...

You want to be HIS WOMAN..not HIS MOMMA..and he keeps casting you in that role...YUCK..

Gee, I take a couple of days off to have eye surgery am back on page 3 already. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

The woochipper thread is just much more fun, anyway!!

Eye surgery was a success! Just got home from my follow up and everything looks great! I have 20/20 vision in the eye that they worked on! Merry Christmas to me!

I’ve been thinking these last couple of days about ‘allowing’ him to contact me /exposing myself to his negativity when he throws it my way. Yes, I did react to it, but for me, it was different in that it was not done as a “I’m trying to please or pacify” act. I gave a statement of fact that he could take whatever way he chose.

No, Mimi, I am not his Momma. And he absolutely wants to cast me into that role - - which is interesting because one of the things he told me I did wrong was to treat him like a child. The truth is that we BOTH were a party to that dynamic in our relationship. Unconsciously, he needs/wants me to continue to fill that need for him.

He called again, wanting to talk about DSS. Long story short, Drac has not (as WE already knew) stepped up to the plate to be the PARENT. We’ll see if there is any change in that in the future. It’s not something I can DO for him or that I can control. I can help DSS when he is here, and I will continue to do that.

Drac also wanted to engage about the holiday schedule,,,, having sent me an email that I hadn’t read about how we “don’t have to go by the court schedule.” He says he’s not spending any time with family,,, just with the kids so his schedule is flexible. He claimed that he didn’t even KNOW what the ordered schedule says about the holiday. I’ve already arranged my life & schedule around the court order. I didn’t want to vary from that, despite his “trying to work with me”. I didn’t want to discuss, but I made an error and let him know that DD isn’t happy about spending most of the break with him, that I didn’t know why, and that she won’t tell him because she does not want to hurt his feelings. To quote him, it should be about what the kids want,,,,,,, but WE should be the ones to discuss it. ???

We left it that I would find out about DD’s dance schedule and let him know. I was very short, curt, and to the point in my reply. In the meantime, he’s sent an email that saying it is apparent that I prefer to stick with the court schedule, that he made arrangements to be off work, and he’d meet me Christmas Day for the exchange. WOW! He made arrangements to be OFF work? Did he plan on working all of those days?? Geez. I haven’t responded to his email. I intend to find out about her dance class tonight and then will reply.

He wants me to give in to being the friendly co-parents and I am not prepared for that.

WHY am I not prepared for it is the question?

I am Strong enough to let the crap bounce off of me when it comes to him these days. Even after the weekend situation and schedule back & forth, I feel calm and at peace. I’m not keyed up and thinking about it non-stop. I don’t feel the uncontrollable NEED to contact him. I don’t feel the NEED to explain to him the how or why of what I feel or do.

What I DO feel, and what I DO know is that I DO still love my husband. I don’t know the person that I have been dealing with for the last year and I don’t like the imposter person he’s trying to be in order to get me to interact with him.

I just don't feel as though I need some new or detailed plan on every moment of my life right now. I don’t need to plan for what he may or may not do - - - what he may or may not say - - what he may or may not think - and certainly about what he may or may not feel.

I’m happy with my life right now. I don’t want for anything, except to have my kids be happy. I do what I can in that regard.

Ok, I’ll ask just one question for now - - do I sound goofy here??

You don't sound goofy Bugs.. but you -are- being drawn into his drama.

(((Bugs)))

You gotta do what's right for you, but your anxiety is inversely proportional to your darkness these days.

I'm behind you and Rin whatever you guys do, but I worry for you both sticking your heads out of the foxhole like this.

I'll make this PLAIN AND SIMPLE...

If you want to recover your marriage, I think you can but ONLY..if you do a dark PLAN B and NOT be cast into the role of OLD BUGS..he will keep you in that role and have NO OTHER NEED for you... If it were me, there is NO WAY, I would be that OLD BUGS for him..not for ONE MINUTE..not even A SECOND...

If you want to remain divorced, move on, fall in love with someone else, then ABSOLUTELY keep the current status quo, even better...COPARENT with him..

I support you either way, my KINDRED SPIRIT...

But I will share that I did that for MY HUSBAND and still do..but he had to WANT me FOR MORE than that..my H wanted the OW for FUN AND GAMES AND ROMANCE and wanted me to MANAGE HIS LIFE..Do you see where I'm going with this, Bugsy?

He's still a CAKE-EATER and you are ENABLING this.

He wants to USE YOU.

It makes you FEEL GOOD to BE USEFUL to him...I think?

