Welcome to the
Marriage Builders® Discussion Forum

This is a community where people come in search of marriage related support, answers, or encouragement. Also, information about the Marriage Builders principles can be found in the books available for sale in the Marriage Builders® Bookstore.
If you would like to join our guidance forum, please read the Announcement Forum for instructions, rules, & guidelines.
The members of this community are peers and not professionals. Professional coaching is available by clicking on the link titled Coaching Center at the top of this page.
We trust that you will find the Marriage Builders® Discussion Forum to be a helpful resource for you. We look forward to your participation.
Once you have reviewed all the FAQ, tech support and announcement information, if you still have problems that are not addressed, please e-mail the administrators at mbrestored@gmail.com
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Page 34 of 142 1 2 32 33 34 35 36 141 142
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 998
C
Member
Offline
Member
C
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 998
Quote
CW.. I'm sorry I made a bad assumption, not being familiar with your story.. I do still very much value your perspective here. Especially considering I think my wife may be in the same sitch.. including the bipolar thing.. is there -anything- you can think of that might have turned things around? Was it too late for your BS when you finally came out of the fog? Is there -anything- he could have done differently that might have affected the decision to go through with the D even after the A ended?

No big deal. I just wanted to make sure you knew up front that I didn't recover my marriage. Trying to do better this second time around.

Things might have turned around if I'd had an inkling that I was truly ill. I'd been in the hospital because I cried for three solid days after I asked for the divorce. The psych hospital didn't find the bipolar thing. It's taken me a few years until I finally figured that out on my own. Looking back I can see that I was in a manic episode and had no clue. I can spot them better now and I'm on meds. I had a hysterectomy shortly before all of that happened as well and I think the hormonal shock brought on the first episode.

I mean I was doing wild things that were just so out of character for me, yet no one saw really. My ex FIL suggested that I might be ill, but I saw two dr's plus the hospital and they thought it was because he'd been so neglectful.

I'm not trying to blame my affair on being bipolar. I did make the choice to cheat and I knew it was wrong. In looking back now though I can see so much that I did wrong.

If my ex would have responded in a loving manner towards me it would have went a long way. If he would have Plan A'd me (but he refused MB principals). There was alot that was going on that I won't get into here in our relationship but as I said before, I was 100 percent wrong in my choice to cheat but my infidelity gave him a free pass on the numerous issues that he'd caused in the marriage. I could go into detail about things I'd done way before the affair to mend our marriage that he refused but I won't because that would sound like justification on my part. And nothing he did justified the affair.

Up until the divorce was almost final I probably would have broken, if he'd come to me in a loving way and said "Honey, I forgive you for the things you've done. I know what they are. I truly believe you're ill- because you've done this, this and that that are so out of character for you. Let's put our relationship issues on hold for now until we really get to the bottom of what's going on with you".

There were alot of things that were done to me, by either him or his family that were extremely hurtful. I literally couldn't run to the drugstore and not run into someone who thought I was a ******. I'm not talking MB exposure here.
So, I had that to deal with as well.

By the time the divorce was about to be final I'd suffered alot of emotional abuse from almost an entire community and there would have been no way I could have gone back to him.

I'm rambling I guess and I'm sorry. I still feel tremendous guilt over the whole thing. (being bipolar does that to you] I don't think he'll ever forgive me and I've come to the point where I understand that. I'm also working on trying to forgive him for the things that he did to me- both before the divorce and after.

Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,900
J
Jamesus Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
J
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,900
Oh wow.. now that does give a guy quite an insight.

Honestly, she too says that she has tried and tried and tried with me, but I just let stuff roll off my back.

When I ask her though she says that a conversation we had -way- back in January was her 'warning' that she had a foot out the door. It was the 'I'm lonely.. I feel like we're just together for the kids' thing... I figured it was her annual bout of post holiday depression and comforted her, and we did a few things over the course of a couple of months that seemed to make things better. In May she updated her blog and said life was busy but good. The week before she left I got flowers with my anniversary present that had a note on it that said: If I had it to do over, I'd marry you all over again, you are my partner and my best friend.

Now she says that was the week she 'decided' it was over between us.

I'm not really sure how to approach her CW, or if I should at all. I'm trying to Plan A from a distance but mostly it's uncomfortable interactions on the phone where one or the other of us seems on the defensive.. or in person during the exchanges where I'm cordial but it's very superficial conversation if any... and she's making no efforts to show me any respect seeing as Wonderscumbag has been with her the last couple times *puke*.

I feel at times alternately like she's -totally- emotionally vacated herself from me, and others like she's reaching out.

Like today.. her willingness to compromise on the holiday schedule.. it's been the -first- successful negotiation we've had since she left.. seriously, everything has to be contested, and I'm usually the one to give, especially now that she has the power over giving me more time with DS if she does at all.

I'm trying to show in subtle ways that I care, though I imagine she doesn't really notice. I'm trying to be considerate of her, even though I'm sitting back here watching her make some -extremely- bad choices for her life.. not just Wonderboy and his wackjob family.. but buying a house just down the way from his mom that she can't possibly afford.. and he's going to be no help either since he's always the first guy to get laid off on his road construction crew.. due to being a worthless slob.

Gah.. I figure I'm just going to have to wait for the A to reach critical mass before she starts -really- reaching out to me.. try and keep a Plan A going until then.. I figure I've got 3 more months till the 6 month mark.. I -gave- their relationship about 6 months tops to survive anyhow at the beginning.. then I'll evaluate whether or not I'm happy with my Plan A.. and ultimately transition to B and really kind of move on with my life in all ways but fidelity.

What types of things do you think you would have been receptive to Plan A wise while you were actively in your A?

I'm not sure it's Plan A stuff but tonight when I called to talk to DS she answered:

Her: Hello?
Me: Hey there.. how's it going?
Her: Uh.. pretty good, thanks.
Me: Is DSD or DS around?
Her: DS is crashed out, and DSD is in the middle of eating.
Me: Oh I see..
Her: Do you want me to wake him up?
Me: No.. no don't wake him up if he's already out.. just have him call me if he wakes up before you take him to bed, or at least give him a big hug and a kiss for me, and tell him I love him.. please do the same for DSD.
Her: Mmmhmm (seemed kind of upbeat)
Me: Ok.. well, I'll assume you got my response to your email.
Her: Yeah, I got it.
Me: I've got the papers drawn up for us to look at on Sunday, just wanted to let you know.
Her: Ok, no problem.
Me: Ok.. well I'll see you Sunday, Bye.

Now this is the first time she's offered any compromise where it comes to DS.. and the FIRST time she's offered to go out of her way to try and make sure I get to talk to DS..

Am I being relegated to 'friend'?

Is that necessarily a -bad- thing if I'm trying to reconnect even a little with her so I can start EN meeting what I can in Plan A?


Me - 32
DS - 5
DD - 13
DSD - 9
D final 12-8-08
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 2,828
B
Member
Offline
Member
B
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 2,828
James,

Before I comment on anything, I have a question.

Ok, a couple of questions.

Is it Plan A or Plan B?

And

Whichever one it is,,, why?

I think we need to know which it is and your reasoning before giving any direction or comment - - Atleast this 5th Grader needs some clarification! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />


BS (me)
ExWS -Drac
DD 9
DSS 15
D Day 11/06
Divorced 10/01/07

"You Can't Fix Stupid" - My Mom
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,900
J
Jamesus Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
J
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,900
Well.. I guess my sig line is a little misleading.

When I talked briefly to Harley on the radio show he recommended a modified Plan B.. He started talking Plan A but I think -I- shut him down on that saying that she was out of the house and completely emotionally vacant.

It was true at the time, but I see moments where I have the opportunity to Plan A her.

I never really -did- a Plan A.. I chased her for 2 months trying to 'educate' her and convince her to come home. It was a -terrible- plan.. and it backfired.