But it is CRUMBS...

What if you REALLY had another fellow? Would he put up with this crap from Drac? You are still attending to him...

James,

Thanks for the concern. I've no intention of continued interaction with Drac. He's welcome to his own drama. While it ticked me off about the vm the other day, I really didn't feel 'anxious' about it. The emotions and desire to DO something just weren't there.

I really am peaceful and content with my life.

I look at it this way - - he's like a little boy with a stick who comes across an animal which he is afraid of & doesn't understand. He's facinated by it and just HAS to poke it with a stick to see what it will do. He's just trying to poke me with a stick.

I am not like a snake who feels it necessary to hiss and spit at him because I am afraid and am in defensive mode.

Neither am I a helpless turtle that has been rolled over on it's back and can't get upright.

Those days are gone on both counts.

He may not see that. It may not come across in my posts. But I feel peaceful. From the top of my head to the tips of my toes and all the way to the bottom of my heart. It's a GREAT feeling. It's not the hyped up HIGH of just a moment or two, but the sort of good that you know is going to stay.

Let him try to rely on the OW(s) to help him remember things...They will fail...then he will MISS you...

He has no motivation to reconcile if he has some of the cake...

I think you're fooling yourself, Bugs..

You're not ABSOLUTELY peaceful..

You're peaceful until he gets to you...

He should not be able to GET TO YOU AT ALL...PERIOD...

Plus, you shouldn't be feeling PEACEFUL...

You should be going through WITHDRAWAL..but you are not..you are maintaining contact with him...keeping that little door open..and he knows it...sending you cartoons.. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" />

I know I'm being hard on you..

but I LUV YA...is why...

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

Only time to scan, but I think Mimi's onto something here.

(((Bugs)))

My posting time has been reduced dramatically by work demands and computer problems at home. So I had to SEARCH to find you back on page 3! Unacceptable!!

Mimi is most definitely on the right track, Bugsy.
Analyze what it is that you are getting out of this situation. Confirmation that he needs you? Proof you are a better parent? Being able to watch his self-destruction?

You are not nearly dark enough. You should know by now there is no such thing as a MODIFIED plan b. There is no such thing as plan b with SOME contact.

And you should know by now that anything less than PLAN B is damaging to your overall plan. You're protecting his fall. You are preventing his fall. You're prolonging his fall.

And why do you want to do that?

Awww Mimi,




I know,,,,but thanks for the reminder!!
<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />



yes, I do see where you are going with it. And I see the point of settling for crumbs by doing the life management for him.

Yet, I have a question. IF all he wants me to do is manage his life, and based on what we've seen, that is ALL he wants me to do --- then HOW or WHY is it possible that he would he ever think of me, see me, or want me for any other reason? <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" />

Don't get me wrong - - I'm not saying I want to fall into the role is is setting for me as his life manager and nothing more. I don't want that.

Bugs...

I hear ya. I am so exhausted right now...it has been two weeks of almost constant motion and activity. I say this because I don't know if whatever I say will make any sense. I'm practically keeling over.

Just go dark. Dark. Dark. Dark.

You do not NEED to do A N Y T H I N G for Drac.

You do not NEED to say A N Y T H I N G to Drac.

You are under NO OBLIGATION to make room in you life for that man. He brutalized you and destroyed your family. He STOLE something that was absolutely precious to you, crushed it, and tossed it away...without (apparent) remorse or regret.

Danger Will Robinson. Keep away from him.

If he were a stranger, you certainly would. Why should Drac get special treatment from you just because you were married to him? Just because you have kids?

You are under NO OBLIGATION to co-parent, to keep him updated, to coordinate anything, to make anything easier for him. Those details are outlined in the divorce papers.

HIS cruelty, HIS betrayal is what prompted you to cut him off from your life. You did so to take care of yourself, because he TAUGHT you that he cannot be trusted to protect you.

It is HIS responsibility to make amends for that. He needs to teach you (demonstrably) that he can be trusted to protect you.

Until then, pretend the man does not exist.

Who knows what will happen. But right now, I urge you to resist the urge to engage, to peek out, to ponder.

Awww...easier said. Since my WH has never attempted to draw me out, it's easy for me to give advice. Sorry. I just would like to help.

I better go soak in a tub and crawl in bed.

GET UP, GIRLIE!! WE NEED YOU AROUND HERE!!

That's the best post I heard from you, Sis!!

I'm applauding and holding my mouth wide open!!

AMEN!!