I've read several threads where people have Plan A'd from a distance and it -worked- out possibly even better than Plan A'ing at home. I'm just looking to get some strategies so that I can do a Plan A from a distance effectively.

I honestly think the 'modified Plan B', or what I was calling a Modified Plan B is -really- a from afar Plan A. I want to try to make that work, where at every interaction I'm cordial, warm, caring, and self assured.. to show that I'm back on my feet and strong, and to give her a glimpse of the man she -should- be missing.

The reason why, is because I think she -wants- a Plan B right now, I think nothing would make her (and probably Wonderboy is -pushing- hard for this) than for her to have nothing more to do with me. I don't think a Plan B would be very effective for her without me honestly making an effort to do a good Plan A. I don't want to flush my best opportunity (following the plans) down the drain.

I'm only 3 months into this.. it's -felt- like an eternity but like everyone says, this is a marathon, not a sprint.. 3 months isn't long at all to most of you here. I think I still have an opportunity for Plan A to good effect.. and if I see her drawing closer, and fence sitting.. then I'll look at a Modified Plan B.

I'm strongly considering making an appointment with Harley to talk to him and get a -real- plan together.. I'm right now looking for suggestions on how to Plan A from a distance effectively.

Looking at MWIL's thread it looks possible.. I just need to figure out how to get the foot in the door and get the 'light' conversations started, and just let things progress from there.


Me - 32
DS - 5
DD - 13
DSD - 9
D final 12-8-08
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 7,093
W
Member
Offline
Member
W
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 7,093
Quote
I'm strongly considering making an appointment with Harley to talk to him and get a -real- plan together.. I'm right now looking for suggestions on how to Plan A from a distance effectively.


Okay, then you might want to change your sig line. It's not a modified Plan B, if even a thing exists. And it may, I am just not familiar with the idea of one.

I don't understand why you would want to get back with her, but I'll support you and try to come up with ideas along with the others. I am thinking it is either because you need to know you tried everything possible or because your believe your children would be better off if you were together. Both good reasons. Although I doubt she has it in her, at least not for several years and one or two life changing, brought to her knees type occurances. But again, no cyrstal ball, just a hunch and her track record as a measure.

And with that said, regarding any type of continued Plan A, please do as 2long said and make yourself the focus. You have got to focus on yourself, while hoping for the best. Any focus on her will do two things, fuel her nasty entitlement quality, and keep you in place of non growth.

I have to say once more James, her track record is sorely lacking in being able to be in a long term marriage where family comes first. But I'm not God, so don't have all the info needed to say for sure. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,900
J
Jamesus Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
J
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,900
Weaver.. your post is a reflection of my greatest fear in all of this. That she just honestly doesn't have it in her to make a lifetime commitment work.

Her track record is certainly an indication that this is a strong liklihood.. but I -do- believe that she desires at least on some level to have -that- relationship. She just doesn't think that she's found it yet.

This has been a period of intense individual growth for me, and I know that it has the potential to be the same for her. I honestly don't know if she's ever experienced the -deep- love it requires to make a marriage work. She's still chasing the love she reads about in her romance novels.

But maybe.. if the true guilt and suffering of this divorce and affair sinks in at some point, that could be the life altering event in her that makes a lifelong commitment possible.

I'm keeping myself the focus, and honestly I'm going into this with no expectations of success. I've really come to realize that I will survive with or without her, and can be even better than I was before -either way-..

I know that I don't -need- her in my life. I am not dependent upon her for my happiness. She does however enhance my life in so many ways, and I -want- to have a happy, loving, lasting marriage with her. It's not just about the kids, but I tell you, they are an extremely large reason for me to continue to hope and fight for a new and improved relationship with my wife.


Me - 32
DS - 5
DD - 13
DSD - 9
D final 12-8-08
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 7,093
W
Member
Offline
Member
W
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 7,093
Quote
Weaver.. your post is a reflection of my greatest fear in all of this. That she just honestly doesn't have it in her to make a lifetime commitment work.


It is not my intention to be the wet rag here, or to hurt you, but sense she is operating entirely on "feelings", you need to operate on logic, and with your head out of the sand. Hope is good, because it is energy. But denial is self-defeating.

Quote
Her track record is certainly an indication that this is a strong liklihood.. but I -do- believe that she desires at least on some level to have -that- relationship. She just doesn't think that she's found it yet.


Bingo. Looking without, instead of within.

Quote
This has been a period of intense individual growth for me, and I know that it has the potential to be the same for her. I honestly don't know if she's ever experienced the -deep- love it requires to make a marriage work. She's still chasing the love she reads about in her romance novels.


Again, bingo.

Quote
But maybe.. if the true guilt and suffering of this divorce and affair sinks in at some point, that could be the life altering event in her that makes a lifelong commitment possible.


Yes, but this is something that is not in your control. Not even with a Plan A. However, sometimes after a Good Plan A, a good Plan B will serve as a life changing event where the WS is served (on a silver platter), and maybe for the first time, that they are not the center of the universe. That they are responsible for making a good marriage. That everyone doesn't exist in this universe to serve them. And the biggy here the BS actually has a choice, and they are exercising that right, and that they are going to move on just fine without the WS

I experienced that eye opening experience with a BF I had in my twenties who finally said he didn't need my selfishness in his life. I had broken up with him because I thought I wanted to be with someone else, and then about three months into my new R, it hit me like a ton of bricks that had I treated my xBF the way I was treating this new guy we would have rocked the world with our R... it was ME and not him who was the problem. Well he wouldn't take me back. I found out that he actually had a choice and his choice was to move on.

But I hadn't had a baby yet. And I'm thinking that if having a baby isn't a life altering event, in and of itself...well I don't know.
Did she respond on your question about allowing DSD to come over?

Last edited by weaver; 11/16/07 09:41 AM.
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,900
J
Jamesus Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
J
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,900
Thanks again for the great input Weaver, and I think what you said about Plan B serving as a life changing event is one of the main reasons I think it is important now to do the best Plan A I possibly can, for as long as I can do it.

3 more months would be 6 months from separation and DDay.. I think that'd probably be fairly appropriate as a time to go back and evaluate my Plan A.. not the results I see on her end, but the results on -mine-.

Did your xBF in your twenties do anything to maintain a friendship with you after the breakup? I'd like to examine that, and what made you think of him in the context of how you treated him?

As for your question about DSD, I haven't heard anything back from her on the subject, but between you and me and the rest of the board here, I have -no- expectation of seeing her, or of her even being asked if she wants to go by WW.


Me - 32
DS - 5
DD - 13
DSD - 9
D final 12-8-08
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 7,093
W
Member
Offline
Member
W
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 7,093
Quote
Did your xBF in your twenties do anything to maintain a friendship with you after the breakup? I'd like to examine that, and what made you think of him in the context of how you treated him?


For a few weeks he acted out of desparation to get me back. He even came over and asked me to marry him, but I knew it was out of desparation and quite frankly I had treated him so badly I didn't trust his motivations.

He stopped calling altogether really at that point, but it took me a couple of months to notice (I was quite involved in this new R and didn't want him to call me either).

My old BF and I used to do a lot of things together like camping, canoeing and boating, while my new BF liked to party a lot. He was not established in a job, or with a house, etc like my old BF, and this started to bother me. Plus I didn't like to party very much. I really started to miss my old BF and things we used to do, and that was when I started to notice he wasn't calling at all. I started calling him but he was always busy, was out and about with friends...was doing all the things we used to do with other people.

I asked him if we could get back together, but he said he wasn't ready. Didn't want to get hurt again. I have to tell you I was devastated. I was completely crushed. He started dating someone else and married her eventually. If I had given him time he may have gotten back with me, but I wouldn't leave him alone. Again, I was being selfish and he didn't see the changes he wanted to see in me in order to take another chance.

So, it took a while for me to miss him and our life together, and in order for that to happen he had to stop calling.

I din't want anything to do with the new BF after that. It took me about three years to get over my xBF.

Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,900
J
Jamesus Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
J
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,900
Wow Weaver...

Well.. I suppose I can only hope that since even in the Plan A from afar, I'm not going to go out of my way to initiate contact other than absolutely necessary stuff for DS.. that that might give her a chance to miss me.

I know she's -way- wrapped up in her life right now and with OM.. so it may just be a matter of playing the waiting game, and being wonderful glorious me when she does get a chance to catch a glimpse.

I dunno really.. I guess I'm just looking for some direction or someone to tell me I'm already doing what I can.

Just trying at this point to think of what really -is- a good Plan A in my situation.


Me - 32
DS - 5
DD - 13
DSD - 9
D final 12-8-08
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 7,093
W
Member
Offline
Member
W
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 7,093
Quote
so it may just be a matter of playing the waiting game, and being wonderful glorious me when she does get a chance to catch a glimpse.


Being the wonderful, glorious you. YES.

Playing the waiting game. NO.

What you need to do is present a man who is loving life. Take up with your band again. Show a guy who is out and about with friends and involved in your passions.

Do not date, but a little mystery goes a long way with women.

You have a child together so you will have lots of opportunities to shine.

And yes, stop initiating any contact for awhile. What you might do, onc all initiating has stopped for a month or so, is casually invite her to come along with you and son to some fun acticity. Be prepared for her to say no, and then act non challant about her rebuttal.

And then repeat in a few weeks when another fun thing comes along.

After that, don't ask anymore.

This is about a two month plan.

PS My xBF didn't need to do a Plan A, because his whole life was a Plan A. He had always treated me well and treated himself well. A Plan A from him would have been counterproductive and would have fueled my entitlement even more. He did everything right, by continuing to enjoy life and let me go, without making a big deal out of it. That is when I noticed him again.

Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,900
J
Jamesus Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
J
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,900
I'm -so- printing this out and keeping it in my pocket.

I think this advice is probably right on with what I'm currently doing, and what I -need- to be doing.

((((Weaver)))) Thank you -so- much for taking the time to post to me today. You've been a Godsend for me today. I can't thank you enough.

I think I'm going to have -plenty- of opportunities to invite her to do something fun with DS and I over the holiday.. like taking a walk through the park to see the Christmas Lights.. going to see the We Care trees in the mall etc...

2 months huh? That'll get us through the holidays, and come up right before Valentines.. hmm.. might be a great time to Plan B..


Me - 32
DS - 5
DD - 13
DSD - 9
D final 12-8-08
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 10,816
2
Member
Offline
Member
2
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 10,816
Jamesus:

I think you're biggest fear isn't that your W will never come around. I think your biggest fear really is that you will lose interest before she does (and that's making the big assumption that she will).

This talk of old relationships and how they ended reminds me of my first real girlfriend. I was 18 and she was 15. I worked at a tropical fish store about a block from her high school and on her way home every day. That's how we met.

She was pretty, in a subtle way (never wore makeup). But it was her sweetness that interested me in her. Because she was under age, we were pretty careful about what we did on dates - silly stuff like roller skating, walking through the park, minia2re golf...

We lasted about 4 months, when she suddenly was unreachable by phone, even "not home" when I'd go by after work on my way home. I do remember her answering the door one day about a month after she "broke up" with me. She said all kinds of things 2 hurt me, claiming she had new friends and was in2 drugs and stuff. Looking back, probably none of it was true, she simply had changed and seemingly didn't want me coming around anymore.

Well, she was only 15, after all.

I remember being pretty torn up for about 6 months. But I didn't try 2 contact her after I saw her that day.

...until about a year later. A friend of mine, who'd gone on double dates with us a 2ple of times, said we should go by her place and see what she's up 2. So, we did.

She was home. She said something that I even thought at the time was ridiculous "I was just thinking about you the other day." We all went walking around some school playground near her house, just small-talking. I still thought she was pretty, but after what I'd felt the year before, I didn't want 2 take another chance with her.

It was clear that my friend thought we should start dating again, because he ran off 2 climb a tree or something. She even seemed like she was waiting for me 2 take her hand or something. There was some sort of tension going on.

But I didn't, and after about an hour we said goodbye at her door.

Funny, I recalled just now that my friend 2k me over there a few days later and we all went out for burgers or something 2gether. In retrospect, I think he was trying 2 see if I was really no longer interested in her so he could make a move. But she wasn't interested in him.

I saw her once more about 4 years later, when my W (fiance at the time) and I were buying a pair of levis from a store she apparently worked at. We were all surprised 2 learn that we all knew each other - my W (and one of my sisters) had a class in junior college with her (my sister never told my W that she'd been my GF before). It was really a funny meeting. my xGF said "you're lucky", quickly followed by "both of you" when we told her we were engaged.

I've never seen or heard from her since.

...boy, sorry for the tangent! I guess my point with all this is that even guys like me, who think they'll never get over someone they're so madly in love with, most definitely can. And do.

Because it's not really the love you're getting over, it's the unhealthy attachment 2 another person. It's part of honing your own relationship skills, from the experiences you've had.

Most likely, your WW will go down in his2ry as a key player in one of your learning experiences. Right now, that doesn't sound positive 2 you. But perhaps even2ally it will. You can still cherish someone for their contribution 2 your growth, even if you're no longer involved with them.

You will forever FEEL differently than you do now. Your perspective on relationships has been forever altered. In a good way, I think, in spite of how it came about.

-ol' 2long

Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,900
J
Jamesus Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
J
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,900
Not so sure about that 2long, though while my initial reaction to the post is to disagree with the notion since I can immediately come up with several examples in my life why I don't think that's the case.. several past GF's that I've thought about over the years.. even a girl I was engaged to in College and we broke it off over some really stupid stuff (thank goodness in retrospect)..

I'm not afraid of losing this emotional attachment to her.. at least I don't think I am. Honestly it'd be a whole heck of a lot easier on me if I could just flip that switch and move on. Thing is.. I suppose.. I don't want to. Not out of fear.. but well...

You know.. I'm going to think on this real good.. I may never get back to you on whether or not I agree or not... but I -will- give it full consideration.

I have no doubt that eventually I will get over her and move on with my life without her.. I'm not so sure that's my fear. If there is a fear here.. it might be that that time may come too soon.. and then I'd look back and maybe -I- would be the one not giving things the chance they deserve.

Does that make any sense?

Did I talk myself through a lot of the thought process while typing?

I'll digest this some more offline <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />


Me - 32
DS - 5
DD - 13
DSD - 9
D final 12-8-08
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 998
C
Member
Offline
Member
C
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 998
Quote
What types of things do you think you would have been receptive to Plan A wise while you were actively in your A?

Well I wasn't in my A when he found out about it or when I asked for the divorce.

Things he could have done?

Responded to me in a loving manner.

He could have called, to check and see how I was. He could have asked me on a date, he could have sent me flowers- those kinds of things. He could have said give me a chance to show you I've changed before you pull the plug on this family.

All the time would have been too much but he could have pursued me a little to let me know he thought I was still worth having.

He never wanted to plan dates for us to go anywhere when we were married- he always spent his weekends away from home doing what he wanted to do. I couldn't plan anything either because when I would suggest it he'd be like "I'm doing so and so that weekend" until the calendar would be full. So trying to date me would have been a big thing to me. He never did any of those things. Trying to be involved in his kids lives would have been nice- because he'd spent so much time away from home he missed a ton.

Instead it was a constant stream of nasty emails and text messages...... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

Anyway......I think it would be great for you to ask her to do something fun. Or do something out of the ordinary for her that you wouldn't normally have done.

So, you are saying that your wife did come to you and tell you she was unhappy? <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" />

I did that several times a year the last year we were married and I specifically told him the areas I felt needed improvement. I wasn't one of those "If he loves me, he'd know" kind of gals. Still not.

Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,900
J
Jamesus Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
J
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,900
Yeah.. she did tell me back in January that she felt lonely and that we were just together for the kids.

I didn't completely discount it, but I will be the first to acknowledge that I didn't take it seriously enough. She wanted the Catholic wedding.. and her convictions about family, openness, and honesty were so strong (or so I thought) that Divorce didn't even enter my mind. She was always home with me at the end of the night so I never even gave an affair a second thought.

Yeah.. I was that guy. I loved my wife completely, and never expected she was capable of this.

Well.. I don't think anything I sent was nasty over the last few months.. I have persued, possibly a little more than I should have, but I've pulled back, waaay back now that I've recovered some self esteem and confidence.

What she never did though was give me any specifics on things I did that made her unhappy.. mostly she'd complain to Wonderboy's mom at work, or SIL and just be mad at me. Whenever she -was- perceptibly upset with me I'd ask her what was wrong and she'd never want to talk about it. Something that needs to change in the future for sure.


Me - 32
DS - 5
DD - 13
DSD - 9
D final 12-8-08
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 10,816
2
Member
Offline
Member
2
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 10,816
Quote
Whenever she -was- perceptibly upset with me I'd ask her what was wrong and she'd never want to talk about it. Something that needs to change in the future for sure.

Be prepared. This may not happen. Not because you don't want it 2 or can't make it, from your end. But because she may never give you the chance.

You still appear 2 be hanging a lot on her even2ally coming around. Not all do.

-ol' 2long

Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,900
J
Jamesus Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
J
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,900
I know the chances are slim that her personality type will be able to fully accept the burden of acknowledging what she has done 2long.

But I am here on these boards for a reason, to try everything I can to recover my M. That's why I still speak in terms of when/if she does come around. I want to be prepared and have a plan for recovery if it should ever happen.

Honestly, like I've said before.. I know I will be ok if she doesn't come home, and honestly that is -probably- the easier road to take.

I do love her though, and hope for the best. I plan for the worst.

I'm focusing my efforts on recovering me at this point, and I think I'm doing a darn good job of that. I've always been fond of the man in the mirror. I can look at him now and know that he's flawed, but working on it. On the whole however he is a good man, a good husband, a good father, and trying to be better on all counts every day. I've got a lot of respect for that guy.. he's been through he11, and he's still walking upright, and recently he's gotten some of the old swagger back.

I keep speaking hopefully because I can see cracks in the WW's relationship.. and seriously, knowing her as I do, I don't see her sticking around that situation long term if there's a wonderful alternative out there for her.

We'll see.


Me - 32
DS - 5
DD - 13
DSD - 9
D final 12-8-08
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 6,643
Q
Member
Offline
Member
Q
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 6,643
Jamesus,

You and I are on such the same path. However, I don't see the cracks in his R with OW other than he is always angry or tired.

I would personally think that if you aren't working overtime anymore, have no kids around to take up your energy you would be happy and relaxed. But he isn't.

I am right with you, your biggets champion hoping for the best and believing that it will happen as G-d wants it to.

Warmly,
SG


BS 52, FWH 53, Married 1-1-84
D-day 5-14-07, WH moved in with OW
Plan A 9 months, DARK Plan B 3-17-08 until 3-2-09
WH and OW broke up 1-09
Started over 7-09
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,900
J
Jamesus Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
J
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,900
Well.. it's been 3 months in..

And today I had a 3 year old crying his eyes out in my arms because mommy and daddy weren't (in his words) best friends anymore.

I cried too, and held him close.

I explained to him that it was a very confusing situation and that I understood his sadness, and that it was ok to be sad. I told him that I will always love his mommy very much, and as much as I want to be her 'best friend', that isn't what she wants right now.

He said he wants mommy and gaga (DSD) to come home and be with us.. that he wants to stay with me, and doesn't want to have to go away with mommy.. a 3 year old said to me today: I don't want to be mommy's friend anymore.

I basically told him that what was important here is that mommy and I would always be -his- best friends, and that we would both always be there for him even if we weren't there together. That we both loved him very much and even though a lot of things are changing in everyones lives that our love for him is something that will never change. Seemed to make him feel a little better at least.

He's almost 4.. leads me to start thinking about his 4th birthday coming up in February.

I was in tears as well.. it's so hard for me to see him suffering like that. I held him for about 20 minutes while he cried, just letting him get it out. Then I took him and DD to the dollar theaters to see Underdog.

I gotta tell you guys, it shook me up pretty good.. I'm still a little shaken by it.

The daily Catholic Mass reading today is oddly.. a little comforting. I 'll post it here:

Sirach 26: 1 - 3, 15 - 18, 19 - 24
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

1 Happy is the husband of a good wife; the number of his days will be doubled.
2 A loyal wife rejoices her husband, and he will complete his years in peace.
3 A good wife is a great blessing; she will be granted among the blessings of the man who fears the Lord.
15 A modest wife adds charm to charm, and no balance can weigh the value of a chaste soul.
16 Like the sun rising in the heights of the Lord, so is the beauty of a good wife in her well-ordered home.
17 Like the shining lamp on the holy lampstand, so is a beautiful face on a stately figure.
18 Like pillars of gold on a base of silver, so are beautiful feet with a steadfast heart.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
1 Timothy 5: 3 - 10
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

3 Honor widows who are real widows.
4 If a widow has children or grandchildren, let them first learn their religious duty to their own family and make some return to their parents; for this is acceptable in the sight of God.
5 She who is a real widow, and is left all alone, has set her hope on God and continues in supplications and prayers night and day;
6 whereas she who is self-indulgent is dead even while she lives.
7 Command this, so that they may be without reproach.
8 If any one does not provide for his relatives, and especially for his own family, he has disowned the faith and is worse than an unbeliever.
9 Let a widow be enrolled if she is not less than sixty years of age, having been the wife of one husband;
10 and she must be well attested for her good deeds, as one who has brought up children, shown hospitality, washed the feet of the saints, relieved the afflicted, and devoted herself to doing good in every way.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Psalms 31: 4 - 5, 8 - 9, 20, 24 - 25
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

4 take me out of the net which is hidden for me, for thou art my refuge.
5 Into thy hand I commit my spirit; thou hast redeemed me, O LORD, faithful God.
8 and hast not delivered me into the hand of the enemy; thou hast set my feet in a broad place.
9 Be gracious to me, O LORD, for I am in distress; my eye is wasted from grief, my soul and my body also.
20 In the covert of thy presence thou hidest them from the plots of men; thou holdest them safe under thy shelter from the strife of tongues.
24 Be strong, and let your heart take courage, all you who wait for the LORD! ------------------------------------------------------------------------

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Matthew 25: 31 - 40
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

31 "When the Son of man comes in his glory, and all the angels with him, then he will sit on his glorious throne.
32 Before him will be gathered all the nations, and he will separate them one from another as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats,
33 and he will place the sheep at his right hand, but the goats at the left.
34 Then the King will say to those at his right hand, `Come, O blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world;
35 for I was hungry and you gave me food, I was thirsty and you gave me drink, I was a stranger and you welcomed me,
36 I was naked and you clothed me, I was sick and you visited me, I was in prison and you came to me.'
37 Then the righteous will answer him, `Lord, when did we see thee hungry and feed thee, or thirsty and give thee drink?
38 And when did we see thee a stranger and welcome thee, or naked and clothe thee?
39 And when did we see thee sick or in prison and visit thee?'
40 And the King will answer them, `Truly, I say to you, as you did it to one of the least of these my brethren, you did it to me.'

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Me - 32
DS - 5
DD - 13
DSD - 9
D final 12-8-08
Page 34 of 142 1 2 32 33 34 35 36 141 142

Moderated by  Fordude 

Link Copied to Clipboard
Forum Search
Who's Online Now
0 members (), 251 guests, and 55 robots.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Newest Members
Bibbyryan860, Ian T, SadNewYorker, Jay Handlooms, GrenHeil
71,839 Registered Users
Building Marriages That Last A Lifetime
Copyright © 1995-2019, Marriage Builders®. All Rights Reserved.
Site Navigation
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5